Hello Tony I have an ancestor whose grandfather's name appears on her marriage certificate as being her father. This is particularly impressive feat as the grandfather died five years before she was born. The ancestor in question was born c.1844 and married in 1863, but notwithstanding this, her birth does not appear to have been registered. There is however a baptism which gives a mother's name and a (presumably) fictous father, since he had the same surname as the mother and the maternal grandparents. The mother died in 1845, so the child was brought up by her grandmother and she was recorded in census data as being a daughter rather than a granddaughter. Regards Peter ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Ellis" <aellis@bigpond.net.au> To: <NORFOLK@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 10:05 PM Subject: [NFK] Grandfather's name as Father on Wedding Certificate > Hi All > > I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does > not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the > person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born > out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage > certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of his > grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father was, and > his name was quite different. > > Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name > required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' to > either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family were > religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. > > Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, > theories - all gratefully accepted.. > > Tony > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have a similar one. Child baptised with name of a man as the father, and his daughter as the mother ! On two subsequent census child is with the "father" labelled in the first census as a grandson, and the second census 10 years later as the son of the "father". The "mother" had moved on and married. I presume the child was illegitimate (rather than the incestuous offspring of father/daughter, especially as the mother/grandmother was still around and part of the household). I have also seen cases where the father's name was mistakenly given a marriage certificate - again from this distance it is not possible to work out if this was a mistake or deliberate obfuscation. Would be great to time travel and find out what was actually happening at the time. Julie On 14/11/2011 18:08, Jim Fisher wrote: > Yes, that sort of thing was common at that time (with variations), > not always for obvious reasons and not only in Norfolk. My paternal > grandfather was illegitimate, although his parents lived openly > together and produced several children, all with their mother's > surname, When he married in 1906, on the certificate he gave his > father his correct first name but the same surname as his own and his > mother's. This was in a small Wiltshire village where he and his > parents were all locals. His new wife and father-in-law were from > distant London, but the reason could not have been to deceive them > since his mother and his new mother-in-law were sisters! > > Jim Fisher > > On 14 Nov 2011 at 9:05, Tony Ellis wrote: > >> Hi All >> >> I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does >> not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the >> person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born >> out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage >> certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of >> his grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father >> was, and his name was quite different. >> >> Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name >> required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' >> to either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family >> were religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. >> >> Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, >> theories - all gratefully accepted.. >> >> Tony >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > -- Julie Harold FreeREG Norfolk Coordinator http://www.freereg.org.uk

Yes, that sort of thing was common at that time (with variations), not always for obvious reasons and not only in Norfolk. My paternal grandfather was illegitimate, although his parents lived openly together and produced several children, all with their mother's surname, When he married in 1906, on the certificate he gave his father his correct first name but the same surname as his own and his mother's. This was in a small Wiltshire village where he and his parents were all locals. His new wife and father-in-law were from distant London, but the reason could not have been to deceive them since his mother and his new mother-in-law were sisters! Jim Fisher On 14 Nov 2011 at 9:05, Tony Ellis wrote: > Hi All > > I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does > not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the > person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born > out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage > certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of > his grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father > was, and his name was quite different. > > Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name > required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' > to either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family > were religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. > > Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, > theories - all gratefully accepted.. > > Tony > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- My web site is now at http://www.jimella.me.uk Family history, Gardening, Humour, Politics and more ...and blogs at http://jimella.livejournal.com and http://jimella.wordpress.com

Been away from the list for a couple of years but have decided to return to my old brickwall. William Skitmer marries the widow Sarah Gillingwater in 1768 at St John Timberhill in Norwich . They have 2 known children: William and Elizabeth who dies as an infant. I have been unable to determine the birth of Wm snr or the burial of him and Sarah. The son settles in the Rockland St Peter's area c 1800 and fathers a number of children who are variously recorded as either Skitmore or Kitmore ( sometimes being baptised with one surname and buried under another!) After about 1840 the surname stabilises as Skitmore. Transcribers for FreeREG (myself included) have produced numerous instances of Kitmore and it's variations , mostly located in and around SW Norfolk up to about 1700. After that date they are few and far between so am still looking for a bridge between William's marriage in 1768 and what might be his forebears, variously spelled, in the late 1600s. Any assistance gratefully received. David Tennant

Thank you to everyone who has helped on this. I am contacting various people and hopefully will have what I need soon. Jan -----Original Message----- From: Harold Bennington Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 10:32 AM To: norfolk@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please The Rector of Gressenhall is responsible for the WENDLING Registers & they can be viewed if you apply to him. I saw them some years ago but seem to have lost his address or phone number. Not sure of who holds the Narborough Registers. Harry -----Original Message----- From: elizabeth howard <elizgh@btinternet.com> To: norfolk@rootsweb.com Sent: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 9:46 Subject: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please Hi, try looking for the local to Wendling and Narborough Registrar`s office , probably E Dereham and apply there for a 1906 burial . life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Rockett" <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> To: <norfolk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:48 PM Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please > Stephanie, > Thanks for that but I need 1906 in Narborough and the images only go so > for > as 1901. > > Jan > > -----Original Message----- > From: Stephanie Ray > Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:13 PM > To: norfolk@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please > > Would the burial record images for Narborough suffice? > > https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11827-44749-63?cc=1416598&wc=12706202#uri=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.familysearch.org%2Frecords%2Fwaypoint%2F12702121 > > For Wendling, 1844 is after civil registration commenced. According to > http://www.origins.org.uk/genuki/NFK/places/w/wendling/, Wendling was > in Mitford and Launditch Registration District. > > It looks like you can buy certs here: > http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Community_and_living/Registration_services/NCC090564 > > You can also check out NROCAT: > http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/DServe/DServe.exe?dsqServer=128.60.0.31&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=Index.tcl > > Good luck, > Stephanie > > On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 2:31 PM, Jan Rockett <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> > wrote: >> Could anyone tell me please if the burial records for Narborough are >> online? >> >> Also, are the 1844 marriages for Wendling anywhere to be found? The >> registers online on Family Search finish in 1837. >> >> Jan >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Jan NRO holdings show for Narborough burials original registers to 1951 and Wendling marriages both original registers and on microform 1708 - 2002 but whether there are gaps isn't clear. If you are able to 'phone them they would tell you. Regards Jean > >

Hi, try looking for the local to Wendling and Narborough Registrar`s office , probably E Dereham and apply there for a 1906 burial . life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Rockett" <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> To: <norfolk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:48 PM Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please > Stephanie, > Thanks for that but I need 1906 in Narborough and the images only go so > for > as 1901. > > Jan > > -----Original Message----- > From: Stephanie Ray > Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:13 PM > To: norfolk@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please > > Would the burial record images for Narborough suffice? > > https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11827-44749-63?cc=1416598&wc=12706202#uri=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.familysearch.org%2Frecords%2Fwaypoint%2F12702121 > > For Wendling, 1844 is after civil registration commenced. According to > http://www.origins.org.uk/genuki/NFK/places/w/wendling/, Wendling was > in Mitford and Launditch Registration District. > > It looks like you can buy certs here: > http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Community_and_living/Registration_services/NCC090564 > > You can also check out NROCAT: > http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/DServe/DServe.exe?dsqServer=128.60.0.31&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=Index.tcl > > Good luck, > Stephanie > > On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 2:31 PM, Jan Rockett <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> > wrote: >> Could anyone tell me please if the burial records for Narborough are >> online? >> >> Also, are the 1844 marriages for Wendling anywhere to be found? The >> registers online on Family Search finish in 1837. >> >> Jan >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi All I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of his grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father was, and his name was quite different. Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' to either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family were religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, theories - all gratefully accepted.. Tony

They may well be still with the Vicar at the Rectory and not deposited at the Norfolk Records Office. Regards l Lesley Sent from my iPad On 13 Nov 2011, at 23:48, "Jan Rockett" <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> wrote: Stephanie, Thanks for that but I need 1906 in Narborough and the images only go so for as 1901. Jan -----Original Message----- From: Stephanie Ray Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:13 PM To: norfolk@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please Would the burial record images for Narborough suffice? https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11827-44749-63?cc=1416598&wc=12706202#uri=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.familysearch.org%2Frecords%2Fwaypoint%2F12702121 For Wendling, 1844 is after civil registration commenced. According to http://www.origins.org.uk/genuki/NFK/places/w/wendling/, Wendling was in Mitford and Launditch Registration District. It looks like you can buy certs here: http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Community_and_living/Registration_services/NCC090564 You can also check out NROCAT: http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/DServe/DServe.exe?dsqServer=128.60.0.31&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=Index.tcl Good luck, Stephanie On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 2:31 PM, Jan Rockett <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> wrote: > Could anyone tell me please if the burial records for Narborough are > online? > > Also, are the 1844 marriages for Wendling anywhere to be found? The > registers online on Family Search finish in 1837. > > Jan > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The Rector of Gressenhall is responsible for the WENDLING Registers & they can be viewed if you apply to him. I saw them some years ago but seem to have lost his address or phone number. Not sure of who holds the Narborough Registers. Harry -----Original Message----- From: elizabeth howard <elizgh@btinternet.com> To: norfolk@rootsweb.com Sent: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 9:46 Subject: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please Hi, try looking for the local to Wendling and Narborough Registrar`s office , probably E Dereham and apply there for a 1906 burial . life is hard . soften it with a cat \\\=^..^=/// ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Rockett" <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> To: <norfolk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:48 PM Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please > Stephanie, > Thanks for that but I need 1906 in Narborough and the images only go so > for > as 1901. > > Jan > > -----Original Message----- > From: Stephanie Ray > Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:13 PM > To: norfolk@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please > > Would the burial record images for Narborough suffice? > > https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11827-44749-63?cc=1416598&wc=12706202#uri=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.familysearch.org%2Frecords%2Fwaypoint%2F12702121 > > For Wendling, 1844 is after civil registration commenced. According to > http://www.origins.org.uk/genuki/NFK/places/w/wendling/, Wendling was > in Mitford and Launditch Registration District. > > It looks like you can buy certs here: > http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Community_and_living/Registration_services/NCC090564 > > You can also check out NROCAT: > http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/DServe/DServe.exe?dsqServer=128.60.0.31&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=Index.tcl > > Good luck, > Stephanie > > On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 2:31 PM, Jan Rockett <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> > wrote: >> Could anyone tell me please if the burial records for Narborough are >> online? >> >> Also, are the 1844 marriages for Wendling anywhere to be found? The >> registers online on Family Search finish in 1837. >> >> Jan >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have only just found a moment to look at this site Richard, and I can't thank you enough for introducing me to it! To any others not having looked at it yet, you will find verbal snapshots of the real things that happened in the nineteenth century in England, and particularly Norfolk. I spend hours reading it! Richard In a message dated 01/11/2011 20:38:51 GMT Standard Time, rjsfh1949@googlemail.com writes: Apologies to anyone who already knows about this but I found an interesting item while searching for something else entirely, (as you do). Entitled "Norfolk Annals. A chronological record of remarkable events in the nineteenth century" by Charles Mackie. It is a rather eclectic mix of reports from various sources about events in nineteenth century Norfolk. Volume 1 covers the period 1801 - 1850 and can be found here http://www.gutenberg.org/files/34439/34439-h/34439-h.htm Volume 2 covers the period 1851 - 1900 and can be found here http://www.gutenberg.org/zipcat2.php/36206/36206.txt The whole 2 volumes can be downloaded free. Richard Spink ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Stephanie, Thanks for that but I need 1906 in Narborough and the images only go so for as 1901. Jan -----Original Message----- From: Stephanie Ray Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 11:13 PM To: norfolk@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NFK] Wendling and Narborough help please Would the burial record images for Narborough suffice? https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11827-44749-63?cc=1416598&wc=12706202#uri=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.familysearch.org%2Frecords%2Fwaypoint%2F12702121 For Wendling, 1844 is after civil registration commenced. According to http://www.origins.org.uk/genuki/NFK/places/w/wendling/, Wendling was in Mitford and Launditch Registration District. It looks like you can buy certs here: http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Community_and_living/Registration_services/NCC090564 You can also check out NROCAT: http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/DServe/DServe.exe?dsqServer=128.60.0.31&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=Index.tcl Good luck, Stephanie On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 2:31 PM, Jan Rockett <jan.rockett@ntlworld.com> wrote: > Could anyone tell me please if the burial records for Narborough are > online? > > Also, are the 1844 marriages for Wendling anywhere to be found? The > registers online on Family Search finish in 1837. > > Jan > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have seen certificates roughly the same date with the father's name left blank so it must have been allowed. One option is that he had made the pretence for reasons of employment. Or to save face- although only witnesses get to see a marriage certificate he may have had to conjure up a deceased parent. He would not have been able to carry off an open deceit if he lived married and worked where he grew up I would have thought. Rosie On 13/11/2011 22:52, Elizabeth Inmon wrote: > Hi Tony, > > Had the same situation with my maternal grandmother. No father's name on > birth, grandfather's name on marriage as the father. My mother told me that > her mother grew up believing that her grandparents were her parents, while > being told that her natural mother was her "sister". So much for family > secrets. My grandmother's mother actually married the man believed to be > the father a few years later, having more children. However, my grandmother > was left with her grandparents and was raised by them. > > Good luck with your research, > > Elizabeth > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tony Ellis > Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 5:05 PM > To: NORFOLK@rootsweb.com > Subject: [NFK] Grandfather's name as Father on Wedding Certificate > > Hi All > > I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does > not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the > person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born > out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage > certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of his > grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father was, and > his name was quite different. > > Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name > required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' to > either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family were > religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. > > Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, > theories - all gratefully accepted.. > > Tony > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Could anyone tell me please if the burial records for Narborough are online? Also, are the 1844 marriages for Wendling anywhere to be found? The registers online on Family Search finish in 1837. Jan

Sorry Jill URL should only be http://www.olivetreegenealogy.com/ships/canada/PLU-ShipsIndex.shtml On 13 November 2011 20:25, Jean Greenwood <jeangreenwood@virginmedia.com>wrote: > Hi Jill > > > http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.olivetreegenealogy.com%2Fships%2Fcanada%2FPLU-ShipsIndex.shtml&h=bAQF3rB1VAQEpvd1RAQUA9lTY_ROtO5-CSWnL5FJuEzrMEg > > Olive Tree Genealogy - Poor Law Union Immigrants to Canada has some ships > with pasenger lists. > > Jean > >> >> >>

Hi Jill http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.olivetreegenealogy.com%2Fships%2Fcanada%2FPLU-ShipsIndex.shtml&h=bAQF3rB1VAQEpvd1RAQUA9lTY_ROtO5-CSWnL5FJuEzrMEg Olive Tree Genealogy - Poor Law Union Immigrants to Canada has some ships with pasenger lists. Jean > > >

Thank you Stan. I knew I had seen it somewhere-my great grandmother's sister, surname Digby, married one of the many Kettlestone Greens who stayed behind. Rosie On 13/11/2011 15:23, Stan Langley wrote: > The 1836 Pauper Exports from Kettlestone and Heacham may be seen here: > >http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/passengerlists/kettle1836.htm< > > Stan L. Langley - West Norfolk U.K. > Principal Interests; JICKLING; LANGLEY; RICHMOND; WAD(DE)LOW; W(H)ILLOCK. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "xpn11"<xpn11@aol.com> > To:<norfolk@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 1:49 PM > Subject: Re: [NFK] !836 emigration > > > Around 40 people from Kettlestone emigrated to Canada in 1836 From > bits and pieces on the National Archive indexes which mentions records > of expenses and elsewhere I got the impression they were actively > encouraged to emigrate so they were not a drain on the local tax payers > who had to pay for poor law relief > On this Holkham page there are details of how £200 had been borrowed > from the government and the vicar also borrowed money from the Coke > estate which owned land in Kettlestone. The emigrants clothing is > described as being in a wretched state. Fulmodeston is also mentioned > http://www.holkham.co.uk/downloads/WS_2010.pdf > As I understand it ( very shaky here) there was a great depression in > the 1830s for a number of reasons, including 60 years of enclosures > acts. In 1834 the Poor Laws were amended to cut out relief, so paupers > would have been forced into the work house instead of getting a > supplement to low wages. Rate payers would have had to fund the relief > without getting cheap workers so no doubt they were not tardy in > shuffling paupers onto ships bound to Canada > Rosie > > > On 13/11/2011 12:40, Jill Bloom wrote: >> Bonnie >> >> Please could you give me a clue where to find info on this 1836 >> emigration? >> I guess it may have been an early part of the agricultural depression, >> plus >> the dying silk weaving etc., but have never heard a particular year for >> Canada. I would like to read up on Norfolk 18th-19th century emigres. >> >> Interested because our twig of the Nortons was apparently all that was >> left, >> at that time, of an earlier 18th century network, thriving and with a >> printed genealogy would you believe! Furthermore, the last person on this >> tree, Stephen Norton (b.Brooke 1782) appears to be pretty impecunious by >> 1841, living in Norwich. So far the reason undiscovered. Very strange to >> have relatively good info on our Scott side, a number of whom left England >> for the same part of Canada in the 1880s, with others possibly leaving >> Scotland at an earlier date, but nothing on any emigrating Nortons from >> this >> area. >> >> Many thanks for any clues you can give - there's no hurry . >> >> Jill >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Bonnie Ostler"<bjrgen@gmail.com> >> To:<norfolk@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 4:02 AM >> >> >> The big emigration from Norfolk to Canada took place in 1836. when more >>> than 3,000 men, women and children left Norfolk, the majority landed in >>> Quebec. >>> >>> Bonnie >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. > We are a community of 7 million users fighting spam. > SPAMfighter has removed 3568 of my spam emails to date. > Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len > > The Professional version does not have this message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The same thing happened in my family. My paternal grandmother had a child 8 years before she married and moved away. He was brought up by his grandparents and only knew of them as his parents. His marriage and death certificates list the grandparents as parents. He would have fit right in ... his aunt was only 3 years older than him and all this only came to light when I got his birth certificate. Rosemary On Sun, Nov 13, 2011 at 5:13 PM, xpn11 <xpn11@aol.com> wrote: > I have seen certificates roughly the same date with the father's name > left blank so it must have been allowed. > One option is that he had made the pretence for reasons of employment. > Or to save face- although only witnesses get to see a marriage > certificate he may have had to conjure up a deceased parent. > He would not have been able to carry off an open deceit if he lived > married and worked where he grew up I would have thought. > Rosie > > On 13/11/2011 22:52, Elizabeth Inmon wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > > > Had the same situation with my maternal grandmother. No father's name on > > birth, grandfather's name on marriage as the father. My mother told me > that > > her mother grew up believing that her grandparents were her parents, > while > > being told that her natural mother was her "sister". So much for family > > secrets. My grandmother's mother actually married the man believed to be > > the father a few years later, having more children. However, my > grandmother > > was left with her grandparents and was raised by them. > > > > Good luck with your research, > > > > Elizabeth > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Tony Ellis > > Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 5:05 PM > > To: NORFOLK@rootsweb.com > > Subject: [NFK] Grandfather's name as Father on Wedding Certificate > > > > Hi All > > > > I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does > > not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the > > person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born > > out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage > > certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of his > > grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father was, and > > his name was quite different. > > > > Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name > > required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' to > > either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family were > > religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. > > > > Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, > > theories - all gratefully accepted.. > > > > Tony > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Tony, Had the same situation with my maternal grandmother. No father's name on birth, grandfather's name on marriage as the father. My mother told me that her mother grew up believing that her grandparents were her parents, while being told that her natural mother was her "sister". So much for family secrets. My grandmother's mother actually married the man believed to be the father a few years later, having more children. However, my grandmother was left with her grandparents and was raised by them. Good luck with your research, Elizabeth -----Original Message----- From: Tony Ellis Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 5:05 PM To: NORFOLK@rootsweb.com Subject: [NFK] Grandfather's name as Father on Wedding Certificate Hi All I have a relative born in Norfolk in 1910. His birth certificate does not show a father, and the mother is living with her parents with the person in question shown as a grandson in the 1911 census. He was born out of wedlock. However, when he marries in 1938 the marriage certificate has a name for his father, which is identical to that of his grandfather. We have a very good idea who the biological father was, and his name was quite different. Was it common in this circumstance to do this? Was a father's name required and could not be left blank? Other thoughts :- a 'white lie' to either help any children from the marriage or the bride's family were religious and wouldn't have accepted such a son-in-law. Any thoughts, knowledge of general practice, legal requirements, theories - all gratefully accepted.. Tony ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

----- Original Message ----- From: "Marg Keable" <mkeable@netconnect.com.au> To: <NORFOLK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2011 12:26 AM Subject: [NFK] In remembrance >I would like to remember the following: > > John KEABLE born Earlham, Norfolk, emigrated to Canada but returned to > England to enlist and fight in WW1. Was wounded in France. My great > uncle. > > William Murray KEABLE born Horning, Norfolk, emigrated to Australia and > fought in WW2 in the Pacific region. (my father). > > John KEABLE, born Horning Norfolk, emigrated to Australia and was in the > airforce during WW2. My uncle > > Marg Keable > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NORFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message