In einer eMail vom 9/29/2006 7:14:47 AM W. Europe Daylight Time schreibt niedersachsen-request@rootsweb.com: There are certain areas of northern Nordrhein Westphalen and Niedersachsen, which uses this naming convention that you are describing. Basically, the name is a Farm name. Whoever marries into the family that owns the farm (male or female), they change their surname to that farm name. I just wanted to add my two cents, since I live over here. The kind of farm (called a "Hof") we're talking about was often established as far back as the 1000's, or, in the case of the area around Osnabrück where I live, the 1200's. As far as I understand things so far, the farms were rented by the local lord under a complicated hereditary system, so that taxes and tithes were always due to the lord. The right to rent the Hof was passed down from parent to child. The most important consideration was that the Hof continue to be farmed (to provide income for the lord, and a living for the farming family). The idea that a man marrying into a family living at a Hof and taking that name as his own and for his children fit into the whole idea that the farming class "belonged" to the lord, rather than the farm and name belonging to the people. I hope I am making myself clear. The Hof next door is the Schobbe Hof, for example, and I have seen records of it going back to the early 1600's, when it apperared to have been a long-established and prosperous farm. I don't know if the current Schobbes have had other paternal names in their history, but I wouldn't be surprised. I am making a generalization about a pattern I've observed doing research in the old church books here. At some point the renting may have changed to owning. I hope the experts out there will chime in on this matter (and to correct any misunderstandings on my part :-)). Carol Saint-Clair

With the discussion on naming practices could someone help me with the this. >From a research report I have the following on my 6th great grandfather: Moritz DÜTMANN geboren BULLER, Halberbe Dütmann durch Einheirat, geboren 1650, gestorben am 08.08.1718 in Osesede. Kirchliche Trauung am 09.10.1691 in Oesede mit Adelheid HEGGER, geboren 1658, gestorben 30.01.1716 in Oesede, 2. Ehe der Frau. Aus dieser Ehe stammen: 1. Bernhard Hermann DÜTMANN, Heuerling, geboren 18.03.1696 in Oesede, gestorben 22.02.1781 in Kloster Oesede mit 84 Jahren. I've translated most of this need some help on the sections in parenthesis Moritz DÜTMANN born BULLER, (--------), born 1650, died 30 January 1716 in Oesede, Married in church on 09 October 1691 in Oesede with Adelheid HEGGER, born 1658, died 18 March 1696 in Oesede, 2nd marriage >From this marriage 1, Berhard Hermann DÜTMANN, (----), born 18 March 1696 in Oesede, died 22 February 1781 in Kloster Oesede at 84 years of age. Bernhard had married twice; to Catherinea Gertrud BERGMANN and Margaretha Elizabeth SIEKER. I would appreciate it if someone could fill in the blamks for me. Their is no record of his first wife, am I correct in assuming that her surname was DÜTMANN and that she had inherited the family faem and that Moritz had taken her name. I have the DÜTMANN line to the present day where the name is spelled Dittman in the US. The spelling was changed by my great grandfather after his immigration. Also, I am interested in finding the connection between the DÜTMANN GARTMANN line in Osnabrück today and my DÜTMANN line; I believe that it was within the last few generations. Would also like to hear from anyone that may be searching any of the surnames that I mentioned. Jerry Dittman Boonsboro, MD

Hi Jerry, In answer to your question about the parts in parentheses, these are the occupations of the person in question. A "Halberbe" is the owner of a Hof which is approximately half the size of a full-sized Hof (a "Vollerbe"). It is my understanding that these distinctions defined their social classes, as well. Vollerbe were the "highest" social class, followed by Halberbe, then Erbkötter (which was a son of a Vollerbe who did not inherit the full farm, but was given a small portion of land). Finally was the Markkötter which was a Hof too small to support a family. A "heuerling" was a renter or tenant, and in my understanding is a person who rented from a Hof (I would assume a Vollerbe or possibly a Halberbe). In my research, I've also run across the term "Leibzucht" and basically that is where the retired farmer (Vollerbe or Halberbe) lived after he handed over the farm to his heir. I have seen a situation where one of my ancestors was living on a Leibzucht, but they were in their 20's or 30's. This ancestor was a Hochschumacher (wooden-shoemaker). He was married and had children. Is anyone able to give me a better explanation of why such a young person would be living on a Leibzucht? I hope this helps! Teresa S. McMillin -----Original Message----- From: niedersachsen-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:niedersachsen-bounces@rootsweb.com]On Behalf Of Jerome Dittman Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 6:07 AM To: niedersachsen@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NIEDERSACHSEN] Naming practices With the discussion on naming practices could someone help me with the this. >From a research report I have the following on my 6th great grandfather: Moritz DÜTMANN geboren BULLER, Halberbe Dütmann durch Einheirat, geboren 1650, gestorben am 08.08.1718 in Osesede. Kirchliche Trauung am 09.10.1691 in Oesede mit Adelheid HEGGER, geboren 1658, gestorben 30.01.1716 in Oesede, 2. Ehe der Frau. Aus dieser Ehe stammen: 1. Bernhard Hermann DÜTMANN, Heuerling, geboren 18.03.1696 in Oesede, gestorben 22.02.1781 in Kloster Oesede mit 84 Jahren. I've translated most of this need some help on the sections in parenthesis Moritz DÜTMANN born BULLER, (--------), born 1650, died 30 January 1716 in Oesede, Married in church on 09 October 1691 in Oesede with Adelheid HEGGER, born 1658, died 18 March 1696 in Oesede, 2nd marriage >From this marriage 1, Berhard Hermann DÜTMANN, (----), born 18 March 1696 in Oesede, died 22 February 1781 in Kloster Oesede at 84 years of age. Bernhard had married twice; to Catherinea Gertrud BERGMANN and Margaretha Elizabeth SIEKER. I would appreciate it if someone could fill in the blamks for me. Their is no record of his first wife, am I correct in assuming that her surname was DÜTMANN and that she had inherited the family faem and that Moritz had taken her name. I have the DÜTMANN line to the present day where the name is spelled Dittman in the US. The spelling was changed by my great grandfather after his immigration. Also, I am interested in finding the connection between the DÜTMANN GARTMANN line in Osnabrück today and my DÜTMANN line; I believe that it was within the last few generations. Would also like to hear from anyone that may be searching any of the surnames that I mentioned. Jerry Dittman Boonsboro, MD _____________________________ To contact the list admin send an email to: NIEDERSACHSEN-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to NIEDERSACHSEN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message