Norm, If you look closely at the map you will also see Moravia (Mähren) marked on it. Bohemia is only a part of the Czech Republic. Rose Green >To my unskilled eye, the shape of Boehmen appears identical to that of the >Czech Republic today, at least the western part. Is that right? > >Norm B.

>Is part of Bohemia not in south East Germany today over spilling into the >Czech Republic? No. It is not a geographic region but a political one. It used to be a kingdom, which eventually combined with the kingdom of Moravia. Hundreds of years ago, German settlers were encouraged to settle there, and lived pretty happily until WWII, when they were expelled (the Czech didn't feel too happy about Germany taking over Czechoslovakia). As on any border, though, you will see cultural and ethnic crossovers. There are many Slavic town and river names on the eastern border of modern-day Germany. I am half Bohemian (both Czech and German), and as far as I can tell from my cousins who still live there, the cultures are still similar (or else they were being nice because we were visiting from Germany!) Rose Green researching HARTWIG, BRUNIGES

Hello Jerry The farm Meier zu Oestringen was mentioned in 1223 "villicus in Osteringen". I found a brief history of this farm (which still stands today) in a book about Haste. In 1240 Meier zu Oestringen belonged to the Bishop of Osnabrück. In 1240 the farmer had to pay the following to the bishop: 6 pigs 4 Malter (old measurement) barley 1 load of dry wood 2 Malter rye 1 Urne (old measurement) butter 10 hens 3 "maldra" cheese for Easter 100 eggs 100 "seutelas" 2 geese 10 Denare (currency) In the 14th century the convent in Enger received income from Meier zu Oestringen. The following people registred on the farm in 1540: the farmer Meier zu Oestringen his wife 2 farmhands 2 farm lasses The following people were registred in 1601: Meiger to Oestringen with his wife Anna the farmhand Dirk the shepherd Hans the miller Joest and Hüsselte Hille (Hüsselte were people of lower status who found a place to live on a farm) in the Leibzucht (a smaller house on the farm usually used for the old farmer and his wife when the farm was taken over by the heir) Lüdeke with his wife and sister Lise. Livestock in 1557: 8 cows 9 cattle 30 sheep 16 pigs 5 horses The following open fields belonged to the farm in 1723: die Lienwiese Meyers Esche Der Rübengarten Auf dem Oesteresch Das Kirchenstück Der große und kleine Berg Die Hove Die Holle In der Stegde Der Fischteich Der große und kleine Sunderkathen Der Mühlenhof Der Cleeberg In 1677 the bishop gave the farm including the mill to the Earl of Platen. After that the Court Marshal von Moltke und then Itel Stael were in possession of the farm. In 1730 the farm was bought by the convent Gertrudenberg There is still an inscription at the main building: Burned down in 1780, rebuilt a lot bigger in the same year by Mother Superior Walburger von Sarau. Reerected the 27th of June. At the beginning of the 19th century the Meierhof consisted of the main building, about 15 Scheffel (old measurement) arable land, the right to fish the river Nette within their land and the mill that belonged to the farm. It isn't known when this mill was built. The mill was pulled down in 1888/89. At the beginning of the 17th century a so called copper hammer belonged to the farm. In 1772 the convent let the farm to Johann Bernd Gerdinck from Malgarten whose family worked the farm for more than 200 years. The Gerding family left the farm in 1984 and the arable land was sold to another farmer (Hanesch) in Haste. The building is now used for living purposes only. Well, I hope the above is of some interest to you. There is also a Grothaus farm in Haste but I can't see a connection to the Grothaus in Harderberg. Kind regards Renate DRY in Germany ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerome Dittman" <dittdad@md.net> To: <NIEDERSACHSEN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2005 12:58 AM Subject: Re: [NIEDERSACHSEN] MEYER, PIEPENSCHNEIDER > I have the following MEYER in the Osnabrück area from the towns listed: > > Anna Margaretha b. Hickingen b. 1636 + Dietrich KRUSE b. Hickingen b.1625 > Anna Margaretha of Allendorf d. 1698 + Nikolaus RÖTGER b. Kloster Oesede > 1633-1681 > Anna Maria zu Oestringen b. Haste1676-1716 + Hermann GROTHAUSb. Harderberg > 1679-1756 (my great great grandmother is was a GROTHAUS) > Anna Wwe NIEMANN d. 1674 + Georg KLEKAMP 1629-1688 > Friedrich of Hickingen 1595-1699 + Clara GELSHORN of Hickingen b.1605 > George 1658-1723 + Anna Gertrud GELSHORN 1659-1728 > Georg Laurenz zu Oestringen + Caroline Margaretha DE SCHORLEMMER > Joseph + Anna Maria GROTHAUS b. Harderberg 1809 > Marie Gertrud zu Nahne (NIEMEYER) 1717-1742 + Hermann Heinrich HÜLSEBUSCH > > 1713-1766 > Nikolaus of Hickingen + Margaretha (Unknown) > (Unknown) zu Garthausen + Hermann Rudolph SUTTMEYER b. Kloster Oesede 1679 > > Anyone have any references to these names? They are ancestors of My DÜTMANN > and HENGELSBERG great grandparents > > Jerry Dittman > Boonsboro, MD > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <TheLinda1@cs.com> > To: <NIEDERSACHSEN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 12:01 PM > Subject: [NIEDERSACHSEN] MEYER, PIEPENSCHNEIDER > > > > Carol, > > > > So far the only connection is the Meyer surname & the St. Louis area, as > > well > > as the same general area in Germany. And the time frame. I'm finding > > more > > and more of the 700 or so German immigrants to the Chicago area in the mid > > to > > late1800's from the Hannover area that are connected to my ancestors. > > Other > > areas that they migrated to from Chicago were St. Louis & St. Joseph, MO; > > Ohio, > > Randolph County, IL; Jackson, Scott, Fayette and Bremer Counties in Iowa; > > Martin County, Minn.; eastern section of Nebr., especially Gage, Franklin, > > Lancaster, Douglas, Cuming, Wayne, Dakota Counties, as well as other > > areas; areas in > > Michigan, Wisconsin and Kansas. I'm finding the same groups of names, > > with a > > few others thrown in here and there, at least in the first couple of > > generations after the immigrant. Some of those surnames are: Andermann, > > Beermann, > > Biermann, Bergmann, Beheke/Behncke, Bargmann, Dauel/Dahl, Duensing, > > Gathmann, > > Hasselbring, Helfers/Helvers, Krumwiede, Kruse, > > Leseberg/Leeseberg/Leiseberg, > > Meyer, Nebel, Niemeyer, Pilster, Pralle, Runge, Rabe, Rafe, Rodewald, > > Stunkel/Stuenkel, Thoms, Thiesse/Thies, Vogeler, and others. Linda > > > > > > ==== NIEDERSACHSEN Mailing List ==== > > To contact the List Admin: mailto:NIEDERSACHSEN-admin@rootsweb.com > > > > To unsubscribe send an email to: NIEDERSACHSEN-L-request@rootsweb.com > > (In Digest Mode change the "L" to a "D") with the word unsubscribe > > in the body of the message. > > > > ============================== > > Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the > > areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. > > Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx > > > > > > > > ==== NIEDERSACHSEN Mailing List ==== > To contact the List Admin: mailto:NIEDERSACHSEN-admin@rootsweb.com > > To unsubscribe send an email to: NIEDERSACHSEN-L-request@rootsweb.com > (In Digest Mode change the "L" to a "D") with the word unsubscribe > in the body of the message. > > ============================== > Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the > areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. > Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >

Guten Tag, Carol, and thanks for that Sudetenland URL. Unfortunately for most, the text is in German. The intro says that the referenced book is a trip to the past in a land existing only in the memory; it shows pictures of a land that no longer exists: Boehmen (Bohemia). Fortunately, the map therein is "universal". To my unskilled eye, the shape of Boehmen appears identical to that of the Czech Republic today, at least the western part. Is that right? Norm B. ----- Original Message ----- From: SaintWare@aol.com To: NIEDERSACHSEN-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2005 4:36 AM Subject: [NIEDERSACHSEN] Sudetenland - map Here's a link to a map of the Sudetenland. Sudetenland >>http://www.joern.de/sudetenland.htm<< Carol

Hello Alan und Renate Thank you very much for the history of the Meier zu Oestringen farm. It is very interesting reading and, IF, there were additional family names given would extend my family record back to 1223. As it is, from the information in my files, from research done in Osnabrück, I would say that the people listed as "registered in 1601" could be my 6th great grandparents, who are listed in my research report as, Hermann Grothaus 1679-1756 and his 1st wife, Anna Maria Meyer zu Oestringen 1675-1716. The parents of Anna Maria Meyer are listed as Georg Laurenz Meyer zu Oestringen and Caroline Margaretha de Schorlemmer, no dates are listed for these two. Again thank you for your time and effort in compiling this data; I and the other researchers of the Dittman/Dütmann and Hengelsberg families in Osnabrück area appreciate it. Jerry Dittman Boonsboro, MD ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan und Renate Dry" <alan-renatedry@osnanet.de> To: <NIEDERSACHSEN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2005 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [NIEDERSACHSEN] MEYER, PIEPENSCHNEIDER > Hello Jerry > The farm Meier zu Oestringen was mentioned in 1223 "villicus in > Osteringen". > I found a brief history of this farm (which still stands today) in a book > about Haste. > In 1240 Meier zu Oestringen belonged to the Bishop of Osnabrück. In 1240 > the farmer had to pay the following to the bishop: > 6 pigs > 4 Malter (old measurement) barley > 1 load of dry wood > 2 Malter rye > 1 Urne (old measurement) butter > 10 hens > 3 "maldra" cheese > for Easter > 100 eggs > 100 "seutelas" > 2 geese > 10 Denare (currency) > In the 14th century the convent in Enger received income from Meier zu > Oestringen. > The following people registred on the farm in 1540: > the farmer Meier zu Oestringen > his wife > 2 farmhands > 2 farm lasses > The following people were registred in 1601: > Meiger to Oestringen > with his wife Anna > the farmhand Dirk > the shepherd Hans > the miller Joest > and Hüsselte Hille (Hüsselte were people of lower status who found a place > to live on a farm) > in the Leibzucht (a smaller house on the farm usually used for the old > farmer and his wife when the farm was taken over by the heir) Lüdeke with > his wife and sister Lise. > Livestock in 1557: > 8 cows > 9 cattle > 30 sheep > 16 pigs > 5 horses > The following open fields belonged to the farm in 1723: > die Lienwiese > Meyers Esche > Der Rübengarten > Auf dem Oesteresch > Das Kirchenstück > Der große und kleine Berg > Die Hove > Die Holle > In der Stegde > Der Fischteich > Der große und kleine Sunderkathen > Der Mühlenhof > Der Cleeberg > In 1677 the bishop gave the farm including the mill to the Earl of Platen. > After > that the Court Marshal von Moltke und then Itel Stael were in possession > of > the farm. > In 1730 the farm was bought by the convent Gertrudenberg > There is still an inscription at the main building: > Burned down in 1780, rebuilt a lot bigger in the same year by Mother > Superior Walburger von Sarau. Reerected the 27th of June. > At the beginning of the 19th century the Meierhof consisted of the main > building, about 15 Scheffel (old measurement) arable land, the right to > fish > the river Nette within their land and the mill that belonged to the farm. > It isn't known when this mill was built. The mill was pulled down in > 1888/89. At the beginning of the 17th century a so called copper hammer > belonged to the farm. > In 1772 the convent let the farm to Johann Bernd Gerdinck from Malgarten > whose family worked the farm for more than 200 years. The Gerding family > left the farm in 1984 and the arable land was sold to another farmer > (Hanesch) in Haste. The building is now used for living purposes only. > > Well, I hope the above is of some interest to you. There is also a > Grothaus > farm in Haste but I can't see a connection to the Grothaus in Harderberg. > > Kind regards > Renate DRY > in Germany

Hallo list members I think this is the first time I have posted to this list, I have been researching in this area of Germany for the last 15 years and have all sorts of odds and ends I have saved to hopfully connect my family to or to help other reseachers out. This is not connected to my family other than a baptismal record listing Maria Clara Nobilis De Monsebroch as a godparent. This letter was from Jens Muller Koppe who I had hired as a researcher. I will be happy to answer any questions. Steven C. Wehling Just some very short note about a very interesting find which I made during my visit to the State Archive Oldenburg this week: I finely found the von Münzbruch family (the name was spelled Münzebruch, Monsbrock, Monsbruch as well)! This might be a very important hint for the origin of Boldewin (Balduin) Depenbrock, after Maria Clara, Nobilis De Monsebrock was a godmother of his earliest (known) child in 1713. The Noble Von Münzbruch family were the owners of the Twistel estate near the village of Heeke, AIIhausen parish from 1649 until 1790. It was the father of the first owner Conrad (Meier) von Münzbruch, Hugo Meier, who was a Lutheran priest in St. Sylvester Quakenbrück [1585- 1625], who was peered by me King of Sweden (') There are a number of hints for the fact that the von Münzbruch family was closely connected (not in a geaneological, but in a political and religious sense) to the Swedish Kingdom, which was the leading power of the Lutheran Countries in the 17th century, with great influence (and even annexed areas) in Northern Germany. I have no positive evidence, but 1 am almost sure that the family was still Lutheran in the (early) 18th centwy. In this period they lived in an area with 65 to 85 % Catholics. In 1790 the last male decendent of me family, the lieutenant Carl Ludwig von Münzbruch, sold the Twislel estate. He died in 1803. The owners of Twistel were: I. Conrad (Meier) Von Münzbruch son of Hugo Meier (Von Münzbroch) bought the estate from the father of his wife Johann Von Quernheim in 1649 He was Vizedrost (administrator) ofWittlage, Gronenberg and Hunteburg due to Swedish protection 00I Anna Clara Von Quernheim 002 Johann Eiisabeth von Brawe, widow von Frese II. Gustav Adolf Von Münzbruch (+10. 02.1696) oo Marie Odilia Von Wulfen III. Johann Friedrich Hilmar von Münzbruch The estate was managed by guardians until 1712, when Johann Friedrich Hilmar was of age 00 I Judith Catharina Von Der Horst auf Vinkenburg (+ 1730) 002 Wilhelmine Charlotte von Steuben IV. CarJ Ludwig von Münzbruch, Oberstlieutenant sold the estate in 1790 (+ 1803) The fact that a member of the Von Münzbruch family was a Depenbrock godmother in 1713 is a strong hint for a connection of the Boldewin Depenbrock to this family. Maybe he was dependent to the Twistel Estate or even connected to the family. Therfore it seems to be possible - if not probable - that Boldewin or his parents were Lutheran as well before 1713. What are the conc1usions that we are able to draw from the information about the von Münzbrueh family? #1 Boldewin Depenbrock might have been Lutheran originally The Lutheran parish for Alfhausen and Bersenbriick was St. Christopherus in Gehrde (northeast of Bersenbrück). There are parish registers preserved from 1713 on from this parish. #2 There werc no Münzbruch and Depenbrock entries found in Alfhausen, which was the Catholic parish for Heeke, but after Twistel located was much nearer to Bersenbrück than to Alfhausen, the Catholic church of St. Vincentius Bersenbrück, might be another chance (remebering it was usual in this area that a minority of Lutherans can be found in Catholic parish registers).there are records from 1672 (baptism) resp. 1688 (00 and +) preserved for Bersenbrück. #3 Last but not least it should be mentioned that the Von Münzburg family owned a farm(state) in Osnabrück-Neustadt from 1660 on as well. May be the Depenbrock family was connected to this line of the family, ... (Two Lutheran Parishes and two Catholic Parishes in the city of Osnabrück, records reach back to 1678 St. Katharinen Luth. 1685/1691 St. Marien Luth. (17th century) Dom Cath. (17th century) St. Johannis Cath. Well, this might be a good "breeding ground" for further research about the origin of the mysterious Boldewin Depenbrock some time (may be including State Archive Research in Osnabrück as suggested earlier). Last but not least, I was able to access and check a printed farm register of the Amt Damme, which included some very interesting facts about some families, which are connected to the Depenbrocks: Westerhausen, Neuenkirchen parish a) Westerhaus farm 24 ha Osnabriick subjects (Halbersbe) dependent to the Kommende Lage, 1830 to the Kingdom of Hannover b) Taubke-Westerhues Hmn 34 ha Munster subjects (Ganzerbe) not dependent to any Gutsherr (landowner) c) Heye Bei Der Hake farm 7 ha Munster subjects (Kötterei) not dependent to any Gutsherr (landowner) 1777: was oblidged to being the letters to Vechta, , Osnabruck, Furstenau and Hopsten Nellinghof, Neuenkirchen Parish a) Schurmann (Sehürhof) farm 67 ha Osnabriick subjects (Halberbe) dependent to the Gut Schulenburg (Herren von Dinklage) until 1844 b) Torbeck farm 30 ha Osnabruck subjects (Ganzerbe) dependent to the Gut Schulenburg (Herren von Dinklage) until 1844 c) Linesch farm 75 ha Osnabruck subjccts (Halberoo) dependent to the Kommende Lage Both the very small villages of Westerhausen and Nellinighof were located directely at the Osnabrück / Munster (from 1816 on Oldenburg) border, just 3 resp. 3 1/2 kilometer north of Rieste. Please remeber that Neuenkirchen was the only parish with a Lutheran and a Catholic church in the whole area of the Niederstift Münster (later on called "Oldenburger Münsterland"). It might bc possible that the Schurmann family was Lutheran.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/ZVC.2ACE/3961 Message Board Post: I am looking for information on a daughter born to Melzina Wysong and John B (Robert) Burns. The only thing I have to go by is Melzina's obit(she was my ggrandmother). In the obit it said she had a daughter Mrs Homer Rossen of Constantine, Mich. she would had been born between 1899 and 1905. I can not find her anywhere. Melzina died 1-11-1950 Melzena Millington Claimed by Death Mrs. Melzena Millington, 67, wife of Ira Millington, died at 9 p.m. Wednesday at her home at 1104 West Central avenue, following an illness of two years. She was born in Huntington county on December 3, 1882, a daughter of John and Mary Brown Wysong. Two previous marriages were to Robert Burns and Clinton Richards, both of whom are deceased. She was married at Bluffton on December 30, 1943 to Ira Millington. The decedent resided most of her life in Wells county and was a member of the First Pentecostal church. Surviving in addition to the husband are two sons, Claude and Carl Richards, both of Bluffton; two daughters, Mrs. Earl Perry, of Bluffton, and Mrs. Homer Rossen, of Constantine, Mich; four stepchildren, Mrs. Addie Baumgartner, of Fort Wayne; Mrs. Edith Middleton, of Butler, and Emmett and Kenneth Millington, both of this city; two brothers, Chester Wysong of Bluffton and Emmett Wysong of Three Rivers, Mich; two sisters, Mrs. William Yates Sr. of Bluffton and Mrs. Florence Mains, of Galion, Ohio, 18 grandchildren and two great grandchildren. The body was removed to the Thoma funeral home where it will remain until time for services. Thanks Linda

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Wysong, Rossen Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/ZVC.2ACE/972.2.1.1 Message Board Post: I am looking for information on a daughter born to Melzina Wysong and John B (Robert) Burns. The only thing I have to go by is Melzina's obit(she was my ggrandmother). In the obit it said she had a daughter Mrs Homer Rossen of Constantine, Mich. she would had been born between 1899 and 1905. I can not find her anywhere. Melzina died 1-11-1950 Melzena Millington Claimed by Death Mrs. Melzena Millington, 67, wife of Ira Millington, died at 9 p.m. Wednesday at her home at 1104 West Central avenue, following an illness of two years. She was born in Huntington county on December 3, 1882, a daughter of John and Mary Brown Wysong. Two previous marriages were to Robert Burns and Clinton Richards, both of whom are deceased. She was married at Bluffton on December 30, 1943 to Ira Millington. The decedent resided most of her life in Wells county and was a member of the First Pentecostal church. Surviving in addition to the husband are two sons, Claude and Carl Richards, both of Bluffton; two daughters, Mrs. Earl Perry, of Bluffton, and Mrs. Homer Rossen, of Constantine, Mich; four stepchildren, Mrs. Addie Baumgartner, of Fort Wayne; Mrs. Edith Middleton, of Butler, and Emmett and Kenneth Millington, both of this city; two brothers, Chester Wysong of Bluffton and Emmett Wysong of Three Rivers, Mich; two sisters, Mrs. William Yates Sr. of Bluffton and Mrs. Florence Mains, of Galion, Ohio, 18 grandchildren and two great grandchildren. The body was removed to the Thoma funeral home where it will remain until time for services. Thanks Linda

Here's a link to a map of the Sudetenland. Sudetenland >>http://www.joern.de/sudetenland.htm<< Carol

Is part of Bohemia not in south East Germany today over spilling into the Czech Republic? -----Original Message----- From: RID1541@aol.com [mailto:RID1541@aol.com] Sent: Samstag, 7. Mai 2005 13:29 To: NIEDERSACHSEN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [NIEDERSACHSEN] Bohemia If some one was from Boehemia, what part of Germany is that and how close to Calenburg. Thank you. Bohemia (Boehmen, Sudetenland) today is part of the Czech Republic. At one time it was part of Germany. There were generations of German settlers, who were forced to leave after WW II. The settlers there were called Sudeten-Germans, (Sudeten-Deutsche) It is still a touchy issue today between the two countries. I believe there is a message board for Sudetentland/Bohemia Calenberg was a principality, part of the Kingdom of Hanover under the Welfen Dynasty, (Guelphs) in southern Niedersachsen now, around Goettingen and the region between the rivers Weser and Leine. It is a fairly long journey from one area to the other. The capital of Bohemia, Prague, was multi lingual at the time and had the first University in Europe, in 4 languages. _http://www.uni-oldenburg.de/nausa/dtlinks.htm_ (http://www.uni-oldenburg.de/nausa/dtlinks.htm) _ /_ (http://www.koenigreich-hannover.de/) _http://www.koenigreich-hannover.de/_ (http://www.koenigreich-hannover.de/) My ancestors are from Calenberg, I do have Broeker in my familytree . Have a nice weekend, greetings. Ingrid Fetkoeter ==== NIEDERSACHSEN Mailing List ==== To contact the List Admin: mailto:NIEDERSACHSEN-admin@rootsweb.com To unsubscribe send an email to: NIEDERSACHSEN-L-request@rootsweb.com (In Digest Mode change the "L" to a "D") with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. ============================== Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New content added every business day. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Lammers Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/ZVC.2ACE/811.257.1.1 Message Board Post: Mr. Meyer, Thank you for your interest in my message about Lammers. My sources for Grethe Ilse Lammers are: 1.records Niedersachsisches Staatasarchiv,216 Stade,W.Ger 2.extract Ev-Luth church records Wisselhovede & Verden 3.relative: Wilhem Kranz states that Johann Grunhagen was born June 1743 at Benzen and his daughter,Catharine was born 05 Jan.1770 at Lehrden. He also states that the wife,Greth Ilse Lammers,was born 11 Mar.1748 at Hollehrden. 4.marriage record states that Johann Hinrich Grunhagen was a Hausmann in Hollehrden. As far as I can determine Hollehrden is an actual place probably near Lehrden. Any information you may be able to provide will be greatly appreciated. Thank you, Leila Mayberry

Re: Calenberg and the noble, royal genealogy _http://www.koenigreich-hannover.de/ _ (http://www.koenigreich-hannover.de/ ) For those interested, study info. in this link, there is a Welfen genealogy, I believe available in English. AMT was an administrative location, a village in charge of surrounding villages and farms. Tax collectors for the Nobles to whom they had to pay per, farmland, harvest and live stock. All farmers in the villages had to turn over certain amounts of harvest, and services to the noble Lord. Sounds like share croppers to me in English. This system was 1200 through 1700s, more or less. Their land belonged to the Lords. They also had to pay monetary head taxes, (Kopfsteuer) I have a book of Tax Roll records (Kopfsteuer) for the region of Calenberg-Göttingen, Calenberg-Grubenhagen, from 1689. It is as good as a census, lists all houses, hearths, heads of household, and family members by age, some occupations. If you know the village your ancestors came from, I can do look ups for a name you have. Rita: I'll get back to you on the Broeker name, have to go back into my family tree. Happy Mother's Day to all you mothers out there. Regards, Ingrid

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/ZVC.2ACE/3715.2 Message Board Post: I came across the name Christian Skov in my search on here. I am new to this, but know I have an ancestor by the name of Christian Skov, son of Peter and Johanne. He was born in 1862. Maybe there is a connection. Glenn

Al in Music City you are making me curious now... so I am going to do some searching for the "Hannoverian Kings". J.N.

Definitions of principality: territory ruled by a prince www.cogsci.princeton.edu/cgi-bin/webwn According to medieval Christian theologians, the Angels are organized into several orders, or Angelic Choirs. The most influential of these classifications was that put forward by Pseudo-Dionysius the Areopagite in the Fourth or Fifth century, in his book The Celestial Hierarchy. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_(angel) A principality is a monarchial feudatory or sovereign state, whose monarch is a prince or princess. The term is also sometimes used as a general term for other small sovereign states led by lesser royalty, as for instance grand duchies, whose monarch is a Grand Duke or Duchess. No sovereign duchy currently exists, but Luxembourg is a surviving example of a sovereign grand duchy. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality Area of a Kingdom ruled by a Prince and Princess, who swear an oath of loyalty to the King and Queen. May become a Kingdom in its own right some day, or remain as a permanent Principality. Must have at least 150 full members, and usually involves 500-2000 people. www.sca.org.au/rowany/newcomers/glossary.html In an SCA context, a subdivision of a kingdom either for the administrative convenience or instituted with the development of a new kingdom in mind. www.chronique.com/Library/Glossaries/glossary-KCT/gloss_p.htm The object of composition being always to secure unity; that is to make one complete picture out of many objects. The first mode in which this can be effected is by determining that one feature shall be more important than all the rest; this concept being Principality. This is the simplest law of ordinary ornamentation known to all designers, and, incidentally, no doubt, to all who have done landscape photography. www.paulsmithimages.com/artistic_glossary.htm

although I have not studied the historic European terms much... I believe a principality is... an area given over to the governance by a PRINCE... member of royalty. Easy, huh? (At least in ancient and medieval times). Someone else may give a much better explanation that this. Judy

Makes sense now that it is explained. Who were the princes of Calenberg, if anyone knows? I have been trying to find out for years whose writ ran in the area without much success. The region in which they lived was sometimes referred to as Amt Lauenstein as well and there is castle or schloss by that name not too far away. What was the relationship between Calenberg and Amt Lauenstein (again, if anybody knows)? Thanks. Al in Music City ----- Original Message ----- From: "Katharina Hines" <hines747@msn.com> To: <NIEDERSACHSEN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 2:41 PM Subject: [NIEDERSACHSEN] Re: principality > Al wrote > Where can I find out something > about this principality (in English) and while I am at it, what exactly is > a > principality? I have used this word myself and haven't a clue as to what > it > means. > Principality : > is a territory ruled by a prince. > In this time in Europe are 3 principalities > Andorra, Lichtenstein and Monaco. > > > Katharina Hines > > > > > ==== NIEDERSACHSEN Mailing List ==== > NOTICE -- To answer messages from the MESSAGE BOARD you > must click on the link in the message. This will take > you to the MESSAGE BOARD and you can click POST REPLY > to answer. Your reply will be sent back to the list for > all to benefit. > > ============================== > Jumpstart your genealogy with OneWorldTree. Search not only for > ancestors, but entire generations. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13972/rd.ashx >

Al wrote Where can I find out something about this principality (in English) and while I am at it, what exactly is a principality? I have used this word myself and haven't a clue as to what it means. Principality : is a territory ruled by a prince. In this time in Europe are 3 principalities Andorra, Lichtenstein and Monaco. Katharina Hines

Rita, Bohemia (Böhmen) is now part of the Czech Republic. Hope that helps, Sarah If some one was from Boehemia, what part of Germany is that and how close to Calenburg. Thank you. Rita Broeker Missouri __________________________________________________