I only meant to say that the book was available in case someone was looking for it.....Thanks for giving us a history on the languages...Very interesting.... May the peace of the Great Spirit be with you. Gabby ----- Original Message ----- From: "R D Winthrop" <RDWinthrop@a1access.net> To: <NISHNAWBE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 12:13 PM Subject: Re: [NISHNAWBE] Ojibway Language > > >Sorry to be so naive... but ... what is the comparison of the Ojibway and > >Potawatomi language? Both are Algonquin language. Are the dialects very > >different IF at all? > > Algonquin is a family of language stocks which, with some exceptions, > at Contact covered pretty much cover the greater part of northeastern > quadrant of North America; notable exception is the Iroquoian family > clustered mainly around the lower Great Lakes (includes Wendat > (Huron)) and in the southeast (Cherokee). > > The Algonquin family is often academically split into Northwestern and > Eastern branches; included in the former are languages often not > thought of as Algonquin including those spoken by Cheyenne, Blackfoot, > and Arapahoe. Also in the Northwestern branch are those spoken by > Cree, Shawnee, Fox, Menominee, and Illinois as well as Potawatomi and > Ojibway (Odawa / Otttawa is generally treated as not significantly > different from Ojibway but as a dialect.) > > The Eastern branch -- that is, east of the Niagara Escarpment (Bruce > Peninsula) -- include Micmac, Malacite, Abenaki, Mohegan-Pequot, > Narragansett,Mohegan, Muncie, Powhattan and others. Generally > speaking, these Eastern languages have not fared so well since Contact > as have the more widespread and/or remote Northwestern tongues = about > a dozen of them have effectively disappeared, and others are vestigal. > > I'm simplifying, but Ojibwe / Odawa are probably dialects, that is > variations of the same language. Potawatomi doesn't differ a lot -- it > uses the same building blocks, the same grammar, etc. but sounds a > little different, some words vary, etc., so it is usually treated as a > different language. Theory is that the languages diverged pretty late > in their linguistic history, so they're not far apart; flip side of > that is that the closer related they are, the less time has elapsed > since divergence. > > Even within Ojibwe / Odawa there is a lot of regional variation in > vocabulary, pronunciation, etc so that a southeastern Ojibwe speaker > from Michigan would speak / hear somewhat differently from a plains > Ojibwe in Manitoba; should be mutually intelligible, as would a > Potawatomi - Ojibway conversation. > > Potawatomi, Ojibwe & Odawa tongues can safely be referred to as > Anishinaabemowin. > > >> _Dictionary of The Ojibway Language_ by Fredric Baraga. It is 422 pages > >> and is really nice, a paper back with a price tag of $24.95. Barnes and > >> Noble also carries this book. It has a new forwrd by: John D. Nichols. > > Baraga was the hardest-working Supulcian in North America in mid 19th > c. -- he's all over the Superior country, and he worked hard at his > linguistic work, having his first dictionary published in Detroit in > the 1850s. U Minnesota, bleess their hearts, have it in print and I > recommend it to anyonme who does much work digging around in > Anishinaabemowin, although I gotta fess up and tell you I was > discourageed from using Baraga for a long time by the Speaker who > tries to get me to understand his language -- says it's too rooted in > the 19th century, and he's right that it is, but that's not > necessarily a bad thing for historical work in that period ... > > If you search for the book at places like these ought to find it new > for considerably less than list; if Used is okay, even less. > > These are comparison shopper sittes listing a range of sellers > http://www.pricescan.com/home_books.asp (< $20) > http://www.addall.com/ (< $20) > http://www.alibris.com/ (used only) > > This is a single seller i like to get a 'base price' on new books > from -- they're fast and reliable in my experience, a good seller. > http://www.alldirect.com/ ($15.47 + s/h) > > U Minnesota also published A CONCISE DICTIONARY OF MINNESOTA OJIBWE by > John D. Nichols and Earl Nyholm [ISBN=0816624283] which is also > available in paper, sometimes under $10. It is more contemporary, > easier to use, but orthography and some words are a little different > over der in Minnie-Soter than they are on this side of the Lake ;} > > regards - rdw > > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > >