Hello Chris - Apologies for any problems there may be with this as I am answering from my web-mail at present. A very interesting observation by both of us it seems and I copy what I have found about "SCOTTI" ..... "The foundation myths of Scotland state that the Scottish Gaels originated from the Dal Riata tribe in Antrim, north-east Ireland. Around AD 500, or so the story goes, Fergus Mor mac Eirc supposedly established a new Dal Riata in Argyll because of dynastic competition at home (Foster, 1996: 13). According to this view, they displaced a previous British or Pictish community from Argyll - a process which eventually ended with the takeover of the entire Pictish kingdom in the 9th century to create the united kingdom of Alba that became Scotland." I have no source proof to back me up, as I am only repeating what must be hearsay. It is significant that the word "SCOTTI" is not in my Scottish Dictionary so one might suppose the word to be Irish? The name SCOT is in fact of Irish origin, not I think necessarily meaning an Irishman though, but an Irishman with that name. I take this from the OE for SCOTT which is stated as being the name given to a certain man of Irish descent, as set out in Reany's dictionary of surnames. What relationship between SCOTT & SCOTTI there is, can only be conjecture I think? As far as the name ELPHIN is concerned, the time scale was in St Patrick's era whereas the earliest instance of Scott I have is c.1124 with Uchtred filius Scot in Selkirk. Perhaps we might carry on this discussion outside of the group as it seems to be a little of topic now? or is it? Chris Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote: Hello Roy I am interested in your comment that the Irish originated in Scotland. In researching the surname Scott we found it originated from the word Scotti about the 10th century which meant Irishman so it would seem some Scottish were immigrants from Ireland so did the name Elphin go the other way. regards Chris Bartlett -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roy Sent: Sunday, 10 December 2006 2:44 a.m. To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [OEL] origin of saint's name My "Little" Booke Again! It doesn't appear that it was a Saint or is it? There is a place Elphin on the A835, in the north west of Scotland (Just an aside) St Patrick founded a cathedral near Elphin (Ireland), "By a river issuing from two fountains," in the 15th century, and placed over it St. Asicus, whom he created bishop, and who soon after filled it with monks. After many centuries many places became annexed to Elphin, which became one of the richest sees in Ireland. The see was united to Kilmore in 1841, under the provisions of the Church Temporalities Act, passed Aug. 1833. Looking at other possibilities, there is a surname ELPHNISTON(E) c.1250- from the lands of Elphinstone in Tranent (Midlothianshire) History comments that the (Irish) originated from Scotland; do we have a link here, perhaps the Irish town of Elphin was named after one such emigrant? What a lovely sunny day it is today, here in the south, to mark our 56 years of marriage - Whoopee! Kindest Regards to all subscribers and to say how pleasant it is to take part in these discussions - Roy LD Cox and June Mary my wife - -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of norman lee Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 1:01 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [OEL] origin of saint's name Does anyone know the origin of the saint's name to which Warrington Parish Church dedicated? It is St. Elphin. A local historian has suggested it could be a bad reading of Stephen but this would have been a very long time ago. Audrey ===================================== WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH ===================================== ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ===================================== WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH ===================================== ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.15.15/580 - Release Date: 8/12/2006 12:53 p.m. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.15.15/580 - Release Date: 8/12/2006 12:53 p.m. ==================================== WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Kind Regards Roy LD Cox www.coxresearcher.com/index.htm
well I'm interested though can't contribute Ros ----- Original Message ----- From: "ROY COX" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 10:46 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] origin of saint's name > Hello Chris - > > Apologies for any problems there may be with this as I am answering from > my web-mail at present. > > A very interesting observation by both of us it seems and I copy what I > have found about "SCOTTI" ..... > > "The foundation myths of Scotland state that the Scottish Gaels > originated from the Dal Riata tribe in Antrim, north-east Ireland. Around > AD 500, or so the story goes, Fergus Mor mac Eirc supposedly established a > new Dal Riata in Argyll because of dynastic competition at home (Foster, > 1996: 13). According to this view, they displaced a previous British or > Pictish community from Argyll - a process which eventually ended with the > takeover of the entire Pictish kingdom in the 9th century to create the > united kingdom of Alba that became Scotland." > > I have no source proof to back me up, as I am only repeating what must be > hearsay. > > It is significant that the word "SCOTTI" is not in my Scottish Dictionary > so one might suppose the word to be Irish? > > The name SCOT is in fact of Irish origin, not I think necessarily meaning > an Irishman though, but an Irishman with that name. I take this from the > OE for SCOTT which is stated as being the name given to a certain man of > Irish descent, as set out in Reany's dictionary of surnames. What > relationship between SCOTT & SCOTTI there is, can only be conjecture I > think? > > As far as the name ELPHIN is concerned, the time scale was in St > Patrick's era whereas the earliest instance of Scott I have is c.1124 with > Uchtred filius Scot in Selkirk. > > Perhaps we might carry on this discussion outside of the group as it > seems to be a little of topic now? or is it? > > > Chris Bartlett <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello Roy > > I am interested in your comment that the Irish originated in Scotland. In > researching the surname Scott we found it originated from the word Scotti > about the 10th century which meant Irishman so it would seem some Scottish > were immigrants from Ireland so did the name Elphin go the other way. > > regards Chris Bartlett > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roy > Sent: Sunday, 10 December 2006 2:44 a.m. > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [OEL] origin of saint's name > > My "Little" Booke Again! > > It doesn't appear that it was a Saint or is it? > > There is a place Elphin on the A835, in the north west of Scotland (Just > an > aside) > > St Patrick founded a cathedral near Elphin (Ireland), "By a river issuing > from two fountains," in the 15th century, and placed over it St. Asicus, > whom he created bishop, and who soon after filled it with monks. > > After many centuries many places became annexed to Elphin, which became > one > of the richest sees in Ireland. > > The see was united to Kilmore in 1841, under the provisions of the Church > Temporalities Act, passed Aug. 1833. > > Looking at other possibilities, there is a surname ELPHNISTON(E) c.1250- > from the lands of Elphinstone in Tranent (Midlothianshire) > > History comments that the (Irish) originated from Scotland; do we have a > link here, perhaps the Irish town of Elphin was named after one such > emigrant? > > > What a lovely sunny day it is today, here in the south, to mark our 56 > years > of marriage - Whoopee! > > Kindest Regards to all subscribers and to say how pleasant it is to take > part in these discussions - Roy LD Cox and June Mary my wife - > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of norman lee > Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 1:01 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: [OEL] origin of saint's name > > Does anyone know the origin of the saint's name to which Warrington Parish > Church dedicated? It is St. Elphin. A local historian has suggested it > could > be a bad reading of Stephen but this would have been a very long time ago. > > Audrey > ===================================== > WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH > ===================================== > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ===================================== > WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH > ===================================== > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.15.15/580 - Release Date: 8/12/2006 > 12:53 p.m. > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.15.15/580 - Release Date: 8/12/2006 > 12:53 p.m. > > > > ==================================== > WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > Kind Regards > > Roy LD Cox > www.coxresearcher.com/index.htm > > > > ==================================== > WEB PAGE: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ARCHIVES: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index?list=OLD-ENGLISH > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >