Clearly, I seem to have upset one or two people with my forthright and strongly-held opinions. I am a born-and-bred, died-in-the-wool Yorkshireman and happen to believe in calling a spade a spade and not pussyfooting and tippy-toeing around subjects that seem to worry others. If that offends some folks, then I can only apologise, but it won't change my views! As a retired journalist (over 40 years in the media in local and national newspapers) and the former editor for 10 years of the Journal of One-Name Studies for the Guild of One-Name Studies (twice an award-winning publication), yes, I hold strong opinions and I am not afraid to express them. It seems to me that in these politically correct times far too many people are terrified of saying what they think in case it upsets some timid, precious little soul. I happen to believe, as a family historian, that we should tell it like it is - warts and all - and not be shy about admitting to scandals, illegitimacies, etc, in our family history. We all have them and don't let's pretend we haven't! Now, regarding the issue of privacy, may I be permitted to make a few salient points? 1) It is perfectly open to anyone, wherever they may reside in the world, to obtain the birth, marriage or death certificate of anyone else who was born in England and Wales since 1st July 1837 when civil registration was first introduced. The system has always been a completely open one and rightly so. The reason it is open is to guard against the very thing that some people seem to worry about, i.e. fraud. There are documented cases in the 1840s when fictitious births and deaths were inserted into the registers in order that the registrar or his cohorts, who were paid by the number of entries they produced, actually invented people who never existed in order to boost their pay! One registrar in Liverpool went to jail over the scandal and there may well have been others who were never uncovered. Some of those entries are still in the GRO records today. A reason for marriage records being open and available to all is to guard against bigamous marriages (of which I have personally uncovered a number in Victorian times AND written about them in magazine articles). 2) Anyone who was born in England and Wales from the third quarter of 1911 onwards, to this day, will have their mother's maiden name recorded in the indexes, which are accessible online to everyone, as we all know, at Ancestry, Findmypast and other websites. These records are very clearly IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN and accessible to all and it is foolish nonsense to pretend otherwise. I have pointed out earlier in this thread that anyone who gives their mother's maiden name as a codeword to their bank, building society, etc, is foolish to do so. It's not the fault of the registration system, it's the fault of the idiots who run the financial world and don't seem to have caught up with the realities. 3) If you choose to take part in mailing lists AND put your personal details and family history online, then you are laying yourself open to it being abused. You are inviting less-than-honest people to either steal or alter it!!! If you don't want your family history stolen or altered, then take my advice and keep it to yourself. There are some very unscrupulous people around, but talking of taking legal action against them is so much nonsense because you will simply be chucking away good money to parasitic lawyers who will be delighted to take it. 4) There is far too much paranoia about so-called privacy. As I pointed out also, earlier, every time I telephone a company to buy something the very first thing they ask is for my postcode. They then tell me who I am and where I live! Whether you like it or not, we all of us ARE on databases held by government, local councils, the NHS, police, big companies and lord-knows-who else. We appear in telephone books and electoral registers, our details of our birth and marriage etc, are held by somebody somewhere; thus, to claim privacy on a mailing list that can be read online all over the world is simply spurious and paranoid nonsense. Lecture over! -- Roy Stockdill Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Newbies' Guide to Genealogy & Family History: www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

Hi, A bit of common sense at last, Roy, and totally agree with what you have posted. regards Pete ( not quite far north as Yorkshire, but nearly there) in Mansfield ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2012 2:53 PM Subject: Re: [NTT] Respect for others opinions > Clearly, I seem to have upset one or two people with my forthright and > strongly-held opinions. > I am a born-and-bred, died-in-the-wool Yorkshireman and happen to believe > in calling a > spade a spade and not pussyfooting and tippy-toeing around subjects that > seem to worry > others. If that offends some folks, then I can only apologise, but it > won't change my views! > > As a retired journalist (over 40 years in the media in local and national > newspapers) and the > former editor for 10 years of the Journal of One-Name Studies for the > Guild of One-Name > Studies (twice an award-winning publication), yes, I hold strong opinions > and I am not afraid > to express them. It seems to me that in these politically correct times > far too many people are > terrified of saying what they think in case it upsets some timid, precious > little soul. > > I happen to believe, as a family historian, that we should tell it like it > is - warts and all - and > not be shy about admitting to scandals, illegitimacies, etc, in our family > history. We all have > them and don't let's pretend we haven't! Now, regarding the issue of > privacy, may I be > permitted to make a few salient points? > > 1) It is perfectly open to anyone, wherever they may reside in the world, > to obtain the birth, > marriage or death certificate of anyone else who was born in England and > Wales since 1st > July 1837 when civil registration was first introduced. The system has > always been a > completely open one and rightly so. The reason it is open is to guard > against the very thing > that some people seem to worry about, i.e. fraud. There are documented > cases in the 1840s > when fictitious births and deaths were inserted into the registers in > order that the registrar or > his cohorts, who were paid by the number of entries they produced, > actually invented people > who never existed in order to boost their pay! One registrar in Liverpool > went to jail over the > scandal and there may well have been others who were never uncovered. Some > of those > entries are still in the GRO records today. A reason for marriage records > being open and > available to all is to guard against bigamous marriages (of which I have > personally uncovered > a number in Victorian times AND written about them in magazine articles). > > 2) Anyone who was born in England and Wales from the third quarter of 1911 > onwards, to > this day, will have their mother's maiden name recorded in the indexes, > which are accessible > online to everyone, as we all know, at Ancestry, Findmypast and other > websites. These > records are very clearly IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN and accessible to all and it > is foolish > nonsense to pretend otherwise. I have pointed out earlier in this thread > that anyone who > gives their mother's maiden name as a codeword to their bank, building > society, etc, is foolish > to do so. It's not the fault of the registration system, it's the fault of > the idiots who run the > financial world and don't seem to have caught up with the realities. > > 3) If you choose to take part in mailing lists AND put your personal > details and family history > online, then you are laying yourself open to it being abused. You are > inviting less-than-honest > people to either steal or alter it!!! If you don't want your family > history stolen or altered, then > take my advice and keep it to yourself. There are some very unscrupulous > people around, > but talking of taking legal action against them is so much nonsense > because you will simply > be chucking away good money to parasitic lawyers who will be delighted to > take it. > > 4) There is far too much paranoia about so-called privacy. As I pointed > out also, earlier, every > time I telephone a company to buy something the very first thing they ask > is for my postcode. > They then tell me who I am and where I live! Whether you like it or not, > we all of us ARE on > databases held by government, local councils, the NHS, police, big > companies and > lord-knows-who else. We appear in telephone books and electoral registers, > our details of > our birth and marriage etc, are held by somebody somewhere; thus, to claim > privacy on a > mailing list that can be read online all over the world is simply spurious > and paranoid > nonsense. > > Lecture over! > > > > -- > Roy Stockdill > Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer > Newbies' Guide to Genealogy & Family History: > www.genuki.org.uk/gs/Newbie.html > > "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, > and that is not being talked about." > OSCAR WILDE > > > > > > > Notts Surname List > > http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hughw/notts.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message