thanks- Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "'pic'" <pic73@worldnet.att.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2008 8:38 AM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery >A Sawyer is someone who works at a Saw Mill and cuts the trees into boards. > It is a rather large saw either manual or electric. In early days it was > manual blade with cutting teeth on both sides and required to people to do > it. > > pic > > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

A Sawyer is someone who works at a Saw Mill and cuts the trees into boards. It is a rather large saw either manual or electric. In early days it was manual blade with cutting teeth on both sides and required to people to do it. pic

You said that you have the deed information--did that include who bought the plot deed? That could be a clue as to who they followed to the US. I think you are right older people just don't pick up to start a new life in another country unless they were following someone there (good chance it was a daughter). Who is now buried in the plot they were previously buried in? They might be relatives. Passenger lists for that time period are really tough, not much to work with. Was there anything generated by the English for people leaving the country that might help? I know in Sweden the church records indicated when the individual was leaving the country. They had a state church like England has the "Church of England"--is there anything that might have been generated by them? What about papers in their hometown in England that might be like a "gossip column" where by they mention that they are going to see relatives in the states? That's about all I can think of--it seems like you have covered all your basis and the window of time you have to work with is so slim! Good Luck, Joan -------------- Original message -------------- From: "N. Gabriele Harkey" <ngharkey@sbcglobal.net> > Does anyone have people buried there? > It turns out I have 2, one died 1865 and was reinterred there in 1872, the > other died in > 1869 and was reinterred there in 1877. This makes no sense to me. > > I have the deed and have visited the cemetery. As luck would have it, this > is the ONLY > part of the cemetery that has gone to waste. The office was surprised to > see there was a deed > for the plots they were in as it was the *indigent* section and most plots > were free, pauper > burials, some in groups. A caretaker took the plat map and walked out where > approximately > the graves would have been. Of course there are no stones anymore. > > The ledger in the office had the information for the deed but not when it > was bought, or why they > were reinterred there, and even more oddly, why not together. > > Husband died in 1865 and was moved there in 1872. > Wife dies in 1869 and gets moved in 1877. > One would think they would have been moved together in 1872 as both were > dead by then. > > Has anyone dealt with the archivist there? How hard is it to deal with > them. The people > in the cemetery office said that is where I might find the answers. > They were all very helpful. > > > tia, > Gabriele > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message

Well, not *too* much you can do to Walker and from England, but yes, I tried a few variations. I am pretty good at finding the obscure but so far not in thsi case. Unfortunately census does not help much as they came after 1861 and both died before 1870. I am sure about his occupation before he arrives, 1841, 1851 and 1861 English census has him as a carpenter / craftsman / cabinet maker. He had apprentices for cabinet making as well. 1861 Victualler (Tavern Keeper) was added. There must be another child I never found in England whom he followed to the states. There had to be someone named Walker with a school aged boy - elementary school range, aged about 9-11 between 1865 and 1869. Unfortunately Walker is a common name and it is not unusual to find a Robert and Sarah Walker in approximate age range. I have yet to find a ship manifest with them on it. The answers are out there somewhere. Gabriele ----- Original Message ----- From: Sue Maxwell To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery Oh, also- you need to check various spellings, too. Maybe it got spelled wrong. I have found one man's name spelled two different ways Nagle and Nagel; and Scherrer can be spelled, Scherrer, Scherer, Scheerer, Sherer, and Schearer, in the city directories. I was just over looking up city directories and was amazed with what I found by looking at different spellings. Is it, also possible that he lived with someone else and wasn't the head of the house? Maybe with some children? You might try the census for that- I have found that quite a few times. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "N. Gabriele Harkey" <ngharkey@sbcglobal.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 11:57 AM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery >I looked, no sign of them there either. > I must have overlooked something somewhere..... > Maybe just too many Robt Walker's in the directories > but none had an occupation that made sense for this man. > > > Gabriele > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Sue Maxwell > To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 1:48 PM > Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > > > city directories > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > Jim Garrity, List Administrator jimgarrity@earthlink.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thankyou for the info pat -------------- Original message -------------- From: "BobClancy" <clancspa@earthlink.net> > The IGG web site does not have a database for births. If the county of birth > is known, a request for a search and birth certificate can be submitted > directly to the New York City archives. The state of New York does not have > vital record information for the City. > > An alternative is to rent, from through your local LDS Family History > Center, a microfilm index of births. The index will contain the certificate > number which you can get by renting the microfilm containing the > certificate or order directly from Salt Lake. > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: > Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 10:26 PM > To: > Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] NY /1905/ Leah Olivia Bryant /Cert # > > > I went to that site ,but I did not find any link for birth cert. #'s > > > > pat > > > > -------------- Original message -------------- > > From: cheap@simon.com > > > >> "You can get the certificate number at Italiangen.org web site and click > >> on > >> a link there > >> to get an application to send in to the Municipal Archives for a copy of > >> the certificate." > >> > >> I didn't know italiangen had birth certificates, Thanks for the info. > >> > >> Thanks, > >> Carol L. Heap > >> Florida > >> Jim Garrity, List Administrator > >> jimgarrity@earthlink.net > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > >> quotes in > >> the subject and the body of the message > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message

Oh, also- you need to check various spellings, too. Maybe it got spelled wrong. I have found one man's name spelled two different ways Nagle and Nagel; and Scherrer can be spelled, Scherrer, Scherer, Scheerer, Sherer, and Schearer, in the city directories. I was just over looking up city directories and was amazed with what I found by looking at different spellings. Is it, also possible that he lived with someone else and wasn't the head of the house? Maybe with some children? You might try the census for that- I have found that quite a few times. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "N. Gabriele Harkey" <ngharkey@sbcglobal.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 11:57 AM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery >I looked, no sign of them there either. > I must have overlooked something somewhere..... > Maybe just too many Robt Walker's in the directories > but none had an occupation that made sense for this man. > > > Gabriele > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Sue Maxwell > To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 1:48 PM > Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > > > city directories > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

that doesn't mean anything- I am researching one family and it is surprizing how their occupations change- for example, a blacksmith could be a laborer . I found a new one today- a "sawyer," and I saw it twice so it wasn't a mispelling for lawyer. Everything on paper is notoriously questionable. I discovered people missing when they should have been there, also. What kind of occupation seems reasonable? Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "N. Gabriele Harkey" <ngharkey@sbcglobal.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 11:57 AM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery >I looked, no sign of them there either. > I must have overlooked something somewhere..... > Maybe just too many Robt Walker's in the directories > but none had an occupation that made sense for this man. > > > Gabriele > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Sue Maxwell > To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 1:48 PM > Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > > > city directories > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Yes they did and even who bought it...wonderful!!! Now I just need to find someone in Queens who'll take a photo :-) -----Original Message----- From: nynewyor-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nynewyor-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Elizabeth V Cardinal Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 2:43 PM To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Calvary Cemetery Queens NY <<I spoke to Calvary and they were wonderful - gave me all sorts of fascinating information. There was no wait and no charge!!!>> Terrific. Did they tell you who else was buried in the plot? Elizabeth V. Cardinal evc1369@comcast.net Jim Garrity, List Administrator jimgarrity@earthlink.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

<<I spoke to Calvary and they were wonderful - gave me all sorts of fascinating information. There was no wait and no charge!!!>> Terrific. Did they tell you who else was buried in the plot? Elizabeth V. Cardinal evc1369@comcast.net

I spoke to Calvary and they were wonderful - gave me all sorts of fascinating information. There was no wait and no charge!!! -----Original Message----- From: nynewyor-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nynewyor-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Elizabeth V Cardinal Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 9:17 AM To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Calvary Cemetery Queens NY Call Calvary and they will confirm the person is interred there. They will tell you how many others are in the same grave give you a price for obtaining the information. They do not confirm headstones. You will either have to visit in person or find someone willing to look for you. Elizabeth V. Cardinal evc1369@comcast.net Jim Garrity, List Administrator jimgarrity@earthlink.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Keep in my mind that the person who gave the information regarding occupation may have been mistaken. Elizabeth V. Cardinal evc1369@comcast.net

I looked, no sign of them there either. I must have overlooked something somewhere..... Maybe just too many Robt Walker's in the directories but none had an occupation that made sense for this man. Gabriele ----- Original Message ----- From: Sue Maxwell To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 1:48 PM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery city directories

Robert E. WALKER b. abt 1806 - London d. 25 June 1865 Sarah Elizabeth Walker nee BLUNT b. 1802 - London d. 25 Feb 1869 It is a mystery I have been revisiting for a few years now. They came from England after spring of 1861 as I located them in the Staffs census for 1861. Robert Walker dies June 25, 1865 and is now buried at Evergreens, as of 1872. Sarah Walker dies Feb 25, 1869. Now also at Evergreens. as of 1877. Plot is No. 2654 Path Side, both are there. I have not been able to pinpoint when between 1861 and 1865 they came. A son Robert arrives in 1866, another, Letford, in 1871. With the deaths in June of 1865 and Feb of 1869 they fall into a census hole. I have found nothing I can say for sure would be them in any newspapers either. I went through all the death cards at the 42nd St Library and found no trace of them. I looked through the 1865 census, nothing. The only evidence I have they were even there is the cemetery deed and the printed death cards which were in the possession of an old, now dead, aunt. I did find a *good boy card* from the NY City schools for an *illegible* Walker, it was together with the deed and other documents. They were way to old to have school aged children, perhaps there were other children besides the ones I have in my data that came before they did. I find it hard to believe Robert Walker and his wife, over the age of 60, would just pick up and leave England for NY if not following someone. I could be wrong. In England Robert was a Cabinet Maker and Victualler. Because of the *good boy* card issued by NY City schools I am leaning towards them having resided in Manhattan or Bronx as opposed to Brooklyn as Brooklyn was not part of NYC yet at that date. Such a mystery... thanks for reading. Any idea on how to hunt them down in a census hole? Gabriele ----- Original Message ----- From: Sue Maxwell To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 12:23 PM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery Also, maybe it was a financial problem that prevented them from moving both parents at the same time. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Maxwell" <suemaxwell@comcast.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 9:53 AM Subject: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > Often people are buried someplace first, if a cemetery didn't open until > after their death- they were moved from one to another. And often people > are moved from one place to another, inorder to have them together in the > same place. I have some ancestors buried there, but that info is buried in > some folder of a line I havn't worked on in a long time; if my memory > serves me, they were buried there first and moved some other place. I > agree- it does seem odd, and there may be reasons that you don't yet > understand- problems in the family, indecision of the children about where > to bury. It was inundated with people after it opened and many were moved > to other cemeteries in NYC. > > The cemetery has been in use since 1851. > > Sue > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > Jim Garrity, List Administrator jimgarrity@earthlink.net ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

city directories ----- Original Message ----- From: "N. Gabriele Harkey" <ngharkey@sbcglobal.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > Robert E. WALKER b. abt 1806 - London d. 25 June 1865 > Sarah Elizabeth Walker nee BLUNT b. 1802 - London d. 25 Feb 1869 > > It is a mystery I have been revisiting for a few years now. > They came from England after spring of 1861 as I located > them in the Staffs census for 1861. Robert Walker dies > June 25, 1865 and is now buried at Evergreens, as of 1872. > > Sarah Walker dies Feb 25, 1869. Now also at Evergreens. > as of 1877. > > Plot is No. 2654 Path Side, both are there. > > I have not been able to pinpoint when between 1861 > and 1865 they came. A son Robert arrives in 1866, > another, Letford, in 1871. With the deaths in June of 1865 and > Feb of 1869 they fall into a census hole. > I have found nothing I can say for sure would be them in any > newspapers either. > > I went through all the death cards at the 42nd St Library and > found no trace of them. I looked through the 1865 census, nothing. > The only evidence I have they were even there is the cemetery deed and > the printed death cards which were in the possession of an old, now dead, > aunt. > > I did find a *good boy card* from the NY City schools for an *illegible* > Walker, > it was together with the deed and other documents. They were way to old > to > have > school aged children, perhaps there were other children besides the ones I > have in my > data that came before they did. I find it hard to believe Robert Walker > and > his > wife, over the age of 60, would just pick up and leave England for NY if > not following someone. I could be wrong. In England Robert was a Cabinet > Maker > and Victualler. > > Because of the *good boy* card issued by NY City schools I am leaning > towards them having resided in Manhattan or Bronx as opposed to > Brooklyn as Brooklyn was not part of NYC yet at that date. > Such a mystery... thanks for reading. > > Any idea on how to hunt them down in a census hole? > > Gabriele > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Sue Maxwell > To: nynewyor@rootsweb.com > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 12:23 PM > Subject: Re: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > > > Also, maybe it was a financial problem that prevented them from moving > both > parents at the same time. Sue > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sue Maxwell" <suemaxwell@comcast.net> > To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 9:53 AM > Subject: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > > >> Often people are buried someplace first, if a cemetery didn't open until >> after their death- they were moved from one to another. And often people >> are moved from one place to another, inorder to have them together in the >> same place. I have some ancestors buried there, but that info is buried >> in >> some folder of a line I havn't worked on in a long time; if my memory >> serves me, they were buried there first and moved some other place. I >> agree- it does seem odd, and there may be reasons that you don't yet >> understand- problems in the family, indecision of the children about >> where >> to bury. It was inundated with people after it opened and many were moved >> to other cemeteries in NYC. >> >> The cemetery has been in use since 1851. >> >> Sue >> Jim Garrity, List Administrator >> jimgarrity@earthlink.net >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Gabriele, I do have people there (Bethel Slope area) but they were buried and stayed put. Would they have been moved to there from a different cemetery? Different dates of relocation might have been for financial reasons. Possibly there never were tombstones. I had a surname only marker put in Cypress Hills where there are 13 burials and never a tombstone. I was unaware of an 'archivist.' This is someone outside the office?? --Noelle On Jan 25, 2008 11:12 AM, N. Gabriele Harkey <ngharkey@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > Does anyone have people buried there? > It turns out I have 2, one died 1865 and was reinterred there in 1872, the > other died in > 1869 and was reinterred there in 1877. This makes no sense to me. > > I have the deed and have visited the cemetery. As luck would have it, > this > is the ONLY > part of the cemetery that has gone to waste. The office was surprised to > see there was a deed > for the plots they were in as it was the *indigent* section and most plots > were free, pauper > burials, some in groups. A caretaker took the plat map and walked out > where > approximately > the graves would have been. Of course there are no stones anymore. > > The ledger in the office had the information for the deed but not when it > was bought, or why they > were reinterred there, and even more oddly, why not together. > > Husband died in 1865 and was moved there in 1872. > Wife dies in 1869 and gets moved in 1877. > One would think they would have been moved together in 1872 as both were > dead by then. > > Has anyone dealt with the archivist there? How hard is it to deal with > them. The people > in the cemetery office said that is where I might find the answers. > They were all very helpful. > > > tia, > Gabriele > > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Does anyone have people buried there? It turns out I have 2, one died 1865 and was reinterred there in 1872, the other died in 1869 and was reinterred there in 1877. This makes no sense to me. I have the deed and have visited the cemetery. As luck would have it, this is the ONLY part of the cemetery that has gone to waste. The office was surprised to see there was a deed for the plots they were in as it was the *indigent* section and most plots were free, pauper burials, some in groups. A caretaker took the plat map and walked out where approximately the graves would have been. Of course there are no stones anymore. The ledger in the office had the information for the deed but not when it was bought, or why they were reinterred there, and even more oddly, why not together. Husband died in 1865 and was moved there in 1872. Wife dies in 1869 and gets moved in 1877. One would think they would have been moved together in 1872 as both were dead by then. Has anyone dealt with the archivist there? How hard is it to deal with them. The people in the cemetery office said that is where I might find the answers. They were all very helpful. tia, Gabriele

Also, maybe it was a financial problem that prevented them from moving both parents at the same time. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Maxwell" <suemaxwell@comcast.net> To: <nynewyor@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2008 9:53 AM Subject: [NYNEWYOR] Evergreen Cemetery > Often people are buried someplace first, if a cemetery didn't open until > after their death- they were moved from one to another. And often people > are moved from one place to another, inorder to have them together in the > same place. I have some ancestors buried there, but that info is buried in > some folder of a line I havn't worked on in a long time; if my memory > serves me, they were buried there first and moved some other place. I > agree- it does seem odd, and there may be reasons that you don't yet > understand- problems in the family, indecision of the children about where > to bury. It was inundated with people after it opened and many were moved > to other cemeteries in NYC. > > The cemetery has been in use since 1851. > > Sue > Jim Garrity, List Administrator > jimgarrity@earthlink.net > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYNEWYOR-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Often people are buried someplace first, if a cemetery didn't open until after their death- they were moved from one to another. And often people are moved from one place to another, inorder to have them together in the same place. I have some ancestors buried there, but that info is buried in some folder of a line I havn't worked on in a long time; if my memory serves me, they were buried there first and moved some other place. I agree- it does seem odd, and there may be reasons that you don't yet understand- problems in the family, indecision of the children about where to bury. It was inundated with people after it opened and many were moved to other cemeteries in NYC. The cemetery has been in use since 1851. Sue

A will IF one was made and IF it was filed would be in the courthouse along with any probate records. A will is only filed if a probate is opened. A probate may not have been necessary. It depends on the terms of the will and so on. An in person search is required. You also asked: <<Would a will have been necessary if he had a wife but no children or other relatives living in America?>> There is NO law requiring anyone to have a will. Elizabeth V. Cardinal evc1369@comcast.net

Hello LIST, Where would I look for a will for someone who died in 1950 (I have the exact date). Would a will have been necessary if he had a wife but no children or other relatives living in America? Sorry for all the questions today....but I know so little about research in NY. Fiona. IGP County Down Coordinator http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/