----- Original Message ----- From: "norman.lee1" <norman.lee1@virgin.net> To: "John Barton" <bartonlander@free.net.nz>; <OLD-ENGLISH-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 8:21 AM Subject: Re: [OEL] Rhyming slang > And then there's the common ones such as 'trouble and strife' for wife; > apples and pears for stairs; Rosy Lea for tea; Barnet Fair for hair and many > more. Everyone in my childhood knew these. Some of those you mention, John, > weren't familiar to me. Although I knew that dukes were fists I had no idea > of the original phrase. All of them got to be shortened in some way and it > was a sort of code I suppose, but more to keep outsiders outside. It may > have fooled some people but children? Can't remember being fooled for one > moment. Now, if you were talking about the mysteries of life, what went on > between men and women was one of the most puzzling. Rhyming slang was easy > compared to this. > > Audrey > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Barton" <bartonlander@free.net.nz> > To: <OLD-ENGLISH-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 4:20 AM > Subject: [OEL] Rhyming slang > > > > When I go to London- about once every 20 years on average- one thing I > miss > > is Cockney rhyming slang. It was more than a local underworld cant to > fool > > cops and children; it had its own history; always changing. "Putting your > > dooks up" in a fist fight, for example. A "Duke (or Duchess) of Teck" was > a > > cheque; "Duke of York" meant to talk, to walk (later ball [of chalk]), or > a > > fork. With the counterpart "Duke of Fife" for knife. But things got > > confused; the latter could also be 'wife'. Ambiguous and sexually > > inappropriate, it soon changed to "Duchess of Fife". Thence, by 1880, > > shortened to "Dutch" (my old dutch). That in turn became "old Dutch > china", > > and "China".(Which was dear!).Helped - since a man's wife was his 'mate', > by > > china for pal or mate (china plate). So "Duke of Fife" was now exclusively > > knife. Often used not of table-knives, but transferred more to the hands > > that held them in the street. > > The fingers of which were suggestive of knives (Dukes/dooks/ Fifes/ bunch > of > > fives, i.e. 5 fingers) or forks (Yorks/ dooks again).To 'put up the dooks' > > was to engage in a fight; to grease the dooks meant to accept a bribe. > > An etymology as involved as this lies behind hundreds more rhyming slang > > words, origins now almost lost. > > > > John Barton > > > > > > > > ==== OLD-ENGLISH Mailing List ==== > > OLD-ENGLISH Web Page > > http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > > >