Sue, That's a great story but you didn't tell us who your Granny was. That info might help some folks. Phoebe in CA In a message dated 1/15/2010 12:39:10 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, goldsage@aol.com writes: Marty and Julia et al. While I haven't had the honor of spending any time in the records office in Goshen, I have sent others in to do the work for me - because like Julia, I am a neophyte when it comes to digging in these places. The ace in the hole was a friend of mine who works with the Warwick Historical Society and knew what I was looking for. Femi just happened to be digging in the files at Goshen for something else and found a document that warmed the cockles of my little heart. This document was my GGGGgrandmother, filing for her dower rights after my GGGGgrandfather died in 1818. You see he had left the farm to the boys, and she was none-too-pleased about it, as it appeared her eldest son was mismanaging the place. The instrument she filed was an ADMEASURE. Apparently the admeasure proceedings opened a rift. This son left for Ohio in 1829 leaving one brother who moved upstate. Their mother sold the land in 1838 and moved to PA with her youngest daughter. So yes, you will find instruments that were filed by women. I am working in the records of England these days, and have found several wills circa 1600 written by women, although they are fewer than men. If there is no male heir in the family the lands are often left to the daughters and then they must be responsible for passing the legacy on, which is usually done with a will. Sometimes the wills in England are nuncupative, and while I haven't run across any like that in America, I am sure that they exist. What Does Nuncupative Will Mean? A verbal will that must have two witnesses and can only deal with the distribution of personal property. A nuncupative will is considered a "deathbed" will, which is often written down after the death by the witnesses and the probated. Also, don't discount land record searches. They may be the only way you will know what happened to the family. I was looking in Ohio for the land records in Brownhelm, and while there were references to the records being there, the staff was not finding them. Then I found a very obscure notation about the records I was seeking. I gave the record to another researcher who had some tenacity. She went into the records office and when they told her they didn't exist, she said, "May I look in your basement?" Lo and behold, the records had been unceremoniously tossed into the basement and were not part of the modern database. In the past someone had become lazy and left them stranded down there with the moisture. The records have now been returned into the database. Sometimes land records are the only way to find a marriage. In Iowa, (same family) there are no official marriage records before 1880. The only clue we had to this particular marriage was persistent hearsay. Again, Providence looked upon us kindly, when in a deed was found in the courthouse, the name of the bride emerged. SHE LIVED! Moral of the story . . . keep looking. It's out there somewhere. Sometimes intuition and persistence is a great tool. Sue Simonich In a message dated 1/15/2010 11:59:23 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, k2mi@frontiernet.net writes: Julia (and others), Regarding the gap between liber 2 and liber 27...even the chief clerk could not answer that one. Remember...that happened more than a century before her time. My guess is that 1 to 26 were skipped because A to Z takes 26 libers, but if so...why did they create 1 and 2 which overlap two earlier ones? I have no idea why they did that, nor do I know which wills were duplicated (if any). I just know the first and last years of libers 1 and 2.. When I am asked to copy wills, I copy everything available for that individual, since the supplementary records may contain additional names of family members. For instance, my great great grandfather died when his wife was 3 months pregnant, so there was no possible way for him to name the last child in a will. Re: "Early Orange County Wills (1731 - 1830)" - it was created by humans, and I found one will that was missed by this book. OCGS has another book covering probate records of the same era, if you'd care to stop by and take a look at it. In general, though, if no will for an individual was listed in that book, the odds are very high that it doesn't exist. As for Julia's other questions, all I can add is that every case is individual, and my experience has been that even wealthy people died intestate. Some wealthy people did not have any probate records at all. Why not??? Perhaps others would care to share their experiences with probate records. Marty Irons Goshen NY k2mi@frontiernet.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYORANGE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYORANGE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message