Although BHC chapel was built in 1826 according to "British Listed Buildings" webpage, it seems as though marriages were performed pre-1837 at other rural locations. The Carterhead and Cocklaw could have been farms, private houses, field chapel meetings or anywhere non-Conformist people worshiped together at that time. Gen: In England and Wales there were NO marriages in nonconformist chapels before 1837. I know that sometimes pre-1837 marriages are indeed recorded in their registers but they were always ones of congregation members who had married elsewhere. The nonconformist church register was just a handy record of the fact that they were married and with details such as where, when etc. In particular I have seen Roman Catholic registers with numerous pre-1837 weddings recorded (eg Bishopwearmouth St Mary) but on investigation all turn out to have been in Ireland b efore the couple moved over to Sunderland! While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, "The Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. Incidentally, Birdhopecraig registers go back well before 1826. What happened then was a re-building of an existing chapel. It might be that its location was changed slightly, as I have a feeling I once heard it had begun some quarter to half a mile further up the road from where it is now. It was founded in 1672 and the earliest surviving register dates from 1728. Geoff Nicholson

I believe you are correct about Birdhopecraig chapel. I seem to recall that the earlier (1672) one was at Sillsburnfoot, not very far from where the "new" stone chapel was built in 1826. I haven't been in that area for a few years now, but I do recall the chapel is now closed and is possibly a private residence now ? Mike Temple. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Nicholson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:02 PM Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn > > Although BHC chapel was built in 1826 according to "British Listed > Buildings" > webpage, it seems as though marriages were performed pre-1837 at other > rural > locations. The Carterhead and Cocklaw could have been farms, private > houses, > field chapel meetings or anywhere non-Conformist people worshiped together > at > that time. > > Gen: > > In England and Wales there were NO marriages in nonconformist chapels > before 1837. I know that sometimes pre-1837 marriages are indeed recorded > in their registers but they were always ones of congregation members who > had married elsewhere. The nonconformist church register was just a handy > record of the fact that they were married and with details such as where, > when etc. In particular I have seen Roman Catholic registers with > numerous pre-1837 weddings recorded (eg Bishopwearmouth St Mary) but on > investigation all turn out to have been in Ireland b efore the couple > moved over to Sunderland! > > While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, "The > Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those > at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at > Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. > > Incidentally, Birdhopecraig registers go back well before 1826. What > happened then was a re-building of an existing chapel. It might be that > its location was changed slightly, as I have a feeling I once heard it had > begun some quarter to half a mile further up the road from where it is > now. It was founded in 1672 and the earliest surviving register dates > from 1728. > > Geoff Nicholson > > > > > > .. > Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any > reply...... Thank you! > > The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at > http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Michael, During renovations, the chimney on the road end of the manse fell in through the roof. Since, the manse has been rebuilt and is an occupied house. The chapel (I last saw in August 2012) remains empty and (probably) unused. Melvyn. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Temple" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 1:30 PM Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn >I believe you are correct about Birdhopecraig chapel. > I seem to recall that the earlier (1672) one was at Sillsburnfoot, not > very > far from where the "new" stone chapel was built in 1826. > I haven't been in that area for a few years now, but I do recall the > chapel > is now closed and is possibly a private residence now ? > Mike Temple. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Geoff Nicholson" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:02 PM > Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn > > >> >> Although BHC chapel was built in 1826 according to "British Listed >> Buildings" >> webpage, it seems as though marriages were performed pre-1837 at other >> rural >> locations. The Carterhead and Cocklaw could have been farms, private >> houses, >> field chapel meetings or anywhere non-Conformist people worshiped >> together >> at >> that time. >> >> Gen: >> >> In England and Wales there were NO marriages in nonconformist chapels >> before 1837. I know that sometimes pre-1837 marriages are indeed >> recorded >> in their registers but they were always ones of congregation members who >> had married elsewhere. The nonconformist church register was just a >> handy >> record of the fact that they were married and with details such as where, >> when etc. In particular I have seen Roman Catholic registers with >> numerous pre-1837 weddings recorded (eg Bishopwearmouth St Mary) but on >> investigation all turn out to have been in Ireland b efore the couple >> moved over to Sunderland! >> >> While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, "The >> Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those >> at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at >> Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. >> >> Incidentally, Birdhopecraig registers go back well before 1826. What >> happened then was a re-building of an existing chapel. It might be that >> its location was changed slightly, as I have a feeling I once heard it >> had >> begun some quarter to half a mile further up the road from where it is >> now. It was founded in 1672 and the earliest surviving register dates >> from 1728. >> >> Geoff Nicholson >> >> >> >> >> >> .. >> Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any >> reply...... Thank you! >> >> The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at >> http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > .. > Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any > reply...... Thank you! > > The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at > http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2013.0.2890 / Virus Database: 2637/6024 - Release Date: 01/10/13 > Internal Virus Database is out of date. >

Melvyn, I'm surprised that the chapel has not been snapped up by some property developer ! Mike Temple. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Melvyn Hunter" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 6:13 PM Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn > Dear Michael, > > During renovations, the chimney on the road end of the manse fell in > through > the roof. Since, the manse has been rebuilt and is an occupied house. The > chapel (I last saw in August 2012) remains empty and (probably) unused. > > Melvyn. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael Temple" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 1:30 PM > Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn > > >>I believe you are correct about Birdhopecraig chapel. >> I seem to recall that the earlier (1672) one was at Sillsburnfoot, not >> very >> far from where the "new" stone chapel was built in 1826. >> I haven't been in that area for a few years now, but I do recall the >> chapel >> is now closed and is possibly a private residence now ? >> Mike Temple. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Geoff Nicholson" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:02 PM >> Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn >> >> >>> >>> Although BHC chapel was built in 1826 according to "British Listed >>> Buildings" >>> webpage, it seems as though marriages were performed pre-1837 at other >>> rural >>> locations. The Carterhead and Cocklaw could have been farms, private >>> houses, >>> field chapel meetings or anywhere non-Conformist people worshiped >>> together >>> at >>> that time. >>> >>> Gen: >>> >>> In England and Wales there were NO marriages in nonconformist >>> chapels >>> before 1837. I know that sometimes pre-1837 marriages are indeed >>> recorded >>> in their registers but they were always ones of congregation members who >>> had married elsewhere. The nonconformist church register was just a >>> handy >>> record of the fact that they were married and with details such as >>> where, >>> when etc. In particular I have seen Roman Catholic registers with >>> numerous pre-1837 weddings recorded (eg Bishopwearmouth St Mary) but on >>> investigation all turn out to have been in Ireland b efore the couple >>> moved over to Sunderland! >>> >>> While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, >>> "The >>> Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those >>> at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at >>> Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. >>> >>> Incidentally, Birdhopecraig registers go back well before 1826. >>> What >>> happened then was a re-building of an existing chapel. It might be that >>> its location was changed slightly, as I have a feeling I once heard it >>> had >>> begun some quarter to half a mile further up the road from where it is >>> now. It was founded in 1672 and the earliest surviving register dates >>> from 1728. >>> >>> Geoff Nicholson >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> .. >>> Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any >>> reply...... Thank you! >>> >>> The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at >>> http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> .. >> Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any >> reply...... Thank you! >> >> The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at >> http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ----- >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 2013.0.2890 / Virus Database: 2637/6024 - Release Date: 01/10/13 >> Internal Virus Database is out of date. >> > > .. > Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any > reply...... Thank you! > > The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at > http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Geoff, I think you may have heard of the 'meeting house' at the back of Woollaw that I mentioned in an earlier reply. I remember there being foundations when I visited in the early 1970s. Melvyn. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Nicholson" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2013 1:02 PM Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn > > Although BHC chapel was built in 1826 according to "British Listed > Buildings" > webpage, it seems as though marriages were performed pre-1837 at other > rural > locations. The Carterhead and Cocklaw could have been farms, private > houses, > field chapel meetings or anywhere non-Conformist people worshiped together > at > that time. > > Gen: > > In England and Wales there were NO marriages in nonconformist chapels > before 1837. I know that sometimes pre-1837 marriages are indeed recorded > in their registers but they were always ones of congregation members who > had married elsewhere. The nonconformist church register was just a handy > record of the fact that they were married and with details such as where, > when etc. In particular I have seen Roman Catholic registers with > numerous pre-1837 weddings recorded (eg Bishopwearmouth St Mary) but on > investigation all turn out to have been in Ireland b efore the couple > moved over to Sunderland! > > While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, "The > Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those > at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at > Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. > > Incidentally, Birdhopecraig registers go back well before 1826. What > happened then was a re-building of an existing chapel. It might be that > its location was changed slightly, as I have a feeling I once heard it had > begun some quarter to half a mile further up the road from where it is > now. It was founded in 1672 and the earliest surviving register dates > from 1728. > > Geoff Nicholson > > > > > > .. > Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any > reply...... Thank you! > > The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at > http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2013.0.2890 / Virus Database: 2637/6024 - Release Date: 01/10/13 > Internal Virus Database is out of date. >

Geoff > While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, "The Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. Where did you get your information that "the Carterbarn" was a Border Marriage House at Carter Bar? Gen in NBL England

Gen: I - and, I think, the original query - referred to "The Carterhead", not "The Carterbarn". While I cannot off-hand point to any single example, I just "know", from having read it in several different places, that what we call Carter Bar (NOT "Barn") was originally called The Carterhead. Its status as the head of a valley is most obvious from the English side; possibly less so from the Scottish side, though it does stand at the head of a (smaller) valley on that side also. Perhaps one of those valleys is or was known locally as the Carter Valley, but if so I have never heard of it; on the English side it is Redesdale, or a tributary of it, and on the Scottish side it is Jedforest, the valley of the Jed Water, or a tributary of it. I also take it as granted that the original "Bar" was not a place selling drinks, but a Toll Bar in the days when what is now the A68 was a turnpike road. There is another name, now long disused, which has also applied to the Carter Bar district, and that is "Redeswire", a Border Battle having been fought there several centuries ago. Geoff Nicholson -----Original Message----- From: gen listlass <[email protected]> To: northumbria <[email protected]> Sent: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 18:59 Subject: Re: [NMB] Marriage in Redesdale - resources searched at Woodhorn Geoff > While I am not sure of the status of Cocklaw as a wedding venue, "The Carterhead" seems to have been a Border Marriage House, similar to those at Lamberton Toll, Gretna Green etc, and was presumably on the border at Carter Bar on what is now the A68 road. Where did you get your information that "the Carterbarn" was a Border Marriage House at Carter Bar? Gen in NBL England .. Please remember to snip most of the earlier message before you post any reply...... Thank you! The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message