Maybe his employment records might have something? I have city dir of Syr various yrs, 1894-1956 if a lookup might help. Just mention the names and yrs- and towns if you know them. Diane Sweeney Groman Researching SWEENEY,CONNOR,BARRETT,DOLAN,..CROSSMOLINA PARISH, CO. MAYO. SWEENEY, CONNOR, BYRON in Syracuse NY ca 1880 - current. ----Original Message Follows---- From: [email protected] Reply-To: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: NYONONDA-D Digest V04 #45 Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:00:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: from lists5.rootsweb.com ([66.43.18.41]) by mc10-f2.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6824); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:05:32 -0800 Received: (from [email protected])by lists5.rootsweb.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) id i2Q50QWl010742;Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:00:26 -0700 X-Message-Info: QIy1oIULmHfn3uFDDZ2jR9HC8SE3CVps Message-Id: <[email protected]> X-Loop: [email protected] X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/volume04/45 Precedence: list Return-Path: [email protected] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Mar 2004 05:05:32.0815 (UTC) FILETIME=[F74451F0:01C412EF] Content-Type: text/plain NYONONDA-D Digest Volume 04 : Issue 45 Today's Topics: #1 [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1947/ [Aaron Howard <[email protected]] #2 Re: [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1 [Aaron Howard <[email protected]] #3 Re: [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1 [Aaron Howard <[email protected]] Administrivia: To unsubscribe from NYONONDA-D, send a message to [email protected] that contains in the body of the message the command unsubscribe and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. ______________________________ X-Message: #1 Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:59:40 -0800 (PST) From: Aaron Howard <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Subject: [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1947/Onondaga County Hospital Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Could anyone tell me if Community General Hospital was once Onondaga County Hospital? If not, what hospital did it become, and where would their records be kept? I am interested because my great-grandmother's "nephew" (could be brother, son, etc.), Shadrach Jones, died there of hypostatic pneumonia, according to the burial permit for him in November of 1947. I have found his obituary, found the file on his funeral at the funeral home, and found his burial permit, none of which have any notation about who his parents were. Even a diary that he kept when he 15 doesn't mention one word about "Mom" or "Dad", and it's a frustrating brick wall that seems so "see through". I realize that his death certificate is likely to include information about his parents, but I really don't want to shell out $30 now(!) and wait for the state or a no-record-report from the town I think would have the cert. Since this is a matter of some debate among living members of his grandfather's descendants, I am looking for any information about the hospital that might help--whether there are still extant records, whether anyone has had luck accessing them, etc. I hope to hear your experiences soon! Aaron Howard North Syracuse, NY Thanks for your time, all you listers, Aaron Howard North Syracuse, NY - ------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. ______________________________ X-Message: #2 Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:33:59 -0800 (PST) From: Aaron Howard <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1947/Onondaga County Hospital Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Bill, Thanks for the ideas-- I have sent two requests to the NYS DOH for a birth certificate, knowing from other records that he was born May 22, 1883 (one source shows the same date in 1885). I have received a no record found notice for 1884-1886, and although the Genealogy Unit tells me that the second request could take 10 months to fulfill, I have checked the index available on microfiche at the Onondaga County Public Library, and have not seen an entry for Shadrach Jones between 1881 and 1887. I don't hold much hope that there is a birth certificate. The local registrar does not have birth certificates going back that far, they were lost in a fire. I have also checked the censuses (1892, 1900, 1920, 1930) and found Shadrach. In 1892, and 1900, when he was still rather young, he was living with his "grandfather", i.e. he was listed as a grandson, with no mention of anyone who could be Shadrach's parents. It's possible that there is a baptismal record somewhere, but it will be some time before I can find the person whom I can ask. Thanks again for the input-- Aaron Howard North Syracuse, NY bill worth <[email protected]> wrote: Wouldn't you have better luck looking for his birth certificate providing he was born in the US, I sent for my gtgrandfathers death certificate and there were no parents mention.Have you checked census? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aaron Howard" To: Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 4:59 AM Subject: [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1947/Onondaga County Hospital > Could anyone tell me if Community General Hospital was once Onondaga County Hospital? If not, what hospital did it become, and where would their records be kept? > > I am interested because my great-grandmother's "nephew" (could be brother, son, etc.), Shadrach Jones, died there of hypostatic pneumonia, according to the burial permit for him in November of 1947. I have found his obituary, found the file on his funeral at the funeral home, and found his burial permit, none of which have any notation about who his parents were. Even a diary that he kept when he 15 doesn't mention one word about "Mom" or "Dad", and it's a frustrating brick wall that seems so "see through". I realize that his death certificate is likely to include information about his parents, but I really don't want to shell out $30 now(!) and wait for the state or a no-record-report from the town I think would have the cert. > > Since this is a matter of some debate among living members of his grandfather's descendants, I am looking for any information about the hospital that might help--whether there are still extant records, whether anyone has had luck accessing them, etc. > > I hope to hear your experiences soon! > > Aaron Howard > North Syracuse, NY > > Thanks for your time, all you listers, > > Aaron Howard > North Syracuse, NY > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. > > - ------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. ______________________________ X-Message: #3 Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:10:27 -0800 (PST) From: Aaron Howard <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [NYOnonda] Shadrach Jones/d. 1947/Onondaga County Hospital Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Dear Ann, Thank you for so much help! I think that I might have found the answer to my original question about the Onondaga County Hospital. I believe that it is now the Van Duyn Home and Hospital, in some form. I will be contacting them to pursue this line of research. To answer your questions, I found Shadrach in the early censuses (1892 NYS, and 1900 federal) in the town of Nelson, Madison County. Later, by 1917 anyway, he lived in Delphi Falls, Madison County, and from 1920 until he died in 1947 he was in the village of Manlius, Onondaga County. I do have his grandparents' obits, such as they were, and Shadrach is not mentioned, but his "sisters" and "brothers" were. If I restate the relationships, maybe it will make the singularity of this person clearer (as in mud-clear): James Jones (1826-1912) married Jane Davis (1835-1897) and they had nine children, the oldest of whom was Jane, born 1856, and the youngest of whom, Eva, was born in 1881. Shadrach, born 1883, is listed in the 1892 census as a grandson. Another document, a typescript family tree, shows Shadrach as "adopted". No one in the family knows his true status. Evan Shadrach's diary from when he was 15 shows him referring to his "grandparents'" children as brothers and sisters, and in fact, the one child of theirs (James and Jane) who survived Shadrach was mentioned in the obituary as a brother. James did not name Shadrach as a son when applying for or amending any document relating to his Civil War pension after Shadrach's birth. But, Shadrach is mentioned in and bequeathed to in James' will. Moving on to more answers to your questions: I do not believe that Shadrach was adopted in any conventional way, if at all. I have not yet checked for adoption papers, but will do so soon (in Madison County) to see if there are any guardianship papers or surrogate records. Anne, you mentioned the following, and I have to aske for some clarification: "Did you look at the death indexes from the very beginning of record for the family last name? I know Jones is difficult, but back then it may have been very less common & easier to track." If you mean did I check for Shadrach in the index to death certificates, I did, and I found the record. I haven't yet pursued that through the state DOH, and would prefer not to, per my experience and your advice. You are certainly right that Jones is a difficult and common name, and there were many unrelated Jones families in the Nelson area since the 1850s. If there is something else you meant by "death indexes", I'm not sure what it is. We do know that Shadrach never married, and never served in the military. I do not believe that he registered for the draft, either, but can't be sure without investing in a search. It is possible that he registered for Social Security, but doubtful, given his age at death, and the tenor of the times. Thanks again for the help--I hope that answering here frames the problems a little more clearly so that my situation can be understood. Aaron Howard North Syracuse, NY [email protected] wrote: Where did you locate Shadrach in the census? What Town, City, Village, etc.? Have you tried to trace his grandfather in previous censuses? Or, did you look for his grandfather or grandmother's obits? They may lead to a clue of what children they had previously lost. Have you looked for Guardianship papers at the County Court house? Or the Surrogate records from his grandparents or others with the same last name? Did you look at the death indexes from the very beginning of record for the family last name? I know Jones is difficult, but back then it may have been very less common & easier to track. As for baptismal records, back in the late 1800s it might be easier to track if you check the city directories to see where the family may have been living, then approach a neighborhood church to see if they would look in those records. I always try to look in strange places & then I sometimes get lucky & find the answers I am looking for. Sometimes it takes a long time ... years, but other times the timing is correct & it is right there. I wouldn't send to the State for anything without a Certificate number, you've lost your money if you do. I wonder if he would have been in the Military, or if he had applied for a Social Security Card? Other places to look for information (this can cost money, so do it as a last resort, but before sending another contribution to NYS DOH) I hope this makes sense. Anne Ruggeri Brewerton, NY - ------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page – FREE download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/