In a message dated 10/24/2002 7:58:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time, Zina_1@msn.com writes: << I am looking for land records for the Moses Allard farm on Cannon Corners Road in Mooers Forks and also for burial records and obituaries for 1862, 1888, and 1896 on this family. Where do I look? The records are not in Plattsburgh in the County offices, been there done that! >> I'm surprised there are no property records for your family at the courthouse. Have spent considerable times looking through deed books in Plattsburgh and have found a wealth of information. Did you check the Surrogate's office for probate information? For obits--have you checked newspapers on microfilm? Your local library should be able to help you rent reels of newspapers for the appropriate dates. (Did notice there's an Allard listed on the Clinton County Genweb site in the Morning Telegraph index) Have you checked the McLellan survey for burial information? Did a quick look on the Genweb Clinton County site--lists Allards buried in Mooers and Champlain. You can order copies of the pages from the Feinberg Library (Again, check the Genweb site for their address; or you should be able to get it through the county or town historian--or Dick Ward's office at the Plattsburgh Public Library has a complete set of the McLellan survey.) >>Does anyone have an e-mail address for the Mooers Historian, Carol Nedeau?<< This site has a list and information about various Clinton County town historians--including Carol Nedeau, though it gives no e-mail address. Amazing that it may seem, there are still a lot of folks in that part of the world who fill pens with ink and write or use a telephone rather than the magic of e-mail. There is a great deal of information available in Clinton County--one must dig a bit or a lot. Linda Guynup Dewey San Francisco In Clinton County: Guynup, Hare, Butler

I can't put my hands on the material now, but there is a local history association - the American-Canadian something or other, in Keeseville, that has some of the published Clinton County records. Perhaps it might pay to join. I'm sure others on the list are better organized than I am and can give you the address. Best wishes to all - Edie in Maine

I don't recall what names you were researching, but if they were French Canadian or Catholic, there are many parishes in Clinton County that have had their records published. Again, many of these records are spotty as their sometimes wasn't a priest their and it may have been a missionary or traveling priest and the record may not have been recorded in the church registers. Also many of the marriage records only list the Bride and Groom and witnesses, which weren't necessarily the parents. In Keeseville NY there is the Northern NY American Canadian Genealogical Society which has a website at http://www.rootsweb.com/~nnyacgs/. I believe they may charge a fee, or if your a member they will do some look ups. They have published many of the church records for the area and there are other organizations who have published some also. I don't know where you are located but the American Canadian Genealogical Society in Manchester NH has many of these published records of the Catholic Church in their library. I have a copy of the records Baptism, Marriage & Burials for St. Anne's Church in Mooers Forks and also the marriage records for Clinton County (multiple parishes) to 1880. Please send me your look ups if they are catholic and I will check my references though I am very busy and it may take me a couple of days. My e-mail is pacochran29@hotmail.com. Regards, Phil -----Original Message----- From: Little Moose [mailto:MozizRB@webtv.net] Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 1:01 PM To: NYCLINTO-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NYCLINTO] Records for Clinton County prior to 1880. I heard that this is a statewide problem for New York. No Vital Records kept before the mandate was issued in 1880 or 1882 and the little counties didn't get the message until 1884 or 1885. Someone from DAR (Daughters of the American Revolution) Society in Washington DC told me that they call New York State the genealogical "black hole" state. DAR does a lot of work to help people with genealogical research, so they'd know. What I'm told is to find church records...What I wonder is how? How can I know what church, if any, my ancestors would have belonged to? And I've received a lot of cold shoulders from people who have access to records but seem to be afraid that I will ask them to go out of their way to do MY research for me. I feel so bad that before me were requesters who were too overwhelmed, busy piecing things togther, or just plain rude to say a proper "thank you". What I wish is that there would be deposits for records--and I mean ALL the records-- that researchers could access inexpensively without having to ask anyone to go out of their way. But I guess I'm dreaming there. There are LDS family history centers, but from what I've encountered, they are fairly incomplete. Anyone have any other experiences with them or suggestions? Anastasia p*r*a*i*s*e H! I! M from W#H#O#M all blessings f~l~o~w especially for the sacrifice and resurrection of J@E@S@U@S, so that we might have l%i%f%E with H^I^M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ==== NYCLINTO Mailing List ==== NYCLINTO List Administrator: sandymac@powerup.com.au

Anastasia, If you go to www.Familysearch.org. and click on "Library", you will gain access to the entire listing that the LDS Family History Center in Salt Lake City has. You can rent a roll of microfilm for 30 days for $3.50 (may have gone up to $4.00). You do this at the Family History Center near you, as they will have the film sent to them. Using the Library Search is sometimes tricky. To start, you may want to just type in New York and see what comes up. You'll need to write down the number of the film and a brief description on the order blank. Getting this information while you are at home saves a great deal of time. Keep a record of all the film that you view so you won't order the same film twice. The Family History Centers have thousands of microfiches that are often overlooked by people. You may find some data on these, as well. Reading old handwriting is tricky and takes practice. These two sites;http://www.cyndislist.com/handwrit.htm#General and http://www.genealogy.com/genealogy/68_sperry.html?Welcome=1035489446 will give you some background in old handwriting. This site; http://www.genealogia.fi/faq/faq031e.htm has several alphabet formats of old letters that you can copy and print out to use as aides in translating. Good Luck, Mac ----- Original Message ----- From: "Little Moose" <MozizRB@webtv.net> To: <NYCLINTO-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 10:01 AM Subject: Re: [NYCLINTO] Records for Clinton County prior to 1880. > I heard that this is a statewide problem for New York. No Vital Records > kept before the mandate was issued in 1880 or 1882 and the little > counties didn't get the message until 1884 or 1885. Someone from DAR > (Daughters of the American Revolution) Society in Washington DC told me > that they call New York State the genealogical "black hole" state. DAR > does a lot of work to help people with genealogical research, so they'd > know. What I'm told is to find church records...What I wonder is how? > How can I know what church, if any, my ancestors would have belonged to? > And I've received a lot of cold shoulders from people who have access to > records but seem to be afraid that I will ask them to go out of their > way to do MY research for me. I feel so bad that before me were > requesters who were too overwhelmed, busy piecing things togther, or > just plain rude to say a proper "thank you". > > What I wish is that there would be deposits for records--and I mean ALL > the records-- that researchers could access inexpensively without having > to ask anyone to go out of their way. But I guess I'm dreaming there. > There are LDS family history centers, but from what I've encountered, > they are fairly incomplete. Anyone have any other experiences with them > or suggestions? > > Anastasia

So silly of me!! I got talking and I forgot to mention that Addie Shields, Clinton County Historian, at her office in the Clinton County Government Center can send you copies of cemetery records at 25 cents a page in addition to a general search fee of $10. The address there is: Clinton County Government Center; 137 Margaret Street; Plattsburgh, NY 12901. I believe these are post-1880 but ask her to make sure. Anastasia p*r*a*i*s*e H! I! M from W#H#O#M all blessings f~l~o~w especially for the sacrifice and resurrection of J@E@S@U@S, so that we might have l%i%f%E with H^I^M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I heard that this is a statewide problem for New York. No Vital Records kept before the mandate was issued in 1880 or 1882 and the little counties didn't get the message until 1884 or 1885. Someone from DAR (Daughters of the American Revolution) Society in Washington DC told me that they call New York State the genealogical "black hole" state. DAR does a lot of work to help people with genealogical research, so they'd know. What I'm told is to find church records...What I wonder is how? How can I know what church, if any, my ancestors would have belonged to? And I've received a lot of cold shoulders from people who have access to records but seem to be afraid that I will ask them to go out of their way to do MY research for me. I feel so bad that before me were requesters who were too overwhelmed, busy piecing things togther, or just plain rude to say a proper "thank you". What I wish is that there would be deposits for records--and I mean ALL the records-- that researchers could access inexpensively without having to ask anyone to go out of their way. But I guess I'm dreaming there. There are LDS family history centers, but from what I've encountered, they are fairly incomplete. Anyone have any other experiences with them or suggestions? Anastasia p*r*a*i*s*e H! I! M from W#H#O#M all blessings f~l~o~w especially for the sacrifice and resurrection of J@E@S@U@S, so that we might have l%i%f%E with H^I^M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If the records for Clinton County were not kept until 1880, then where are the records prior to this date? Are they in another county? I am looking for land records for the Moses Allard farm on Cannon Corners Road in Mooers Forks and also for burial records and obitituaries for 1862, 1888, and 1896 on this family. Where do I look? The records are not in Plattsburgh in the County offices, been there done that! Does anyone have an e-mail address for the Mooers Historian, Carol Nedeau? Thanks in advance. Leatrice in Ma.

At 08:35 PM 10/23/02 -0400, you wrote: >Anyway, on the Bond family list from Ellenburg, >a FRANK BOND married a MINNIE WILLIAMS between 1882-1908. Do you have >more information about this couple? Ellenburg is near the Dannemora >area. >Any info, however vague, appreciated. >Anastasia Hope this helps. 1900 census for Clinton, Clinton Co. NY has Frank Bond b. Aug 1870 NY, father b. NY, mother b. VT; wife Minnie b. May 1882 NY, parents both b. NY, married 2 years, 1 child, 1 child living; and daughter Bernice b. Feb. 1900 in NY. If you have access to the LDS 1880 census CD's, you may be able to locate him with his parents. This was on census pages 197 (2nd of 2) and 198. Anothe bond family nearby has a John b. NY and wife Charlotte b. VT - so possibly these are connected. They had been married 43 years. I can provide additional info on John and Charlotte from the census if you are interested. Florence

Hi, Did you know that Lacelle carries a "dit" name of Duclos and there are many Duclos listings in the St. John the Baptist repertoire. Just a thought. Andree > I was despairing of connecting with other researchers on this mailing > list, but perhaps I should be a little more optimistic. I'm researching > primarily the LASELL/LACELL/LASELLE/LACELLE family and the BOND family > in Clinton County, most of which information seems to have been lost > post 1852. I know but I can't "prove" that the LASELLS at this time > were Abenaki Indian, and also had connections somehow with Canada, so > this of course complicates things. The Vital Records for Clinton County > were not kept until 1880s, so I'm told, and since the names etc Thelma > LaBombard, Ellenburg town clerk, provided don't connect with anything > online I would need to buy more official copies than I can afford. > > Anyway, on the Bond family list from Ellenburg, > a FRANK BOND married a MINNIE WILLIAMS between 1882-1908. Do you have > more information about this couple? Ellenburg is near the Dannemora > area. > > > Any info, however vague, appreciated. > > Anastasia > > > p*r*a*i*s*e H! I! M from W#H#O#M all blessings > f~l~o~w > especially for the sacrifice and resurrection of J@E@S@U@S, so that we > might have l%i%f%E > with H^I^M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >

Here is a list of Vital Records of names Lasells and Bonds in Ellenburg married into: BOND Chester to Ella SHUTTS 1882-1908 Elliot to Angie GRIFFEN 1882-1908 Frank to Minnie WILLIAMS 1882-1908 Frederick to Frances HARVEY 1882-1908 Clarence to Laura MONETTE 1908-1927 Fred to L. DELONE 1908-1927 Elsie to Ralph GOOD 1908-1927 Addie Amelia to Marshall Milo LASELL 1871 Seth to Ruth SHAW ?1840? LASELL Willard to Pearle Edythe DREW 1903 Hubert Harlan to Mae SPAULDING 1903 Milo Galen to Ella Frances HITMAN 1897 Luella Alberta to George Widmer BROOKS 1901 Henry to Frances HUGGINS 1911 Marshall to Sarah TURNEY 1927 Bernice to Oswald GIBSON 1927 Napolian Jr to Ellen HEDDING 1909 Arnold to Irene SCOFFIELD 1928 LASELLE Merrill Gilbert to Sarah Maria WHITE 1872 Haskell Smith to Sarah Jane SARGENT 1870 Loron Marcellus to Sarah Emma WIGHT 1878 Henry Robertt to Gertrude May WELCH 1889 Henry to ?Henriette VIVIA? 1882-1908 Any info concerning any of these families appreciated. Please email me at: WINTRESSANNA@YAHOO.COM Anastasia p*r*a*i*s*e H! I! M from W#H#O#M all blessings f~l~o~w especially for the sacrifice and resurrection of J@E@S@U@S, so that we might have l%i%f%E with H^I^M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello there... I was despairing of connecting with other researchers on this mailing list, but perhaps I should be a little more optimistic. I'm researching primarily the LASELL/LACELL/LASELLE/LACELLE family and the BOND family in Clinton County, most of which information seems to have been lost post 1852. I know but I can't "prove" that the LASELLS at this time were Abenaki Indian, and also had connections somehow with Canada, so this of course complicates things. The Vital Records for Clinton County were not kept until 1880s, so I'm told, and since the names etc Thelma LaBombard, Ellenburg town clerk, provided don't connect with anything online I would need to buy more official copies than I can afford. Anyway, on the Bond family list from Ellenburg, a FRANK BOND married a MINNIE WILLIAMS between 1882-1908. Do you have more information about this couple? Ellenburg is near the Dannemora area. Any info, however vague, appreciated. Anastasia p*r*a*i*s*e H! I! M from W#H#O#M all blessings f~l~o~w especially for the sacrifice and resurrection of J@E@S@U@S, so that we might have l%i%f%E with H^I^M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Pat, Nope, wasn't referring to Dannemora. That prison has been there for about 100 years now. My father was a guard there and we lived in Dannemora. My dad worked in the mines in Lyon Mountain before that. The Correctional facility that I was referring to is relatively new. I think it's a minimum security facility, unlike Dannemora, which is maximum security. There are a few "minimum security" prison in Northern New York now, probably because the land was so cheap since the small farmers all but disappeared from that area. As for the records, I don't think you'll have any luck at the town levels, however, as they are really small in that area. Dannemora is only about 4,000 (same as it was when I went to school there, nearly fifty years ago!) and the largest in the area, next to Plattsburg. Any old vital statistics would be in Plattsburgh, it if Clinton County at all. The Family History Center has a great deal of microfilm that would be much faster than waiting on a reply if a person had to go to Albany for the information, which is where it probably is, if it still exist. Clinton County records are a bit skimpy and take some time to research. Mac > I believe you are referring to Dannemora prison? It was there at least > since the 1930's. My mother had a cousin or uncle who worked there. My > great great grandfather lived in Lyon Mountain but I had thought it was > closer to Franklin County. I didn't know it was close to Dannemora. > > Pat >

Hi Robin, Thanks so much for the website. I know about Roots web, but I should search more to find these little treasures. Take care, Bryant RobinCoon@aol.com wrote:If you ever need to find out what county a town is in, you can go to http://resources.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/townco.cgi Type in the town & state, it will bring back the county. I use it frequently. Robin Bryant Florida --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site

Thanks for your help on this matter. It gives me something to go on. Bryant "R. L. McKinney" <Moonandsixpence@attbi.com> wrote:Lyon Mountain is in Clinton County and may be within the Town of Dannemora, as it is not far to the west of it. In it's heyday, it was an iron mining town, complete with company housing, store and gas station. If you are in the area, you can easily see the remnants of what was once called "ore sand", still in piles that once dotted the landscape, on a much larger scale, a half century ago. The State of New York has built a correction facility in the town in recent years, the mines closing up nearly forty years ago. Bryant Florida --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site

Hi Pat, Thanks for your help on my Lyon Mountain questions. And, your help into church records. Your last name is also my middle name and is somewhat tied up with my search into Lyon Mountain. My great grandmother was suppose to be a Mohawk Indian and married a white miner in Clinton County, in the Dannemora area. His name was Warren Williams, and his father was Hezekiah Williams of Plattsburgh. What I'm searching for desperately is the name of my great grandmother who married Warren Williams, maybe in Lyon Mountain. They had a child named Caroline Louise Williams, who was born in August, 1885. They also had a son named Edward in 1883. Warren Williams and his wife either separated, or the wife died. Either way, Warren gave up the children to other family members. And here is the other person I'm desperately looking for more information on, my grandmother, Caroline Louise Williams. She married a William Garfield Dunn in 1907 in NYC. They had one child, my mother. Caroline Dunn left her husband and returned, I think to Clinton County and either lived or married again to a man named Boynton. William Garfield Dunn used to vacation a lot in Clinton Co, in the Plattsburgh area, Malone, Lyon Mountain, and so on. If you run across any information on Warren Williams and his wife and children, please send it on! It would be most valuable. Thank you, Pat. Bryant Dunn Martin Patricia Dunn <modapa@sssnet.com> wrote:Hi, Bryant, I'm not sure where to look for Lyon Mountain records, probably in Saranac. Lyon Mountain was in Clinton County. Saranac is the town listed on my great great grandfather, Dennis Gonyea's death certificate. Who are you looking for? I have some church records for that area. Pat Bryant Florida --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site

If you ever need to find out what county a town is in, you can go to <A HREF="http://resources.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/townco.cgi">http://resources.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/townco.cgi</A> Type in the town & state, it will bring back the county. I use it frequently. Robin

Hi Pat, I noticed you listed a Dennis Gonyea. My great grandmother's sister, Josephine Patenaude married a Edward Louis Gonyea, b. abt Nov 1865 Rouses Point, NY, d. Nov 10, 1938 Indian Orchard, MA. married Josephine Patenaude bet. 1882-1883 ? She was born April 15, 1865 in VT., died Sept. 24, 1947 Indian Orchard, MA. They had 9 known children; Annie M. Gonyea; Lillian A. Gonyea, m. (1)Edward F. Collins, m. (2)Charles H. Mitchell, Jr.; Louis E. Gonyea; Alexander H. Gonyea; Marguerite E. Gonyea, m.Daniel J. Belleville; Bertha Louise Gonyea, m. Theodore Parker Mills; Lawrence Leo Gonyea, m. Lyla L. Griswold; Leonidas Floyd Gonyea; and Joseph Oliver Gonyea, m. Katherine V. Magiera. Do you have any of these Gonyea's in your line? Roberta Cyr Springfield, Ma. > Subj:Re: [NYCLINTO] Lyon Mountain, again. > Date:10/22/02 10:35:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time > From: modapa@sssnet.com (Patricia Dunn) > Reply-to: NYCLINTO-L@rootsweb.com > To: NYCLINTO-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > Hi, Bryant, > > I'm not sure where to look for Lyon Mountain records, probably in Saranac. > Lyon Mountain was in Clinton County. Saranac is the town listed on my great > great grandfather, Dennis Gonyea's death certificate. Who are you looking > for? I have some church records for that area. > > Pat >

Hi , You might want to check out this website, http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~clinton/ it has a map of all the towns in Clinton County. You might find it in there. Pat ----- Original Message ----- From: "bryant martin" <picketchar1863@yahoo.com> To: <NYCLINTO-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 5:49 PM Subject: [NYCLINTO] Lyon Mountain, again. > > Hi > > First, thanks for the two replies to my post on "Lyon Mountain." I'm glad it still exists! > > To McKinney: No, sorry, not related to any of those families. > > Can my helpers, or anyone else, tell me what county Lyon Mountain is in? Clinton or Franklin? Also, to what township (town) I would mail a request to get vital records for Lyon Mountain? > > Lyon Mountain is not listed as a separate township on any website I've checked. So, it must be part of a township like Saranac? Or, which one? > > Thanks for continuing help. > > Bryant > > > Bryant > Florida > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site >

Hi, Bryant, I'm not sure where to look for Lyon Mountain records, probably in Saranac. Lyon Mountain was in Clinton County. Saranac is the town listed on my great great grandfather, Dennis Gonyea's death certificate. Who are you looking for? I have some church records for that area. Pat ----- Original Message ----- From: "bryant martin" <picketchar1863@yahoo.com> To: <NYCLINTO-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 5:49 PM Subject: [NYCLINTO] Lyon Mountain, again. > > Hi > > First, thanks for the two replies to my post on "Lyon Mountain." I'm glad it still exists! > > To McKinney: No, sorry, not related to any of those families. > > Can my helpers, or anyone else, tell me what county Lyon Mountain is in? Clinton or Franklin? Also, to what township (town) I would mail a request to get vital records for Lyon Mountain? > > Lyon Mountain is not listed as a separate township on any website I've checked. So, it must be part of a township like Saranac? Or, which one? > > Thanks for continuing help. > > Bryant > > > Bryant > Florida > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site >