Good morning and thank you. The only disappointing and confusing thing about this is that Carrie said--as I mentioned--put down on legal documents and said to her family that her parents were Jonathan and Hannah Pickel. Stranger stories have been told, I know, but when she was so far away in time and distance, I don't see the need for lying. We may never know. If Elizabeth and Carrie were sisters...then they shared the other siblings, too. I have no other name for Caroline's parents than the above that she mentioned. I know that my grandparents didn't know that they weren't her parents because Grandpa (W.E. Chandler of MI) lived to be one-hundred and alert to the end. He lived with my family, Stewart and Mildred (Annis) Chandler after my grandmother died in her early eighties. He did back genealogy plus the names and towns of all his fifteen siblings of whom he was the youngest living one...and to whom they were married and who their children were. He has my grandmother's family all listed in the same way...except for Elizabeth...who doesn't appear, but he might not have known much about Carrie's family since it looks like no others besides the two lived in MI--unless the Calkins are related. These two seemed to live with other families, perhaps related to them or former neighbors, anyway. The Man/n name doesn't surprise me..pleases me that Elizabeth Man and her husband signed as witnesses to Carrie's marriage to Truman Curtis. I'm glad that there are no surprises in the Curtis family and seems to be well documented. I wonder who the Calkins were and what was their connection. I guess I'll have to do a little poking around on that one to for my own satisfaction. Where do I write for the will? I remember in my early days of genealogy I learned that NJ was one of the first genealogy-friendly states. This was nice information to get first thing in the morning. I was wondering where I start next. I hope you have a wonderfuk weekend, Helen Chandler (in Miami) In a message dated 11/15/2008 12:42:28 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [email protected] writes: Doty & Helen, Jonathan Odell Pickell, husband of Hannah Besson, left a will, file 6899J. I don't know if he mentioned all of his children in his will, but it would be worth obtaining if you think they are the parents of Caroline and/or Elizabeth. It costs about $5. The 1840 census of Washington, Macolm Co., MI Elizabeth Pickle: no males, 1 female < 5, 2 females < 10, 1 female < 15. 1 female 40-50. On the same page was the family of Hiram Calkins (Elizabeth Pickle Jr was living with them in 1850) and a Mann family. It is likely that Elizabeth Pickle Sr. died before 1850 and her children went to live with family and friends. A probate record may exist for her or guardianships for her children who were under age. Tax records begin in Washington Twp in 1844. If Elizabeth Pickel Sr. owned land and died after 1843, she would be listed and you could get a clearer idea of when she died. It is likely that Elizabeth's husband purchased land when the family moved to Michigan. I think those records would show who her husband was. > Elizabeth Pickel died Feb 14, 1827, age 3 weeks and was buried at St Thomas > Episcopal in Alexandria She was the daughter of Jonathan Odell Pickel and Hannah Besson. She was born in January 1827. I don't show that couple had a daughter named Caroline. The 1830 census of Alexandria, Hunterdon Co shows only one Jonathan Pickel with only1 daughter at that time. She was Mary Ann, born 04 Feb 1828. > other later siblings could be named after their deceased sibling or are these > 2 Elizabeth Pickel girls COUSINS? This was a common practice and should be looked at. However, Elizabeth is listed in the 1850, 1870 & 1880 census as being born about 1825. In the 1860 census she is listed as being born about 1827 in Michigan. I think it is more likely the two Elizabeth's were cousins. Elizabeth Pickle Mann had a daugther named Carrie, implying they were close. > Elizabeth Pickel who according NJDARM database married Conrad Hockenberry 16 > May 1852 in Lebanon, Hunterdon County, NJ. She was the daughter of Henry Pickel and Hannah Johnson. Mike Morrissey ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 8:38 PM Subject: Re: [NJHUNTER] Carrie/Caroline Pickel 1833 Elizabeth Pickel died Feb 14, 1827, age 3 weeks and was buried at St Thomas Episcopal in Alexandria Caroline Lennard died Se[p 26, 1851 at age 2 years 7 months. Fred Lathrop ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 8:10:09 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [NJHUNTER] Carrie/Caroline Pickel 1833 I'll let you know. Dot and I are on line together now...back and forth. She doesn't see it like i do. I think We've got her cornered In a message dated 11/14/2008 8:09:08 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [email protected] writes: Hi Mike, Good clue. Caroline and Truman's marriage was witnessed by John and Elizabeth Man. Have to find that census and see. Thanks for the reply. I will be sure to get back to you if/when I find Carrie's parents. Dot ----- Original Message ----- From: "mike" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 7:27 PM Subject: Re: [NJHUNTER] Carrie/Caroline Pickel 1833 > Dot, > > There is a film copy of at least some of the records available through the > Family History Library: > Church records of the German Reformed Church, of Alexandria Township, > Hunterdon County, New Jersey FHL US/CAN Film 441466 Item 2 > > Ancenstry.com has the records from 1763 through 1802. > > You may have noticed in the 1850 census of Washington, Macomb, MI > Elizabeth Pickle, age 25, b NJ living with the Calkins family. > She married John Mann and died in 1897. > see Past and Present of Macomb County, Michigan By Robert F. Eldredge, > page 406 > search Google books for "Elizabeth Pickle" Macomb > > Bruce and Washington townwhips border each other. I am guessing, but > Elizabeth may be a sister of Caroline. > > I would be interested to hear if you are able to confirm Caroline's > parents. > > Mike Morrissey > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dotbfl" <[email protected]> > To: "NJHUNTER mail list" <[email protected]> > Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 4:18 PM > Subject: [NJHUNTER] Carrie/Caroline Pickel 1833 > > >>I am trying to find the source for the date of birth of Carrie/Caroline >>Pickel on 2 April 1833 in Alexandria, Hunterdon Co, NJ. She was in >>Michigan in 1850 and m Truman Curtis 1859. She died 1910. >> Need to connect her to parents who I believe are Jonathan Pickel and wife >> Hannah Person or Besson. They were married 1821 in Alexandria German >> Reformed Church but it was not in operation when Carrie/Caroline was >> born. Does anyone know where I could find the records from this church? >> Any help greatly appreciated. >> Dot >> >> Visit the Hunterdon County GenWeb page at: >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~njhunter >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > Visit the Hunterdon County GenWeb page at: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~njhunter > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > Visit the Hunterdon County GenWeb page at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~njhunter ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message **************Get the Moviefone Toolbar. Showtimes, theaters, movie news & more!(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1212774565x1200812037/aol?redir= htt p://toolbar.aol.com/moviefone/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000001) Visit the Hunterdon County GenWeb page at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~njhunter ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Visit the Hunterdon County GenWeb page at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~njhunter ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Visit the Hunterdon County GenWeb page at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~njhunter ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message **************Get the Moviefone Toolbar. Showtimes, theaters, movie news & more!(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1212774565x1200812037/aol?redir=htt p://toolbar.aol.com/moviefone/download.html?ncid=emlcntusdown00000001)

Helen, > Where do I write for the will? http://www.state.nj.us/state/darm/links/reference.html Land and Estate Records Wills and Estate Inventories 1670-1952 $5.00 per packet (up to 10 pages), $1.00 each additional page; provide the name of the deceased, approximate death date, and county or major city of residence. Include file number, if known. Jonathan died on 07 Feb 1869 in Hunterdon Co., NJ. The file number is 6899J. Checks should be made payable to: New Jersey General Treasury Mail requests to: New Jersey State Archives PO Box 307 Trenton, NJ 08625-0307 Many Michigan county histories are online at: http://quod.lib.umich.edu/m/micounty/ Mike Morrissey -------------------------------------------------- From: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2008 8:36 AM To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [NJHUNTER] Carrie/Caroline Pickel 1833 Where do I write for the will? I remember in my early days of genealogy I learned that NJ was one of the first genealogy-friendly states. This was nice information to get first thing in the morning. I was wondering where I start next.