Dear Walter and Jan, Thank you for the reply. It is nice to find someone with such knowledge of an area I am just beginning to research. Some more questions for ya- Do I write to the City Hall in the town of Islip for marriage and birth records? If not the town of Islip, then where? I am looking for Marriage and birth records between 1885 and 1892. Where there city directories which included this area? In the hamlet of Bay Shore what could be likely occupations for a poor French immigrant who spoke little English? He married Katherine Kerrigan, who arrived from Ireland. Were there many Irish in the Islip area? Lastly, family lore is that they met at the "docks" and lived in NYC. I originally presumed this to mean they met at Angel Island and lived in Manhatten. Since I now know from his naturalization papers that he lived in Bay Shore, were there docks there that may be the docks that he met his future wife at? Perhaps he was employed there. Forgive me for rambling, but I have busted through many a brick wall that way! Lilly Murphy Cleveland

NY - Columbia - Vol. R 1882-1885 (21 Jan) OH - Belmont - Vol. M (1879-1882) (21 Jan) MD - Frederick - Vol. 16-19 (1864-1884) (a portion is missing) (21 Jan) NY - New York - Vol. 48-49 (1808-1811) (21 Jan) NY - Madison - Vol. 29-30 (1885-1887) (21 Jan) Free as ever to browse and to use as resource/reference as well to find yours. http://www.sampubco.com/ W. David Samuelsen SAMPUBCO

All - this is an absolutely fascinating aspect of American history and needs to be understood, for genealogical, social and historical reasons. Tom Cooper Cleveland, OH

Also try this site, it's great too. www.NancyCanfield.com I'm building my business by referrals, and yours is valuable to me. If you hear of anyone who is buying or selling a home, I'd appreciate it if you'd give them my name and number. Thanks so much. -----Original Message----- From: Janice Miller [mailto:jgrellim@sbcglobal.net] Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:10 PM To: NY-LONGISLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NY-LONGISLAND] Orphans Court? Walter What an outstanding website! I am printing all 37 pages to take to my class next week. In the meantime, I will be trying to get to some of the sites suggested. I had absolutely no clue there were separate courts to deal with this sad situation. >From class, I also learned that there were many Irish children in this as well. Their parents too, were poor and often unable to find work, leaving their children destitute. Because much of my husband's history is in Illinois, I was aware of the Orphan Trains, but not the source from which these poor kids originated. Thank you. My associates in the class will be impressed--as am I. Jan Soyamaven@aol.com wrote: On 1/22/04 (3:11:11 PM MST), as part of an eMail, Jan G. Miller (jgrellim@sbcglobal.net) asked, "Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as my task for next class!" The information you seek might be available at: http://www.hnoh.com/ Regards, Walter Greenspan ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== Karima, List Administrator mailto:NY-LONGISLAND-admin@rootsweb.com List Guidelines: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html Jan G. Miller jgrellim@sbcglobal.net ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== Please do not send messages to the list asking the members to join in "letter writing" campaigns, regardless of the purpose. Guidelines for the list can be found at: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html

Thank you Jim. I've received an eye-opening response--I've been doing the genealogists route for almost 10 years and never run across this very significant source. Probably a lot of people haven't tapped it, either. I breezed along thinking merely "courts". That a special court for this special situation existed is a whole new doorway. Thanks. Jan "James L. Stokes" <jlstokes@redrose.net> wrote: Hi Jan, The courts vary from state to state, in Pa. (including Philadelphia) the orphan's court would have handled wills. They would also have handled children who's parents had died, especially if the father had died. If the mother died and the father was still alive, probably nothing would be done because married woman were not allowed to own property by law. Any property they owned would become their husband's property at marriage. It was not uncommon for these assets to be left until the children were of marrying age where they would be used to help a young married couple get started. Money might have also been deducted from their accounts for their maintenance if necessary. If the mother remarried the step father was almost never appointed guardian, it was almost always someone else, a relative, an older brother (above age) or a friend of the family. There was no Department of Children Services to see to the welfare of children, if no one presented the case to Orphan's Court then nothing would be done. There was no city or state agency looking for these cases, it would only come up if someone brought it to the attention of the Orphan's Court, like a relative or friend of the family. Occasionally these things would be handled by the family, unofficially, and there would be no record. This was more common in rural areas and among some religious sects, like Mennonites. In the time frame your working on there was a distinction between Philadelphia city and county. The two were merged into one political unit in 1854. When the father died his assets would be accessed by a representative of the orphan's court and a portion would be given to each of the kids and to the wife. A guardian would be appointed to look out for their economic interests of the children, they wouldn't live with this person, he was to see that the kids legacy wasn't squandered or wasted. Guardians were appointed for boys under 16 and girls under 18, boys over 14 could choose their own guardian while girls over 16 were given the same choice. The rest of the children would have guardians appointed. Boys over 14 may have been apprenticed or hired out, girls that age may also have been hired out. They also may have been placed in an orphanage, placed with relatives or adopted. If adopted they should be a reference in the Orphan's Court records. You might find the youngest children in the 1850 census, if they were living with a family with a different surname they should be listed on the indexes. I'm not familiar with New York, in New Jersey they had a similar court but with a different name, they also probably had different rules and proceedures. Good luck. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Janice Miller" To: Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 5:10 PM Subject: [NY-LONGISLAND] Orphans Court? > Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. > > Where would I start to look for such a court--in particular, NYC. If so, I would presume there might be the same for Boston or Philadelphia at one time or another as well. > > I have one family in which both parents were dead by 1839 and the youngest child was only 1 1/2. There were slightly older siblings, so now I am curious as to how those 6 young children were cared for. > > Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as my task for next class! Jan > > > > > Jan G. Miller > jgrellim@sbcglobal.net > > > ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== > Karima, List Administrator mailto:NY-LONGISLAND-admin@rootsweb.com > List Guidelines: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html > > ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== * * * IS YOUR ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE UP TO DATE?? * * * Karima, List Administrator mailto:NY-LONGISLAND-admin@rootsweb.com List Guidelines: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html Jan G. Miller jgrellim@sbcglobal.net

Hi Jan, The courts vary from state to state, in Pa. (including Philadelphia) the orphan's court would have handled wills. They would also have handled children who's parents had died, especially if the father had died. If the mother died and the father was still alive, probably nothing would be done because married woman were not allowed to own property by law. Any property they owned would become their husband's property at marriage. It was not uncommon for these assets to be left until the children were of marrying age where they would be used to help a young married couple get started. Money might have also been deducted from their accounts for their maintenance if necessary. If the mother remarried the step father was almost never appointed guardian, it was almost always someone else, a relative, an older brother (above age) or a friend of the family. There was no Department of Children Services to see to the welfare of children, if no one presented the case to Orphan's Court then nothing would be done. There was no city or state agency looking for these cases, it would only come up if someone brought it to the attention of the Orphan's Court, like a relative or friend of the family. Occasionally these things would be handled by the family, unofficially, and there would be no record. This was more common in rural areas and among some religious sects, like Mennonites. In the time frame your working on there was a distinction between Philadelphia city and county. The two were merged into one political unit in 1854. When the father died his assets would be accessed by a representative of the orphan's court and a portion would be given to each of the kids and to the wife. A guardian would be appointed to look out for their economic interests of the children, they wouldn't live with this person, he was to see that the kids legacy wasn't squandered or wasted. Guardians were appointed for boys under 16 and girls under 18, boys over 14 could choose their own guardian while girls over 16 were given the same choice. The rest of the children would have guardians appointed. Boys over 14 may have been apprenticed or hired out, girls that age may also have been hired out. They also may have been placed in an orphanage, placed with relatives or adopted. If adopted they should be a reference in the Orphan's Court records. You might find the youngest children in the 1850 census, if they were living with a family with a different surname they should be listed on the indexes. I'm not familiar with New York, in New Jersey they had a similar court but with a different name, they also probably had different rules and proceedures. Good luck. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Janice Miller" <jgrellim@sbcglobal.net> To: <NY-LONGISLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 5:10 PM Subject: [NY-LONGISLAND] Orphans Court? > Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. > > Where would I start to look for such a court--in particular, NYC. If so, I would presume there might be the same for Boston or Philadelphia at one time or another as well. > > I have one family in which both parents were dead by 1839 and the youngest child was only 1 1/2. There were slightly older siblings, so now I am curious as to how those 6 young children were cared for. > > Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as my task for next class! Jan > > > > > Jan G. Miller > jgrellim@sbcglobal.net > > > ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== > Karima, List Administrator mailto:NY-LONGISLAND-admin@rootsweb.com > List Guidelines: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html > >

Walter What an outstanding website! I am printing all 37 pages to take to my class next week. In the meantime, I will be trying to get to some of the sites suggested. I had absolutely no clue there were separate courts to deal with this sad situation. From class, I also learned that there were many Irish children in this as well. Their parents too, were poor and often unable to find work, leaving their children destitute. Because much of my husband's history is in Illinois, I was aware of the Orphan Trains, but not the source from which these poor kids originated. Thank you. My associates in the class will be impressed--as am I. Jan Soyamaven@aol.com wrote: On 1/22/04 (3:11:11 PM MST), as part of an eMail, Jan G. Miller (jgrellim@sbcglobal.net) asked, "Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as my task for next class!" The information you seek might be available at: http://www.hnoh.com/ Regards, Walter Greenspan ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== Karima, List Administrator mailto:NY-LONGISLAND-admin@rootsweb.com List Guidelines: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html Jan G. Miller jgrellim@sbcglobal.net

I don't know where you live, but a physical copy is usually found in a historical library very near where I live. It is a frequently used source, so the chances for it to be part of a library's holdings are good. Jan Flsu40@aol.com wrote:Can anyone tell me if this book is available on line somewhere? I'm looking for a Joseph King of New London Ct and wife Hannah, daughter Sybil b abt 1759. Sybils marriage records show she was of Oysterpond / Orient when she married ( Jan 24, 1788 ) to Moses Griffing / Griffin who was living in southold at that time. This couple settled on Shelter Island. I am trying to "pin down" her parents who I've found named as above, quoted from the book, REFUGEES OF 1766 FROM LI TO CT. Any help would be appreciated! :) Thanks Susan Winters ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== Please do not send messages to the list asking the members to join in "letter writing" campaigns, regardless of the purpose. Guidelines for the list can be found at: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html Jan G. Miller jgrellim@sbcglobal.net

I checked, the book is available at ProQuest Heritage Quest, but you need to have a subscription, Terre

Can anyone tell me if this book is available on line somewhere? I'm looking for a Joseph King of New London Ct and wife Hannah, daughter Sybil b abt 1759. Sybils marriage records show she was of Oysterpond / Orient when she married ( Jan 24, 1788 ) to Moses Griffing / Griffin who was living in southold at that time. This couple settled on Shelter Island. I am trying to "pin down" her parents who I've found named as above, quoted from the book, REFUGEES OF 1766 FROM LI TO CT. Any help would be appreciated! :) Thanks Susan Winters

On 1/22/04 (3:11:11 PM MST), as part of an eMail, Jan G. Miller (jgrellim@sbcglobal.net) asked, "Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as my task for next class!" The information you seek might be available at: http://www.hnoh.com/ Regards, Walter Greenspan

On 1/22/04 (2:53:17 PM MST), Jan in California (jgrellim@sbcglobal.net) wrote, "You will probably receive a more complete answer from Walter Greenspan, who is also subscribed to this list, but I'll wager the records for Bayshore are in Hungington Township. Let's see if I've improved my Long Island lore ." Yes, I did post an answer to Lilly MURPHY (LMlakewood@aol.com) eMail. But, sorry Grasshopper, you lost the wager: Bayshore is in the Town of Islip and Huntington is a town, not a township. Regards, Walter Greenspan

Go to www.google.com and type in: "Orphan Court" you will get over 5,000 hits. Margit > Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that > before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were > Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems > reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. > > Where would I start to look for such a court--in particular, NYC. If so, I > would presume there might be the same for Boston or Philadelphia at one time > or another as well. > > I have one family in which both parents were dead by 1839 and the youngest > child was only 1 1/2. There were slightly older siblings, so now I am curious > as to how those 6 young children were cared for. > > Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as > my task for next class! Jan

Today in class there was reference to Orphan's Court. I hadn't heard that before--perhaps because I paid little attention, although I do know there were Orphan Trains from East Coast cities to the mid-west in the 1800s. It seems reasonable then to accept the existence of Orphan's Courts. Where would I start to look for such a court--in particular, NYC. If so, I would presume there might be the same for Boston or Philadelphia at one time or another as well. I have one family in which both parents were dead by 1839 and the youngest child was only 1 1/2. There were slightly older siblings, so now I am curious as to how those 6 young children were cared for. Because I expressed interest, I was given the research of Orphan's courts as my task for next class! Jan Jan G. Miller jgrellim@sbcglobal.net

You will probably receive a more complete answer from Walter Greenspan, who is also subscribed to this list, but I'll wager the records for Bayshore are in HungingtonTownship. Let's see if I've improved my Long Island lore . Jan in California LMlakewood@aol.com wrote: Hi, I am new to the list. I have recently discovered a Suffolk connection. I am seeking information on Fank NICE/NYS who whas born in France in 1865. He naturualized March 23, 1892 in Suffolk County Court. He gave his residence as Bayshore. The following year he and his family moved to Cleveland, Ohio. He married Katherine KERRIGAN (daughter of Patrick KERRIGAN and Anna CHAMBERS) who was born in Ireland, abt 1885. They had 3 sons born in New York: John NICE born 1887 Joseph NICE born 1888 Harry NICE born 1891 According to census records, Frank immigrated in either 1880 or 1881, however, I can't find him in the 1880 census. I am seeking assitance or advice in locating Suffolk county records between 1881 and 1892. I believe Frank NICE was married and his children were born in Suffolk County. I am also interested in discovering his occupation and address while living there. Are City directories available? Is Bayshore part of the New York City Directories? Frank NICE and Catherine KERRIGAN were Catholic. Was there a Catholic church in Bayshore during this time period? I imagine a marriage record and Christening records for his children would be there. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Lilly MURPHY Cleveland ==== NY-LONGISLAND Mailing List ==== Karima, List Administrator mailto:NY-LONGISLAND-admin@rootsweb.com List Guidelines: http://userweb.springnet1.com/quest/LongIslandWelcome.html Jan G. Miller jgrellim@sbcglobal.net

On 1/22/04 (7:42:21 AM MST), as part of an eMail, Lilly MURPHY (LMlakewood@aol.com) asked, "I am new to the list. I have recently discovered a Suffolk connection. I am seeking information on Fank NICE/NYS who whas born in France in 1865. He naturualized March 23, 1892 in Suffolk County Court. He gave his residence as Bayshore. The following year he and his family moved to Cleveland, Ohio. Is Bayshore part of the New York City Directories? Frank NICE and Catherine KERRIGAN were Catholic. Was there a Catholic church in Bayshore during this time period?" Answering your questions in reverse order: Circa 1890, Bayshore was in the Roman Catholic Diocese of Brooklyn. Since 1957, it has been in the Roman Catholic Diocese of Rockville Centre. Ms. Jean Walsh, Diocesan Archivist Diocesan Archives R.C. DIOCESE OF ROCKVILLE CENTRE Seminary of the Immaculate Conception 440 West Neck Road Huntington, NY 11743 Tel: 631/423-0483, ext. 109 Fax: 631/423-7922 eMail: archives@drvc.org http://www.drvc.org/ Ms. Walsh is responsible for records on and after 1957, when the Diocese of Rockville Centre separated from the Diocese of Brooklyn. Likewise, the Diocese of Brooklyn is responsible for records on and after 1853, when the Diocese of Brooklyn separated from the Diocese of New York. The Diocese of Rockville Centre currently covers all of Nassau County and almost all of Suffolk County, except for Fishers Island. (Fishers Island, in the Town of Southold, Suffolk County, is in the Diocese of Hartford, Connecticut.) Bayshore is a hamlet in the Town of Islip, Suffolk County and is not part of the New York City Directories. For all other questions, you may want to contact the Bay Shore-Brightwaters Public Library. Bay Shore-Brightwaters Public Library One South Country Road Brightwaters, NY 11718 Tel: 631/665-4350 Fax: 631/???-???? eMail: bsbwlib@suffolk.lib.ny.us http://bayshore.suffolk.lib.ny.us/ The pertinent geography: Bay Shore is a hamlet (unincorporated area) in the southwestern section of the Town of Islip, Suffolk County. There are 4 villages (incorporated municipalities) and 23 hamlets all or partly in the Town of Islip. There are no cities and 10 towns in Suffolk County. There are 2 Indian reservations in Suffolk County. (I'm including after my name a NYS Geographic Glossary with the NYS definitions of county, city, town, village, hamlet and postal zone.) Beginning on the north and moving in a clockwise direction, the Hamlet of Bay Shore in the Town of Islip is bordered on the north by Hamlets of Baywood and North Bay Shore; on the east by the Hamlet of Islip; on the south by the Great South Bay; and, on the west by the Village of Brightwaters. And, as occurs in every one of Suffolk County's 157 communities (0 cities, 31 villages and 126 hamlets), the Hamlet of Bay Shore has a different border than does the "Bay Shore, NY 11706" postal zone (i.e., a place can have a Bay Shore mailing address and not be in Bay Shore). Those places that have a "Bay Shore, NY" mailing address that are not in the Hamlet of Bay Shore are in the Hamlet of North Bay Shore, the Hamlet of West Bay Shore, the Hamlet of Baywood, the Hamlet of Islip, the Village of Saltaire and in the Hamlet of Fire Island. For those who have their copy of the 2002 or earlier edition of the LI Population Survey or have already downloaded the report from the Long Island Power Authority web site (eMail me directly if you need instructions on how to access and download the report), you'll find the Hamlet of Bay Shore in the Town of Islip, Suffolk County on pages 14 & 20 (map) and 21 (population estimate). I hope this information is useful or, at least, interesting. Regards, Walter Greenspan . Cities, Towns, Villages, Hamlets and Postal Zones in New York State New York State is divided into counties. County A county is a municipal corporation, a subdivision of the state, created to perform state functions; a "regional" government. All counties are divided into cities, towns and Indian reservations. City A city is a unique governmental entity with its own special charter. Cities are not sub-divided, except into neighborhoods, which are informal geographic areas. Town A town is a municipal corporation and encompasses all territory within the state except that within cities or Indian reservations. Towns can be sub-divided into villages and hamlets. Village A village is a general purpose municipal corporation formed voluntarily by the residents of an area in one or more towns to provide themselves with municipal services. The pattern of village organization is similar to those of a city. A village is divided into neighborhoods, which are informal geographic areas. Hamlet A hamlet is an unincorporated area in one or more towns that is governed at-large by the town(s) it is in. A hamlet is divided into neighborhoods, which are informal geographic areas. Postal Zone "City" and "Town" A postal zone "City" and "Town" is an administrative district established by the U.S. Postal Service to deliver the mail. Postal zone "City" and "Town" may not (but are encouraged to) conform to municipal or community borders. Thus, postal zone location does not always determine city, village or hamlet location. Please be aware: In many areas of New York State, the problem of non-conforming postal zones leads to a situation where the majority of places have a different community name in their mailing address than the community where that place is actually located.

Hi, I am new to the list. I have recently discovered a Suffolk connection. I am seeking information on Fank NICE/NYS who whas born in France in 1865. He naturualized March 23, 1892 in Suffolk County Court. He gave his residence as Bayshore. The following year he and his family moved to Cleveland, Ohio. He married Katherine KERRIGAN (daughter of Patrick KERRIGAN and Anna CHAMBERS) who was born in Ireland, abt 1885. They had 3 sons born in New York: John NICE born 1887 Joseph NICE born 1888 Harry NICE born 1891 According to census records, Frank immigrated in either 1880 or 1881, however, I can't find him in the 1880 census. I am seeking assitance or advice in locating Suffolk county records between 1881 and 1892. I believe Frank NICE was married and his children were born in Suffolk County. I am also interested in discovering his occupation and address while living there. Are City directories available? Is Bayshore part of the New York City Directories? Frank NICE and Catherine KERRIGAN were Catholic. Was there a Catholic church in Bayshore during this time period? I imagine a marriage record and Christening records for his children would be there. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Lilly MURPHY Cleveland

seeking info on decendants Descendants of Jacob Thorne Generation No. 1 1. Jacob4 Thorne (Thomas3, Joseph2, William1)1,2 was born Abt. 1756. He married (1) Hannah Comes. He married (2) Susanna Sherwood March 30, 1779 in St. George's church,Hempsted, L.i., N.Y.. She was born in presumed of Yorktown, family. Notes for Jacob Thorne: He was a Tory like his brothers James & Melanethon. He is listed in the Federal Census of 1790 in Oyster Bay,NY with a family of himself and wife,two sons under age of 16 who may have been Henry Comes and Stephen & two daughters Child of Jacob Thorne and Hannah Comes is: 2 i. Hannah Comes5 Thorne. Children of Jacob Thorne and Susanna Sherwood are: 3 i. Henry Comes5 Thorne, born February 13, 1775. More About Henry Comes Thorne: Baptism: February 13, 1775 4 ii. Stephen Thorne Thorne, born June 10, 1778. Endnotes 1. Family History of the Thorne Family of Long Island. 2. Family Treemaker CD # 173 Long Island Genealogies ,1600-1800's vol #1.

On 1/18/04 (1:39:55 PM MST), as part of an eMail, ????? (Johnlsaywhat@aol.com) wrote, "He was born Abt. 1722 in Musketa Cove L.I., N.Y., and died August 12, 1812 in Cornwall, Orange, NY. Circa 1722, Musketa Cove was a hamlet in the Town of Oyster Bay, Queens County. Now, it's the City of Glen Cove, Nassau County. Bearing that in mind, for questions such as yours, you may want to contact the Glen Cove Public Library: Glen Cove Public Library 4 Glen Cove Avenue Glen Cove, NY 11542-2885 Tel: 516/676-2130 Fax: 516/676-2788 eMail: glencove@lilrc.org http://www.nassaulibrary.org/glencove/ The pertinent geography: Glen Cove is a city in Nassau County and is located in the north central part of Nassau County. There are 2 cites and 3 towns in Nassau County. (I'm including after my name a NYS Geographic Glossary with the NYS definitions of county, city, town, village, hamlet and postal zone.) Glen Cove incorporated as a city in 1918 and became independent of the Town of Oyster Bay. Prior to that date, Glen Cove was a hamlet (unincorporated area) in the Town of Oyster Bay, initially in Queens County until January 1, 1899, and since then in Nassau County. Before it was called Glen Cove, the hamlet was called Musketa Cove. Beginning on the north and moving in a clockwise direction, the City of Glen Cove is bordered on the north by Long Island Sound; on the east by the Villages of Lattingtown and Matinecock in the Town of Oyster Bay; on the south by the Hamlet of Glen Head and the Village of Sea Cliff in the Town of Oyster Bay; and, on the west by Long Island Sound. And, as occurs in all but one of Nassau County's 136 communities (2 cities, 64 villages and 70 hamlets), it has a different border than does the "Glen Cove, NY 11542" postal zone (i.e., a place can have a Glen Cove mailing address and not be in Glen Cove). ...........................................acres ........City of Glen Cove..........4,336 ........Glen Cove, NY 11542....4,496 As you can see, some 160 acres or 3.5% of places with a Glen Cove mailing address are NOT in the City of Glen Cove. These places that have a "Glen Cove" mailing address, but are not in the City of Glen Cove are either in the Village of Lattingtown (incorporated in 1931) or the Village of Matinecock (incorporated in 1928) in the Town of Oyster Bay. For those who have their copy of the 2002 or earlier edition of the LI Population Survey or have already downloaded the report from the Long Island Power Authority web site (eMail me directly if you need instructions on how to access and download the report), you'll find the City of Glen Cove, Nassau County on pages 2, 5 & 11 (map) and 10 (population estimate). I hope this information is useful or, at least, interesting. Regards, Walter Greenspan . Cities, Towns, Villages, Hamlets and Postal Zones in New York State New York State is divided into counties. County A county is a municipal corporation, a subdivision of the state, created to perform state functions; a "regional" government. All counties are divided into cities, towns and Indian reservations. City A city is a unique governmental entity with its own special charter. Cities are not sub-divided, except into neighborhoods, which are informal geographic areas. Town A town is a municipal corporation and encompasses all territory within the state except that within cities or Indian reservations. Towns can be sub-divided into villages and hamlets. Village A village is a general purpose municipal corporation formed voluntarily by the residents of an area in one or more towns to provide themselves with municipal services. The pattern of village organization is similar to those of a city. A village is divided into neighborhoods, which are informal geographic areas. Hamlet A hamlet is an unincorporated area in one or more towns that is governed at-large by the town(s) it is in. A hamlet is divided into neighborhoods, which are informal geographic areas. Postal Zone "City" and "Town" A postal zone "City" and "Town" is an administrative district established by the U.S. Postal Service to deliver the mail. Postal zone "City" and "Town" may not (but are encouraged to) conform to municipal or community borders. Thus, postal zone location does not always determine city, village or hamlet location. Please be aware: In many areas of New York State, the problem of non-conforming postal zones leads to a situation where the majority of places have a different community name in their mailing address than the community where that place is actually located.

searching for info on a Phebe Coles m. Thomas Thorn I have several Pheebe & Phobe Coles this one does not quite fit They did have a daughter that married Zeno Carpenter See below: 1. PHEBE1 COLES She married THOMAS THORN. Child of PHEBE COLES and THOMAS THORN is: 2. i. ELIZABETH2 THORN, b. Abt. 1722, NY. Generation No. 2 2. ELIZABETH2 THORN (PHEBE1 COLES) was born Abt. 1722 in NY. She married ZENO CARPENTER Abt. 1740 in NY, son of BENJAMIN CARPENTER and DIANA ALBERTSON. He was born Abt. 1722 in Musketa Cove L.I., N.Y., and died August 12, 1812 in Cornwall, Orange, NY.