Dick, Many thanks. I've turned fultonhistory, the census, ancestry records and newspapers, and everything else inside out. Her name was Isabell Fyvie and as you have in 1920, she was the wife of Jesse. I have an obit for a Fidell who died in 1894. leaving a wife and two young children, none named. I can't seem to find any of the (Fidell) survivors in 1900, but by 1910 I found Fred and Jesse in Lenox. The ages are good for them to have been young children of someone who died in 1894. Then I found an obit for Frances Dibble, with sons Fred and Jesse Fidell. I have a strong feeling, but can't prove that she was the wife and they were the children. I can't find any other Fidells who would fit the scenario, but that doesn't mean that somebody didn't adopt them and change their name, in which case I'll never find them. I appreciate your help. Cheers, Joan ----- Original Message ----- From: Rich Hill To: nymadiso@rootsweb.com Sent: Monday, June 28, 2010 8:48 PM Subject: Re: [NYMADISO] Fidell family >From an obit in the Utica Observer Dispatch, Sat. July 3, 1971 Mrs. Isabell FIDELL. 78 of 219 east Railroad Street, Oneida, a retired domestic, died Friday [so July 2] in City of Oneida Hospital. born in Canastotoa d/o James & Margaret [REMORA/RAMONE? FYVLIE? unreadable]. First Methodist Episcopal ch. 3 sons: Frederick of California Roger of Indianapolis Jess FIDELL Jr. of Oneida 1 dau Mrs. Joseph [Marion] PERRETTA of Canastota. (fultonhistory.com) Then from 1920 census ED 125, Sheet 9A, FIDELL Jessie head owns mortgage age 32 b. NY finisher silver ware factory Isabell age 28 Frederick 10 Rodger 7 Wannettabell 5 Marion 3 Carlton 2mos. [is this Jesse Jr.?] (ancestry.com) That should get you started. Dick Hillenbrand Upstate New York Genealogy www.UNYG.com/ www.UNYG.com/blog/ Another genealogy research tool: www.GenealogyDNA.com

Joan, My friend Dick Barr saw the message on the Madison mail list and sent me a bit of FIDELL research he did for someone a while back so will forward his message that has an attachment. Let me know if the attachment does not forward and can send it separtely. Not sure it has anything to do with your people but in the same neighborhood, so might give you some ideas. Best Dick Hillenbrand On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 8:39 PM, Joan Rebholz <jurebholz@comcast.net> wrote: > Dick, > > Many thanks. I've turned fultonhistory, the census, ancestry records and > newspapers, and everything else inside out. Her name was Isabell Fyvie and > as you have in 1920, she was the wife of Jesse. > > I have an obit for a Fidell who died in 1894. leaving a wife and two young > children, none named. I can't seem to find any of the (Fidell) survivors in > 1900, but by 1910 I found Fred and Jesse in Lenox. The ages are good for > them to have been young children of someone who died in 1894. Then I found > an obit for Frances Dibble, with sons Fred and Jesse Fidell. I have a > strong feeling, but can't prove that she was the wife and they were the > children. I can't find any other Fidells who would fit the scenario, but > that doesn't mean that somebody didn't adopt them and change their name, in > which case I'll never find them. > > I appreciate your help. > Cheers, > Joan > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Rich Hill > To: nymadiso@rootsweb.com > Sent: Monday, June 28, 2010 8:48 PM > Subject: Re: [NYMADISO] Fidell family > > > >From an obit in the Utica Observer Dispatch, Sat. July 3, 1971 > Mrs. Isabell FIDELL. 78 of 219 east Railroad Street, Oneida, a retired > domestic, died Friday [so July 2] in City of Oneida Hospital. born in > Canastotoa d/o James & Margaret [REMORA/RAMONE? FYVLIE? unreadable]. > First > Methodist Episcopal ch. > 3 sons: > Frederick of California > Roger of Indianapolis > Jess FIDELL Jr. of Oneida > 1 dau Mrs. Joseph [Marion] PERRETTA of Canastota. > (fultonhistory.com) > > > Then from 1920 census ED 125, Sheet 9A, > FIDELL Jessie head owns mortgage age 32 b. NY finisher silver ware > factory > Isabell age 28 > Frederick 10 > Rodger 7 > Wannettabell 5 > Marion 3 > Carlton 2mos. [is this Jesse Jr.?] > (ancestry.com) > > That should get you started. > > Dick Hillenbrand > Upstate New York Genealogy > www.UNYG.com/ > www.UNYG.com/blog/ > > Another genealogy research tool: > www.GenealogyDNA.com > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NYMADISO-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Joan, It looks like you are building a strong case for presumption of this Frances and her boys in the obit to be the correct family. Sometimes the absence of any other records, as documented by your research records ruling them out, is sufficient to establish the highest probability that these are the correct family members. I know it isn't as satisfying as absolute proof. I can see you've been very thorough in your search, however a couple thoughts crossed my mind that you didn't mention trying. If the funeral home still exists that handled Frances' burial, contact them and see if they have any records that they would copy for you. You may find some new clues to renew your search. Or perhaps the cemetery has some records. Was there a marriage license issued when she married Edward Dibble, or a church record made? It might list her maiden name. Regarding the 1900 census, if you are relying on Ancestry's transcriptions, the surname may have been transcribed incorrectly. I find errors like that on Ancestry constantly. I always submit corrections for them. Since the boys are in Madison Co. in 1910, and if you haven't already done so, you might just read every page of the 1900 census for Madison County and see if you can find the family. Is it Dibble in 1900? When did Frances and Edward marry? You don't mention Frances' date ranges for birth and death. Might she ever have had a drivers license? Did she have a will or any estate that would have been probated? Have you explored who the people were that the boys were boarding with in 1910? I didn't look up Jesse but I saw that Fred, age 19, was boarding in the village of Canastota in town of Lenox, with an older widowed woman and her middle-aged daughter, who was single. Fred was a packer at a furniture factory. Perhaps these woman are actually extended family members. I hope one of these ideas will give you a direction for further research, although I realize that you may have done them already. Good luck. Tink At 06:39 PM 6/28/10, you wrote: >Dick, > >Many thanks. I've turned fultonhistory, the census, ancestry >records and newspapers, and everything else inside out. Her name >was Isabell Fyvie and as you have in 1920, she was the wife of Jesse. > >I have an obit for a Fidell who died in 1894. leaving a wife and two >young children, none named. I can't seem to find any of the >(Fidell) survivors in 1900, but by 1910 I found Fred and Jesse in >Lenox. The ages are good for them to have been young children of >someone who died in 1894. Then I found an obit for Frances Dibble, >with sons Fred and Jesse Fidell. I have a strong feeling, but can't >prove that she was the wife and they were the children. I can't >find any other Fidells who would fit the scenario, but that doesn't >mean that somebody didn't adopt them and change their name, in which >case I'll never find them. > >I appreciate your help. >Cheers, >Joan > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Rich Hill > To: nymadiso@rootsweb.com > Sent: Monday, June 28, 2010 8:48 PM > Subject: Re: [NYMADISO] Fidell family > > > >From an obit in the Utica Observer Dispatch, Sat. July 3, 1971 > Mrs. Isabell FIDELL. 78 of 219 east Railroad Street, Oneida, a retired > domestic, died Friday [so July 2] in City of Oneida Hospital. born in > Canastotoa d/o James & Margaret [REMORA/RAMONE? FYVLIE? unreadable]. First > Methodist Episcopal ch. > 3 sons: > Frederick of California > Roger of Indianapolis > Jess FIDELL Jr. of Oneida > 1 dau Mrs. Joseph [Marion] PERRETTA of Canastota. > (fultonhistory.com) > > > Then from 1920 census ED 125, Sheet 9A, > FIDELL Jessie head owns mortgage age 32 b. NY finisher silver > ware factory > Isabell age 28 > Frederick 10 > Rodger 7 > Wannettabell 5 > Marion 3 > Carlton 2mos. [is this Jesse Jr.?] > (ancestry.com) > > That should get you started. > > Dick Hillenbrand > Upstate New York Genealogy > www.UNYG.com/ > www.UNYG.com/blog/ > > Another genealogy research tool: > www.GenealogyDNA.com > > > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >NYMADISO-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Tink, Thanks for the very thoughtful suggestions. The story is a little more convoluted. The obit for Frances Dibble (1867 - 1948) mentioned another son with the surname Brewer. So, unless she adopted Fred and Jesse Fidell, she was apparently married (at least) three times, and probably divorced from Brewer. I found a marriage record for the Brewer son, and this had a fourth surname for Frances, which I assumed to be her maiden name. She and Dibble are in the 1930 census, having been married since ~1921. I have done first name searches, surname searches, and in a few cases pulled the names of everybody in the towns, everything I can think of, and otherwise Frances succeeded in being very elusive, but I'm not even sure how much piecing together her subsequent history would help to confirm that she and Chris Fidell were the natural parents of Jesse and Fred. I cannot find a phone number for the cemetery where Frances was buried, but I see that the funeral home that buried Frances and Jesse Fidell is still in business, so I'll call them, although I've not had much luck with funeral homes in the past. She's in Oakwood Cemetery where Fidell and Dibble are also buried. Maybe I'll luck out and find out that she's buried with Fidell. Based on Dick H.'s suggestion, I think I'll also look into some surrogate court records. I do believe that there's a strong case here, as you pointed out, but it will be a good learning experience delving into some of these new (to me) sources. Many thanks again, Cheers, Joan ----- Original Message ----- From: Tink Miller To: nymadiso@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2010 4:47 AM Subject: Re: [NYMADISO] Fidell family Hi Joan, It looks like you are building a strong case for presumption of this Frances and her boys in the obit to be the correct family. Sometimes the absence of any other records, as documented by your research records ruling them out, is sufficient to establish the highest probability that these are the correct family members. I know it isn't as satisfying as absolute proof. I can see you've been very thorough in your search, however a couple thoughts crossed my mind that you didn't mention trying. If the funeral home still exists that handled Frances' burial, contact them and see if they have any records that they would copy for you. You may find some new clues to renew your search. Or perhaps the cemetery has some records. Was there a marriage license issued when she married Edward Dibble, or a church record made? It might list her maiden name. Regarding the 1900 census, if you are relying on Ancestry's transcriptions, the surname may have been transcribed incorrectly. I find errors like that on Ancestry constantly. I always submit corrections for them. Since the boys are in Madison Co. in 1910, and if you haven't already done so, you might just read every page of the 1900 census for Madison County and see if you can find the family. Is it Dibble in 1900? When did Frances and Edward marry? You don't mention Frances' date ranges for birth and death. Might she ever have had a drivers license? Did she have a will or any estate that would have been probated? Have you explored who the people were that the boys were boarding with in 1910? I didn't look up Jesse but I saw that Fred, age 19, was boarding in the village of Canastota in town of Lenox, with an older widowed woman and her middle-aged daughter, who was single. Fred was a packer at a furniture factory. Perhaps these woman are actually extended family members. I hope one of these ideas will give you a direction for further research, although I realize that you may have done them already. Good luck. Tink