I do not know if this helps or hinders the current discussion on this subject which I find very interesting. Baptismal entry from the Loughinisland RC parish register: "Nov 22 1823 John of Col Forde illegt" This would be the same Col. Forde who owned Loughinisland Parish lands in their entirety. No mention of the mother or indeed the surname given this child. Owen Davey -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for private users. It has removed 25 spam emails to date. Paying users do not have this message in their emails. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len