SUBJECT: Visitations by God ??? REPLY: Nice to hear from you, I, too, am interested in collecting more information about the October 1867 and 1885 Labrador disasters. Mosdell in his 1922 book titled "When Was That" records that "the schooner "Hope" out of Harbour Grace was lost with all hands on October 9th, 1867" Gerald Andrews in his 1997 book said quote: page 177 & 178..." As if the political and religious problems were insufficient, the decade was attended by numerous personal tragedies and natural disasters. During 1861, severe illnesses became widespread among young people, resulting in numerous deaths. During the fall of 1867, a severe gale hit the Labrador coast destroying huge amounts of property, including dozens of vessels, and causing the deaths of scores of people. Large quantities of fish were lost onboard vessels wrecked on the way home. So many vessels were destroyed that most of the remaining fish had to be left on the coast, leaving many Labrador fishing families in a destitute condition. This fierce Labrador gale destroyed the two larges remaining Port de Grave vessels. On October 9, 1867, the "Tangiers" a 131-ton Brigantine owned by Thomas Butler, the merchant at Por de Grave, was lost at Grady. On the same day, the "Estelle", a 176-ton Brigantine, owned by Richard Hennebury was destroyed nearby at Indian Tickle, attended by a major tragedy. The whole crew were lost, except for a Mrs. Littlejohn from Coley's Point. Among the casualties were several Port de Grave residents. Two known victims were Isaac Morgan of Blow Me Down and Richard Hennebury of Bareneed. In January 1868, three Dawe brothers from Ship Cove perished on a trip to Kellys Island to cut firewood. On April 8th of the same year, six men from Port de Grave were lost from the Brigus sealer "Deerhound". John Maddock referred to those tragedies in a letter to government seeking help." lghr note: letter dated June 25th, 1868.....end of quotes from G. Andrews. The borrowed tape recording of Mr. Robert H. Dawe's 1977 voice is in my possession. I have transcribed most of the family history information on the tape. Mr. Dawe mentioned the loss of his relative Capt. Isaac Morgan and his vessel "The Excell", which occurred, (according to Mr. Dawe, age 92 years) one day after his birth on October 9th, 1885. Other records indicate that the "Excell" was lost on October 10-11, 1885. Grave marker for Isaac, Henry and Esther, Russell at CP Anglican cemetery confirm the date of their transition as October 1885. Mr. Dawe did not mention a Labrador disaster in 1867. You are welcome to listen to the tape at my home anytime within this month of November. Even though some of Mr. Andrews' timeline printed dates may be questioned, (possible transcript mistakes) I still highly recommend his book to anyone who can trace their ancestry to CBN, NL. Cheers, Lloyd ********************** --- jwarford <jwarford@nf.sympatico.ca> wrote: > Lloyd > I am interested in the memoirs of the Mr Dawe that you > referenced in > your posting. Are these transcribed? If so, where would I be > able to read > them or listen to the tape. I am particularly interested in the > Labrador > disaster of 1867. > > Jim Warford > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Lloyd Rowsell <lgrowsell@yahoo.com> > To: <NFLD-LAB-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 2:14 PM > Subject: [NFLD-LAB] NL Folklore, Genealogy and > Visitations/Causes PART I > > > > *********SUBJECT**** > > "Seary's NL Folklore, Opinions, Facts, Whitmonday,and the > passage > > of time".......updated Oct. 31st, 2003 > > prepared by Lloyd George Henry Rowsell.....for sharing, on > the > > internet, with members of the NL ROOTS genealogy group, etc. > > > > *****message, PART I******** > > > > > > This note is a follow up to a short piece that I earlier > posted > > to NL Roots under the subject. "Three Brothers--Folklore, > Fact > > and Fancy". Since I like to work within the bounds and > order of > > 'timeline linkages' I will continue that mode of presentation > > here. > > > > 1647...Richard Russell, of Charlestown, Mass. sold two vessels > to > > the Colony of Avalon, "according to the laws of Oleron". > > > > 1700 - 1807 - 1865...A copy of the 1865 Lecture at BR Anglican > > Church by Rev. Blackmore was serially printed in the BR > newspaper > > Feb. 20 to March 20, 1943....some quotes: > > #1.."From the several documents the date of this settlement > as a > > prominent fishing station may be safely fixed at about the > year > > 1700, or somewhat more than 160 years ago." > > #2...But in the year 1807 a fresh movement took > > place.........Mark Delaney, an Irishman, at that time living > in > > French's Cove......etc." > > #3..."1810........Somewhat later back......while at Coley's > Point > > the eye could rest on the two little tilts, which were > occupied by > > Mr. T.M. Russell and J. Churchill, set up near the spot where > Mr. > > G. Jackson now lives. ( lghr: I wonder if this was Mr. Thomas > > Henry Russell and Mr. John Churchill, of other records, M & H > are > > sometimes transcribed incorrectly?) > > #4. "At the beginning of the present century.........in a > little > > cove at the foot of Whit Monday Hill, was Mr. > Badcock.......The > > schooner was called the "Fox". It was 60 tons measurement, > and > > carried a complement of 20 men.........The following > > year....another little schooner was build down the Harbour > > likewise, this time by the present family of Russell's. The > > schooner was named the "John William." (lghr note: "John and > > William" was a 64 ton schooner built in 1806 reg#S826007 owned > by > > Henry and Stephen Russell, Farmers/Planters of Bay > Roberts......in > > 1838 Henry and Stephen Russell owned the 84 ton schooner named > > Antigonish, built in NS. reg.# S838099). > > > > 1810-1815....Here are replies from Dr. Robert M. Lewis to > > questions which I asked in April 2003.. > > > > Question #1...." Do you know the actual numbers of population > > growth between 1810 and 1815 caused by in migration as opposed > to > > natural birth rate increase?" > > REPLY: "Robert M. Lewis" <lewis@mun.ca> wrote: " I am not > sure > > what you mean here by 'opinions'. This is Shannon Ryan's > > interpretation (an 'opinion' but one based on a careful > analysis > > of records from the time) of the historical evidence > available, > > which I > > agree with. It has to be an interpretation because neither > births > > and deaths nor 'immigration' was being recorded. I put > > 'immigration' in quotes because I am very sure that many who > came > > in that period did not think of themselves as 'immigrating' to > > Newfoundland but rather as coming to work here for a while but > who > > just ended up staying (for many reasons, but, along with Ryan, > I > > think that the development of the seal fishery was central). > This > > process was, I believe, much like that of many Newfoundlanders > who > > have gone to work in Boston, Sydney, Toronto, Ft. McMurray, > &c., > > have over time and who have ended up staying. The hows and > > wherefores of the early settlement of Newfoundland is still > very > > much a point of historical debate, though I think that Ryan's > > interpretation is the most widely accepted one. But there are > > others....." > > > > #2. "Do you know if records exist for the names of the Irish > > persons who came to Newfoundland during the period 1810-1815 > > either as passengers or stowaways? > > REPLY: " No, and I don't think that many exist. Officially > they > > would all have been considered migratory workers who would > return > > to England or Ireland at the end of the season or in a year or > > two. There was no official immigration at the time because > > Newfoundland was not considered an official colony until 1825. > In > > England and Ireland there probably are at least a few ships > > records of crewmen and passengers coming to Newfoundland in > this > > period but I can't tell you where exactly where because I > have > > never gone looking for them., One of the things I think that > > many people ignore is that the settlement of Newfoundland was > > quite different than that of the United States in the 19th > century > > (or at least as it is usually presented). There was no Ellis > > Island in Newfoundland, no immigration officer, and no > > 'immigration ships'. Immigration to Newfoundland was not as > cut > > and dried as was immigration to the United States was (though > that > > wasn't as cut and dried as it often is presented, e.g., one of > the > > largest 'immigrant' groups in the18th and early 19th centuries > > were African slaves who also lack the neat records of the more > > 'normal' immigrants). That is one of the reasons that there > aren't > > the same sort of records found in the U.S." end of quotes. > > > > Whit Monday Hill: > > 1857-2003....After spending part of the years 1944 to 1947 as > an > > Episcopalian Missionary at Bay Roberts, in the year 1858 > Robert > > T.S. Lowell (Russell ancestors, family from Charlestown, > Mass.) > > returned to his home in Mass. and published a novel > > titled "New Priest in Conception Bay". Quotes from page 17: > > " The place was like a balcony; in front one could see down > the > > shore of the harbor along the sea-face of Whitmonday Hill, and > > over more than one little settlement: and out in the bay to > > Belle-Isle, and the South Shore, and down towards Capt St. > > Francis." page21: "This Whitmonday Hill, in Peterport, of > which > > mention was made in the last chapter, is, on its travelled > face, > > steep enough for a practiced beast (if there were such in > > Peterport) to slide down.......This edging stretches along as > > debatable ground between the hill and the sea, to Daughter's > Dock, > > (the little cove where a 'Seventh Daughter' lives,).......The > > scene, to a sympathetic eye, was a pretty one of home life; > but > > the prettiest part of it was on the wateredge of Whitmonday > > Hill........" (lghr question: Can anyone, who traces > ancestry to > > the town of Bay Roberts or Port de Grave, correctly identify > the > > location of Whitmonday Hill today?) > > > > 1915....James P. Howley published a book about the History of > > Newfoundland. A few days ago, at the library in downtown > > Victoria, I saw a copy of this book noted his words, > concerning > > the history of the Rowsell family in Notre Dame Bay, some of > > which I had read earlier on a website about NL Rowsell > genealogy. > > Here is the preamble, left out of the internet record. > Excerpt > > from page 282 of "The Beothucks or Red Indians, the > Aboriginal > > Inhabitants of Newfoundland" (1915) by. James P. Howley, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Exclusive Video Premiere - Britney Spears http://launch.yahoo.com/promos/britneyspears/