Thank you to everyone who answered my query about a hind. I especially found the answers to Bruces question very informative. cheers Lynne

Hi Brian The death's show up from 1866 not 1869 :-) > > The ages weren't on the indexes until 1869, but they were > on certificates right from the start in 1837. > > Brian > -- > Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ > Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List > GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer > > > The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at > http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORTHUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

On 27/03/2010 22:59, Jennette Gest wrote: > The death's show up from 1866 not 1869:-) Jennette You mean the ages show up from 1866 - OK I stand corrected. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

Thanks for your help Brian edith talbot -----Original Message----- From: northumbria-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:northumbria-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Brian Pears Sent: 27 March 2010 17:01 To: northumbria@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NMB] VERT&WHITFIELD HELP PLEASE On 27/03/2010 16:29, Edith Talbot wrote: > I was unaware early death certs recorded ages as the ages are not on the > early indexes, Edith The ages weren't on the indexes until 1869, but they were on certificates right from the start in 1837. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORTHUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

On 27/03/2010 16:29, Edith Talbot wrote: > I was unaware early death certs recorded ages as the ages are not on the > early indexes, Edith The ages weren't on the indexes until 1869, but they were on certificates right from the start in 1837. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

Sorry brian, they were married in dec 1826 getting mixed up with the Gro records, I was unaware early death certs recorded ages as the ages are not on the early indexes, Thanks for your reply edith talbot -----Original Message----- From: northumbria-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:northumbria-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Brian Pears Sent: 27 March 2010 16:11 To: northumbria@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NMB] VERT&WHITFIELD HELP PLEASE On 27/03/2010 16:00, Edith Talbot wrote: > Thomas Whitfield Dec quarter 1826 all saints church Edith Where does this "Dec Quarter" come from? We see it in birth, marriage and death indexes, of course, but these only began on 1st July 1837 and your reference is from 1826. So where does it come from? Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORTHUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

On 27/03/2010 16:00, Edith Talbot wrote: > Thomas Whitfield Dec quarter 1826 all saints church Edith Where does this "Dec Quarter" come from? We see it in birth, marriage and death indexes, of course, but these only began on 1st July 1837 and your reference is from 1826. So where does it come from? Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

On 27/03/2010 16:00, Edith Talbot wrote: > 1841 finds her a widow living in newgate street, newcastle a clothes > dealer, a possible death for Thomas has been found in Newcastle in > 1839, but as this death cert would not record his age, and subsequently > his approx date of birth, is the end of the line for my search.. I have > checked all the usual indexes and igi without any luck, I would be > pleased if someone could perhaps give me some further suggestions Edith Death certificates do record the age of the deceased - so I your next step should be to obtain his death certificate. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

Hi , My ancestor Jane vert b 1798/1799 in byker hills,( her age is consistent on the various census's) =Thomas Whitfield Dec quarter 1826 all saints church 1841 finds her a widow living in newgate street, newcastle a clothes dealer, a possible death for Thomas has been found in Newcastle in 1839, but as this death cert would not record his age, and subsequently his approx date of birth, is the end of the line for my search.. I have checked all the usual indexes and igi without any luck, I would be pleased if someone could perhaps give me some further suggestions edith talbot

Michael, I have seen "pitman", "coal miner" ,"collier" , and "coal owner" used to describe the occupations of some of my Northumberland ancestors . I assume they all mean the same, except "coal owner", though I wondered about "collier " and thought it may indicate a coal dealer ? Mike Temple, Spain. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Dixymick@aol.com> To: <northumbria@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [NMB] profession > Maybe Joshua Hall declared himself to the census enumerator as a > "husbandman" but enumerator categorised him as "ag lab". > > In my area of Northumberland ( s-e corner) some men were recorded in > church > records as " pit man" but were recorded as " coal miner" on censuses ( My > father who retired in early 1980s from Bates colliery, Blyth always > referred to himself as a pitman) > > Michael Dixon > > > The NORTHUMBRIA FAQ page is located at > http://www.bpears.org.uk/NorthumbriaFAQ/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORTHUMBRIA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2771 - Release Date: 03/26/10 07:33:00

Thanks Brian, That would be right as my ancestors were all farmers .I believe the term husbandman means the same thing. Lynne

I have a copy of a birth entry on which the babies father 's profession says hind. Can anybody tell me what this would be please. Thanks Lynne

Maybe Joshua Hall declared himself to the census enumerator as a "husbandman" but enumerator categorised him as "ag lab". In my area of Northumberland ( s-e corner) some men were recorded in church records as " pit man" but were recorded as " coal miner" on censuses ( My father who retired in early 1980s from Bates colliery, Blyth always referred to himself as a pitman) Michael Dixon

On 26/03/2010 11:07, ADRABBOTT@aol.com wrote: > Funnily enough, I discovered yesterday that my g.g.g.grandfather Joshua > HALL who was described in the 1841 Census in Lamesley as an "Ag. Lab." was > described on his his son's marriage certificate (Chester-le-Street) four weeks > later as a Husbandman - the son trying to gild the lily I suspect, since > Joshua was still an Ag. Lab. in 1851. Yes indeed, you even see ag labs described as "farmers" - though usually by relations rather than themselves. It's a similar situation with "engineer" and "fitter". Of course this is nothing compared to the modern trend with job titles whereby virtually everyone except the cleaner and office junior is a "manager" (at least) of something. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

On 26/03/2010 04:15, Bruce Dodd wrote: > If you can go back over the past three weeks or so and look up the > several replies to my dumb question :"What is a hurd?" you will find > some really fascinating stories of hinds, one of them even illustrated, > provided by the patient members of this list. If you can't get to them, > contact me off list, 'cos I kept 'em. The hurd/hind thread is at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/northumbria/2010-03/1268027297 Please don't ask for off-list contact - how someone replies must always be a matter of choice for the person replying. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

On 26/03/2010 04:35, Kevin & Lynne Hyde wrote: > That would be right as my ancestors were all farmers . > I believe the term husbandman means the same thing. Lynne No, absolutely not. A "hind" was a labourer, whereas a "husbandman" was usually the owner or renter of a smallholding. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

In a message dated 26/03/2010 10:23:31 GMT Standard Time, bp@bpears.org.uk writes: "husbandman" was usually the owner or renter of a smallholding. Funnily enough, I discovered yesterday that my g.g.g.grandfather Joshua HALL who was described in the 1841 Census in Lamesley as an "Ag. Lab." was described on his his son's marriage certificate (Chester-le-Street) four weeks later as a Husbandman - the son trying to gild the lily I suspect, since Joshua was still an Ag. Lab. in 1851. Adrian

On 26/03/2010 03:41, Kevin & Lynne Hyde wrote: > I have a copy of a birth entry on which the babies father 's profession > says hind. Can anybody tell me what this would be please. Lynne He was a farm labourer - probably tending animals. Brian -- Brian Pears (Gateshead, UK) http://www.bpears.org.uk/ Joint List Admin NORTHUMBRIA Genealogy Mailing List GENUKI Northumberland Maintainer

Kevin and Lynn If you can go back over the past three weeks or so and look up the several replies to my dumb question :"What is a hurd?" you will find some really fascinating stories of hinds, one of them even illustrated, provided by the patient members of this list. If you can't get to them, contact me off list, 'cos I kept 'em. Bruce Dodd, Ottawa

Thanks Bob and Heather Now I look at the flourishes on the handwriting it is clear that the first letter is and A ... CC Roper lived in "The Avenues" but suspect this is meant to be Avenue as I can see that on the modern maps. Although there are several Co Durham Roper families this one is only there for two generations CCR's father was Charles Roper an engine driver born Shelfanger Norfolk abt 1883 and moved to Shildon with a pal Clifton Bloomfield around 1900. (1901 Rg13/4647 f 55 p 7) Regards Robin