Dorothy Koenig wrote: > > Dear Otto, No, I don't agree with your assumptions :-). You have entered > a forest of Vosbughs and have to proceed cautiously from the known to the > unknown. Names alone won't do the trick. The safest way is to establish > whole family groups as far as possible from contemporary records and then > see what reasonable conclusions can be drawn. > > I think we are in agreement that your Samuel Vosburgh was the one baptized > at Kinderhook on 3 Sep 1769. Here are the 3 children we found baptized in > that church -- children of Johannes A. Vosburg and Sara Gardinier. > All-important baptismal sponsors are included: > > 6 Jun 1767 Abraham Herman Van Buren, Eva Van Slyk (his wife) > 3 Sep 1769 Samuel Abraham Van Vleck, Jannetje Vosburg (his wife) > 22 Nov 1778 Pieter Pieter A. Vosbnurg, Helena Gardinier > > In the book "New York Marriages before 1784" I found the following > marriages. Note that the book contains only marriage *licenses*, not the > records of church marriages. > > 10 Jun 1763 Harmen Van Bueren and Eva Slyeck > 18 Apr 1768 Abraham I. Van Vleck and Jane Vosburg > 15 May 1765 John Abraham Vosburg and Sarah Gardinier. > > Form this you have confirmation that John, the father of your Samuel, was > indeed the son of an Abraham Vosburg. You can also determine that these > were all young couples and that none of them would be of the generation of > John Abraham Vosburg's parents. > > My working assumption is that the "Pieter A. Vosburg" who was a baptismal > sponsor for his namesake "Pieter" baptized on 22 Nov 1778 was the > *brother* of John Abrahams Vosburg. > > There is a significant gap between 1769 and 1778 in the above baptisms. > If we could discover where John and Sarah might have had other children > baptized, it would be nice to have the names of possible daughters! > > So now we are looking for an Abraham Vosburg who had sons named John and > Peter. Since the immigrant Vosburg was named Abraham Pietersz Vosburg, > there is no shortage of candidates! > > In the Albany DRC an Abraham Vosburg and his wife Elizabeth Winne (already > suggested as parents in a previous message) had these sons baptized > > 3 Jul 1726 Pieter Pieter Winne, Maria Van Buuren > 7 Oct 1739 Johannes Harmen Ganzevoort, Annatje Hun > > I think a more likely possibility is Abraham Vosburg and Geertie Van den > Berg because this Abraham was the son of Isaac Vosburg "of Kinderhook" and > his wife Anna Jans Goes. Geertie was the daughter of Willem Gysberts van > den Berg and Catherine van der Poel. (Abraham Vosburg is #18 on the > descendancy chart you have posted. There are a couple of flaws in that > compiled family group, i.e. the eldest son, Isaac, does not appear. The > baptism of Anna was in 1725 (not 1735), and the youngest child was named > "Marritje" (not Nanetje). > > All of the children of Abraham Vosburg and Geertie Van den Berg were > baptized in the Albany DRC: > > 15 Jul 1720 Isaac Gerrit vd Berg, Neeltie Abeel > 2 Dec 1722 Willem Wynant & Alida vd Berg > 25 Nov 1725 Annetje Levinus Lieves, Catherine vd Berg > 21 Apr 1728 Catherine Gysbert & Catherine vd Berg > 17 Oct 1730 Petrus W. & Geertie vd Berg > 2 Oct 1733 Geertie W. G. vd Berg & Rebecca Fonda > 6 Oct 1737 Johannes W. & Catherine vd Berg > 9 Jan 1740 Marritie Franciscus & Marritje Lansing > > There is a discouraging lack of Vosburg baptismal sponsors! > > If the Johannes Abrahams Vosburg baptized on 6 Oct 1737 happens to be the > one who married Sarah Gardinier, a *possible* (not certain!) line of > descent for your Samuel Vosburg who married Cathrina Burghardt is > > Abraham Pietersz Vosburg and Geertruy Pieters Coeymans > Isaac Vosburg and Anna Jans Goes > Abraham Vosburg and Geertie van den Burg > Johannes Vosburg and Sarah Gardinier > Samuel Vosburg and Catherine Burghardt > > If you reconstruct all the family groups and understand the presence of > all the baptismal witnesses and if the dates and places are coherent from > the contemporary records, then you have a much better chance of > establishing a sound line of descent. I offer these suggestions a a > tentative roadmap for you :-). > > Dorothy Dorothy: Your approach is very thorough! Abraham and Pieter VOSBURGHs also appear as siblings in the descendants of Abraham VOSBURGH and Claartje BRESIE: Descendants of Abraham Vosburgh Generation No. 1 1. ABRAHAM4 VOSBURGH (JACOB ABRAHAMSEN3, ABRAHAM PIETERSE2, PIETE JACOBITE1) was born Abt. 1680. He married CLAARTJE BRESIE, daughter of CHRISTOPHER BRESIE and CHRISTINA CLAESGEN. She was born Abt. 1684. More About CLAARTJE BRESIE: Christening: Abt. 1684, Zion Lutheran, Athens, Greene, NY Children of ABRAHAM VOSBURGH and CLAARTJE BRESIE are: i. JACOB5 VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1705. ii. DORTHEA VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1707. iii. CHRISTOFFEL VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1709. iv. MARYTJE VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1711. v. CHRISTINA VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1714. vi. ABRAHAM VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1719. vii. ISAAC VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1720. viii. GEERTY VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1721. ix. JANNETJE VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1723. x. LENA VOSBURGH. 2. xi. CORNELIUS VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1725; d. 1796. xii. PIETER VOSBURGH, b. Abt. 1727. The family of the above Abraham and Claartje is intriguing, because a BURGHARDT cousin of Cathrina, who m. Samuel VOSBURGH, also married a BRESIE [see below] Descendants of Lambert Burghardt Generation No. 1 1. LAMBERT5 BURGHARDT (HENDRIK4, COENRAAT HENDRICKSE3, HENDRICK COENRAETSE2 BURCHARDT, COENRAET HENDRICKSE1) was born Abt. 1735 in probably Kinderhook, Columbia, NY, and died 06 September 1821 in West Stockbridge, Berkshire, MA. He married ENGELTIE BRESIE, daughter of CHRISTOFFEL BRESIE and AGNES ROSSMAN. She was born Abt. 1738. More About LAMBERT BURGHARDT: Baptism: 16 January 1736/37, Kinderhook, Columbia, NY More About ENGELTIE BRESIE: Christening: Abt. 1738, Vedder Church, Mt. Ross, Children of LAMBERT BURGHARDT and ENGELTIE BRESIE are: i. HINRICH6 BURGHARDT, b. 1761. More About HINRICH BURGHARDT: Christening: 29 October 1761, Loonenburg, Greene, NY ii. CHRISTOFFEL BURGHARDT, b. 1763. More About CHRISTOFFEL BURGHARDT: Christening: 01 July 1763, Loonenburg, Greene, NY 2. iii. ISAAC BURGHARDT, b. Abt. 1775; d. Salem, Saratoga, NY. Otto Burgett