Hi, I am going to answer this on line in hopes that it might ring a bell for someone else. I very much appreciate the brainstorming that I got from Elizabeth and Judy. I am very satisfied that I have researched the family in America. I just know nothing about them when they were in Germany. The information for the NYC reference came from the two obituaries. I had thought originally that they went directly to Ohio. Altho the two obituaries differ in many places they both say that they lived for several (2 o3) years in NY. Some of the things that I have for the American time period. 1. All of the census records - these give different places such as Prussia and Nassau and I have researched how that might have changed. 2. William shows as a bucketmaker (Ohio) in the first census that I have for him. That sounds more like farming area to me. Not too long after that he opened a shop (Ohio(. I have no idea of what he did in NYC. 3. They belonged to a non denominational church. It was a German church where wervices were conducted in German. William was very active in the church. I wrote to the church because I did hope that they might have birth or marriage records. I never received an answer. 4. I have death certificates for the children who died in Ohio. They are on line. There is some conflicting information but I was able to sort that out depending who gave the information. This is where I found Henrietta maiden name. I do not have them for William and Henrietta. Henrietta died in 1895 and I do not have an obituary for her. Wiloliam died in 1908 and I do not have a death certificate for him. I have the two obituaries for him. 5. William and Henrietta were burried in Mounds Cemetery (quite a history for that cemetery.) Only one child is buried there. The remainder are in several different cemeteries. A super kind person person went to all of the other cemeteries and took tombstone pictures and then went into the office and got the records for them. I would never have asked anyone to do this. She just did it and sent all of the information to me. 6. The tree that is on line is missing two of the children (I had not seen that tree before.) I have a beautiful picture of all seven children (5 boys and 2 girls) The children who are missing are William Louis Meuser who was living in San Francisco by the 1870s and Caroline (Carrie) who was married but did live in Ohio. I have the names of all of their spouses. 7. The four boys who were in Ohio had a piano manufacturing business about the turn of the century. The Newspaper Archives have the newspapers for that city and time period. There was very much information in those newspapers. The papers also had many of their social activities. 8. You would be surprized at how many people have a surname of Meuser in Germany. Without knowing the place I can't tell which might be them and I don't speak or read German/ 9. From family lore and the obituaries it is clear that they arrived sometime between 1850-1853. 10. I took one of those genealogy trips to Salt Lake City. There are people there who are specialist in German research. They tried to help me but we found nothing. They had URLs for sites that I had never heard of. Practically every record gave a different place of birth or living for them. (census records and obituaries and family lore)I even managed to get my brother (like pulling teeth) to help me decide which place was theirs. I think that there were 7 different places. We could not figure it out but we did rate them and think that they probably lived near Franfurt. We put circles around the places and several intersected near Franfurt. My father said that none of the relatives were Catholic. We think that what he was saying was that they were from a more Protestant area which seems to be in the north so we took that into consideration. Since Frankfurt is not a port we were also trying to decide where they would have sailed from. Anyway, we have an entire page of possible places. If anyone can think of anything else I would certainly welcome their input. Thanks, Velma -----Original Message----- From: nyc-roots-request <nyc-roots-request@rootsweb.com> To: nyc-roots <nyc-roots@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tue, Sep 6, 2011 12:30 am Subject: NYC-ROOTS Digest, Vol 6, Issue 131 Today's Topics: 1. Looking for a NY marriage between 1850-1853 (knowltonew@earthlink.net) 2. Re: Looking for a NY marriage between 1850-1853 (J. Eggers) 3. Elisabeth Christiansen (Kim Hawkins) 4. Re: Elisabeth Christiansen (Kate) 5. NYC & Brooklyn City Directories--Online Source (VLB) 6. Re: Elisabeth Christiansen (Kim Danielsen) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 07:43:56 -0400 From: "knowltonew@earthlink.net" <knowltonew@earthlink.net> Subject: [NYC-ROOTS] Looking for a NY marriage between 1850-1853 To: nyc-roots@rootsweb.com Message-ID: <380-22011915114356625@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Velma, You did not indicate whether you had done all your census work. Did the Meusers die before a census that would give their year of immigration? Or how many years they were married? What were their years of birth? Also, we are assuming they lived in New York CITY, but you do not actually say this. Since they lived in Ohio cities, it is certainly possible that they were city people and first lived in NYC. What was William's occupation? Keep in mind that the records of NYC are quite separate from those of New York State. I agree it is likely that they were married in NY since no children were born until Ohio. However, a first child might have died at birth. Frankly, New York is a miserable state in which to do research (LOL), and I have been doing this for 25 years. The indexes for NYC vital records are only very recently on line and roughly cover the period from the 1890s forward. Here is a check list of research I would use in your case. You may very well have done some of it. Census records in Ohio for every single descendant. Vital records for same. Cemetery records for same, including tombstones. Church records City directories for same. Great you have obituaries. Match them up with death certificates for William and Henrietta in Ohio to see matching and new information, who gave that information, etc. It is unusual for people to move on their own without knowing others who have made the journey before. Keep alert in Ohio for not only other family members but people in the church records who may be part of the migrating community. One of those might have on his/her tombstone the place of origin in Germany (although this is more commonly done in the Irish community). Be happy these people were Germans as they are good record keepers. Be happy also the name is Meuser and not Schmidt (as in my case). Since you know William's occupation from Ohio, check NYC directories for him in that small time period. [A little may be on Ancestry now, but you will not have to rent many LDS NYC directory films to know whether William is listed.] If you get an address for William, then you can narrow down the church where the couple may have married. You do not say whether they were Roman Catholic or Protestant (perhaps Lutheran). Check also for the Stahls. If Henrietta was single in NYC, it is doubtful she came immigrated alone. You know neither is on the US 1850 census for NY? I suggest you read material from the Brooklyn NY Genealogy website http://www.bklyn-genealogy-info.com/ not because your ancestors were in Brooklyn but because it is just so good and inclusive with lots of information about Manhattan (since so many Brooklynites first lived there). I did a Meuser search for you, but all dates were 1870s and earlier. However, read information on site below. Vital records did not really begin in New York state until 1880s. http://www.bklyn-genealogy-info.com/Marriage/index.html There is also information on Manhattan churches that would allow you to figure out their church if you had an address from a directory. Those city directories are like gold and worth any rental money you might pay for films if necessary. Hmm, I see someone has a tree for this person, that he did live until 1900 census, and that he never lived in a large city, rather Marietta and Massillon, OH. It says year of immigration is unknown--so that is out. Edward is born 1857. How do you know the years William is in NY? http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/16339876/person/390769402 Is this your tree? >My ancestors- William Meuser and his wife Henrietta Stahl Meuser were in New York between 1850-1853. I can not find the ship that they were on to come to America. and thus do not know what year they arrived. I do not know if they were married in Germany or America.< Elizabeth W. Knowlton in Atlanta where supposedly it is finally raining, but only a thimblefull has fallen. ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2011 11:22:00 -0400 From: "J. Eggers" <msgene@mac.com> Subject: Re: [NYC-ROOTS] Looking for a NY marriage between 1850-1853 To: nyc-roots@rootsweb.com Message-ID: <FB384641-16B6-4821-9A8D-143CCF131541@mac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Hi, I tried to find a marriage record for 1850-1854 in the NYC Archives. The response I received from the archives was "Marriage records predates extant Civil Vital records". They recommended I find the church where they married. As for that, I have no idea. Judy On Sep 5, 2011, at 2:54 AM, kalishoek@eircom.net wrote: > Did you try www.italiangen.com great for new york records and not > just italian ones > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From:vjspringer@aol.com > To:NYC-ROOTS@rootsweb.com > Subject:[NYC-ROOTS] Looking for a NY marriage between 1850-1853 > > > Hi, > > I am new to this list and have no idea what is available in New York. > My ancestors- William Meuser and his wife Henrietta Stahl Meuser were > in New York between 1850-1853. I can not find the ship that they were > on to come to America. and thus do not know what year they > arrived. I > do not know if they were married in Germany or America. > > They eventually moved to Ohio about 1853. The problem is that when > William died there were two obituaries in the newspaper.s They lived > in > one Ohio City. When his wife died, William moved to another city where > his children lived. One obituary was in the paper where they lived > so > many years together. > The other was in the city where his children lived and where he lived > for a little over 10 years. The problem is that the information in > the two obituaries did not have the same information. The basics were > the same such as the names of their children, name of spouse etc. > The > Germany part and the New York part were not the same. One said that > William was born near Frankfurt. The other said that William was > born > in Hamburg. Those two cities are quite a distance apart. The > census records show different places of birth but the family is the > same on all of them. There is quite a disparity in the information > for the years that they lived in New York. That would include whether > they married in Germany or America. > > I have looked everywhere that I can think of except this list. I am > wondering if there are marriage records for the time period between > 1850-1853. > I think that New York might be where they were married. Their first > child was born in 1855 in Ohio. It seems as if they would have had a > child earlier if they were married in Germany. There are lots of > William Meusers and several Henrietta Stahls on the LDS birth records > for Germany. I find no German marriage record for them. That is > another reason why I think that they might have been married in New > York. > > Thanks for any help that you can be to me. > Velma > VJSpringer@aol.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYC-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYC-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message Judith Eggers jeeggers@mac.com ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 11:31:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Kim Hawkins <khawk67@yahoo.com> Subject: [NYC-ROOTS] Elisabeth Christiansen To: NYC list <NYC-roots-L@rootsweb.com>, NYBrooklyn NYBrooklyn <NYBROOKLYN@rootsweb.com> Message-ID: <1315247496.72174.YahooMailClassic@web112612.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Im trying to find a date of death for Elisabeth (Elisa, Lizzie) Christiansen. She immigrated in 1885 with one son, her husband must have already been in the US. He died before 1900. I found her in the 1900 and 1910 census's living in Brooklyn. She was b. October 21, 1838 in Hederslev, Denmark. The census records all say she was born in Germany but I believe the town of Hederslev had changed hands between Danish and German rule several times in history. She had 3 children all born in Denmark. On the 1910 census she is living with her son august. On the 1920 census he is married and living in Queens. I believe Elisabeth died in Brooklyn between 1910 and 1920 but cant find any death record for her. Ive tried the IGG, Brooklyn info pages, ancestry, familysearch and findagrave. Does anyone know of any other way to find a death date for her? I just moved to a new town, a suburb of detroit, and Im sure there must be an LDS church around here somewhere...would they have other records? Thanks. Kim ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 12:28:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Kate <chrismomxyz@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [NYC-ROOTS] Elisabeth Christiansen To: nyc-roots@rootsweb.com Message-ID: <1315250907.40107.YahooMailClassic@web65910.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Have you tried maybe looking for an obituary on Old Fulton Postcards? Or Chronicling America? Both free sites- Kate --- On Mon, 9/5/11, Kim Hawkins <khawk67@yahoo.com> wrote: From: Kim Hawkins <khawk67@yahoo.com> Subject: [NYC-ROOTS] Elisabeth Christiansen To: "NYC list" <NYC-roots-L@rootsweb.com>, "NYBrooklyn NYBrooklyn" <NYBROOKLYN@rootsweb.com> Date: Monday, September 5, 2011, 2:31 PM Im trying to find a date of death for Elisabeth (Elisa, Lizzie) Christiansen.? She immigrated in 1885 with one son, her husband must have already been in the US.? He died before 1900.? I found her in the 1900 and 1910 census's living in Brooklyn.? She was b. October 21, 1838 in Hederslev, Denmark. The census records all say she was born in Germany but I believe the town of Hederslev had changed hands between Danish and German rule several times in history. She had 3 children all born in Denmark.? On the 1910 census she is living with her son august.? On the 1920 census he is married and living in Queens.? I believe Elisabeth died in Brooklyn between 1910 and 1920 but cant find any death record for her.? Ive tried the IGG, Brooklyn info pages, ancestry, familysearch and findagrave.? Does anyone know of any other way to find a death date for her?? I just moved to a new town, a suburb of detroit, and Im sure there must be an LDS church around here somewhere...would they have other records?? Thanks. Kim ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYC-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 12:41:53 -0700 (PDT) From: VLB <vlbcfb@yahoo.com> Subject: [NYC-ROOTS] NYC & Brooklyn City Directories--Online Source To: "NYC-roots-L@rootsweb.com" <NYC-roots-L@rootsweb.com> Message-ID: <1315251713.328.YahooMailNeo@web161016.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 New York City (Manhattan) directories are available online from 1786 thru the early 1900s at Fold3.com, formerly called Footnote.com.? They also have Brooklyn directories from 1862 thru the early 1900s.? These have been a goldmine of info?in my search.? They have other databases too, military, naturalizations etc. It is a paid subscription site but has been well worth it for me with my legion of NY/Brooklyn ancestors.? The down side is that it has to be the most annoying website on the internet that I go to.? Very slow to load, poor search function, lots of tech glitches?etc etc. A hint.? When searching a name, look instead for a common name that might be near it alphabetically.? In searching for my McCaw ancestors, I enter "McCarthy", of whom there are many.? If there is a McCaw, he will be nearby.? On Fold3.com, McCarthy will bring results; McCaw will not. This is in reply to the person looking for a marriage record.?You may find where your ancestor was living and then the church.?I changed the subject line to be more useful to others as well.? Virginia ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 19:12:49 -0700 From: Kim Danielsen <rmagickd@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [NYC-ROOTS] Elisabeth Christiansen To: "nyc-roots@rootsweb.com" <nyc-roots@rootsweb.com> Message-ID: <D73B4683-314F-4F2D-9510-07657CB17E23@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii There are 2 websites to try - both free. The Italian genealogy group and the German genealogy group. Both have indexes for various NYC records including vital records and naturalizations. The vital record indexes include the certif. # and where to send away for a copy. I've found quite a few records there, particularly at the Italian site. You can google it. ...Kim Danielsen Sent from my iPhone On Sep 5, 2011, at 11:31 AM, Kim Hawkins <khawk67@yahoo.com> wrote: > Im trying to find a date of death for Elisabeth (Elisa, Lizzie) Christiansen. She immigrated in 1885 with one son, her husband must have already been in the US. He died before 1900. I found her in the 1900 and 1910 census's living in Brooklyn. She was b. October 21, 1838 in Hederslev, Denmark. The census records all say she was born in Germany but I believe the town of Hederslev had changed hands between Danish and German rule several times in history. She had 3 children all born in Denmark. On the 1910 census she is living with her son august. On the 1920 census he is married and living in Queens. I believe Elisabeth died in Brooklyn between 1910 and 1920 but cant find any death record for her. Ive tried the IGG, Brooklyn info pages, ancestry, familysearch and findagrave. Does anyone know of any other way to find a death date for her? I just moved to a new town, a suburb of detroit, and Im sure there must be an LDS church around here > somewhere...would they have other records? Thanks. > Kim > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYC-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------ To contact the NYC-ROOTS list administrator, send an email to NYC-ROOTS-admin@rootsweb.com. To post a message to the NYC-ROOTS mailing list, send an email to NYC-ROOTS@rootsweb.com. __________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NYC-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body of the email with no additional text. End of NYC-ROOTS Digest, Vol 6, Issue 131 *****************************************