I typed Caora into the search at Yahoo and various Caora came up. I have since gone back into them and find they are all pay sites now. Polly

I typed Caora in the Yahoo search and various Caora came up. Going into it further they all seem to be pay to use sites now Polly

Not so. Look at the crests of the O'Brians, O'Rourkes, O'Reillys, O'Neills, O'Mearas, Kinsellas, Keoghs, Heffernans, Dillons, etc., etc. See: Irish Family Names, arms & origins by Brian de Breffney. Clans and Families of Ireland by John Grenham. Irish Family Histories by Ida Grehan. As many Irish families had close connections with the Anglo-Normans the rampant lion may be of Norman origin. Before the Norman invasion there likely were no family arms as such and many of the ones depicted today on all sorts of tourist items and depicted by Internet merchants are of comparatively recent or even fictional origin. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Donal O'Kelly" <ocollaugh@comcast.net> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 10:48 PM Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > Perhaps a figment of imagination, but I have looked up hundreds of COA, > pennants and flags, and it seems to me that the lion is more associated > with > Britain, while the boar is more associated with Wales. The COA I found for > the Owen line in Wales and North Ireland both have a boar on them. > > donkelly > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peter McGuinness" <pmcguinness@sbcglobal.net> > To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 9:47 PM > Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > > >> The McGuinness crest I have shows a Lion and a BOAR, rather than a bear. >> Maybe an excusable mistake. >> Peter >> >> Fiona Jones wrote: >>> Thanks Hugh......I should clarify....this was from the "Man About Town" >>> at >>> the Mourne Observer...I didn't write it. Perhaps you should send your >>> piece >>> to the MO in response to the MAT. I have his email address if you need >>> it. >>> >>> CHEERS!!!!!! >>> >>> Fiona. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com >>> [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] >>> On Behalf Of Hugh Macartney >>> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 2:35 PM >>> To: nir-down@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >>> >>> There is another explanation for the name MacGuinness and that is it >>> derives >>> >>> from the Irish MacAonghasa from the personal name Aongas (Angus) made up >>> of >>> aon (one) and gus (choice). It is said to be the name of a famous >>> Pictish >>> king of Scotland, supposedly the son of the Irish God Daghda and Boinn, >>> the >>> goddess who gave her name to the River Boyne. My Irish is a bit rusty >>> but I >>> >>> don't recognise Gion Ais. A ridge in Irish is drum/drom drimm. The >>> MacGuinnesses displaced the O'Haugheys in the 12th. C. and ruled over >>> the >>> region until the 17th.C. Kinelarty derives from Cinel Arty (territory of >>> the >>> >>> (Mac) Artans who with the Macgennis clan shared the territory. Artan is >>> said >>> >>> to come from the Celtic or perhaps Pictish word "art/artois" meaning >>> bear. >>> The Macartneys of Scotland and later Ulster likely were originally >>> MacArtans >>> >>> to went to Scotland as raiders or settlers and stayed there, the name >>> gradually changing to McCartney/Macartney and variant spellings. The >>> distance from the County Down coast to Scotland is only around 20 >>> miles - >>> an >>> >>> easy day's sail. The idea that the Mac/McArtneys were derived from the >>> McCarthys of Munster is very unlikely to be true. The Guinness crest I >>> have >>> seen has a lion and a red hand but no bear. Many thanks Fiona for an >>> interesting story and I'll drink a creamy pint to Arthur not caring if >>> he >>> was entitled to his crest or no. A large number of crests and coats of >>> arms >>> are purely fictional creations of the Victorian and earlier eras anyway. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Fiona Jones" <mourneminers@optonline.net> >>> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 6:00 AM >>> Subject: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >>> >>> >>> >>>> Story below from the Man About Town (Mourne Observer Newspaper) >>>> http://www.mourneobserver.com/Man%20about%20town.htm >>>> >>>> Fiona. >>>> >>>> IGP Co. Down Coordinator >>>> >>>> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ >>>> >>>> ============ >>>> >>>> Guinness and the Guiness connection >>>> >>>> IT seems DNA research has now linked the great Guinness brewing dynasty >>>> to >>>> the McCartan clan of Kinelarty in rural Down, rather than, has been >>>> previously claimed, the high-born Magennis chieftains of Iveagh. >>>> Newspaper reports on the discovery - contained in a new biography, >>>> "Arthur's >>>> Round: The Life and Times of Brewing Legend Arthur Guinness" - have >>>> been >>>> accompanied by such expressions as "ancestral pretensions," "an act of >>>> social climbing," and "humble background." >>>> For hundreds of years it has been assumed that brewery founder Arthur >>>> Guinness was a descendant of the Iveagh chieftains. Indeed, when he >>>> married >>>> in 1761 he engraved a silver cup with the armorial bearings of the >>>> Magennises - a lion, with the red hand of Ulster and a bear. >>>> DNA test carried out at Trinity College Dublin at the behest of the >>>> family >>>> show the male Y-chromosomes can, instead, be traced to the McCartan >>>> clan - >>>> and not the clan chiefs but, rather, their followers. >>>> Where the McCartans once lived is today the small hamlet of Guiness, a >>>> name >>>> derived from the Irish Gion Ais, meaning wedge-shaped ridge, thus >>>> explaining >>>> the roots of the surname. >>>> And, of course, as local researchers will tell you, there's a strong >>>> connection between the McCartans and the late French President Charles >>>> De >>>> Gaulle His great-grandmother was one Marie Angelique McCartan. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes >>> in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1218 - Release Date: >> 1/10/2008 >> 1:32 PM >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Yes, that is correct. The boar is on the crest, not on the shield. In other words, it is on all the fancy bits surrounding it, which include a couple of stags, an armoured helmet and a boar divided into gold and red quarters on the version I have. Peter Hugh Macartney wrote: > I have three books on Irish ancient families by Grehan, Grehan and Brian de > Breffney and all show the MacGuinness shield with only a red hand and a lion > rampant. Possibly other branches of the family had variations. The name is > derived from MacAonghusa (son of Angus) and the family is descended from > Saran, chief of Dal Airaidhe. About two dozen variations of name have been > found including MacInnes of Scotland. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peter McGuinness" <pmcguinness@sbcglobal.net> > To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 9:47 PM > Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > > > >> The McGuinness crest I have shows a Lion and a BOAR, rather than a bear. >> Maybe an excusable mistake. >> Peter >> >> Fiona Jones wrote: >> >>> Thanks Hugh......I should clarify....this was from the "Man About Town" >>> at >>> the Mourne Observer...I didn't write it. Perhaps you should send your >>> piece >>> to the MO in response to the MAT. I have his email address if you need >>> it. >>> >>> CHEERS!!!!!! >>> >>> Fiona. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com >>> [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] >>> On Behalf Of Hugh Macartney >>> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 2:35 PM >>> To: nir-down@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >>> >>> There is another explanation for the name MacGuinness and that is it >>> derives >>> >>> from the Irish MacAonghasa from the personal name Aongas (Angus) made up >>> of >>> aon (one) and gus (choice). It is said to be the name of a famous Pictish >>> king of Scotland, supposedly the son of the Irish God Daghda and Boinn, >>> the >>> goddess who gave her name to the River Boyne. My Irish is a bit rusty >>> but I >>> >>> don't recognise Gion Ais. A ridge in Irish is drum/drom drimm. The >>> MacGuinnesses displaced the O'Haugheys in the 12th. C. and ruled over the >>> region until the 17th.C. Kinelarty derives from Cinel Arty (territory of >>> the >>> >>> (Mac) Artans who with the Macgennis clan shared the territory. Artan is >>> said >>> >>> to come from the Celtic or perhaps Pictish word "art/artois" meaning >>> bear. >>> The Macartneys of Scotland and later Ulster likely were originally >>> MacArtans >>> >>> to went to Scotland as raiders or settlers and stayed there, the name >>> gradually changing to McCartney/Macartney and variant spellings. The >>> distance from the County Down coast to Scotland is only around 20 miles - >>> an >>> >>> easy day's sail. The idea that the Mac/McArtneys were derived from the >>> McCarthys of Munster is very unlikely to be true. The Guinness crest I >>> have >>> seen has a lion and a red hand but no bear. Many thanks Fiona for an >>> interesting story and I'll drink a creamy pint to Arthur not caring if he >>> was entitled to his crest or no. A large number of crests and coats of >>> arms >>> are purely fictional creations of the Victorian and earlier eras anyway. >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Fiona Jones" <mourneminers@optonline.net> >>> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 6:00 AM >>> Subject: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Story below from the Man About Town (Mourne Observer Newspaper) >>>> http://www.mourneobserver.com/Man%20about%20town.htm >>>> >>>> Fiona. >>>> >>>> IGP Co. Down Coordinator >>>> >>>> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ >>>> >>>> ============ >>>> >>>> Guinness and the Guiness connection >>>> >>>> IT seems DNA research has now linked the great Guinness brewing dynasty >>>> to >>>> the McCartan clan of Kinelarty in rural Down, rather than, has been >>>> previously claimed, the high-born Magennis chieftains of Iveagh. >>>> Newspaper reports on the discovery - contained in a new biography, >>>> "Arthur's >>>> Round: The Life and Times of Brewing Legend Arthur Guinness" - have been >>>> accompanied by such expressions as "ancestral pretensions," "an act of >>>> social climbing," and "humble background." >>>> For hundreds of years it has been assumed that brewery founder Arthur >>>> Guinness was a descendant of the Iveagh chieftains. Indeed, when he >>>> married >>>> in 1761 he engraved a silver cup with the armorial bearings of the >>>> Magennises - a lion, with the red hand of Ulster and a bear. >>>> DNA test carried out at Trinity College Dublin at the behest of the >>>> family >>>> show the male Y-chromosomes can, instead, be traced to the McCartan >>>> clan - >>>> and not the clan chiefs but, rather, their followers. >>>> Where the McCartans once lived is today the small hamlet of Guiness, a >>>> name >>>> derived from the Irish Gion Ais, meaning wedge-shaped ridge, thus >>>> explaining >>>> the roots of the surname. >>>> And, of course, as local researchers will tell you, there's a strong >>>> connection between the McCartans and the late French President Charles >>>> De >>>> Gaulle His great-grandmother was one Marie Angelique McCartan. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes >>> in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Linda There were Burnsides in the Ballymoney area. You may find then in one of the book by Rev. T. H. Mullin and his wife Julia Mullins, They have written books towgether and separately. Another sourse is North Antrim Families, T. J. G. Bennett, 1974, pp 27-49; 68; 89-91; 104-106; 119-125; 143-145; 168. These page references are for Boyd but do contain some Burnsides. This book was at the Local Library section of the Ballymena Library. (so they may be able to look it up the Index for you to give you names and time period. Mike Boyd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Holley" <ljholley@comcast.net> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 7:56 AM Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] Burnside FAMILY > Hugh, > > Thank you for the reply! Would you mind telling me where Newry and Drumbo > are located, hopefully they are near Co. Antrim where Robert said he was > born. Do you happen to know where the Burnside name was found in Antrim? > I keep thinking someone may have done research before 1922 and their > material is deposited somewhere. I am coming there in the summer and a > kind person from another list has offered to help me look at PRONI. I am > trying to collect every tiny bit I can before I get there. > > Upon rereading my original email I see I made a hugh mistake - my Robert > reported on his naturlization papers he was born in Co. Antrim and 2 of > his sons said they were born in Co. Down. I apologize for the mistake. I > had one eye dilated this morning and I can barely see straight. > > Linda > > > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > From: Hugh Macartney <hhmacartney@shaw.ca> >> In County Down the name Burnside was principally found in Newry and >> Drumbo. >> Most of the early Irish records were destroyed in 1922 so the early >> families >> might be difficult to trace. I would suggest you look at the >> International >> Genealogical Index (IGI) for Ireland in your nearest Mormon library and >> see >> if any show up. The 1843 Belfast directory listed only one Burnside - >> Thomas, a bricklayer. Likely he came there from somewhere else. The name >> can >> be either English or Scottish. A Burnside was an American senator in the >> 19th.C. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Linda Holley" <ljholley@comcast.net> >> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:18 AM >> Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Burnside FAMILY >> >> >> > Thought I would post info again about my Burnside family is case >> > someone >> > was new to the list that might have information about this family. My >> > gggggrandfather was Robert Burnside - born abt.1760 who immigrated to >> > American in 1817. He reported on his naturalization paper he was born >> > in >> > Co. Down and 2 of his sons reported in the 1860 census of PA that they >> > were born in Co. Down. >> > >> > Robert's sons were, Willaim, Samuel - born about 1790, Alexander, >> > John/James, and Robert. >> > >> > Thank you, Linda Holley >> > >> > -------------- Original message ---------------------- >> > From: Roxanne Neel <roxanne4mastiffs@verizon.net> >> >> Thank You Fiona! I will put these in a safe place ;-) >> >> Best Regards, >> >> Roxanne >> >> >> >> >> >> Fiona Jones wrote: >> >> >> >> >Hi Roxanne - the site address is: >> >> > >> >> >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ >> >> >and the BRICKWALL page is at: >> >> > >> >> >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/brickwall.htm >> >> > >> >> >Fiona. >> >> >IGP Co. Down Coordinator >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >-----Original Message----- >> >> >From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com >> >> >[mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> >> >On Behalf Of Roxanne Neel >> >> >Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 1:20 PM >> >> >To: nir-down@rootsweb.com >> >> >Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Fiona's Website [Brickwall section] >> >> > >> >> >Hi Fiona, >> >> >What is the address to your website that includes Brickwalls? Sorry, >> >> >but I've misplaced it :-/ >> >> >Many Thanks, >> >> >Roxanne >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> >> quotes in >> >> the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in >> the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Great thank you for the 3 Dugan and 3 Gribben families in Moneyscalp and surrounding areas. -----Original Message----- From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Sean McCartan Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 5:33 PM To: nir-down@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down Marilyn In 1846 there were three DUGAN families and three GRIBBEN families in the adjacent townlands of Moneyscalp and Burrenreagh. From Estate rentals. Sean -----Original Message----- From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of bnm29 Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 9:22 PM To: nir-down@rootsweb.com Subject: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down I have been researching a Francis Dugan in County Down, but I believe it's a lost cause since he left for Phila. PA in 1854, and married a Catharine Gribbon in Phila. who had also come from Co. Down. He was born in ca 1827. This was a very early time period for catholic records. My question is, where in Co. Down was the name Dugan/Duggan principally found in that time period? Marilyn Partee ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1218 - Release Date: 1/10/2008 1:32 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1218 - Release Date: 1/10/2008 1:32 PM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you for all of your great ideas on the Dugans in Co. Down. Marilyn -----Original Message----- From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of DLCulhane@cs.com Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 5:05 PM To: nir-down@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down Marilyn: The Griffith's index on failteromhat.com shows Dugans mostly in Comber civil parish, which is Newtownards RC parish, but the filmed records go back only to 1856 (it's always possible there are earlier records at the parish church). Duggans were more widely scattered, with the largest numbers in Dromore, both civil and RC, records back to 1823 on LDS film 0926081, and Drumballyconey, which is is Annaclone RC parish, records back on 1834 on LDS film 0926074. Even though that's too late for Francis's baptism, you might look for him as a godfather or marriage witness in the late 1840s and early 1850s, before he emigrated. Diane ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you Mike, I will search for the Dugan's in the Griffith's Valuation. -----Original Message----- From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Mike Boyd Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 4:57 PM To: nir-down@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down Marilyn You would be better off looking at the Griffith Valuation. That would tell you where all the Dugan's were in County Down. I am not sure what period it was done in Co Down. But it would give you the full list of Dugan families that you can shorten and it will give you the local location that you may be able to match with your other records to find your right family. I assume one of the Down Net lists will have Griffith Valuation on it for your to search rather than make a trip to Ireland. Mike Boyd Brisbane ----- Original Message ----- From: "bnm29" <bnm29@comcast.net> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 7:22 AM Subject: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down >I have been researching a Francis Dugan in County Down, but I believe it's >a > lost cause since he left for Phila. PA in 1854, and married a Catharine > Gribbon in Phila. who had also come from Co. Down. He was born in ca > 1827. > This was a very early time period for catholic records. > > > > My question is, where in Co. Down was the name Dugan/Duggan principally > found in that time period? > > > > Marilyn Partee > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you Judy, that gives me another place to search for Gribbon/Gribbin. -----Original Message----- From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Juditoh@aol.com Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 4:42 PM To: nir-down@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down Hi Marilyn, I don't know if this might be any help but I have a record of a Catherine Gribben born 31 Jan 1833 to Bernard Gribben and Elizabeth Fegan in Kilbroney Parish (Rostrevor area). Mary Star of the Sea is the Catholic Church in the area. I don't know if this is your area in County Down but if it should be the age is about right for marriage in the 1850's Judy In a message dated 1/11/2008 2:23:34 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, bnm29@comcast.net writes: I have been researching a Francis Dugan in County Down, but I believe it's a lost cause since he left for Phila. PA in 1854, and married a Catharine Gribbon in Phila. who had also come from Co. Down. He was born in ca 1827. This was a very early time period for catholic records. My question is, where in Co. Down was the name Dugan/Duggan principally found in that time period? Marilyn Partee ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489 ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Marilyn You would be better off looking at the Griffith Valuation. That would tell you where all the Dugan's were in County Down. I am not sure what period it was done in Co Down. But it would give you the full list of Dugan families that you can shorten and it will give you the local location that you may be able to match with your other records to find your right family. I assume one of the Down Net lists will have Griffith Valuation on it for your to search rather than make a trip to Ireland. Mike Boyd Brisbane ----- Original Message ----- From: "bnm29" <bnm29@comcast.net> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 7:22 AM Subject: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down >I have been researching a Francis Dugan in County Down, but I believe it's >a > lost cause since he left for Phila. PA in 1854, and married a Catharine > Gribbon in Phila. who had also come from Co. Down. He was born in ca > 1827. > This was a very early time period for catholic records. > > > > My question is, where in Co. Down was the name Dugan/Duggan principally > found in that time period? > > > > Marilyn Partee > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have an ancestor William Hudelson, an American Revolutionary War veteran who was born probably 1758, family lore saying he was born in North Ireland (some say Belfast). It's unclear when he emigrated to America, but he enlisted in Pennsylvania or New Jersey militia at the very start of the war. U.S. Army processing of the application of his widow for a veteran's widow pension said he may have been born in North Ireland or in Bucks County, PA. Nobody has identified his parents. A 23 Aug 2001 posting on the IRL-ULSTER web page says that there were a substantial number of Hiddleston/Hiddleson/Huddlestons present in the areas of Donaghadee and Comber, including Monlough Townland, Comber Parish in the 19th Century. The posting also says the Copy of Registries in the Barony of Ards lists a John Huddleston in Donaghadee. There apparently are Hiddlesons buried in the Monyreagh Non-Subscribing Presbyterian Church graveyard, from the 18th and 19th Century. \It's a long shot, I know, but does anybody have informataion that can help identify William's parents? David Hudelson

In 1820 there were 6 Boyd families living in the same county of PA as my Robert Burnside - Beaver Co., PA. Do you know if there was some connection to these two families in Ulster? Thank you so much for the information - I will write this down and take it with me. Linda -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "Mike Boyd" <mikejboyd@bigpond.com> > Linda > There were Burnsides in the Ballymoney area. > > You may find then in one of the book by Rev. T. H. Mullin and his wife Julia > Mullins, They have written books towgether and separately. > > Another sourse is North Antrim Families, T. J. G. Bennett, 1974, pp 27-49; > 68; 89-91; 104-106; 119-125; 143-145; 168. These page references are for > Boyd but do contain some Burnsides. This book was at the Local Library > section of the Ballymena Library. (so they may be able to look it up the > Index for you to give you names and time period. > > Mike Boyd > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda Holley" <ljholley@comcast.net> > To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 7:56 AM > Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] Burnside FAMILY > > > > Hugh, > > > > Thank you for the reply! Would you mind telling me where Newry and Drumbo > > are located, hopefully they are near Co. Antrim where Robert said he was > > born. Do you happen to know where the Burnside name was found in Antrim? > > I keep thinking someone may have done research before 1922 and their > > material is deposited somewhere. I am coming there in the summer and a > > kind person from another list has offered to help me look at PRONI. I am > > trying to collect every tiny bit I can before I get there. > > > > Upon rereading my original email I see I made a hugh mistake - my Robert > > reported on his naturlization papers he was born in Co. Antrim and 2 of > > his sons said they were born in Co. Down. I apologize for the mistake. I > > had one eye dilated this morning and I can barely see straight. > > > > Linda > > > > > > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > > From: Hugh Macartney <hhmacartney@shaw.ca> > >> In County Down the name Burnside was principally found in Newry and > >> Drumbo. > >> Most of the early Irish records were destroyed in 1922 so the early > >> families > >> might be difficult to trace. I would suggest you look at the > >> International > >> Genealogical Index (IGI) for Ireland in your nearest Mormon library and > >> see > >> if any show up. The 1843 Belfast directory listed only one Burnside - > >> Thomas, a bricklayer. Likely he came there from somewhere else. The name > >> can > >> be either English or Scottish. A Burnside was an American senator in the > >> 19th.C. > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Linda Holley" <ljholley@comcast.net> > >> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:18 AM > >> Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Burnside FAMILY > >> > >> > >> > Thought I would post info again about my Burnside family is case > >> > someone > >> > was new to the list that might have information about this family. My > >> > gggggrandfather was Robert Burnside - born abt.1760 who immigrated to > >> > American in 1817. He reported on his naturalization paper he was born > >> > in > >> > Co. Down and 2 of his sons reported in the 1860 census of PA that they > >> > were born in Co. Down. > >> > > >> > Robert's sons were, Willaim, Samuel - born about 1790, Alexander, > >> > John/James, and Robert. > >> > > >> > Thank you, Linda Holley > >> > > >> > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > >> > From: Roxanne Neel <roxanne4mastiffs@verizon.net> > >> >> Thank You Fiona! I will put these in a safe place ;-) > >> >> Best Regards, > >> >> Roxanne > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> Fiona Jones wrote: > >> >> > >> >> >Hi Roxanne - the site address is: > >> >> > > >> >> >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ > >> >> >and the BRICKWALL page is at: > >> >> > > >> >> >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/brickwall.htm > >> >> > > >> >> >Fiona. > >> >> >IGP Co. Down Coordinator > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> >-----Original Message----- > >> >> >From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com > >> >> >[mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] > >> >> >On Behalf Of Roxanne Neel > >> >> >Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 1:20 PM > >> >> >To: nir-down@rootsweb.com > >> >> >Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Fiona's Website [Brickwall section] > >> >> > > >> >> >Hi Fiona, > >> >> >What is the address to your website that includes Brickwalls? Sorry, > >> >> >but I've misplaced it :-/ > >> >> >Many Thanks, > >> >> >Roxanne > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> ------------------------------- > >> >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > >> >> quotes in > >> >> the subject and the body of the message > >> > > >> > > >> > ------------------------------- > >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > >> > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > >> quotes in > >> the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message

Perhaps a figment of imagination, but I have looked up hundreds of COA, pennants and flags, and it seems to me that the lion is more associated with Britain, while the boar is more associated with Wales. The COA I found for the Owen line in Wales and North Ireland both have a boar on them. donkelly ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter McGuinness" <pmcguinness@sbcglobal.net> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 9:47 PM Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > The McGuinness crest I have shows a Lion and a BOAR, rather than a bear. > Maybe an excusable mistake. > Peter > > Fiona Jones wrote: >> Thanks Hugh......I should clarify....this was from the "Man About Town" >> at >> the Mourne Observer...I didn't write it. Perhaps you should send your >> piece >> to the MO in response to the MAT. I have his email address if you need >> it. >> >> CHEERS!!!!!! >> >> Fiona. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> On Behalf Of Hugh Macartney >> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 2:35 PM >> To: nir-down@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >> >> There is another explanation for the name MacGuinness and that is it >> derives >> >> from the Irish MacAonghasa from the personal name Aongas (Angus) made up >> of >> aon (one) and gus (choice). It is said to be the name of a famous Pictish >> king of Scotland, supposedly the son of the Irish God Daghda and Boinn, >> the >> goddess who gave her name to the River Boyne. My Irish is a bit rusty >> but I >> >> don't recognise Gion Ais. A ridge in Irish is drum/drom drimm. The >> MacGuinnesses displaced the O'Haugheys in the 12th. C. and ruled over the >> region until the 17th.C. Kinelarty derives from Cinel Arty (territory of >> the >> >> (Mac) Artans who with the Macgennis clan shared the territory. Artan is >> said >> >> to come from the Celtic or perhaps Pictish word "art/artois" meaning >> bear. >> The Macartneys of Scotland and later Ulster likely were originally >> MacArtans >> >> to went to Scotland as raiders or settlers and stayed there, the name >> gradually changing to McCartney/Macartney and variant spellings. The >> distance from the County Down coast to Scotland is only around 20 miles - >> an >> >> easy day's sail. The idea that the Mac/McArtneys were derived from the >> McCarthys of Munster is very unlikely to be true. The Guinness crest I >> have >> seen has a lion and a red hand but no bear. Many thanks Fiona for an >> interesting story and I'll drink a creamy pint to Arthur not caring if he >> was entitled to his crest or no. A large number of crests and coats of >> arms >> are purely fictional creations of the Victorian and earlier eras anyway. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Fiona Jones" <mourneminers@optonline.net> >> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 6:00 AM >> Subject: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >> >> >> >>> Story below from the Man About Town (Mourne Observer Newspaper) >>> http://www.mourneobserver.com/Man%20about%20town.htm >>> >>> Fiona. >>> >>> IGP Co. Down Coordinator >>> >>> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ >>> >>> ============ >>> >>> Guinness and the Guiness connection >>> >>> IT seems DNA research has now linked the great Guinness brewing dynasty >>> to >>> the McCartan clan of Kinelarty in rural Down, rather than, has been >>> previously claimed, the high-born Magennis chieftains of Iveagh. >>> Newspaper reports on the discovery - contained in a new biography, >>> "Arthur's >>> Round: The Life and Times of Brewing Legend Arthur Guinness" - have been >>> accompanied by such expressions as "ancestral pretensions," "an act of >>> social climbing," and "humble background." >>> For hundreds of years it has been assumed that brewery founder Arthur >>> Guinness was a descendant of the Iveagh chieftains. Indeed, when he >>> married >>> in 1761 he engraved a silver cup with the armorial bearings of the >>> Magennises - a lion, with the red hand of Ulster and a bear. >>> DNA test carried out at Trinity College Dublin at the behest of the >>> family >>> show the male Y-chromosomes can, instead, be traced to the McCartan >>> clan - >>> and not the clan chiefs but, rather, their followers. >>> Where the McCartans once lived is today the small hamlet of Guiness, a >>> name >>> derived from the Irish Gion Ais, meaning wedge-shaped ridge, thus >>> explaining >>> the roots of the surname. >>> And, of course, as local researchers will tell you, there's a strong >>> connection between the McCartans and the late French President Charles >>> De >>> Gaulle His great-grandmother was one Marie Angelique McCartan. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1218 - Release Date: 1/10/2008 > 1:32 PM > >

Marilyn In 1846 there were three DUGAN families and three GRIBBEN families in the adjacent townlands of Moneyscalp and Burrenreagh. From Estate rentals. Sean -----Original Message----- From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of bnm29 Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 9:22 PM To: nir-down@rootsweb.com Subject: [NIR-DOWN] DUGAN - County Down I have been researching a Francis Dugan in County Down, but I believe it's a lost cause since he left for Phila. PA in 1854, and married a Catharine Gribbon in Phila. who had also come from Co. Down. He was born in ca 1827. This was a very early time period for catholic records. My question is, where in Co. Down was the name Dugan/Duggan principally found in that time period? Marilyn Partee ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1218 - Release Date: 1/10/2008 1:32 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1218 - Release Date: 1/10/2008 1:32 PM

I have three books on Irish ancient families by Grehan, Grehan and Brian de Breffney and all show the MacGuinness shield with only a red hand and a lion rampant. Possibly other branches of the family had variations. The name is derived from MacAonghusa (son of Angus) and the family is descended from Saran, chief of Dal Airaidhe. About two dozen variations of name have been found including MacInnes of Scotland. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter McGuinness" <pmcguinness@sbcglobal.net> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 9:47 PM Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > The McGuinness crest I have shows a Lion and a BOAR, rather than a bear. > Maybe an excusable mistake. > Peter > > Fiona Jones wrote: >> Thanks Hugh......I should clarify....this was from the "Man About Town" >> at >> the Mourne Observer...I didn't write it. Perhaps you should send your >> piece >> to the MO in response to the MAT. I have his email address if you need >> it. >> >> CHEERS!!!!!! >> >> Fiona. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] >> On Behalf Of Hugh Macartney >> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 2:35 PM >> To: nir-down@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >> >> There is another explanation for the name MacGuinness and that is it >> derives >> >> from the Irish MacAonghasa from the personal name Aongas (Angus) made up >> of >> aon (one) and gus (choice). It is said to be the name of a famous Pictish >> king of Scotland, supposedly the son of the Irish God Daghda and Boinn, >> the >> goddess who gave her name to the River Boyne. My Irish is a bit rusty >> but I >> >> don't recognise Gion Ais. A ridge in Irish is drum/drom drimm. The >> MacGuinnesses displaced the O'Haugheys in the 12th. C. and ruled over the >> region until the 17th.C. Kinelarty derives from Cinel Arty (territory of >> the >> >> (Mac) Artans who with the Macgennis clan shared the territory. Artan is >> said >> >> to come from the Celtic or perhaps Pictish word "art/artois" meaning >> bear. >> The Macartneys of Scotland and later Ulster likely were originally >> MacArtans >> >> to went to Scotland as raiders or settlers and stayed there, the name >> gradually changing to McCartney/Macartney and variant spellings. The >> distance from the County Down coast to Scotland is only around 20 miles - >> an >> >> easy day's sail. The idea that the Mac/McArtneys were derived from the >> McCarthys of Munster is very unlikely to be true. The Guinness crest I >> have >> seen has a lion and a red hand but no bear. Many thanks Fiona for an >> interesting story and I'll drink a creamy pint to Arthur not caring if he >> was entitled to his crest or no. A large number of crests and coats of >> arms >> are purely fictional creations of the Victorian and earlier eras anyway. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Fiona Jones" <mourneminers@optonline.net> >> To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 6:00 AM >> Subject: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty >> >> >> >>> Story below from the Man About Town (Mourne Observer Newspaper) >>> http://www.mourneobserver.com/Man%20about%20town.htm >>> >>> Fiona. >>> >>> IGP Co. Down Coordinator >>> >>> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ >>> >>> ============ >>> >>> Guinness and the Guiness connection >>> >>> IT seems DNA research has now linked the great Guinness brewing dynasty >>> to >>> the McCartan clan of Kinelarty in rural Down, rather than, has been >>> previously claimed, the high-born Magennis chieftains of Iveagh. >>> Newspaper reports on the discovery - contained in a new biography, >>> "Arthur's >>> Round: The Life and Times of Brewing Legend Arthur Guinness" - have been >>> accompanied by such expressions as "ancestral pretensions," "an act of >>> social climbing," and "humble background." >>> For hundreds of years it has been assumed that brewery founder Arthur >>> Guinness was a descendant of the Iveagh chieftains. Indeed, when he >>> married >>> in 1761 he engraved a silver cup with the armorial bearings of the >>> Magennises - a lion, with the red hand of Ulster and a bear. >>> DNA test carried out at Trinity College Dublin at the behest of the >>> family >>> show the male Y-chromosomes can, instead, be traced to the McCartan >>> clan - >>> and not the clan chiefs but, rather, their followers. >>> Where the McCartans once lived is today the small hamlet of Guiness, a >>> name >>> derived from the Irish Gion Ais, meaning wedge-shaped ridge, thus >>> explaining >>> the roots of the surname. >>> And, of course, as local researchers will tell you, there's a strong >>> connection between the McCartans and the late French President Charles >>> De >>> Gaulle His great-grandmother was one Marie Angelique McCartan. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Moneyreagh Non-Subscribing Presbyterian graveyard. HIDDLESON/HUDDLESON (Badly cracked with some lower parts missing). Here lieth the body of Robert Hiddleson of Monlaugh who d. Aug. 17 1799 aged 74. Here lieth the body of Mary Hiddleson alias M...on (possibly Morrison) wife to Robert Hiddleson of Monlaugh who d. March 12 1795 aged 62. here lieth the body of John Hiddleson, son of Robert of Monlaugh, who d. March the ... 1779 aged 22. Here lieth the body of Hannah Hiddleson alias Alexander who d. June 2 .... aged 54 years ...duteous wife, a kind parent ...husband and children with...ent their loss and this is ...James Huddleson of Monlough ...the memory of his wife. HUDDLESTON In mem. of John Huddleston of Monlough who d. Nov.30 1860 aged 72. Also his son David P. Huddleston who d. Feb. 24 1868 aged 33. Also his wife Elizabeth who d. Feb. 4 1881 aged 72. Also his son Robert who d. Oct. 16, 1896 aged 66. And his wife Mary Frame who d. Sept. 20, 1918 aged 75. Also their dau. Mary who d. Aug. 8 1923 aged 78. The 1886 Directory for Comber listed R. Huddleston, Monlough, Moneyreagh, farmer. The Tithe Aplotments for Monlough listed: Samuel & James Frame, John Alexander, John Huddleston. The Tithe Aplotments for Moneyreagh listed James, John & Alexander Huddleston. John Huddleston had 23 acres, Samuel 18 in Monlough. In Maoneyreagh James had 12, John 10 and Alex 7. In the townland of Ballykeel, Comber John Huddleston had 11 acres and Gilbert had 11. Movilla Graveyard, Newtownards HUDDLESTON Erected by his sons David Warwick and William John Huddleston as a grateful memorial to their dearly loved father William Huddleston, formerly of Loughries, born in Donaghadee Sept. 2 1796, died in Belfast Nov. 28 1861. Also to their brothers and sisters who died in infancy. HUDDLESTON Erected by James Huddleston of Ballyalton in mem. of his wife Jennet who d. Jan.10 1830 aged 77. Also the said James H. who d. Dec. 24 1834 aged 82. Also his son James who d. Sept. 23 1836 aged 51. WARWICK Erected by William Huddleston as a grateful memorial of his friend and kinsman the late David Warwick who d. Mar.8 1830 aged 77. Also Martha McCully, wife of Robert Patton, Loughries, who d. Oct. 19 1877 aged 19. Note. The Rev. Archibald Warwick was hanged Oct. 15, 1798 for his part in the '98 Rising. He was the grandson of David and Margaret Warwick of Loughriescouse. I hope this is of some interest. Hugh Macartney ----- Original Message ----- From: <dmh8620@bellsouth.net> To: <NIR-DOWN@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 8:15 PM Subject: [NIR-DOWN] HUDELSON/HUDDLESTON/HIDDLESTON, circa 1758 >I have an ancestor William Hudelson, an American Revolutionary War veteran >who was born probably 1758, family lore saying he was born in North Ireland >(some say Belfast). It's unclear when he emigrated to America, but he >enlisted in Pennsylvania or New Jersey militia at the very start of the >war. U.S. Army processing of the application of his widow for a veteran's >widow pension said he may have been born in North Ireland or in Bucks >County, PA. Nobody has identified his parents. > > A 23 Aug 2001 posting on the IRL-ULSTER web page says that there were a > substantial number of Hiddleston/Hiddleson/Huddlestons present in the > areas of Donaghadee and Comber, including Monlough Townland, Comber Parish > in the 19th Century. The posting also says the Copy of Registries in the > Barony of Ards lists a John Huddleston in Donaghadee. There apparently > are Hiddlesons buried in the Monyreagh Non-Subscribing Presbyterian Church > graveyard, from the 18th and 19th Century. > > \It's a long shot, I know, but does anybody have informataion that can > help identify William's parents? > > David Hudelson > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hugh, Thank you for the reply! Would you mind telling me where Newry and Drumbo are located, hopefully they are near Co. Antrim where Robert said he was born. Do you happen to know where the Burnside name was found in Antrim? I keep thinking someone may have done research before 1922 and their material is deposited somewhere. I am coming there in the summer and a kind person from another list has offered to help me look at PRONI. I am trying to collect every tiny bit I can before I get there. Upon rereading my original email I see I made a hugh mistake - my Robert reported on his naturlization papers he was born in Co. Antrim and 2 of his sons said they were born in Co. Down. I apologize for the mistake. I had one eye dilated this morning and I can barely see straight. Linda -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Hugh Macartney <hhmacartney@shaw.ca> > In County Down the name Burnside was principally found in Newry and Drumbo. > Most of the early Irish records were destroyed in 1922 so the early families > might be difficult to trace. I would suggest you look at the International > Genealogical Index (IGI) for Ireland in your nearest Mormon library and see > if any show up. The 1843 Belfast directory listed only one Burnside - > Thomas, a bricklayer. Likely he came there from somewhere else. The name can > be either English or Scottish. A Burnside was an American senator in the > 19th.C. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda Holley" <ljholley@comcast.net> > To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:18 AM > Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Burnside FAMILY > > > > Thought I would post info again about my Burnside family is case someone > > was new to the list that might have information about this family. My > > gggggrandfather was Robert Burnside - born abt.1760 who immigrated to > > American in 1817. He reported on his naturalization paper he was born in > > Co. Down and 2 of his sons reported in the 1860 census of PA that they > > were born in Co. Down. > > > > Robert's sons were, Willaim, Samuel - born about 1790, Alexander, > > John/James, and Robert. > > > > Thank you, Linda Holley > > > > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > > From: Roxanne Neel <roxanne4mastiffs@verizon.net> > >> Thank You Fiona! I will put these in a safe place ;-) > >> Best Regards, > >> Roxanne > >> > >> > >> Fiona Jones wrote: > >> > >> >Hi Roxanne - the site address is: > >> > > >> >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ > >> >and the BRICKWALL page is at: > >> > > >> >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/brickwall.htm > >> > > >> >Fiona. > >> >IGP Co. Down Coordinator > >> > > >> > > >> >-----Original Message----- > >> >From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com > >> >[mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] > >> >On Behalf Of Roxanne Neel > >> >Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 1:20 PM > >> >To: nir-down@rootsweb.com > >> >Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Fiona's Website [Brickwall section] > >> > > >> >Hi Fiona, > >> >What is the address to your website that includes Brickwalls? Sorry, > >> >but I've misplaced it :-/ > >> >Many Thanks, > >> >Roxanne > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > >> quotes in > >> the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message

The McGuinness crest I have shows a Lion and a BOAR, rather than a bear. Maybe an excusable mistake. Peter Fiona Jones wrote: > Thanks Hugh......I should clarify....this was from the "Man About Town" at > the Mourne Observer...I didn't write it. Perhaps you should send your piece > to the MO in response to the MAT. I have his email address if you need it. > > CHEERS!!!!!! > > Fiona. > > -----Original Message----- > From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] > On Behalf Of Hugh Macartney > Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 2:35 PM > To: nir-down@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > > There is another explanation for the name MacGuinness and that is it derives > > from the Irish MacAonghasa from the personal name Aongas (Angus) made up of > aon (one) and gus (choice). It is said to be the name of a famous Pictish > king of Scotland, supposedly the son of the Irish God Daghda and Boinn, the > goddess who gave her name to the River Boyne. My Irish is a bit rusty but I > > don't recognise Gion Ais. A ridge in Irish is drum/drom drimm. The > MacGuinnesses displaced the O'Haugheys in the 12th. C. and ruled over the > region until the 17th.C. Kinelarty derives from Cinel Arty (territory of the > > (Mac) Artans who with the Macgennis clan shared the territory. Artan is said > > to come from the Celtic or perhaps Pictish word "art/artois" meaning bear. > The Macartneys of Scotland and later Ulster likely were originally MacArtans > > to went to Scotland as raiders or settlers and stayed there, the name > gradually changing to McCartney/Macartney and variant spellings. The > distance from the County Down coast to Scotland is only around 20 miles - an > > easy day's sail. The idea that the Mac/McArtneys were derived from the > McCarthys of Munster is very unlikely to be true. The Guinness crest I have > seen has a lion and a red hand but no bear. Many thanks Fiona for an > interesting story and I'll drink a creamy pint to Arthur not caring if he > was entitled to his crest or no. A large number of crests and coats of arms > are purely fictional creations of the Victorian and earlier eras anyway. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fiona Jones" <mourneminers@optonline.net> > To: <nir-down@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 6:00 AM > Subject: [NIR-DOWN] GUINNESS and the McCartan clan of Kinelarty > > > >> Story below from the Man About Town (Mourne Observer Newspaper) >> http://www.mourneobserver.com/Man%20about%20town.htm >> >> Fiona. >> >> IGP Co. Down Coordinator >> >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ >> >> ============ >> >> Guinness and the Guiness connection >> >> IT seems DNA research has now linked the great Guinness brewing dynasty to >> the McCartan clan of Kinelarty in rural Down, rather than, has been >> previously claimed, the high-born Magennis chieftains of Iveagh. >> Newspaper reports on the discovery - contained in a new biography, >> "Arthur's >> Round: The Life and Times of Brewing Legend Arthur Guinness" - have been >> accompanied by such expressions as "ancestral pretensions," "an act of >> social climbing," and "humble background." >> For hundreds of years it has been assumed that brewery founder Arthur >> Guinness was a descendant of the Iveagh chieftains. Indeed, when he >> married >> in 1761 he engraved a silver cup with the armorial bearings of the >> Magennises - a lion, with the red hand of Ulster and a bear. >> DNA test carried out at Trinity College Dublin at the behest of the family >> show the male Y-chromosomes can, instead, be traced to the McCartan clan - >> and not the clan chiefs but, rather, their followers. >> Where the McCartans once lived is today the small hamlet of Guiness, a >> name >> derived from the Irish Gion Ais, meaning wedge-shaped ridge, thus >> explaining >> the roots of the surname. >> And, of course, as local researchers will tell you, there's a strong >> connection between the McCartans and the late French President Charles De >> Gaulle His great-grandmother was one Marie Angelique McCartan. >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Thought I would post info again about my Burnside family is case someone was new to the list that might have information about this family. My gggggrandfather was Robert Burnside - born abt.1760 who immigrated to American in 1817. He reported on his naturalization paper he was born in Co. Down and 2 of his sons reported in the 1860 census of PA that they were born in Co. Down. Robert's sons were, Willaim, Samuel - born about 1790, Alexander, John/James, and Robert. Thank you, Linda Holley -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Roxanne Neel <roxanne4mastiffs@verizon.net> > Thank You Fiona! I will put these in a safe place ;-) > Best Regards, > Roxanne > > > Fiona Jones wrote: > > >Hi Roxanne - the site address is: > > > >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/ > >and the BRICKWALL page is at: > > > >http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/brickwall.htm > > > >Fiona. > >IGP Co. Down Coordinator > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:nir-down-bounces@rootsweb.com] > >On Behalf Of Roxanne Neel > >Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 1:20 PM > >To: nir-down@rootsweb.com > >Subject: [NIR-DOWN] Fiona's Website [Brickwall section] > > > >Hi Fiona, > >What is the address to your website that includes Brickwalls? Sorry, > >but I've misplaced it :-/ > >Many Thanks, > >Roxanne > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > NIR-DOWN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message

Moneyscalp and Burrenreagh townlands are in Kilcoo parish, the records of which have been filmed back to 1832. Unfortunately not by the LDS, so you'd have to ask someone to look up in PRONI or the NLI or write the parish priest. Again, 1832 wouldn't show the baptism of Francis but could show him as a godparent or marriage witness and probably would show siblings' baptisms, which could help you figure out his parents' names. Diane