Harold and Ann Can't guarantee anything but if you want to send a photo through, I'll have a look. Do you have any context, approximate area or country even? John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harold and Ann Brightbill" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 12:47 AM Subject: [OEL] Writing on old drawer > Hello, Need some assistance reading the writing on a > drawer of an old piece of furniture. If someone can > assist me I will send a digital photo of the writing. > Most of it is readable but I cannot find the village > listed if I am reading it correctly. Thanks for any > assistance. > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Music Unlimited > Access over 1 million songs. > http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >
Hello, Need some assistance reading the writing on a drawer of an old piece of furniture. If someone can assist me I will send a digital photo of the writing. Most of it is readable but I cannot find the village listed if I am reading it correctly. Thanks for any assistance. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited
Hello, Many thanks for help with the first half. I'm afraid the text wrap round on my email caused the url to break in two -- this should work: http://boards.ancestry.co.uk/mbexec/message/5538/localities.britisles.englan d.lnd.london/7400 otherwise the second half can be copied and pasted on. To give some background: equity cases in Chancery show that Elizabeth How's brother Samuel was working at the Boreshead Brewhouse by Fleet Street in the early 1620s. He would go into partnership with John Cock in 1649, running the Black Swan brewhouse on Thames Street. 1 w[hi]ch daie appeared Wm Brittayne of Christ 2 churche p[ar]ishe London m[er]chantayler and desiered 3 license for a marriage intended betweene John 4 Cocke of St Botulphes Algeate purishe brewer 5 and a batcheler aged 30 yeres or thereabout 6 and one Elizabeth How singlewoman aged 7 xxiij ty yeres or thereabou-- & both shervant[es] 8 to Wm Lawe of the same parishe bierebrewer 9 & w[i]th his consent as is testefied by him the said 10 Brittaine & George Lowndes? of St Sepulchre 11 tallow chandler And ... 12 13 or .. by reason of .. contract or 14 15 And prays ... for them to be married 16 together in the parish of St Botolph as 17 aforesaid thanks, Michael -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.14/548 - Release Date: 23/11/2006
Hello, I'm trying to decipher a London marriage licence from 1625 between Elizabeth How and John Cock, and would be grateful for any help. For anyone familiar with this kind of document, I'd also be interested to know who the other people in the document would likely be. The image is here: http://boards.ancestry.co.uk/mbexec/message/5538/localities.britisles.englan d.lnd.london/7400 So far I have: 1 ... appeared Wm Brittayne ... 2 ... parish London ... 3 ... for a marriage between John 4 Cock of St Botolph ... Aldgate parish brewer 5 and a bachelor aged 30 years or thereabouts 6 and one Elizabeth How singlewoman aged 7 twenty years or thereabouts & both ... 8 to Wm Lowe? of the same parish beer brewer 9 & ... & his consent ... 10 Brittaine & George Lowndes? of St Sepulchre 11 tallow chandler And ... 12 13 or .. by reason of .. contract or 14 15 And prays ... for them to be married 16 together in the parish of St Botolph as 17 aforesaid thanks, Michael -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.14/548 - Release Date: 23/11/2006
Hello again. All due apologies for my flip response regarding mistakes in transcription. For all the mistakes that creep in there are multitudes of correct information, and more and more of it available via the Internet. This wouldn t be available without the untold hours and hours put in by so many people, and we so often forget that someone has actually done the work; it didn't just happen". I for one am so glad to be able to actually find "my" people. It is sometimes amusing to see another's take on what is so clear to me, but kudos to those who make it available. We are reminded once again that an index is a very valuable aid - then we need to check the originals before committing information to our trees. The frustration comes from knowing something "should" be there and not finding it in an index in order to find the right direction to the original. With thanks and appeciation to those who do so that we can, Marie -------Original Message------- From: mjcl Date: 11/21/06 16:07:47 To: Norman Lee; [email protected] Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help Audrey, That's why, when doing transcriptions for public consumption, it's so important to have a checker. We are human, and all fallible! Al the best, Martyn ----- Original Message ---- From: Norman Lee <[email protected]> To: [email protected]; [email protected]; John <[email protected] net> Sent: Tuesday, 21 November, 2006 10:58:36 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help Having compiled a very minor index myself from a calendar which, in itself, is a type of index, all I can say is that I find it amazing how accurate some of these lists are. The calendars my friends and I looked at were 19th century lists of probate documents. We inspected all the documents listed for our large ancient parish, took details of the documents, thus producing a fuller description of each entry, and made them into an alphabetical index. Each entry was checked several times over by all three of us and it took us two years to finish the work. Needless to say, we are bound to have made mistakes because we are only human but we did our level best and have accepted any corrections that were submitted to the records office after publication. I think there were only five and so, since these represented a minute percentage of the total, we didn't feel too badly about it. We have been congratulated and thanked for our efforts by more than one researcher. Although we may want to shoot the person who compiled an index and made a mistake in transcription, it isn't beyond possibility to check back with the records office or even to access original documents. As many on this list will have realised, transcription of Old English isn't always easy and mistakes will always happen. With experience and consultation with others, we can often guess that a mistake has been made and can ask the records office for their advice. Audrey ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; "John" <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help >I agree with the shooting - mis-transcription gives us all headaches - but > how many of your own ancestors are mis-indexed because of a > mis-read/mis-transcription? Some we'll never find (in an index) because we > cannot possibly guess at every incorrect way someone else sees the same > name > We will find these ancestors and their records, but by actually looking > around, not by an index entry. > > It also helps if the transcriber is familiar with the place names of the > area - we have found a lot of errors in the Hawaii records (e.G., census > entries indexed on Ancestry) that are plainly because the transcriber > wasn't > from there and had no idea of what would be correct, and just guessed. > > Marie > > -------Original Message------- > > From: John > Date: 11/20/06 10:50:32 > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help > > At 17:41 20/11/2006, [email protected] wrote: >>If so, what did the transcriber >>guess? > > > If the transcriber guessed anything they need taking out and shooting :-D > > I agree with Percer and brass but the last word is vague. It always > helps in cases like this if there are a few other words included as > reference points. > > John
[email protected] wrote: << The second one is a little more problematic. It appears to be split into two and read "Brass Wate" >> It looks more like "Brass Work" to me. Can I make a plea? Could people give some context rather than just posting images of isolated words from documents? I understand concerns about file size and copyright, but it really does help to have other words in the same hand to compare with. Chris Phillips
Audrey, That's why, when doing transcriptions for public consumption, it's so important to have a checker. We are human, and all fallible! Al the best, Martyn ----- Original Message ---- From: Norman Lee <[email protected]> To: [email protected]; [email protected]; John <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, 21 November, 2006 10:58:36 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help Having compiled a very minor index myself from a calendar which, in itself, is a type of index, all I can say is that I find it amazing how accurate some of these lists are. The calendars my friends and I looked at were 19th century lists of probate documents. We inspected all the documents listed for our large ancient parish, took details of the documents, thus producing a fuller description of each entry, and made them into an alphabetical index. Each entry was checked several times over by all three of us and it took us two years to finish the work. Needless to say, we are bound to have made mistakes because we are only human but we did our level best and have accepted any corrections that were submitted to the records office after publication. I think there were only five and so, since these represented a minute percentage of the total, we didn't feel too badly about it. We have been congratulated and thanked for our efforts by more than one researcher. Although we may want to shoot the person who compiled an index and made a mistake in transcription, it isn't beyond possibility to check back with the records office or even to access original documents. As many on this list will have realised, transcription of Old English isn't always easy and mistakes will always happen. With experience and consultation with others, we can often guess that a mistake has been made and can ask the records office for their advice. Audrey ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; "John" <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help >I agree with the shooting - mis-transcription gives us all headaches - but > how many of your own ancestors are mis-indexed because of a > mis-read/mis-transcription? Some we'll never find (in an index) because we > cannot possibly guess at every incorrect way someone else sees the same > name > We will find these ancestors and their records, but by actually looking > around, not by an index entry. > > It also helps if the transcriber is familiar with the place names of the > area - we have found a lot of errors in the Hawaii records (e.g., census > entries indexed on Ancestry) that are plainly because the transcriber > wasn't > from there and had no idea of what would be correct, and just guessed. > > Marie > > -------Original Message------- > > From: John > Date: 11/20/06 10:50:32 > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help > > At 17:41 20/11/2006, [email protected] wrote: >>If so, what did the transcriber >>guess? > > > If the transcriber guessed anything they need taking out and shooting :-D > > I agree with Percer and brass but the last word is vague. It always > helps in cases like this if there are a few other words included as > reference points. > > John > > > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.7/537 - Release Date: 17/11/2006 > ================= Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ================= ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Having compiled a very minor index myself from a calendar which, in itself, is a type of index, all I can say is that I find it amazing how accurate some of these lists are. The calendars my friends and I looked at were 19th century lists of probate documents. We inspected all the documents listed for our large ancient parish, took details of the documents, thus producing a fuller description of each entry, and made them into an alphabetical index. Each entry was checked several times over by all three of us and it took us two years to finish the work. Needless to say, we are bound to have made mistakes because we are only human but we did our level best and have accepted any corrections that were submitted to the records office after publication. I think there were only five and so, since these represented a minute percentage of the total, we didn't feel too badly about it. We have been congratulated and thanked for our efforts by more than one researcher. Although we may want to shoot the person who compiled an index and made a mistake in transcription, it isn't beyond possibility to check back with the records office or even to access original documents. As many on this list will have realised, transcription of Old English isn't always easy and mistakes will always happen. With experience and consultation with others, we can often guess that a mistake has been made and can ask the records office for their advice. Audrey ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; "John" <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 6:26 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help >I agree with the shooting - mis-transcription gives us all headaches - but > how many of your own ancestors are mis-indexed because of a > mis-read/mis-transcription? Some we'll never find (in an index) because we > cannot possibly guess at every incorrect way someone else sees the same > name > We will find these ancestors and their records, but by actually looking > around, not by an index entry. > > It also helps if the transcriber is familiar with the place names of the > area - we have found a lot of errors in the Hawaii records (e.g., census > entries indexed on Ancestry) that are plainly because the transcriber > wasn't > from there and had no idea of what would be correct, and just guessed. > > Marie > > -------Original Message------- > > From: John > Date: 11/20/06 10:50:32 > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help > > At 17:41 20/11/2006, [email protected] wrote: >>If so, what did the transcriber >>guess? > > > If the transcriber guessed anything they need taking out and shooting :-D > > I agree with Percer and brass but the last word is vague. It always > helps in cases like this if there are a few other words included as > reference points. > > John > > > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.7/537 - Release Date: 17/11/2006 >
Hi, Thanks for all your help guys, much appreciated. Simon. _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb
John, Having looked at it again. I tend to agree. Martyn ----- Original Message ---- From: John W Edwards <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Monday, 20 November, 2006 5:26:43 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help Simon I agree with Martyn on 'Percer' but could the occupation be an abbreviation of 'Brass Work(er)' John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Beck" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 11:41 AM Subject: [OEL] Translation Help > Hi, > > Was going through some old records, and came across two things that I > couldn't understand. > > One is a name and one is an occupation. Any help as to what they say will > be > greatly apprecaited, > > I have put the images on the board: > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/topics.researchresources.general/615 > > Thanks, > > Simon > > _________________________________________________________________ > Windows LiveT Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! > http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ================= Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ================= ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
At 17:41 20/11/2006, [email protected] wrote: >If so, what did the transcriber >guess? If the transcriber guessed anything they need taking out and shooting :-D I agree with Percer and brass but the last word is vague. It always helps in cases like this if there are a few other words included as reference points. John
Simon I agree with Martyn on 'Percer' but could the occupation be an abbreviation of 'Brass Work(er)' John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Beck" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 11:41 AM Subject: [OEL] Translation Help > Hi, > > Was going through some old records, and came across two things that I > couldn't understand. > > One is a name and one is an occupation. Any help as to what they say will > be > greatly apprecaited, > > I have put the images on the board: > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/topics.researchresources.general/615 > > Thanks, > > Simon > > _________________________________________________________________ > Windows LiveT Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! > http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ================= > Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ > ================= > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Simon, The first appears to be "Percer". The second one is a little more problematic. It appears to be split into two and read "Brass Wate" All the best Martyn ----- Original Message ---- From: Simon Beck <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Monday, 20 November, 2006 11:41:32 AM Subject: [OEL] Translation Help Hi, Was going through some old records, and came across two things that I couldn't understand. One is a name and one is an occupation. Any help as to what they say will be greatly apprecaited, I have put the images on the board: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/topics.researchresources.general/615 Thanks, Simon _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live™ Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb ================= Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ================= ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
The name does look like Percer, but depending on other letters which we cannot see in the scan, could be Tercer. Occupation looks like Brass Work. Maureen Bryson
Hi, Was going through some old records, and came across two things that I couldn't understand. One is a name and one is an occupation. Any help as to what they say will be greatly apprecaited, I have put the images on the board: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/topics.researchresources.general/615 Thanks, Simon _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb
I agree with the shooting - mis-transcription gives us all headaches - but how many of your own ancestors are mis-indexed because of a mis-read/mis-transcription? Some we'll never find (in an index) because we cannot possibly guess at every incorrect way someone else sees the same name We will find these ancestors and their records, but by actually looking around, not by an index entry. It also helps if the transcriber is familiar with the place names of the area - we have found a lot of errors in the Hawaii records (e.g., census entries indexed on Ancestry) that are plainly because the transcriber wasn't from there and had no idea of what would be correct, and just guessed. Marie -------Original Message------- From: John Date: 11/20/06 10:50:32 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help At 17:41 20/11/2006, [email protected] wrote: >If so, what did the transcriber >guess? If the transcriber guessed anything they need taking out and shooting :-D I agree with Percer and brass but the last word is vague. It always helps in cases like this if there are a few other words included as reference points. John ================= Web Page: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~oel/ ================= ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Is this a document that would have been indexed somewhere? And is "Percer" the name that would have been indexed? If so, what did the transcriber guess? Marie -------Original Message------- From: John W Edwards Date: 11/20/06 10:26:43 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [OEL] Translation Help Simon I agree with Martyn on 'Percer' but could the occupation be an abbreviation of 'Brass Work(ER)' John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Beck" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 11:41 AM Subject: [OEL] Translation Help > Hi, > > Was going through some old records, and came across two things that I > couldn't understand. > > One is a name and one is an occupation. Any help as to what they say will > be > greatly apprecaited, > > I have put the images on the board: > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/message/an/topics.researchresources general/615 > > Thanks, > > Simon
Yes, certainly feel free to quote me, Nancy. I'm not an expert on conservation, Liz. And I don't think I'd want to be. For generations, our grandparents knew instincively how to care for things, without access to new science and materials, or having degrees and reading technical books or going to lectures. Just common-sense. At a guess, I'd say about half of precious items are cared for badly or not at all, and the other half over-conserved by 'experts' for whom no expense is too much. And that can often lead to complicated and rigid procedures which neglect some simple basic.Yes, 'draws' was a mistake for 'drawers'! A cult of professional conservation has arisen, which is more concerned with selling special products, maintaining one-up-manship above common folk, and making a career out of common sense. I'm not against research for really important artefacts into plastics, etc - and certainly it makes sense to ensure that polyester storage sleeves are inert, because even if there is no chlorine in the plastic molecule itself, the other ingredients can be harmful over long periods. But I feel that basics (heat, light, damp, insects, moulds, fungi, industrial gases, and dangers of floods, wars, children, theives, rodents, fire, bursting pipes, etc) can get neglected in academic research. I heard of a pioneer museum in which they placed notices on lace dresses etc, "These fabrics are delicate; please do not touch them". This had little effect, but was solved by replacing them with "Please don't handle these fabrics; for conservation purposes, they are treated with chemicals which can be harmful". Regards, John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nancy Keith" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2006 1:08 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] OT - Old silk military map > John > > May I have permission, please, to forward your message to other > genealogy-related lists? We often have discussions on conserving papers, > photos, fabrics, and such, and your suggestions make very good sense. > > One question: if they are stored in "shallow draws" (which I *think* we > on > this side of the Pond call "drawers"[?], meaning the pull-out storage > parts > of chests and dressers), doesn't there need to be some sort of buffer > between the wood on the bottom of the drawer and the material to be > conserved? It would seem as though acid-free tissue might well be used > there, too. > > What about storage in the newer drawers made of plastic materials? They > aren't all made of archival materials, for certain. Do the > "ultra-violet-safe" framing glasses help? Obviously, there still would be > the humidity problem, but I wonder if we are lulled into thinking it is > safe > because of the modicum of protection from ultra-violet rays... > > My favorite genealogy instructor tells us to make copies of every piece of > paper that we want to display, then archive the original. I think she's > on > to something there. > > Thank you. > > Nancy > in cold, snowy Michigan, US of A > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Barton" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2006 5:35 PM > Subject: Re: [OEL] OT - Old silk military map > > >> The keywords for documents (paper or vellum), letters, newspapers, >> photos, >> slides, negatives, fabrics and a good deal more - >> are" COLD, DARK, and DRY. >> A relative humidity of around 40 to 60%. And never fold. These are the >> most >> important, easy to remember but often neglected even in museums. >> Framing encourages both ultra-violet light and damp damage, and nothing >> precious should ever be framed. I suppose the motive is display, plus >> protection from dust, touching, and fumes; but it is not an option even >> for >> displayed art such as oil paintings - the Mona Lisa etc. >> 'Stapling to cardboard' presumably means the silk has - apart from >> multiple >> holes - contact on one side with glass which harbours growth of >> micro-fungi, >> and on the other with sulphuric acid-rich acid-bleached wood-pulp. >> Fabrics >> are best stored in shallow draws, either flat or loosely rolled between >> buffered acid-free tissue. >> >> John Barton >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > __________ NOD32 1862 (20061110) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > >
Don't know if this is Old English or not but here's a tip when it comes to photocopying. Do not allow photocopies to be exposed to prolonged daylight or sunlight. You will soon end up with a blank page. Keep them out of the light when you're not working on them. Audrey ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Barton" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2006 12:10 PM Subject: Re: [OEL] OT - Old silk military map > Yes, certainly feel free to quote me, Nancy. > I'm not an expert on conservation, Liz. And I don't think I'd want to be. > For generations, our grandparents knew instincively how to care for > things, > without access to new science and materials, or having degrees and reading > technical books or going to lectures. Just common-sense. > At a guess, I'd say about half of precious items are cared for badly or > not > at all, and the other half over-conserved by 'experts' for whom no expense > is too > much. And that can often lead to complicated and rigid procedures which > neglect > some simple basic.Yes, 'draws' was a mistake for 'drawers'! > A cult of professional conservation has arisen, which is more concerned > with > selling special products, maintaining one-up-manship above common folk, > and > making a career out of common sense. > I'm not against research for really important artefacts into plastics, > etc - > and certainly > it makes sense to ensure that polyester storage sleeves are inert, because > even if there is no chlorine in the plastic molecule itself, the other > ingredients can be harmful over long periods. But I feel that basics > (heat, > light, damp, insects, moulds, fungi, industrial gases, > and dangers of floods, wars, children, theives, rodents, fire, bursting > pipes, etc) can get neglected in academic research. > I heard of a pioneer museum in which they placed notices on lace dresses > etc, "These fabrics are delicate; please do not touch them". This had > little > effect, but was solved by replacing them with "Please don't handle these > fabrics; for conservation purposes, they are treated with chemicals which > can be harmful". > Regards, > John > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nancy Keith" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2006 1:08 PM > Subject: Re: [OEL] OT - Old silk military map > > >> John >> >> May I have permission, please, to forward your message to other >> genealogy-related lists? We often have discussions on conserving papers, >> photos, fabrics, and such, and your suggestions make very good sense. >> >> One question: if they are stored in "shallow draws" (which I *think* we >> on >> this side of the Pond call "drawers"[?], meaning the pull-out storage >> parts >> of chests and dressers), doesn't there need to be some sort of buffer >> between the wood on the bottom of the drawer and the material to be >> conserved? It would seem as though acid-free tissue might well be used >> there, too. >> >> What about storage in the newer drawers made of plastic materials? They >> aren't all made of archival materials, for certain. Do the >> "ultra-violet-safe" framing glasses help? Obviously, there still would >> be >> the humidity problem, but I wonder if we are lulled into thinking it is >> safe >> because of the modicum of protection from ultra-violet rays... >> >> My favorite genealogy instructor tells us to make copies of every piece >> of >> paper that we want to display, then archive the original. I think she's >> on >> to something there. >> >> Thank you. >> >> Nancy >> in cold, snowy Michigan, US of A >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "John Barton" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2006 5:35 PM >> Subject: Re: [OEL] OT - Old silk military map >> >> >>> The keywords for documents (paper or vellum), letters, newspapers, >>> photos, >>> slides, negatives, fabrics and a good deal more - >>> are" COLD, DARK, and DRY. >>> A relative humidity of around 40 to 60%. And never fold. These are the >>> most >>> important, easy to remember but often neglected even in museums. >>> Framing encourages both ultra-violet light and damp damage, and nothing >>> precious should ever be framed. I suppose the motive is display, plus >>> protection from dust, touching, and fumes; but it is not an option even >>> for >>> displayed art such as oil paintings - the Mona Lisa etc. >>> 'Stapling to cardboard' presumably means the silk has - apart from >>> multiple >>> holes - contact on one side with glass which harbours growth of >>> micro-fungi, >>> and on the other with sulphuric acid-rich acid-bleached wood-pulp. >>> Fabrics >>> are best stored in shallow draws, either flat or loosely rolled between >>> buffered acid-free tissue. >>> >>> John Barton >>> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> __________ NOD32 1862 (20061110) Information __________ >> >> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >> http://www.eset.com >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.409 / Virus Database: 268.14.2/528 - Release Date: 10/11/2006 > >
Like you,, I know the basics. And I also know that wartime and post war paper is at greater risk of deterioration than Victorian paper in many cases, when I visited a conservator at my RO about documents he told me that if I had limited funds for the polyester stuff, then some of my wartime stuff was probably a better use of the money than some older stuff which tended to be much much better quality. I was very surprised to learn tho that vellum/parchment which is dirty with age can be cleaned very simply with a special kind of eraser type thing which costs very little - about £3.00 I think, and okay you wear cotton gloves when you do it, and go carefully, but it is not difficult at all. Before anyone asks, I dont recall the name of the eraser, but it was the conservator at Stafford Record Office who told me about it. Liz >Yes, certainly feel free to quote me, Nancy. >I'm not an expert on conservation, Liz. And I don't think I'd want to be. >For generations, our grandparents knew instincively how to care for things, >without access to new science and materials, or having degrees and reading > technical books or going to lectures. Just common-sense. >At a guess, I'd say about half of precious items are cared for badly or not >at all, and the other half over-conserved by 'experts' for whom no expense >is too >much. And that can often lead to complicated and rigid procedures which >neglect >some simple basic. _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb