My Gt Grandparents, Moulds and Mary Smith settled in Charing Cross in the late 1870's. I am attempting to locate the property, which in the mid 1990's was named "Elginhough" and owned by Mr Forrester. My memory is that it is within 400m of Charing Cross in either Wards Rd (1763?) or Telegraph Rd (1261?). A unique feature of the property was the remnants of a "Cobb Cottage", built by my Gt Grandfather. I would like to make contact with the current owners with the intent to visit early in 2020. Can anyone help please? Murray Reid Cambridge

The other son of George ROSS of Upper Moutere is Edward Melville ROSS. He is clearly identified in the will of his father, George ROSS who died on 9 Nov 1922. The probate file is on Family Search. NZBDM has Edward's mother incorrectly as "Dorothy Mary" instead of "Dora Mary Louisa": 1904/16502 ROSS Edward Melville |Dorothy Mary | George Edward Melville King can also be found on some NZ Electoral Rolls and NZBDM has his death registered in 1973, aged 69 years. Angela

Beth, I can find the birth of George Cecil Ross and his fatal goring in papers past and death on the BDM, but have not found a birth of the other son yet. I'll keep looking. Jenelle. -----Original Message----- From: aotueka@xtra.co.nz [mailto:aotueka@xtra.co.nz] Sent: Monday, September 23, 2019 7:47 AM To: List - NZ Messages Subject: [nz]George Ross of Sunrise Valley, Upper Moutere Hello. George Ross and his wife lived in Sunrise Valley, Upper Moutere in the early 1900's. I believe that they had only 2 sons - one called Cecil who was fatally gored by a bull in 1917, and the other I understand fell from a horse and was severely disabled as a result. I have been trying, unsuccessfully, to find out the name of this son who fell from the horse, and cannot even find a date of the accident. In fact my internet searches have not yielded any information at all. Does SKS on this list know of this incident, and the boys name? Any information gratefully appreciated. Thanks, Beth _______________________________________________ The List Guidelines http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community --- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com

Hello. George Ross and his wife lived in Sunrise Valley, Upper Moutere in the early 1900's. I believe that they had only 2 sons - one called Cecil who was fatally gored by a bull in 1917, and the other I understand fell from a horse and was severely disabled as a result. I have been trying, unsuccessfully, to find out the name of this son who fell from the horse, and cannot even find a date of the accident. In fact my internet searches have not yielded any information at all. Does SKS on this list know of this incident, and the boys name? Any information gratefully appreciated. Thanks, Beth

probably (CHERE) loved one the larger gap before last letter suggest what looks like "I " is probably R chris Ruislip uk

oh dear I accidentally sent the last couple of items including the corrections as replies, but they went to the NZ list instead of to a small group of correspondents regarding the people of interest because I clicked on the wrong message to reply to. It's much info for most NZ listers but the WARNER and VOLLER recipients out there should be happy with it. Peter > On 13 September 2019 at 17:38 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > oops the third and fourth items Winchelseaare the same date. The first two items were inserted after the fact of writing, if you know what I mean. > > > > On 13 September 2019 at 17:34 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > > > > Hi all > > > > > > I already had Abraham, Ann and William as the children of John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER. > > > > I've been theorising that Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER were John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER. I was half right. Elizabeth is correct but Joseph WARNER is her second beau Joseph RONALDS instead of John VOLLER. > > > > > > These two items are the same date, so I think the settlement examination must have been the precursor of the removal order of Abraham and Ann to Titchfield. > > > > Data follows > > > > Cheers > > Peter > > > > > > MARRIAGES – 1800-1836 Durley, Southampton, Hampshire, ENGLAND > > Date 20 Sep 1803 > > Surname VOLLER > > 1st Name John > > Parish Southwick > > Spouse Surname WARNER > > Spouse 1st Name Elizabeth > > Spouse Parish Durley > > > > > > Hampshire Record Office, > > Ref: 37M73/PO37/6 > > Title: Removal Order: John VOLLER, wife Elizabeth and son Abraham (4 years), removed from Durley. > > Date: 9 May 1809 > > “County of Southhampton > > To the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley in the said County and to the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Titchfield in the County aforesaid ------ > > Upon the complaint of the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley aforesaid in the County of Southhampton unto us whose names are hereunto affixed being two? of HM (His Majesty’s?) Justices of the Peace in and for the said County that: > > John Voller his wife Elizabeth and Abraham his son now aged four years have come to inhabit in the Parish of Durley not having gained a legal settlement there nor produced any certificate owning them or any of them to be settled elsewhere and that the said John Voller, Elizabeth his wife and Abraham their child are actually become chargeable to the Parish of Durley. We, the said Justices, upon our proof made thereof as well as upon the Examination of the said John Voller as otherwise and likewise upon our consideration had of the premises? do adjudge the same to be true and we do likewise adjudge that the lawful settlement of these John Voller, Elizabeth his wife and their son Abraham is in the Parish of Titchfield in the said County and so, therefore, require you the said Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley or some or one of you to convey the said John Voller Elizabeth his wife and Abraham their son from and out of the said Parish of Durley to the said Parish of Titchfield and them to deliver to the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor there or some or one of them together with this our order at the same time showing them the original and we do also hereby require you the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Titchfield to receive and provide for them as inhabitants of your Parish. Given under our hands and seals, the ninth day of May in the forty ninth year of the reign of our sovereign Lord King George the Third." > > > > > > > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > > Level: Item > > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > > > > > http://www.a2a.org.uk/ > > East Sussex Record Office > > PARISH OF WINCHELSEA > > Catalogue Ref. PAR511 > > Former Catalogue Ref. PAR511 > > Creator(s): > > Church of England, Winchelsea Parish, East Sussex > > Settlement - ref. PAR511/32 > > Removal orders from Winchelsea > > FILE - Removal order from Winchelsea - ref. PAR511/32/2/81 - date: 29 Nov 1825 > > [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER (21) and his sister Ann VOLLER (12); to Titchfield in Hampshire > > > > > > From earlier research I think William VOLLER may have married Anne WARNER the daughter of Robert WARNER of Durley and had children William 1843, George 1844 and Ann 1847 at Camberwell Surrey south of the Thames in London. > > > > > > IGI Individual Record > > Abraham VOLLER > > Christening: 30 SEP 1804 Widley, Hampshire, England > > Father: John VOLLER > > Mother: Eliz. > > C062161 1738 - 1812 FHL Film 0918878, > > also film 0883873 Parish register printouts of Widley, Hampshire, England ; christenings, 1738-1876 > > > > > > https://www.findmypast.com.au/transcript?id=GBPRS/B/800200889/1 > > Hampshire baptisms > > Baptised 19 Apr 1788 at Durley parish > > Robt WARNER son of John & Ann WARNER > > > > > > http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=warner+titchfield > > Reference: PROB 11/1512/225 > > Description: Will of Robert WARNER, Landsman on board His Majesty's Ship LION, No. on ships books 495 of Titchfield, Hampshire > > Date: 14 June 1810 > > Held by: The National Archives, Kew > > Legal status: Public Record(s) > > Closure status: Open Document, > > Open Description > > > > > > > > https://www.findmypast.com.au/transcript?id=GBPRS/B/800401352/1 > > Hampshire baptisms > > William VOLLER baptised 15 Sep 1811 at Titchfield to John & Elizabeth VOLLER > > > > > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > > Level: Item > > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > > > > > 01 Aug 1827 > > Marriage @ Ore, Sussex, England : > > Abraham VOLLER = Elizabeth JONES > > Elizabeth WARNER bap 07/10/1827 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer > > Mary Ann WARNER bap 05/12/1830 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer > > Jane WARNER bap 02/10/1834 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer > > > > > > Robert WARNER (William's father-in-law) was a widower in 1851, so one of these might be the death of his wife. The 1841 census might tell us if one or the other could be his wife. > > FreeBMD > > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > > Deaths 3rd Q 1838, WARNER Eliza, Camberwell 4, 123 > > Deaths 2nd Q 1849, WARNER Mary, Camberwell 4, 33 > > > > > > http://www.a2a.org.uk/ > > East Sussex Record Office > > PARISH OF HASTINGS ST CLEMENT > > Catalogue Ref. PAR367 , Former Catalogue Ref. PAR367 > > Creator(s): Church of England, Hastings St Clement Parish, East Sussex > > Overseers of the Poor: settlement - ref. PAR367/32 > > Removal orders to Hastings St Clement > > FILE - Removal order to Hastings St Clement and settlement examination - ref.PAR367/32/3/230 - date: 20 Dec 1838 > > [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER (34), wife Elizabeth, and his children Elizabeth (11), Mary Ann (8) and Jane (3); from Hastings All Saints; fifteen years ago he agreed with William HICKES of Burdett Place, Hastings St Clement, to serve him as a driver to a fly and general servant; left due to ill health and lived with friends at Winchelsea for fifteen months and then went to sea; 11 years ago he was married at Ore to Elizabeth and they have three children > > FILE - Removal order to Hastings St Clement - ref. PAR367/32/3/231 - date: 20 Dec 1838 > > [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER, wife Elizabeth, and his children Elizabeth (11), Mary Ann (8) and Jane (3); from Hastings All Saints > > > > > > Ancestry.com. England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892 [database on-line]. > > Class: HO 27; Piece: 59; Page: 258 > > County of Sussex. Register of all Persons charged with Indictable Offences at the assizes and sessions held within the County during the Year 1839. > > Name of Offender: Abraham VOLLER > > Degree of Instruction: No. Imp? Jmp? > > Age: 35 > > At what Sessions Tried or Discharged without Trial: Hastings Boro' Sessions 25th October > > Offences of which those tried were convicted or Acquitted-and of which those discharged without Trial were charged on Indictment or Committment: Larceny. > > Sentences- > > Imprisonment: 2 months. > > > > > > 04 Nov 1839, Sussex Advertiser, col.6, p.2. > > Abraham VOLLER, labourer, aged 35, was indicted for stealing at Hastings, a quilt, part of a testament, some tea cups and saucers, a piece of writing paper, and sundry articles, the property of George GATES. Harriet GATES, the prosecutor's wife, deposed that she resided with the husband for some weeks in prisoner's house in Bourne-street; that in March last, they left, her husband having obtained work on the Dover railroad, and being unable to take their chest, containing, among others, the articles in question, the prisoner VOLLER offered to keep them until witness could pay the carriage, and send a letter to inform him where they should be sent to ; that letters were sent, but no answer received - upon which witness came to Hastings, and found the prisoner and his wife residing in a cottage on Fairlight-down, in which she saw various articles which had been securely left locked up in the chest, appropriated to the prisoner's use. In answer to the court, witness denied owing prisoner any money for rent or otherwise. Among the articles found in prisoner's house was the piece of writing paper, which was a certificate from Sir David DAVIES, stating that the witness had acted as nurse in the Queen Dowager's household, during the winter of 1836 and 1837, perfectly to his satisfaction, and recommending her to any one in want of a sober, honest, and good nurse. The court expressed their pleasure at finding witness in possession of such a valuable testimony, and that it had been read aloud. The evidence of George GATES was to the same effect. - William REEVES, broker, deposed to having purchased a box or chest of prisoner, in March or thereabouts, similar to the one minutely described by the previous witnesses.-John CAMPBELL, Inspector of Police, stated that he accompanied Harriet GATES to the prisoner’s house, and found there the articles identified by her as her property.-Prisoner, in his defence, said that Gates owed him, when he left for Dover, 10s for rent, and 5s money he had lent him, and as they did not send and pay it, he sold the chest to Mr REEVES.-Gates and his wife being recalled, distinctly denied having owed rent to, or borrowed money from prisoner..-The learned recorder, in summing up the case, observed that if the jury credited the statements of Gates and his wife, they would find the prisoner guilty of felony; but if they believed the prisoner’s statement, the prosecutor owed him money, and appropriated the chest and contents to himself by way of payment, although the act was a highly improper one, it was nevertheless not a felonious undertaking, as the chest came into prisoner’s possession otherwise.-My WINGFIELD, foreman of the jury, asked how long she and her husband had resided in the prisoner’s house, and being informed eight weeks, at 1s per week, the jury unanimously returned a verdict of guilty.;;Mr M. VIDLER, speaking as to the character of the prisoner, said he had known him for 3 years, by his being frequently in his employ, and believed him to be am honest, steady, and industrious man. In answer to a question from the court, inspector CAMPBELL said he never knew anything previously wrong in the prisoner’s conduct.-Mr Jonathan REID stated that VOLLER had been in his employ five months; he had thirty-five labourers at work, and knew VOLLER to be a particularly honest, sober, upright man; would take him into his employ immediately, and trust anything in his hands.-The recorder, in passing sentence, expressed himself perfectly satisfied with the verdict of the jury. They could not suppose GATES and his wife, if they owed the prisoner the money he spoke of, would come over from Dover, and commit acts of the basest perjury; and the character given Mrs GATES in the certificate which had been accidentally read in court, assured them that she could not be guilty of such perjury. Prisoner, he regretted to say, had brought himself into a distressing situation; he had been guilty of a double crime, that of a breach of friendly confidence, as well as of felonious taking, and if it had not been for the character which had been given of him, that he was a very sober, steady, industrious man, he should have inflicted the severest punishment on him. In consequence, however, of the good character he had hitherto borne, and believing it to be prisoner’s first offence, he should inflict a very light punishment-the sentence of the court being that he should be confined in the Lewes house of correction to hard labour, for two months. > > > > > > 06 Jun 1841 Census of England & Wales > > @ ??? White School, Guestling Rd, Ore, Sussex > > Abraham WELLER 35 Ag Lab Y > > Betsy WELLER 30 Y > > Betsy WELLER 13 Y > > Jane WELLER 06 Y > > > > > > State Library of Victoria > > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 and in CO208, Reel 2569 Piece 275 which is the Index to 272 and 273. > > TWEATH? ____?, 275 > > URE Thomas, 553[353?]-420 > > VOLLER Abraham 445 > > > > > > Archives NZ - REPRO 6, Nelson papers NZC 234/2. > > Also, State Library of Victoria > > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 and in CO208, Reel 2569 Piece 275 which is the Index to 272 and 273. > > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand [See Refgulations for the Selection of Emigrant Labourers] > > 32 Mar 1842 > > Application made to M.GILLINGHAM > > 5379 EARLE Richard & Filly, 32 & 30 yrs, brickmaker, residence Oare near Hastinmgs, 2 sons age 12, 10 and 1 daughter age 3. > > 5380 WARNER Rich'd & Eliza, both 23 yrs, quarryman & blacksmith, residence Oare, near Hastings, one son aged 1 year, embarkation #2443. > > 5381 VOLLER, Abraham & Eliz'th, 32 & 31 yrs, Ag. Lab'r & Bricklayer & Quarryman, 3 daughters age 13, 12, 7. Embarkation #2563. > > > > > > State Library of Victoria > > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 > > 1st April [1942] 1093 & 1094 > > Abraham VOLLER 5381 Note of approval > > James PRINGLE 4649 Note of approval > > > > > > State Library of Victoria > > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 > > 5th [May 1842] > > Abraham VOLLER, Oare near Hastings > > The "Thomas Harrison" is now quite full. I regret therefore that it will not be possible for you to share a passage with R. WARNER. > > H. F. ALSTON, Sup't of Em'n. > > > > > > State Library of Victoria > > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 > > 7th July 1842 > > Abraham VOLLER, Oare near Hastings, Sussex > > No. 5381. Usual circular - 2nd ____? > > 22nd July. H. F. ALSTON, Sup't of Emig'n. > > If Thos HIDE could be ready by the 22nd he could be in the same ship with you. > > > > > > Abraham [31] & Elizabeth VOLLER [32] and their 3 daughters Elizabeth [13], Mary Ann [11] and Jane [7] left Gravesend on 27 July 1842 on the THOMAS SPARKS. They came from a brickmaking community called Ore near Hastings England. On the ship Abraham worked as cook and Elizabeth as a nurse. Neither could write. Shirley TURKINGTON heard from a researcher in England that the VOLLERs are mentioned in correspondence held at the PRO at Kew, being between the Poor Law Commissioners and the Hastings Board of Guardians. Abraham, Elizabeth,Mary Ann and Jane are mentioned, the latter two being between 7 and 14 years old, and the subject was the family's assisted emigration, embarking 25 July 1842. Possibly these papers will be in the National Archives at Kew catalogued in the MH12 series of of the Health Dept section under Local Government Board and predecessors: Correspondence with Poor Law Unions and Other Local Authorities1833-1909. It appears that one may have to go to Kew to ascertain the details as the VOLLERs are not indexed by name on the National Archives website catalogue. > > > > > > Copy of a receipt issued to Abraham VOLLER by Captain WAKEFIELD. Original held at National Archives, papers NZC 234/2 > > Immigration Office, Nelson, March 3rd 1843. I hereby certify that Abraham VOLLER and George MILLER > > cook and cooks mate on board the "Thomas Sparks" have to the best of my knowledge and > > judgement faithfully discharged the dutie of their office and are thereby entitled in terms of their > > appointment to receive in remuneration the sum of six pounds one and eight pence. Abraham signed > > with an "x". Also noted was Mrs VOLLER appointed the female hospital mate during one month for > > which she is entitled to receive 10 shillings. > > > > FreeBMD > > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > > Marriages 1st Quarter 1843 > > VOLLER William, Camberwell 4, 33 > > WARNER Ann, Camberwell 4, 33 > > > > > > London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1932 > > https://search.ancestry.com/search/db.aspx?dbid=1623 > > 1843 Marriage solemnized at the District Parish Church in the Parish of St Mary Magdalene in the County of Surrey. > > Married 03 Jan 1843 > > William VOLLER, Full Age, Bachelor, Brickmaker, residence Peckham, father John VOLLER, labourer. > > Ann WARNER, Full Age, Spinster, Peckham, father Robert WARNER, Stoker. > > Married in the District Church according to the Rites and Ceremonies of the Established Church, after Banns by me, > > Jas Sydney DARVELL. > > This Marriage was solemnized between us, > > William VOLLER (X) > > Ann WARNER (X) > > In the Presence of us, > > Joseph NICHOLLS > > Ann MANSELL > > > > The marriage might have been somewhat rushed... > > > > > > FreeBMD > > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > > Births 1st Q 1843, VOLLER William, Camberwell 4, 61 > > Births 3rd Q 1844, VOLLER George, Camberwell 4, 52 > > > > > > > > https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NLYK-MM4 > > IGI - Familysearch > > England Births and Christenings 1538-1975 > > Name: William VOLLER > > Gender: Male > > Christening Date: 25 Jun 1843 > > Christening Place: SAINT GILES, CAMBERWELL,LONDON,ENGLAND > > Birth Date: 25 Jan 1843 > > Father's Name: William VOLLER > > Mother's Name: Ann > > Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00626-1 > > System Origin: England-ODM > > GS Film number: 0254571-0254577 > > > > > > https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JWWH-978 > > IGI - Familysearch > > England Births and Christenings 1538-1975 > > Name: George VOLLER > > Gender: Male > > Christening Date: 15 Sep 1844 > > Christening Place: SAINT GILES,CAMBERWELL,LONDON,ENGLAND > > Birth Date: 20 Jun 1844 > > Father's Name: William VOLLER > > Mother's Name: Ann > > Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00626-1 , System Origin: England-ODM , GS Film number: 0254571-0254577 > > > > > > > > 1847 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Boulcott St) not on Nelson Jury list. > > 1848/49 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Lambton Quay) not on Nelson Jury list. > > 1850 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Willis St). > > 1851 Abraham VOLLER on Jury List for Nelson and not the Wellington one. > > 1852 Abraham VOLLER on Nelson Jury List > > 1858 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 > > 1868 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 > > 1871 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 > > > > > > 30 Mar 1851 Census of England & Wales > > @ City of London Gasworks, St Bride's, Londn, Middlesex > > William VOLLER Marr Servt 37 Stoker b. Bishopwalton, Hants > > + many others at the gasworks > > > > > > 30 Mar 1851 Census of England & Wales > > @1 Canal Place, New Church Road, Camberwell, London, England > > Ann VOLLER Wife Marr 37 Husband employed at Gasworks b. Gosport, Hants > > William VOLLER Son 08 b. Camberwell, Surrey > > George VOLLER Son 06 b. Camberwell, Surrey > > / Robert WARNER Father Widower 63 General Laborer b. Derley, Hants > > / John BENNETT Lodger Unm 30 General Laborer b. Maidstone, Kent > > > > Possible death: > > > > FreeBMD > > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > > Deaths 4th Quarter 1855, WARNER Robert, Camberwell 1d, 298 > > > > > > Is this William's death? > > > > FreeBMD > > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > > Deaths 1Q 1870, William VOLLER, 59, Camberwell 1d, 493 > > > > > > 02 Apr 1871 Census of England & Wales > > @1 Canal Place, Camberwell, London, England > > Ann VOLLER Head Widow 50 b. Gosport, Hants > > Wm VOLLER Son Unm 28 Lab b. Camberwell, Surrey > > Geo VOLLER Son Unm 26 b. Camberwell, Surrey > > Rosa ELLIS Visitor Unm 28 Dom Serv b. Maidstone, Kent > > > > Is this William junior? > > > > > > Is this William? > > > > 03 Apr 1881 Census of England & Wales > > Droxford Union Workhouse, Droxford, Hampshire > > William VOLLER Inmate Unm 38 Labourer b. Exton, Hampshire > > et. al. > > > > http://www.workhouses.org.uk/Droxford/ > > > > > > > > Newspaper report - Nelson Evening Mail - 28 Dec 1875 : > > "Inquest report on the body of Abraham, alias Jerry VOLLER, who was found dead lying in the mud at the back of the Custom House Hotel early this morning. Verdict - found drowned. Funeral to leave from the residence of Mr MILLER, Waimea Rd" > > > > > > Nelson Mail - 30 December 1875 - > > An inquest was held at the Port this afternoon after the body of Abraham VOLLER known as Jerry VOLLER, who was found lying dead in the mud at the back of the Custom House Hotel early this morning. He had been employed at odd jobs at the Hotel yesterday and was last seen early in the evening in a state of intoxication, and it is supposed that he must have fallen over from the landing at high tide into deep water as he relieved himself as his fly was undone > > when he was pulled from the water. A verdict of "Found Drowned" was returned. > > [The coroners report is held at National Archives] > > > > > > Papers Past > > http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ > > Marlborough Express, Volume XI, Issue 776, 1 January 1876, Page 6 > > An inquest was held at the Port on Tuesday afternoon, touching the death of Abraham VOLLER, a very old settler, whose body was found on the beach early that morning. The deceased, who was generally known as Jerry VOLLER, was last seen on the previous evening, and it is generally supposed that whilst in a state of intoxication he must have fallen into the tideway near the Custom House Hotel. A verdict was returned that he was found drowned. — Colonist 30th. > > > > > > http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/8942292 > > The Mercury (Hobart, Tas. : 1860 - 1954), Monday 10 January 1876, Page 3. > > One of the oldest of the Nelson settlers, a man named Abraham VOLLER, was recently drowned. He arrived in the colony by the Thomas Parkes [sic - s/be Thomas Sparks] in 1842, and, except for a few months when he assisted to establish the first settlement of Wellington, VOLLER has resided in Nelson. He was one of the survivors of the historical Wairau massacre, and was one of the crew that helped Captain CARKEEK to sail a craft of 32 tons burden from England to Adelaide in the early days. > > > > > > http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&d=EP18781130.2.23 > > Evening Post, Volume XVI, Issue 284, 30 November 1878, Page 3 > > THE LATE MR. STEPHEN CARKEEK. > > > > > > Ancestry.com. New Zealand, Cemetery Records, 1800-2007 > > Wakapuaka Cemetery, p.294 > > 3837. Anglican Block 4 - Plot 34 > > Burial Records: VOLLER, Abraham - 29 Dec 1875, 75 yrs > > Elizabeth - 2 Feb 1873, 70 yrs > > No headstone. HAWKINS, Frances Eleanor - 3 Oct 1870, 4 mths. > > > > > > Abraham VOLLER's nickname name was Jerry. > > > > > > http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ > > Marlborough Express, Volume XXI, Issue 86, 18 April 1885, Page 2 > > LOCAL AND GENERAL NEWS. > > A Reminiscence. - A correspondent of the Colonist writes : - ln 1855, the good people of Nelson were in a high state of excitement regarding the war that was then raging between England and Russia, and every day we were expecting to receive a visit from a Russian warship. One fine morning the flagstaff at the signal station was covered with flags, which threw the Nelsonians into a great state of excitement, for they could not imagine what the display of bunting meant. On Pilot CROSS proceeding to the signal station, he found poor old Jerry VOLLER in a high state of excitement, which had been greatly increased by the strength of the famous Nelson brewed malt liquors. On inquiring what was up, Jerry replied - " It's all up with us, the Russians have come." Shortly after the Provincial Council met, and as often customary in those days, they were seized with a fit of retrenchment, but the only saving effected was to take sixpence a day off Jerry's salary. I do not know whether his method of announcing the supposed visit of the Russians had anything to do with making the Councillors dock poor Jerry's screw. However, he was the only victim on that occasion. - Old Resident. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 13 September 2019 at 16:56 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Was Richard WARNER's father Joseph really Joseph RONALDS ?????????? And were he and Abraham VOLLER half brothers ???????????? > > > > > > For those of you researching Richard & Eliza WARNER ne WRIGHT who emigrated from Ore Sussex to Nelson NZ, here's an absolute beauty that could crack the WARNER brick wall wide open for us. If it means what I think it might mean, I'm stunned! > > > > > > A bit of preamble to set the scene... > > > > > > Some will know from my ramblings that Richard WARNER and his people were also known as VOLLER. He had some kind of relationship with Abraham VOLLER, either a very close friendship or they were related. Abraham was told by the NZ Company in a letter that it wasn't possible for him to accompany R. WARNER to NZ on the same ship. Abraham also came out to Nelson New Zealand from Ore in 1842 and it appears that his daughter Mary Ann raised Richard & Eliza WARNER's son Abraham WARNER after the early death at Nelson NZ of Eliza in 1865. > > > > > > Abraham VOLLER had the nickname Jerry in NZ. We know he was baptised to John & Elizabeth VOLLER who married as John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER at Durley Hampshir ein 1803. When Abraham's daughters were baptised at Ore he was called WARNER. > > > > > > Richard WARNER's brother Robert, who was turned down for a passage to NZ because he was single, was most often known as VOLLER although he does appear in some records as WARNER especially in some censuses. All his children were registered born as VOLLER but the occasional one married as WARNER. His wife Sarah Ann has to be Sarah Ann VOLLER who was the informant at the death on the death registration of Richard WARNER's mother Elizabeth at Ore in 1851 not long after her husband Joseph WARNER died in the workhouse at Ore. Both died after the census but we can't find them in it. > > > > > > When William WRIGHT stole his sister Eliza WRIGHT's silver watch at Ore and some trousers at Brighton and was transported to Van Dieman's Land his crime and trial were reported in the Sussex Advertiser, with the owner of the watch given as Richard VOLLER rather than Richard WARNER. Technically, upon marriage with Eliza WRIGHT, Richard became the legal owner of the watch. In Tasmania convict records it is stated by William that he "stole my sister's watch", a list of family back home he gave matches that of his parents, and we've recently heard from William's descendant David that he DNA matches with multiple WRIGHT descendants, including my eldest sister, as a 4th cousin. So Richard VOLLER is Richard WARNER all right. > > > > > > Recall that Richard WARNER was baptised at Hastings in 1819 and Robert WARNER his brother was baptised at Hastings in 1822. > > > > > > Now....drum roll....read on..... > > > > > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > > > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > > > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > > > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > > > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > > > Level: Item > > > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > > > > > So, are Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER, the parents of Richard & Robert, actually Joseph RONALDS & Elizabeth VOLLER nee WARNER going by the name of WARNER? If so, then Abraham VOLLER and Richard WARNER were half brothers, which would explain a heck of a lot! > > > > > > Peter

oops the third and fourth items Winchelseaare the same date. The first two items were inserted after the fact of writing, if you know what I mean. > On 13 September 2019 at 17:34 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > Hi all > > > I already had Abraham, Ann and William as the children of John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER. > > I've been theorising that Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER were John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER. I was half right. Elizabeth is correct but Joseph WARNER is her second beau Joseph RONALDS instead of John VOLLER. > > > These two items are the same date, so I think the settlement examination must have been the precursor of the removal order of Abraham and Ann to Titchfield. > > Data follows > > Cheers > Peter > > > MARRIAGES – 1800-1836 Durley, Southampton, Hampshire, ENGLAND > Date 20 Sep 1803 > Surname VOLLER > 1st Name John > Parish Southwick > Spouse Surname WARNER > Spouse 1st Name Elizabeth > Spouse Parish Durley > > > Hampshire Record Office, > Ref: 37M73/PO37/6 > Title: Removal Order: John VOLLER, wife Elizabeth and son Abraham (4 years), removed from Durley. > Date: 9 May 1809 > “County of Southhampton > To the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley in the said County and to the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Titchfield in the County aforesaid ------ > Upon the complaint of the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley aforesaid in the County of Southhampton unto us whose names are hereunto affixed being two? of HM (His Majesty’s?) Justices of the Peace in and for the said County that: > John Voller his wife Elizabeth and Abraham his son now aged four years have come to inhabit in the Parish of Durley not having gained a legal settlement there nor produced any certificate owning them or any of them to be settled elsewhere and that the said John Voller, Elizabeth his wife and Abraham their child are actually become chargeable to the Parish of Durley. We, the said Justices, upon our proof made thereof as well as upon the Examination of the said John Voller as otherwise and likewise upon our consideration had of the premises? do adjudge the same to be true and we do likewise adjudge that the lawful settlement of these John Voller, Elizabeth his wife and their son Abraham is in the Parish of Titchfield in the said County and so, therefore, require you the said Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley or some or one of you to convey the said John Voller Elizabeth his wife and Abraham their son from and out of the said Parish of Durley to the said Parish of Titchfield and them to deliver to the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor there or some or one of them together with this our order at the same time showing them the original and we do also hereby require you the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Titchfield to receive and provide for them as inhabitants of your Parish. Given under our hands and seals, the ninth day of May in the forty ninth year of the reign of our sovereign Lord King George the Third." > > > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > Level: Item > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > > http://www.a2a.org.uk/ > East Sussex Record Office > PARISH OF WINCHELSEA > Catalogue Ref. PAR511 > Former Catalogue Ref. PAR511 > Creator(s): > Church of England, Winchelsea Parish, East Sussex > Settlement - ref. PAR511/32 > Removal orders from Winchelsea > FILE - Removal order from Winchelsea - ref. PAR511/32/2/81 - date: 29 Nov 1825 > [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER (21) and his sister Ann VOLLER (12); to Titchfield in Hampshire > > > From earlier research I think William VOLLER may have married Anne WARNER the daughter of Robert WARNER of Durley and had children William 1843, George 1844 and Ann 1847 at Camberwell Surrey south of the Thames in London. > > > IGI Individual Record > Abraham VOLLER > Christening: 30 SEP 1804 Widley, Hampshire, England > Father: John VOLLER > Mother: Eliz. > C062161 1738 - 1812 FHL Film 0918878, > also film 0883873 Parish register printouts of Widley, Hampshire, England ; christenings, 1738-1876 > > > https://www.findmypast.com.au/transcript?id=GBPRS/B/800200889/1 > Hampshire baptisms > Baptised 19 Apr 1788 at Durley parish > Robt WARNER son of John & Ann WARNER > > > http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=warner+titchfield > Reference: PROB 11/1512/225 > Description: Will of Robert WARNER, Landsman on board His Majesty's Ship LION, No. on ships books 495 of Titchfield, Hampshire > Date: 14 June 1810 > Held by: The National Archives, Kew > Legal status: Public Record(s) > Closure status: Open Document, > Open Description > > > > https://www.findmypast.com.au/transcript?id=GBPRS/B/800401352/1 > Hampshire baptisms > William VOLLER baptised 15 Sep 1811 at Titchfield to John & Elizabeth VOLLER > > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > Level: Item > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > > 01 Aug 1827 > Marriage @ Ore, Sussex, England : > Abraham VOLLER = Elizabeth JONES > Elizabeth WARNER bap 07/10/1827 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer > Mary Ann WARNER bap 05/12/1830 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer > Jane WARNER bap 02/10/1834 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer > > > Robert WARNER (William's father-in-law) was a widower in 1851, so one of these might be the death of his wife. The 1841 census might tell us if one or the other could be his wife. > FreeBMD > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > Deaths 3rd Q 1838, WARNER Eliza, Camberwell 4, 123 > Deaths 2nd Q 1849, WARNER Mary, Camberwell 4, 33 > > > http://www.a2a.org.uk/ > East Sussex Record Office > PARISH OF HASTINGS ST CLEMENT > Catalogue Ref. PAR367 , Former Catalogue Ref. PAR367 > Creator(s): Church of England, Hastings St Clement Parish, East Sussex > Overseers of the Poor: settlement - ref. PAR367/32 > Removal orders to Hastings St Clement > FILE - Removal order to Hastings St Clement and settlement examination - ref.PAR367/32/3/230 - date: 20 Dec 1838 > [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER (34), wife Elizabeth, and his children Elizabeth (11), Mary Ann (8) and Jane (3); from Hastings All Saints; fifteen years ago he agreed with William HICKES of Burdett Place, Hastings St Clement, to serve him as a driver to a fly and general servant; left due to ill health and lived with friends at Winchelsea for fifteen months and then went to sea; 11 years ago he was married at Ore to Elizabeth and they have three children > FILE - Removal order to Hastings St Clement - ref. PAR367/32/3/231 - date: 20 Dec 1838 > [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER, wife Elizabeth, and his children Elizabeth (11), Mary Ann (8) and Jane (3); from Hastings All Saints > > > Ancestry.com. England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892 [database on-line]. > Class: HO 27; Piece: 59; Page: 258 > County of Sussex. Register of all Persons charged with Indictable Offences at the assizes and sessions held within the County during the Year 1839. > Name of Offender: Abraham VOLLER > Degree of Instruction: No. Imp? Jmp? > Age: 35 > At what Sessions Tried or Discharged without Trial: Hastings Boro' Sessions 25th October > Offences of which those tried were convicted or Acquitted-and of which those discharged without Trial were charged on Indictment or Committment: Larceny. > Sentences- > Imprisonment: 2 months. > > > 04 Nov 1839, Sussex Advertiser, col.6, p.2. > Abraham VOLLER, labourer, aged 35, was indicted for stealing at Hastings, a quilt, part of a testament, some tea cups and saucers, a piece of writing paper, and sundry articles, the property of George GATES. Harriet GATES, the prosecutor's wife, deposed that she resided with the husband for some weeks in prisoner's house in Bourne-street; that in March last, they left, her husband having obtained work on the Dover railroad, and being unable to take their chest, containing, among others, the articles in question, the prisoner VOLLER offered to keep them until witness could pay the carriage, and send a letter to inform him where they should be sent to ; that letters were sent, but no answer received - upon which witness came to Hastings, and found the prisoner and his wife residing in a cottage on Fairlight-down, in which she saw various articles which had been securely left locked up in the chest, appropriated to the prisoner's use. In answer to the court, witness denied owing prisoner any money for rent or otherwise. Among the articles found in prisoner's house was the piece of writing paper, which was a certificate from Sir David DAVIES, stating that the witness had acted as nurse in the Queen Dowager's household, during the winter of 1836 and 1837, perfectly to his satisfaction, and recommending her to any one in want of a sober, honest, and good nurse. The court expressed their pleasure at finding witness in possession of such a valuable testimony, and that it had been read aloud. The evidence of George GATES was to the same effect. - William REEVES, broker, deposed to having purchased a box or chest of prisoner, in March or thereabouts, similar to the one minutely described by the previous witnesses.-John CAMPBELL, Inspector of Police, stated that he accompanied Harriet GATES to the prisoner’s house, and found there the articles identified by her as her property.-Prisoner, in his defence, said that Gates owed him, when he left for Dover, 10s for rent, and 5s money he had lent him, and as they did not send and pay it, he sold the chest to Mr REEVES.-Gates and his wife being recalled, distinctly denied having owed rent to, or borrowed money from prisoner..-The learned recorder, in summing up the case, observed that if the jury credited the statements of Gates and his wife, they would find the prisoner guilty of felony; but if they believed the prisoner’s statement, the prosecutor owed him money, and appropriated the chest and contents to himself by way of payment, although the act was a highly improper one, it was nevertheless not a felonious undertaking, as the chest came into prisoner’s possession otherwise.-My WINGFIELD, foreman of the jury, asked how long she and her husband had resided in the prisoner’s house, and being informed eight weeks, at 1s per week, the jury unanimously returned a verdict of guilty.;;Mr M. VIDLER, speaking as to the character of the prisoner, said he had known him for 3 years, by his being frequently in his employ, and believed him to be am honest, steady, and industrious man. In answer to a question from the court, inspector CAMPBELL said he never knew anything previously wrong in the prisoner’s conduct.-Mr Jonathan REID stated that VOLLER had been in his employ five months; he had thirty-five labourers at work, and knew VOLLER to be a particularly honest, sober, upright man; would take him into his employ immediately, and trust anything in his hands.-The recorder, in passing sentence, expressed himself perfectly satisfied with the verdict of the jury. They could not suppose GATES and his wife, if they owed the prisoner the money he spoke of, would come over from Dover, and commit acts of the basest perjury; and the character given Mrs GATES in the certificate which had been accidentally read in court, assured them that she could not be guilty of such perjury. Prisoner, he regretted to say, had brought himself into a distressing situation; he had been guilty of a double crime, that of a breach of friendly confidence, as well as of felonious taking, and if it had not been for the character which had been given of him, that he was a very sober, steady, industrious man, he should have inflicted the severest punishment on him. In consequence, however, of the good character he had hitherto borne, and believing it to be prisoner’s first offence, he should inflict a very light punishment-the sentence of the court being that he should be confined in the Lewes house of correction to hard labour, for two months. > > > 06 Jun 1841 Census of England & Wales > @ ??? White School, Guestling Rd, Ore, Sussex > Abraham WELLER 35 Ag Lab Y > Betsy WELLER 30 Y > Betsy WELLER 13 Y > Jane WELLER 06 Y > > > State Library of Victoria > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 and in CO208, Reel 2569 Piece 275 which is the Index to 272 and 273. > TWEATH? ____?, 275 > URE Thomas, 553[353?]-420 > VOLLER Abraham 445 > > > Archives NZ - REPRO 6, Nelson papers NZC 234/2. > Also, State Library of Victoria > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 and in CO208, Reel 2569 Piece 275 which is the Index to 272 and 273. > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand [See Refgulations for the Selection of Emigrant Labourers] > 32 Mar 1842 > Application made to M.GILLINGHAM > 5379 EARLE Richard & Filly, 32 & 30 yrs, brickmaker, residence Oare near Hastinmgs, 2 sons age 12, 10 and 1 daughter age 3. > 5380 WARNER Rich'd & Eliza, both 23 yrs, quarryman & blacksmith, residence Oare, near Hastings, one son aged 1 year, embarkation #2443. > 5381 VOLLER, Abraham & Eliz'th, 32 & 31 yrs, Ag. Lab'r & Bricklayer & Quarryman, 3 daughters age 13, 12, 7. Embarkation #2563. > > > State Library of Victoria > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 > 1st April [1942] 1093 & 1094 > Abraham VOLLER 5381 Note of approval > James PRINGLE 4649 Note of approval > > > State Library of Victoria > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 > 5th [May 1842] > Abraham VOLLER, Oare near Hastings > The "Thomas Harrison" is now quite full. I regret therefore that it will not be possible for you to share a passage with R. WARNER. > H. F. ALSTON, Sup't of Em'n. > > > State Library of Victoria > Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 > 7th July 1842 > Abraham VOLLER, Oare near Hastings, Sussex > No. 5381. Usual circular - 2nd ____? > 22nd July. H. F. ALSTON, Sup't of Emig'n. > If Thos HIDE could be ready by the 22nd he could be in the same ship with you. > > > Abraham [31] & Elizabeth VOLLER [32] and their 3 daughters Elizabeth [13], Mary Ann [11] and Jane [7] left Gravesend on 27 July 1842 on the THOMAS SPARKS. They came from a brickmaking community called Ore near Hastings England. On the ship Abraham worked as cook and Elizabeth as a nurse. Neither could write. Shirley TURKINGTON heard from a researcher in England that the VOLLERs are mentioned in correspondence held at the PRO at Kew, being between the Poor Law Commissioners and the Hastings Board of Guardians. Abraham, Elizabeth,Mary Ann and Jane are mentioned, the latter two being between 7 and 14 years old, and the subject was the family's assisted emigration, embarking 25 July 1842. Possibly these papers will be in the National Archives at Kew catalogued in the MH12 series of of the Health Dept section under Local Government Board and predecessors: Correspondence with Poor Law Unions and Other Local Authorities1833-1909. It appears that one may have to go to Kew to ascertain the details as the VOLLERs are not indexed by name on the National Archives website catalogue. > > > Copy of a receipt issued to Abraham VOLLER by Captain WAKEFIELD. Original held at National Archives, papers NZC 234/2 > Immigration Office, Nelson, March 3rd 1843. I hereby certify that Abraham VOLLER and George MILLER > cook and cooks mate on board the "Thomas Sparks" have to the best of my knowledge and > judgement faithfully discharged the dutie of their office and are thereby entitled in terms of their > appointment to receive in remuneration the sum of six pounds one and eight pence. Abraham signed > with an "x". Also noted was Mrs VOLLER appointed the female hospital mate during one month for > which she is entitled to receive 10 shillings. > > FreeBMD > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > Marriages 1st Quarter 1843 > VOLLER William, Camberwell 4, 33 > WARNER Ann, Camberwell 4, 33 > > > London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1932 > https://search.ancestry.com/search/db.aspx?dbid=1623 > 1843 Marriage solemnized at the District Parish Church in the Parish of St Mary Magdalene in the County of Surrey. > Married 03 Jan 1843 > William VOLLER, Full Age, Bachelor, Brickmaker, residence Peckham, father John VOLLER, labourer. > Ann WARNER, Full Age, Spinster, Peckham, father Robert WARNER, Stoker. > Married in the District Church according to the Rites and Ceremonies of the Established Church, after Banns by me, > Jas Sydney DARVELL. > This Marriage was solemnized between us, > William VOLLER (X) > Ann WARNER (X) > In the Presence of us, > Joseph NICHOLLS > Ann MANSELL > > The marriage might have been somewhat rushed... > > > FreeBMD > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > Births 1st Q 1843, VOLLER William, Camberwell 4, 61 > Births 3rd Q 1844, VOLLER George, Camberwell 4, 52 > > > > https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NLYK-MM4 > IGI - Familysearch > England Births and Christenings 1538-1975 > Name: William VOLLER > Gender: Male > Christening Date: 25 Jun 1843 > Christening Place: SAINT GILES, CAMBERWELL,LONDON,ENGLAND > Birth Date: 25 Jan 1843 > Father's Name: William VOLLER > Mother's Name: Ann > Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00626-1 > System Origin: England-ODM > GS Film number: 0254571-0254577 > > > https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JWWH-978 > IGI - Familysearch > England Births and Christenings 1538-1975 > Name: George VOLLER > Gender: Male > Christening Date: 15 Sep 1844 > Christening Place: SAINT GILES,CAMBERWELL,LONDON,ENGLAND > Birth Date: 20 Jun 1844 > Father's Name: William VOLLER > Mother's Name: Ann > Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00626-1 , System Origin: England-ODM , GS Film number: 0254571-0254577 > > > > 1847 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Boulcott St) not on Nelson Jury list. > 1848/49 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Lambton Quay) not on Nelson Jury list. > 1850 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Willis St). > 1851 Abraham VOLLER on Jury List for Nelson and not the Wellington one. > 1852 Abraham VOLLER on Nelson Jury List > 1858 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 > 1868 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 > 1871 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 > > > 30 Mar 1851 Census of England & Wales > @ City of London Gasworks, St Bride's, Londn, Middlesex > William VOLLER Marr Servt 37 Stoker b. Bishopwalton, Hants > + many others at the gasworks > > > 30 Mar 1851 Census of England & Wales > @1 Canal Place, New Church Road, Camberwell, London, England > Ann VOLLER Wife Marr 37 Husband employed at Gasworks b. Gosport, Hants > William VOLLER Son 08 b. Camberwell, Surrey > George VOLLER Son 06 b. Camberwell, Surrey > / Robert WARNER Father Widower 63 General Laborer b. Derley, Hants > / John BENNETT Lodger Unm 30 General Laborer b. Maidstone, Kent > > Possible death: > > FreeBMD > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > Deaths 4th Quarter 1855, WARNER Robert, Camberwell 1d, 298 > > > Is this William's death? > > FreeBMD > http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ > Deaths 1Q 1870, William VOLLER, 59, Camberwell 1d, 493 > > > 02 Apr 1871 Census of England & Wales > @1 Canal Place, Camberwell, London, England > Ann VOLLER Head Widow 50 b. Gosport, Hants > Wm VOLLER Son Unm 28 Lab b. Camberwell, Surrey > Geo VOLLER Son Unm 26 b. Camberwell, Surrey > Rosa ELLIS Visitor Unm 28 Dom Serv b. Maidstone, Kent > > Is this William junior? > > > Is this William? > > 03 Apr 1881 Census of England & Wales > Droxford Union Workhouse, Droxford, Hampshire > William VOLLER Inmate Unm 38 Labourer b. Exton, Hampshire > et. al. > > http://www.workhouses.org.uk/Droxford/ > > > > Newspaper report - Nelson Evening Mail - 28 Dec 1875 : > "Inquest report on the body of Abraham, alias Jerry VOLLER, who was found dead lying in the mud at the back of the Custom House Hotel early this morning. Verdict - found drowned. Funeral to leave from the residence of Mr MILLER, Waimea Rd" > > > Nelson Mail - 30 December 1875 - > An inquest was held at the Port this afternoon after the body of Abraham VOLLER known as Jerry VOLLER, who was found lying dead in the mud at the back of the Custom House Hotel early this morning. He had been employed at odd jobs at the Hotel yesterday and was last seen early in the evening in a state of intoxication, and it is supposed that he must have fallen over from the landing at high tide into deep water as he relieved himself as his fly was undone > when he was pulled from the water. A verdict of "Found Drowned" was returned. > [The coroners report is held at National Archives] > > > Papers Past > http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ > Marlborough Express, Volume XI, Issue 776, 1 January 1876, Page 6 > An inquest was held at the Port on Tuesday afternoon, touching the death of Abraham VOLLER, a very old settler, whose body was found on the beach early that morning. The deceased, who was generally known as Jerry VOLLER, was last seen on the previous evening, and it is generally supposed that whilst in a state of intoxication he must have fallen into the tideway near the Custom House Hotel. A verdict was returned that he was found drowned. — Colonist 30th. > > > http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/8942292 > The Mercury (Hobart, Tas. : 1860 - 1954), Monday 10 January 1876, Page 3. > One of the oldest of the Nelson settlers, a man named Abraham VOLLER, was recently drowned. He arrived in the colony by the Thomas Parkes [sic - s/be Thomas Sparks] in 1842, and, except for a few months when he assisted to establish the first settlement of Wellington, VOLLER has resided in Nelson. He was one of the survivors of the historical Wairau massacre, and was one of the crew that helped Captain CARKEEK to sail a craft of 32 tons burden from England to Adelaide in the early days. > > > http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&d=EP18781130.2.23 > Evening Post, Volume XVI, Issue 284, 30 November 1878, Page 3 > THE LATE MR. STEPHEN CARKEEK. > > > Ancestry.com. New Zealand, Cemetery Records, 1800-2007 > Wakapuaka Cemetery, p.294 > 3837. Anglican Block 4 - Plot 34 > Burial Records: VOLLER, Abraham - 29 Dec 1875, 75 yrs > Elizabeth - 2 Feb 1873, 70 yrs > No headstone. HAWKINS, Frances Eleanor - 3 Oct 1870, 4 mths. > > > Abraham VOLLER's nickname name was Jerry. > > > http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ > Marlborough Express, Volume XXI, Issue 86, 18 April 1885, Page 2 > LOCAL AND GENERAL NEWS. > A Reminiscence. - A correspondent of the Colonist writes : - ln 1855, the good people of Nelson were in a high state of excitement regarding the war that was then raging between England and Russia, and every day we were expecting to receive a visit from a Russian warship. One fine morning the flagstaff at the signal station was covered with flags, which threw the Nelsonians into a great state of excitement, for they could not imagine what the display of bunting meant. On Pilot CROSS proceeding to the signal station, he found poor old Jerry VOLLER in a high state of excitement, which had been greatly increased by the strength of the famous Nelson brewed malt liquors. On inquiring what was up, Jerry replied - " It's all up with us, the Russians have come." Shortly after the Provincial Council met, and as often customary in those days, they were seized with a fit of retrenchment, but the only saving effected was to take sixpence a day off Jerry's salary. I do not know whether his method of announcing the supposed visit of the Russians had anything to do with making the Councillors dock poor Jerry's screw. However, he was the only victim on that occasion. - Old Resident. > > > > > > > > On 13 September 2019 at 16:56 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > > > > Was Richard WARNER's father Joseph really Joseph RONALDS ?????????? And were he and Abraham VOLLER half brothers ???????????? > > > > For those of you researching Richard & Eliza WARNER ne WRIGHT who emigrated from Ore Sussex to Nelson NZ, here's an absolute beauty that could crack the WARNER brick wall wide open for us. If it means what I think it might mean, I'm stunned! > > > > A bit of preamble to set the scene... > > > > Some will know from my ramblings that Richard WARNER and his people were also known as VOLLER. He had some kind of relationship with Abraham VOLLER, either a very close friendship or they were related. Abraham was told by the NZ Company in a letter that it wasn't possible for him to accompany R. WARNER to NZ on the same ship. Abraham also came out to Nelson New Zealand from Ore in 1842 and it appears that his daughter Mary Ann raised Richard & Eliza WARNER's son Abraham WARNER after the early death at Nelson NZ of Eliza in 1865. > > > > Abraham VOLLER had the nickname Jerry in NZ. We know he was baptised to John & Elizabeth VOLLER who married as John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER at Durley Hampshir ein 1803. When Abraham's daughters were baptised at Ore he was called WARNER. > > > > Richard WARNER's brother Robert, who was turned down for a passage to NZ because he was single, was most often known as VOLLER although he does appear in some records as WARNER especially in some censuses. All his children were registered born as VOLLER but the occasional one married as WARNER. His wife Sarah Ann has to be Sarah Ann VOLLER who was the informant at the death on the death registration of Richard WARNER's mother Elizabeth at Ore in 1851 not long after her husband Joseph WARNER died in the workhouse at Ore. Both died after the census but we can't find them in it. > > > > When William WRIGHT stole his sister Eliza WRIGHT's silver watch at Ore and some trousers at Brighton and was transported to Van Dieman's Land his crime and trial were reported in the Sussex Advertiser, with the owner of the watch given as Richard VOLLER rather than Richard WARNER. Technically, upon marriage with Eliza WRIGHT, Richard became the legal owner of the watch. In Tasmania convict records it is stated by William that he "stole my sister's watch", a list of family back home he gave matches that of his parents, and we've recently heard from William's descendant David that he DNA matches with multiple WRIGHT descendants, including my eldest sister, as a 4th cousin. So Richard VOLLER is Richard WARNER all right. > > > > Recall that Richard WARNER was baptised at Hastings in 1819 and Robert WARNER his brother was baptised at Hastings in 1822. > > > > Now....drum roll....read on..... > > > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > > Level: Item > > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > > > So, are Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER, the parents of Richard & Robert, actually Joseph RONALDS & Elizabeth VOLLER nee WARNER going by the name of WARNER? If so, then Abraham VOLLER and Richard WARNER were half brothers, which would explain a heck of a lot! > > > > Peter

Hi all I already had Abraham, Ann and William as the children of John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER. I've been theorising that Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER were John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER. I was half right. Elizabeth is correct but Joseph WARNER is her second beau Joseph RONALDS instead of John VOLLER. These two items are the same date, so I think the settlement examination must have been the precursor of the removal order of Abraham and Ann to Titchfield. Data follows Cheers Peter MARRIAGES – 1800-1836 Durley, Southampton, Hampshire, ENGLAND Date 20 Sep 1803 Surname VOLLER 1st Name John Parish Southwick Spouse Surname WARNER Spouse 1st Name Elizabeth Spouse Parish Durley Hampshire Record Office, Ref: 37M73/PO37/6 Title: Removal Order: John VOLLER, wife Elizabeth and son Abraham (4 years), removed from Durley. Date: 9 May 1809 “County of Southhampton To the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley in the said County and to the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Titchfield in the County aforesaid ------ Upon the complaint of the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley aforesaid in the County of Southhampton unto us whose names are hereunto affixed being two? of HM (His Majesty’s?) Justices of the Peace in and for the said County that: John Voller his wife Elizabeth and Abraham his son now aged four years have come to inhabit in the Parish of Durley not having gained a legal settlement there nor produced any certificate owning them or any of them to be settled elsewhere and that the said John Voller, Elizabeth his wife and Abraham their child are actually become chargeable to the Parish of Durley. We, the said Justices, upon our proof made thereof as well as upon the Examination of the said John Voller as otherwise and likewise upon our consideration had of the premises? do adjudge the same to be true and we do likewise adjudge that the lawful settlement of these John Voller, Elizabeth his wife and their son Abraham is in the Parish of Titchfield in the said County and so, therefore, require you the said Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Durley or some or one of you to convey the said John Voller Elizabeth his wife and Abraham their son from and out of the said Parish of Durley to the said Parish of Titchfield and them to deliver to the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor there or some or one of them together with this our order at the same time showing them the original and we do also hereby require you the Churchwardens and Overseers of the Poor of the Parish of Titchfield to receive and provide for them as inhabitants of your Parish. Given under our hands and seals, the ninth day of May in the forty ninth year of the reign of our sovereign Lord King George the Third." https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea Date: 29 Nov 1825 Repository: East Sussex Record Office ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 Level: Item Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. http://www.a2a.org.uk/ East Sussex Record Office PARISH OF WINCHELSEA Catalogue Ref. PAR511 Former Catalogue Ref. PAR511 Creator(s): Church of England, Winchelsea Parish, East Sussex Settlement - ref. PAR511/32 Removal orders from Winchelsea FILE - Removal order from Winchelsea - ref. PAR511/32/2/81 - date: 29 Nov 1825 [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER (21) and his sister Ann VOLLER (12); to Titchfield in Hampshire From earlier research I think William VOLLER may have married Anne WARNER the daughter of Robert WARNER of Durley and had children William 1843, George 1844 and Ann 1847 at Camberwell Surrey south of the Thames in London. IGI Individual Record Abraham VOLLER Christening: 30 SEP 1804 Widley, Hampshire, England Father: John VOLLER Mother: Eliz. C062161 1738 - 1812 FHL Film 0918878, also film 0883873 Parish register printouts of Widley, Hampshire, England ; christenings, 1738-1876 https://www.findmypast.com.au/transcript?id=GBPRS/B/800200889/1 Hampshire baptisms Baptised 19 Apr 1788 at Durley parish Robt WARNER son of John & Ann WARNER http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=warner+titchfield Reference: PROB 11/1512/225 Description: Will of Robert WARNER, Landsman on board His Majesty's Ship LION, No. on ships books 495 of Titchfield, Hampshire Date: 14 June 1810 Held by: The National Archives, Kew Legal status: Public Record(s) Closure status: Open Document, Open Description https://www.findmypast.com.au/transcript?id=GBPRS/B/800401352/1 Hampshire baptisms William VOLLER baptised 15 Sep 1811 at Titchfield to John & Elizabeth VOLLER https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea Date: 29 Nov 1825 Repository: East Sussex Record Office ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 Level: Item Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. 01 Aug 1827 Marriage @ Ore, Sussex, England : Abraham VOLLER = Elizabeth JONES Elizabeth WARNER bap 07/10/1827 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer Mary Ann WARNER bap 05/12/1830 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer Jane WARNER bap 02/10/1834 @ Ore, to Abraham & Elizabeth WARNER, Abraham a labourer Robert WARNER (William's father-in-law) was a widower in 1851, so one of these might be the death of his wife. The 1841 census might tell us if one or the other could be his wife. FreeBMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ Deaths 3rd Q 1838, WARNER Eliza, Camberwell 4, 123 Deaths 2nd Q 1849, WARNER Mary, Camberwell 4, 33 http://www.a2a.org.uk/ East Sussex Record Office PARISH OF HASTINGS ST CLEMENT Catalogue Ref. PAR367 , Former Catalogue Ref. PAR367 Creator(s): Church of England, Hastings St Clement Parish, East Sussex Overseers of the Poor: settlement - ref. PAR367/32 Removal orders to Hastings St Clement FILE - Removal order to Hastings St Clement and settlement examination - ref.PAR367/32/3/230 - date: 20 Dec 1838 [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER (34), wife Elizabeth, and his children Elizabeth (11), Mary Ann (8) and Jane (3); from Hastings All Saints; fifteen years ago he agreed with William HICKES of Burdett Place, Hastings St Clement, to serve him as a driver to a fly and general servant; left due to ill health and lived with friends at Winchelsea for fifteen months and then went to sea; 11 years ago he was married at Ore to Elizabeth and they have three children FILE - Removal order to Hastings St Clement - ref. PAR367/32/3/231 - date: 20 Dec 1838 [from Scope and Content] Abraham VOLLER, wife Elizabeth, and his children Elizabeth (11), Mary Ann (8) and Jane (3); from Hastings All Saints Ancestry.com. England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892 [database on-line]. Class: HO 27; Piece: 59; Page: 258 County of Sussex. Register of all Persons charged with Indictable Offences at the assizes and sessions held within the County during the Year 1839. Name of Offender: Abraham VOLLER Degree of Instruction: No. Imp? Jmp? Age: 35 At what Sessions Tried or Discharged without Trial: Hastings Boro' Sessions 25th October Offences of which those tried were convicted or Acquitted-and of which those discharged without Trial were charged on Indictment or Committment: Larceny. Sentences- Imprisonment: 2 months. 04 Nov 1839, Sussex Advertiser, col.6, p.2. Abraham VOLLER, labourer, aged 35, was indicted for stealing at Hastings, a quilt, part of a testament, some tea cups and saucers, a piece of writing paper, and sundry articles, the property of George GATES. Harriet GATES, the prosecutor's wife, deposed that she resided with the husband for some weeks in prisoner's house in Bourne-street; that in March last, they left, her husband having obtained work on the Dover railroad, and being unable to take their chest, containing, among others, the articles in question, the prisoner VOLLER offered to keep them until witness could pay the carriage, and send a letter to inform him where they should be sent to ; that letters were sent, but no answer received - upon which witness came to Hastings, and found the prisoner and his wife residing in a cottage on Fairlight-down, in which she saw various articles which had been securely left locked up in the chest, appropriated to the prisoner's use. In answer to the court, witness denied owing prisoner any money for rent or otherwise. Among the articles found in prisoner's house was the piece of writing paper, which was a certificate from Sir David DAVIES, stating that the witness had acted as nurse in the Queen Dowager's household, during the winter of 1836 and 1837, perfectly to his satisfaction, and recommending her to any one in want of a sober, honest, and good nurse. The court expressed their pleasure at finding witness in possession of such a valuable testimony, and that it had been read aloud. The evidence of George GATES was to the same effect. - William REEVES, broker, deposed to having purchased a box or chest of prisoner, in March or thereabouts, similar to the one minutely described by the previous witnesses.-John CAMPBELL, Inspector of Police, stated that he accompanied Harriet GATES to the prisoner’s house, and found there the articles identified by her as her property.-Prisoner, in his defence, said that Gates owed him, when he left for Dover, 10s for rent, and 5s money he had lent him, and as they did not send and pay it, he sold the chest to Mr REEVES.-Gates and his wife being recalled, distinctly denied having owed rent to, or borrowed money from prisoner..-The learned recorder, in summing up the case, observed that if the jury credited the statements of Gates and his wife, they would find the prisoner guilty of felony; but if they believed the prisoner’s statement, the prosecutor owed him money, and appropriated the chest and contents to himself by way of payment, although the act was a highly improper one, it was nevertheless not a felonious undertaking, as the chest came into prisoner’s possession otherwise.-My WINGFIELD, foreman of the jury, asked how long she and her husband had resided in the prisoner’s house, and being informed eight weeks, at 1s per week, the jury unanimously returned a verdict of guilty.;;Mr M. VIDLER, speaking as to the character of the prisoner, said he had known him for 3 years, by his being frequently in his employ, and believed him to be am honest, steady, and industrious man. In answer to a question from the court, inspector CAMPBELL said he never knew anything previously wrong in the prisoner’s conduct.-Mr Jonathan REID stated that VOLLER had been in his employ five months; he had thirty-five labourers at work, and knew VOLLER to be a particularly honest, sober, upright man; would take him into his employ immediately, and trust anything in his hands.-The recorder, in passing sentence, expressed himself perfectly satisfied with the verdict of the jury. They could not suppose GATES and his wife, if they owed the prisoner the money he spoke of, would come over from Dover, and commit acts of the basest perjury; and the character given Mrs GATES in the certificate which had been accidentally read in court, assured them that she could not be guilty of such perjury. Prisoner, he regretted to say, had brought himself into a distressing situation; he had been guilty of a double crime, that of a breach of friendly confidence, as well as of felonious taking, and if it had not been for the character which had been given of him, that he was a very sober, steady, industrious man, he should have inflicted the severest punishment on him. In consequence, however, of the good character he had hitherto borne, and believing it to be prisoner’s first offence, he should inflict a very light punishment-the sentence of the court being that he should be confined in the Lewes house of correction to hard labour, for two months. 06 Jun 1841 Census of England & Wales @ ??? White School, Guestling Rd, Ore, Sussex Abraham WELLER 35 Ag Lab Y Betsy WELLER 30 Y Betsy WELLER 13 Y Jane WELLER 06 Y State Library of Victoria Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 and in CO208, Reel 2569 Piece 275 which is the Index to 272 and 273. TWEATH? ____?, 275 URE Thomas, 553[353?]-420 VOLLER Abraham 445 Archives NZ - REPRO 6, Nelson papers NZC 234/2. Also, State Library of Victoria Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 and in CO208, Reel 2569 Piece 275 which is the Index to 272 and 273. Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage to New Zealand [See Refgulations for the Selection of Emigrant Labourers] 32 Mar 1842 Application made to M.GILLINGHAM 5379 EARLE Richard & Filly, 32 & 30 yrs, brickmaker, residence Oare near Hastinmgs, 2 sons age 12, 10 and 1 daughter age 3. 5380 WARNER Rich'd & Eliza, both 23 yrs, quarryman & blacksmith, residence Oare, near Hastings, one son aged 1 year, embarkation #2443. 5381 VOLLER, Abraham & Eliz'th, 32 & 31 yrs, Ag. Lab'r & Bricklayer & Quarryman, 3 daughters age 13, 12, 7. Embarkation #2563. State Library of Victoria Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 1st April [1942] 1093 & 1094 Abraham VOLLER 5381 Note of approval James PRINGLE 4649 Note of approval State Library of Victoria Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 5th [May 1842] Abraham VOLLER, Oare near Hastings The "Thomas Harrison" is now quite full. I regret therefore that it will not be possible for you to share a passage with R. WARNER. H. F. ALSTON, Sup't of Em'n. State Library of Victoria Register of Emigrant Labourers applying for Free Passage; Reel 1480, Piece 272, 273 7th July 1842 Abraham VOLLER, Oare near Hastings, Sussex No. 5381. Usual circular - 2nd ____? 22nd July. H. F. ALSTON, Sup't of Emig'n. If Thos HIDE could be ready by the 22nd he could be in the same ship with you. Abraham [31] & Elizabeth VOLLER [32] and their 3 daughters Elizabeth [13], Mary Ann [11] and Jane [7] left Gravesend on 27 July 1842 on the THOMAS SPARKS. They came from a brickmaking community called Ore near Hastings England. On the ship Abraham worked as cook and Elizabeth as a nurse. Neither could write. Shirley TURKINGTON heard from a researcher in England that the VOLLERs are mentioned in correspondence held at the PRO at Kew, being between the Poor Law Commissioners and the Hastings Board of Guardians. Abraham, Elizabeth,Mary Ann and Jane are mentioned, the latter two being between 7 and 14 years old, and the subject was the family's assisted emigration, embarking 25 July 1842. Possibly these papers will be in the National Archives at Kew catalogued in the MH12 series of of the Health Dept section under Local Government Board and predecessors: Correspondence with Poor Law Unions and Other Local Authorities1833-1909. It appears that one may have to go to Kew to ascertain the details as the VOLLERs are not indexed by name on the National Archives website catalogue. Copy of a receipt issued to Abraham VOLLER by Captain WAKEFIELD. Original held at National Archives, papers NZC 234/2 Immigration Office, Nelson, March 3rd 1843. I hereby certify that Abraham VOLLER and George MILLER cook and cooks mate on board the "Thomas Sparks" have to the best of my knowledge and judgement faithfully discharged the dutie of their office and are thereby entitled in terms of their appointment to receive in remuneration the sum of six pounds one and eight pence. Abraham signed with an "x". Also noted was Mrs VOLLER appointed the female hospital mate during one month for which she is entitled to receive 10 shillings. FreeBMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ Marriages 1st Quarter 1843 VOLLER William, Camberwell 4, 33 WARNER Ann, Camberwell 4, 33 London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1932 https://search.ancestry.com/search/db.aspx?dbid=1623 1843 Marriage solemnized at the District Parish Church in the Parish of St Mary Magdalene in the County of Surrey. Married 03 Jan 1843 William VOLLER, Full Age, Bachelor, Brickmaker, residence Peckham, father John VOLLER, labourer. Ann WARNER, Full Age, Spinster, Peckham, father Robert WARNER, Stoker. Married in the District Church according to the Rites and Ceremonies of the Established Church, after Banns by me, Jas Sydney DARVELL. This Marriage was solemnized between us, William VOLLER (X) Ann WARNER (X) In the Presence of us, Joseph NICHOLLS Ann MANSELL The marriage might have been somewhat rushed... FreeBMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ Births 1st Q 1843, VOLLER William, Camberwell 4, 61 Births 3rd Q 1844, VOLLER George, Camberwell 4, 52 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NLYK-MM4 IGI - Familysearch England Births and Christenings 1538-1975 Name: William VOLLER Gender: Male Christening Date: 25 Jun 1843 Christening Place: SAINT GILES, CAMBERWELL,LONDON,ENGLAND Birth Date: 25 Jan 1843 Father's Name: William VOLLER Mother's Name: Ann Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00626-1 System Origin: England-ODM GS Film number: 0254571-0254577 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JWWH-978 IGI - Familysearch England Births and Christenings 1538-1975 Name: George VOLLER Gender: Male Christening Date: 15 Sep 1844 Christening Place: SAINT GILES,CAMBERWELL,LONDON,ENGLAND Birth Date: 20 Jun 1844 Father's Name: William VOLLER Mother's Name: Ann Indexing Project (Batch) Number: P00626-1 , System Origin: England-ODM , GS Film number: 0254571-0254577 1847 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Boulcott St) not on Nelson Jury list. 1848/49 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Lambton Quay) not on Nelson Jury list. 1850 Abraham VOLLER on Jury list for Wellington (Willis St). 1851 Abraham VOLLER on Jury List for Nelson and not the Wellington one. 1852 Abraham VOLLER on Nelson Jury List 1858 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 1868 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 1871 Abraham VOLLER on electoral roll for Nelson (Haven Road) Householder Sect. 37 30 Mar 1851 Census of England & Wales @ City of London Gasworks, St Bride's, Londn, Middlesex William VOLLER Marr Servt 37 Stoker b. Bishopwalton, Hants + many others at the gasworks 30 Mar 1851 Census of England & Wales @1 Canal Place, New Church Road, Camberwell, London, England Ann VOLLER Wife Marr 37 Husband employed at Gasworks b. Gosport, Hants William VOLLER Son 08 b. Camberwell, Surrey George VOLLER Son 06 b. Camberwell, Surrey / Robert WARNER Father Widower 63 General Laborer b. Derley, Hants / John BENNETT Lodger Unm 30 General Laborer b. Maidstone, Kent Possible death: FreeBMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ Deaths 4th Quarter 1855, WARNER Robert, Camberwell 1d, 298 Is this William's death? FreeBMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ Deaths 1Q 1870, William VOLLER, 59, Camberwell 1d, 493 02 Apr 1871 Census of England & Wales @1 Canal Place, Camberwell, London, England Ann VOLLER Head Widow 50 b. Gosport, Hants Wm VOLLER Son Unm 28 Lab b. Camberwell, Surrey Geo VOLLER Son Unm 26 b. Camberwell, Surrey Rosa ELLIS Visitor Unm 28 Dom Serv b. Maidstone, Kent Is this William junior? Is this William? 03 Apr 1881 Census of England & Wales Droxford Union Workhouse, Droxford, Hampshire William VOLLER Inmate Unm 38 Labourer b. Exton, Hampshire et. al. http://www.workhouses.org.uk/Droxford/ Newspaper report - Nelson Evening Mail - 28 Dec 1875 : "Inquest report on the body of Abraham, alias Jerry VOLLER, who was found dead lying in the mud at the back of the Custom House Hotel early this morning. Verdict - found drowned. Funeral to leave from the residence of Mr MILLER, Waimea Rd" Nelson Mail - 30 December 1875 - An inquest was held at the Port this afternoon after the body of Abraham VOLLER known as Jerry VOLLER, who was found lying dead in the mud at the back of the Custom House Hotel early this morning. He had been employed at odd jobs at the Hotel yesterday and was last seen early in the evening in a state of intoxication, and it is supposed that he must have fallen over from the landing at high tide into deep water as he relieved himself as his fly was undone when he was pulled from the water. A verdict of "Found Drowned" was returned. [The coroners report is held at National Archives] Papers Past http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ Marlborough Express, Volume XI, Issue 776, 1 January 1876, Page 6 An inquest was held at the Port on Tuesday afternoon, touching the death of Abraham VOLLER, a very old settler, whose body was found on the beach early that morning. The deceased, who was generally known as Jerry VOLLER, was last seen on the previous evening, and it is generally supposed that whilst in a state of intoxication he must have fallen into the tideway near the Custom House Hotel. A verdict was returned that he was found drowned. — Colonist 30th. http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/8942292 The Mercury (Hobart, Tas. : 1860 - 1954), Monday 10 January 1876, Page 3. One of the oldest of the Nelson settlers, a man named Abraham VOLLER, was recently drowned. He arrived in the colony by the Thomas Parkes [sic - s/be Thomas Sparks] in 1842, and, except for a few months when he assisted to establish the first settlement of Wellington, VOLLER has resided in Nelson. He was one of the survivors of the historical Wairau massacre, and was one of the crew that helped Captain CARKEEK to sail a craft of 32 tons burden from England to Adelaide in the early days. http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&d=EP18781130.2.23 Evening Post, Volume XVI, Issue 284, 30 November 1878, Page 3 THE LATE MR. STEPHEN CARKEEK. Ancestry.com. New Zealand, Cemetery Records, 1800-2007 Wakapuaka Cemetery, p.294 3837. Anglican Block 4 - Plot 34 Burial Records: VOLLER, Abraham - 29 Dec 1875, 75 yrs Elizabeth - 2 Feb 1873, 70 yrs No headstone. HAWKINS, Frances Eleanor - 3 Oct 1870, 4 mths. Abraham VOLLER's nickname name was Jerry. http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ Marlborough Express, Volume XXI, Issue 86, 18 April 1885, Page 2 LOCAL AND GENERAL NEWS. A Reminiscence. - A correspondent of the Colonist writes : - ln 1855, the good people of Nelson were in a high state of excitement regarding the war that was then raging between England and Russia, and every day we were expecting to receive a visit from a Russian warship. One fine morning the flagstaff at the signal station was covered with flags, which threw the Nelsonians into a great state of excitement, for they could not imagine what the display of bunting meant. On Pilot CROSS proceeding to the signal station, he found poor old Jerry VOLLER in a high state of excitement, which had been greatly increased by the strength of the famous Nelson brewed malt liquors. On inquiring what was up, Jerry replied - " It's all up with us, the Russians have come." Shortly after the Provincial Council met, and as often customary in those days, they were seized with a fit of retrenchment, but the only saving effected was to take sixpence a day off Jerry's salary. I do not know whether his method of announcing the supposed visit of the Russians had anything to do with making the Councillors dock poor Jerry's screw. However, he was the only victim on that occasion. - Old Resident. > On 13 September 2019 at 16:56 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > Was Richard WARNER's father Joseph really Joseph RONALDS ?????????? And were he and Abraham VOLLER half brothers ???????????? > > For those of you researching Richard & Eliza WARNER ne WRIGHT who emigrated from Ore Sussex to Nelson NZ, here's an absolute beauty that could crack the WARNER brick wall wide open for us. If it means what I think it might mean, I'm stunned! > > A bit of preamble to set the scene... > > Some will know from my ramblings that Richard WARNER and his people were also known as VOLLER. He had some kind of relationship with Abraham VOLLER, either a very close friendship or they were related. Abraham was told by the NZ Company in a letter that it wasn't possible for him to accompany R. WARNER to NZ on the same ship. Abraham also came out to Nelson New Zealand from Ore in 1842 and it appears that his daughter Mary Ann raised Richard & Eliza WARNER's son Abraham WARNER after the early death at Nelson NZ of Eliza in 1865. > > Abraham VOLLER had the nickname Jerry in NZ. We know he was baptised to John & Elizabeth VOLLER who married as John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER at Durley Hampshir ein 1803. When Abraham's daughters were baptised at Ore he was called WARNER. > > Richard WARNER's brother Robert, who was turned down for a passage to NZ because he was single, was most often known as VOLLER although he does appear in some records as WARNER especially in some censuses. All his children were registered born as VOLLER but the occasional one married as WARNER. His wife Sarah Ann has to be Sarah Ann VOLLER who was the informant at the death on the death registration of Richard WARNER's mother Elizabeth at Ore in 1851 not long after her husband Joseph WARNER died in the workhouse at Ore. Both died after the census but we can't find them in it. > > When William WRIGHT stole his sister Eliza WRIGHT's silver watch at Ore and some trousers at Brighton and was transported to Van Dieman's Land his crime and trial were reported in the Sussex Advertiser, with the owner of the watch given as Richard VOLLER rather than Richard WARNER. Technically, upon marriage with Eliza WRIGHT, Richard became the legal owner of the watch. In Tasmania convict records it is stated by William that he "stole my sister's watch", a list of family back home he gave matches that of his parents, and we've recently heard from William's descendant David that he DNA matches with multiple WRIGHT descendants, including my eldest sister, as a 4th cousin. So Richard VOLLER is Richard WARNER all right. > > Recall that Richard WARNER was baptised at Hastings in 1819 and Robert WARNER his brother was baptised at Hastings in 1822. > > Now....drum roll....read on..... > > https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 > Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea > Date: 29 Nov 1825 > Repository: East Sussex Record Office > ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 > Level: Item > Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. > > So, are Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER, the parents of Richard & Robert, actually Joseph RONALDS & Elizabeth VOLLER nee WARNER going by the name of WARNER? If so, then Abraham VOLLER and Richard WARNER were half brothers, which would explain a heck of a lot! > > Peter

Was Richard WARNER's father Joseph really Joseph RONALDS ?????????? And were he and Abraham VOLLER half brothers ???????????? For those of you researching Richard & Eliza WARNER ne WRIGHT who emigrated from Ore Sussex to Nelson NZ, here's an absolute beauty that could crack the WARNER brick wall wide open for us. If it means what I think it might mean, I'm stunned! A bit of preamble to set the scene... Some will know from my ramblings that Richard WARNER and his people were also known as VOLLER. He had some kind of relationship with Abraham VOLLER, either a very close friendship or they were related. Abraham was told by the NZ Company in a letter that it wasn't possible for him to accompany R. WARNER to NZ on the same ship. Abraham also came out to Nelson New Zealand from Ore in 1842 and it appears that his daughter Mary Ann raised Richard & Eliza WARNER's son Abraham WARNER after the early death at Nelson NZ of Eliza in 1865. Abraham VOLLER had the nickname Jerry in NZ. We know he was baptised to John & Elizabeth VOLLER who married as John VOLLER & Elizabeth WARNER at Durley Hampshir ein 1803. When Abraham's daughters were baptised at Ore he was called WARNER. Richard WARNER's brother Robert, who was turned down for a passage to NZ because he was single, was most often known as VOLLER although he does appear in some records as WARNER especially in some censuses. All his children were registered born as VOLLER but the occasional one married as WARNER. His wife Sarah Ann has to be Sarah Ann VOLLER who was the informant at the death on the death registration of Richard WARNER's mother Elizabeth at Ore in 1851 not long after her husband Joseph WARNER died in the workhouse at Ore. Both died after the census but we can't find them in it. When William WRIGHT stole his sister Eliza WRIGHT's silver watch at Ore and some trousers at Brighton and was transported to Van Dieman's Land his crime and trial were reported in the Sussex Advertiser, with the owner of the watch given as Richard VOLLER rather than Richard WARNER. Technically, upon marriage with Eliza WRIGHT, Richard became the legal owner of the watch. In Tasmania convict records it is stated by William that he "stole my sister's watch", a list of family back home he gave matches that of his parents, and we've recently heard from William's descendant David that he DNA matches with multiple WRIGHT descendants, including my eldest sister, as a 4th cousin. So Richard VOLLER is Richard WARNER all right. Recall that Richard WARNER was baptised at Hastings in 1819 and Robert WARNER his brother was baptised at Hastings in 1822. Now....drum roll....read on..... https://www.thekeep.info/collections/getrecord/GB179_AMS2277_2330_25 Title: Settlement examination taken at Winchelsea Date: 29 Nov 1825 Repository: East Sussex Record Office ESRO reference: AMS 2330/25 Level: Item Description: Elizabeth Ronalds: aged 47, born as Elizabeth Warner at Durley, Hampshire, hired by Mr Cousens of Bishops Waltham, Hampshire, then by John Cousins of Exton, Hampshire, about 22 years ago married John Voller of Titchfield at Durley, after several years he absconded, she was in Titchfield poorhouse, they had children Abraham (21 years), William (13 years) and Ann (12 years), co-habited with Joseph Ronalds and they have two illegitimate sons, Richard (5 years) born at the house of Tutt Hicks in Hastings, and Robert (3 years) born at Mr Bevill's huts in Hastings, she and Joseph were married in Jul 1822 at St Mary in the Marsh, Kent. So, are Joseph & Elizabeth WARNER, the parents of Richard & Robert, actually Joseph RONALDS & Elizabeth VOLLER nee WARNER going by the name of WARNER? If so, then Abraham VOLLER and Richard WARNER were half brothers, which would explain a heck of a lot! Peter

CHE - E On Friday, 13 September 2019, 09:43:35 GMT+12, Sue & Evan Thomas <sueandevanthomas@gmail.com> wrote: Looks like (GHEIE) > On 12/09/2019, at 1:21 AM, Olwyn Whitehouse <olwynbw@gmail.com> wrote: > > ARTHUR > (_HE_E) maybe a nickname. What does it mean? > Headstone Timaru Cemetery. > <WARE_ Timaru.jpg> > Does anyone have any information on A.A. Ware, photographer, Timaru? > https://sites.rootsweb.com/~nzlscant/#photo > Thanks. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The List Guidelines > > http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community _______________________________________________ The List Guidelines http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Or (CHELE) - I would guess a nick name > On 12/09/2019, at 1:21 AM, Olwyn Whitehouse <olwynbw@gmail.com> wrote: > > ARTHUR > (_HE_E) maybe a nickname. What does it mean? > Headstone Timaru Cemetery. > <WARE_ Timaru.jpg> > Does anyone have any information on A.A. Ware, photographer, Timaru? > https://sites.rootsweb.com/~nzlscant/#photo > Thanks. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The List Guidelines > > http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Looks like (GHEIE) > On 12/09/2019, at 1:21 AM, Olwyn Whitehouse <olwynbw@gmail.com> wrote: > > ARTHUR > (_HE_E) maybe a nickname. What does it mean? > Headstone Timaru Cemetery. > <WARE_ Timaru.jpg> > Does anyone have any information on A.A. Ware, photographer, Timaru? > https://sites.rootsweb.com/~nzlscant/#photo > Thanks. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The List Guidelines > > http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Mōrena Does anyone know of any family of Eileen & Rob RUSBATCH (sp?) who I believe lived in the Maniototo c the late 1920s. I am going through photos of my Hanrahan family and know the two families were friends and would like to return the snaps of Eileen & Rob to any family. There is one pic of Eileen with a baby, perhaps Florence, but unsure if Florence is Eileen’s baby or not. Many thanks Elizabeth O’Connell (copied to the NZSG list)

Seen on Trove, the Australian equivalent of Papers Past : https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/89772535 Leader (Melbourne), Saturday 23 December 1916, Page 48 Family Notices DEATHS. On Active Service. ROSS.—Killed in action somewhere in France on 24th November, Lance-Corporal Ronald Ross, the much loved third son of Mr. and Mrs. R. K. Ross, Richmond Plains, Wedderburn, brother of Trooper Thomas (New Zealand Mounted Rifles), Driver Daniel (A.I.F.), Roy and Elsie, aged 22 years. Late of the Commercial Bank, Nagambie. One of our Gallipoli Heroes. He paid the price, and gave his all. Hope this helps someone some day Graham Hoult Kirwee, Canterbury.

ARTHUR (_HE_E) maybe a nickname. What does it mean? Headstone Timaru Cemetery. [image: WARE_ Timaru.jpg] Does anyone have any information on A.A. Ware, photographer, Timaru? https://sites.rootsweb.com/~nzlscant/#photo Thanks.

Hi Peter I was wondering if you have the time could you please look up and see if there is anything mentioned for the surname OAK. I am just curious, there may be nothing mentioned, and I do not know if they could have been in the area at the time. Possibly around the Hastings area I expect so possibly nothing to find. Many thanks. Judy Berntsen On Wed, Sep 11, 2019 at 5:54 PM Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > I've started looking through FHL Film 4427697 and discovered that I've > mucked up the third item's date range. > > Instead of this > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > FHL Film 4427697 > > > > > > > > G5/14/13 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1851-1854 > > > > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DR7Q-Q2C?i=2&cat=693328 > > > > > > > > G5/14/14 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1854-1857 > > > > G5/14/15 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1849-1851 > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > I should have written this > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > FHL Film 4427697 > G5/14/13 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1851-1854 > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DR7Q-Q2C?i=2&cat=693328 > > G5/14/14 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1854-1857 > G5/14/15 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1857-1859 > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > Peter > > _______________________________________________ > > The List Guidelines > > http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe > https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community >

I've started looking through FHL Film 4427697 and discovered that I've mucked up the third item's date range. Instead of this -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > FHL Film 4427697 > > > > > > G5/14/13 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1851-1854 > > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DR7Q-Q2C?i=2&cat=693328 > > > > > > G5/14/14 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1854-1857 > > > G5/14/15 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1849-1851 -------------------------------------------------------------- I should have written this -------------------------------------------------------------- FHL Film 4427697 G5/14/13 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1851-1854 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DR7Q-Q2C?i=2&cat=693328 G5/14/14 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1854-1857 G5/14/15 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1857-1859 -------------------------------------------------------------- Peter

Apologies for the typo Web address for speakers notes is: www.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/2019AFHExpo -----Original Message----- From: Seonaid Lewis [mailto:Seonaid.Lewis@aucklandcouncil.govt.nz] Sent: Wednesday, 11 September 2019 2:53 p.m. To: new-zealand@rootsweb.com Subject: [nz][EXTERNAL] Expo speakers notes now online Greetings Just to say that the notes are now up on the Auckland Libraries’ website. If the notes you wanted, aren’t there, this is because the speaker has not provided them to us. Apologies for the delay, but we were waiting for some of them to be sent. www.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/2019AFHExpo Ngā mihi | Kind regards - Seonaid Seonaid (Shona) Lewis RLIANZA BA ILS DipRIM | Senior research librarian, family history (Mon-Fri) Te Kohinga Rangahau mō Tāmaki Makaurau | Research Central Tāmaki Pātaka Kōrero - Central City Library Ngā Pātaka Kōrero o Tāmaki Makaurau - Auckland Libraries Phone 09 890 2411 | Extn (46) 2411 Auckland Council, 44-46 Lorne Street, Auckland Twitter: @Kintalk Facebook: Auckland Research Centre<https://www.facebook.com/AkldResearchCentre/?ref=settings> Come along to our FREE lunchtime HeritageTalks<https://www.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/pages/search-results.aspx?k=HeritageTalks> fortnightly on Wednesdays between February and November Subscribe to Central Library’s events newsletters by emailing centrallibraryevents@aucklandcouncil.govt.nz<mailto:centrallibraryevents@aucklandcouncil.govt.nz> Kura Heritage Collections Online is now live! Kura provides easy and free access to our world-renowned heritage collections. Explore Kura now: https://kura.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/<https://kura.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/?fbclid=IwAR02DuyNwn3XSVAwKlfaSUsG3NbreuWfVNB94AXGGUobgf-7r5W6z52_kh8> CAUTION: This email message and any attachments contain information that may be confidential and may be LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this message or attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email message in error please notify us immediately and erase all copies of the message and attachments. We do not accept responsibility for any viruses or similar carried with our email, or any effects our email may have on the recipient computer system or network. Any views expressed in this email may be those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of Council. _______________________________________________ The List Guidelines http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Greetings Just to say that the notes are now up on the Auckland Libraries’ website. If the notes you wanted, aren’t there, this is because the speaker has not provided them to us. Apologies for the delay, but we were waiting for some of them to be sent. www.aucklandlibraries.govr.nz/2019AFHExpo<http://www.aucklandlibraries.govr.nz/2019AFHExpo> Ngā mihi | Kind regards - Seonaid Seonaid (Shona) Lewis RLIANZA BA ILS DipRIM | Senior research librarian, family history (Mon-Fri) Te Kohinga Rangahau mō Tāmaki Makaurau | Research Central Tāmaki Pātaka Kōrero - Central City Library Ngā Pātaka Kōrero o Tāmaki Makaurau - Auckland Libraries Phone 09 890 2411 | Extn (46) 2411 Auckland Council, 44-46 Lorne Street, Auckland Twitter: @Kintalk Facebook: Auckland Research Centre<https://www.facebook.com/AkldResearchCentre/?ref=settings> Come along to our FREE lunchtime HeritageTalks<https://www.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/pages/search-results.aspx?k=HeritageTalks> fortnightly on Wednesdays between February and November Subscribe to Central Library’s events newsletters by emailing centrallibraryevents@aucklandcouncil.govt.nz<mailto:centrallibraryevents@aucklandcouncil.govt.nz> Kura Heritage Collections Online is now live! Kura provides easy and free access to our world-renowned heritage collections. Explore Kura now: https://kura.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/<https://kura.aucklandlibraries.govt.nz/?fbclid=IwAR02DuyNwn3XSVAwKlfaSUsG3NbreuWfVNB94AXGGUobgf-7r5W6z52_kh8> CAUTION: This email message and any attachments contain information that may be confidential and may be LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, disclosure or copying of this message or attachments is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email message in error please notify us immediately and erase all copies of the message and attachments. We do not accept responsibility for any viruses or similar carried with our email, or any effects our email may have on the recipient computer system or network. Any views expressed in this email may be those of the individual sender and may not necessarily reflect the views of Council.

oops I should have pointed out that the time in the house 9 weeks and 6 days I think applies to time spent in the workhouse in the current quarter which I think began 25th March? (which was formerly the first day of the year until it was moved to 1st Jan). 26 Dec I think was the start of another quarter. > On 11 September 2019 at 10:22 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > I meant to add the internet address to Elizabeth WRIGHT's death in the workhouse register but forgot. > > > FHL Film 4427696 > East Sussex Record Office > Hailsham Union Workhouse Admission and Discharge Registers > // > Image 423 > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6824-X1W?i=422&cat=693328 > G5/14/3 1835-1836 item 7 > // > Images 426 + 427 > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6824-NXC?i=425&cat=693328 > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6824-XYF?i=426&cat=693328 > Admitted 26 Dec 1835 > Elizabeth WHRITE, female, age 87, number 2, Church [of England], admitted by order of the Board (of Guardians), settlement Hailsham. > Discharged 1 Jun 1836 > Elizabeth WRIGHT, time in the house 9 weeks and 6 days, discharged due to death. > > > At the top of the admissions page is Hailsham, which I think means the old workhouse in Hailsham town. Subsequent pages have lists for other workhouses. I am not 100% on this, judge for yourself. > > > 04 Jun 1836 Burial @ Hailsham parish > Elizabeth WRIGHT, 87, abode Hailsham. Officiating Minister was R. WELCH > [ Hailsham OPR - Burials 1813-1877, East Sussex CRO, sighted 1988 ] > > Peter > > > > On 11 September 2019 at 10:03 Peter Dillon <peter_dillon@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > > > > Some new info regarding workhouses for those of you on the list descending from Eliza WRIGHT, the wife of Richard WARNER, who born 1820 and baptised 1828 at Hailsham Sussex to James & Elizabeth WRIGHT. Eliza & Richard emigrated to New Zealand from Sussex to Nelson in 1842 on the ship Olympus. James WRIGHT was baptised 1788 at Hailsham, the son of Edward WRIGHT & Elizabeth WRIGHT who were travellers. Edward was baptised 1753 at Hailsham to Adam & Jane WRIGHT who were also travellers > > > > When one looks at Hailsham OPR prior to 1812 in the period of interest, it is only Edward & Elizabeth WRIGHT and their descendants appearing in Hailsham registers. Scans of transcripts of Hailsham OPR up to 1812 can be viewed online at Familysearch but we can't do it from home, we have to visit an LDS FHC. The same applies to most East Sussex parishes but for some reason we can view Salehurst OPR online from home. > > > > Unless there is a better candidate to be his wife (there isn't), then Edward WRIGHT baptised 1753 at Hailsham married Elizabeth WOOD at Salehurst in 1773 with their first child to be baptised being Edward in 1775 at Waldron. > > > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-D4K9-LF6?i=707 > > > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-D4K9-LBW?i=655 > > > > It isn't possible (but many at Ancestry have it having blindly copied each other) for Edward baptised 1753 at Hailsham in Eadst Sussex to have married Elizabeth SWAN just 14 years later in 1767 at Farnham in Surrey, unless he was born many years before he was baptised (is possible with travellers), but it is way harder to believe that Elizabeth SWAN's husband Edward, who was buried age 83 at Farnham and therefore born about 1741, can be Edward baptised 12 years later at Hailsham in 1753. Elizabeth SWAN was buried at Farnham age 82 making her also born about 1741 which seems sensible. The Farnham couple had several children baptised at Farnham and are not the same as the couple Edward & Elizabeth who had children baptised in various parishes in East Sussex especially at Hailsham. At one stage the East Sussex couple had their son Edward WRIGHT baptised at Waldron in East Sussex just 13 days apart from the son John Parker WRIGHT baptised to the Farnham couple at Farnham in Surrey. Another set of baptisms to both was about three months apart, and so on. Questions to ask are, > > 1. If the East Sussex children are credited to Elizabeth SWAN of Farnham, then who had the children baptised at Farnham? > > 2. If the East Sussex children are credited to Elizabeth SWAN of Farnham, then what about Elizabeth SWAN who married Edward at Salehurst? Where were HER children baptised, especially given that the ones we have baptised in East Sussex are the only ones available in the SOG database of East Sussex baptisms up to 1812? > > The simple answer is that the Farnham children belong to Elizabeth SWAN and the East Sussex children belong to Elizabeth WOOD (there isn't another East Sussex marriage available for an Edward WRIGHT marrying an Elizabeth). > > > > In 1820, when Eliza was 3 months old, James and family suffered a removal from the House of Correction at Lewes to Hailsham, having been arrested at Hailsham a week earlier at Hailsham as vagrants living in the open. A settlement examination determined their parish of settlement to be Hailsham. James and family suffered another removal from Ore (by Hastings) to Hailsham in 1837. Under the poor laws a person had an parish of settlement which could be acquired in various ways (being born there was pretty good), and if the person became in need of poor relief and therefore a burden on a parish's poor rates where they were living, a settlement examination would determine the person's parish of settlement which, if it was a different parish, they were removed to via a removal order. A wife acquired her husband's settlement parish status when they married. > > > > I realised recently that the early registers of the Hailsham Union workhouses are online at Family search in the form of scans of register pages on films created by the old East Sussex Record Office. Whoever might want to view them (quite a few on this list) an go to the Familysearch Catalog, do a place search for Hailsham and click on the poorhouse link to find five microfilms containing 18 registers (the items on each film). Be warned that the overlapping dates are really confusing to start with and the list of films at Familysearch isn't given in the order they were made. The East Sussex film numbers at the start of each film are not the same as the FHL digital film numbers online. The order of the films as they were actually made, which reflects the chronology of the workhouses, is as follows: > > > > 4427696 > > 4427321 > > 4426953 > > 4427697 > > 4427570 > > > > The old poor houses in Hailsham parish and surrounding parishes existed from at least the 1700s. The Hailsham Union was created in 1835 after the Poor Law alterations of 1834. The Board of Guardians of the Haolsham Union in 1835 called for tenders to build a new much bigger workhouse at Horsebridge in Hellingly parish by the edge of Hailsham parish, to serve all the parishes in the Hailsham Union, but the old poorhouses of Hailsham and the surrounding parishes which all became part of the Hailsham Union continued to be used for some time even after the big new one was finished. I think for example that the one in Hailsham town (now the offices of the town council?) might have continued as a workhouse until about 1856, not sure. With the new poor laws in operation, the poor now had to be relieved via workhouses, not via older means of relief. The parishes in the Hailsham Union included Arlington, Chiddingly, Hailsham, Heathfield, Hellingly, Hooe, Hurstmonceux, Laughton, Ninfield, Warbleton [Warbelton], Wartling. I'm not sure if that's the exact list but it's about right and gives the idea. People are inclined to read Hooe as Hove but it isn't Hove. > > > > Broadly, the first film 1127696 seems to relate to the old workhouse registers while the other films I think reflect the new workhouse registers. > > > > Plenty of Eliza WRIGHT's people had spells in the workhouses at Hailsham. The places they were listed as from in the admissions and discharges pages reflect their settlement status. The first register filmed actually says 'settlement' in one of the columns and late registers say 'charged to Hailsham' or similar in columns for admission and for discharge (i.e., charged to the settlement parish). As I mentioned, the WRIGHT's appearing in pre 1812 OPR registers are our ones, no one else. > > > > Elizabeth WRIGHT age 87, of Hailsham, buried at Hailsham in 1836 has to be Eliza's grandmother, Elizabeth WOOD, as there is no one else she can be. Telling is the fact that she actually died in the workhouse on 01 Jun 1835 having been there from at least 26 Dec 1835 on the admissions page of the workhouse with her settlement parish given as Hailsham (the first entries in this register, which I think is the workhouse in Hailsham town, were a series of inmates all in the workhouse on that date in the admissions pages which indicates a kind of roll call at the start of a new workhouse quarter). She would have acquired Hailsham as her parish of settlement when she married Edward who was baptised there. When James and family including Eliza were removed to Hailsham in 1820 it was after a settlement examination by Justices of the Peace had determined their parish of settlement to be Hailsham. Not a hard decision seeing as James was baptised at Hailsham, his father Edward was baptised at Hailsham and several of James' siblings were baptised at Hailsham, and there was no way Lewes parish would have wanted a bar of them given their circumstances. > > > > Also in the same register on 26 Dec 1835 are Mary WRIGHT (nee HOLLAND(S))and her daughter Ruth WRIGHT who were in and out of the workhouses constantly after the death of Mary's husband Aaron WRIGHT at Hailsham earlier in 1735. Aaron was a brother to James WRIGHT. Mary had an illegitimate daughter ("bastard") Hariot born in the workhouse who died in the workhouse age 5 months. > > > > Also appearing in workhouse registers constantly are Michael WRIGHT and his family members, Michael being another brother to James WRIGHT. Michael was buried at Hailsham in 1850 having died in the workhouse a few days before. His son Levi died in the workhouse in 1860. Michael had some kind of partial disability. > > > > James and family entered the workhouse at Hailsham on 9 Feb 1841. They discharged themselves of their own accord on 13 Mar 1841 which happens to be the same day that daughter Eliza married Richard WARNER at Ore, which is by Hastings. They were in the 1841 census at Ore on 06 April but returned to the workhouse at Hailsham in November. Unfortunately the register runs out a few days after that and there seems to be a short gap in the registers so that I can't find out when they were discharged. When the family was removed from Ore to Hailsham in 1837, I'm thinking that it would have happened only if they needed poor relief, so that their burden on poor rates would have been borne by Hailsham not ore. I thought I would find them about that time entering a workhouse at Hailsham but I can't can't find such an entry. > > > > It seems to me that during the period when these people were yoyo'ing in and out of the Hailsham Union workhouses, the travelling lifestyle of their forbears Edward and Elizabeth and Adam & Jane had fallen away. The most common reason for being in the workhouse by them was "no work", but infirmity, relations being too poor help, having a child and being an orphan (Ruth became an orphan after her mother Mary died) were some more reasons. > > > > A workhouse wasn't always a bad place to be because they had hospital wings or infirmaries where the poor could seek care when they were ill, injured, really old, on their way out, and so on, especially at places where they were the only places around with anything like hospital type facilities. The workhouse at Sunderland doubled as Sunderlands hospital as well - when someone died at the workhouse address there it didn't necessarily mean they were poor as they could have simply been hospital residents at the time. Many workhouses in fact became the basis of proper hospitals after the workhouse days ended. > > > > Eliza WRIGHT's father-in-law Joseph WARNER died in the Hastings Union workhouse at Ore in 1851 yet he wasn't in the workhouse at the 1851 census not long before. He may well have gone to the hospital wing for hospice type care as he was dying, not because he was poor as such, although of course that was part of it. That workhouse later became part of St Helen's Hospital at Ore which I visited in 1988 to enquire about the workhouse records. The records in the period of interest haven't survived unfortunately. The administration block I enquired at was formerly part of the workhouse. The hospital was demolished a few years ago. > > > > It's pretty sobering going through the workhouse records to realise that these people must have been on the bones of their you know whats, heading into the workhouse whenever work and their resources dried up, which was often. Rather then dipping into the registers it's best to work one's way through them to get a good idea of the setup and how things were. It takes while to absorb some of the ins and outs of how the registers works. > > > > > > This is my overall summary of what's in the workhouse registers. I haven't been through all of them yet.There are hundreds of pages in each register, i.e. hundreds of scan to wade through for each register. This is how we used to do things from home before the interent, by ordering films from Salt Lake City to view at our FHC's. > > > > > > Newspaper: Sussex Advertiser Monday 13 July 1835 > > THE BOARD of GUARDIANS of the POOR the Hailsham Union are desirous receiving Tenders for the Additional New Buildings to the Workhouse Hellingly.—The and Specification the same may seen at the Office of __? Architect ... > > > > > > Hailsham Union Workhouse Registers > > ----------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > Old workhouses operating before the Hailsham Union was formed 1735 [film 4427696] > > > > Arlington > > Chiddingly > > Hailsham > > Heathfield > > Hellingly > > Hooe > > Hurstmonceux > > Laughton > > Ninfield > > Warbleton [Warbelton] > > Wartling > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > FHL Film 4427696 > > > > G5/14/1 Item 5 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1836 > > [Hurstmonceux ] > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6824-XPW?i=121&cat=693328 > > > > G5/14/2 Item 6 Admission and Discharge Registers 1836-1841 > > [Hurstmonceux ] > > > > G5/14/3 Item 7 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1836 > > [a general register with pages for individual workhouses?] > > > > G5/14/4 Item 8 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1843 > > [Hailsham House] > > > > G5/14/5 Item 9 Admission and Discharge Registers 1847-1854 > > [ ??? Hailsham House] > > > > G5/14/6 Item 10 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1836 > > [Warbleton] > > > > G5/14/7 Item 11 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1836 > > [a general register with pages for individual workhouses?] > > > > G5/14/8 Item 12 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1838 > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > > > FHL Film 4427321 > > > > G5/14/8 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1835-1838 > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-DT3Q-TC8?i=2&cat=693328 > > > > G5/14/9 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1838-1840 > > G5/14/10 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1843-1847 [Hellingly] > > [continues on item 1 on FHL film 4427321] > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > > > FHL Film 4426953 > > > > This film actually starts 20 Jun 1847 in the second quarter of 1847 because it is the continuation of G5/14/10 item 3 on FHL Film 4427321. Finishes 23 Sep 1847 ] > > > > G5/14/10 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1843-1847 [Hellingly] > > [sic - should be 2Q 1847-23 Sep 1847) > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-62PS-PXX?i=2&cat=693328 > > > > G5/14/11 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1847-1849 [Hellingly ] > > G5/14/12 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1849-1851 > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > FHL Film 4427697 > > > > G5/14/13 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1851-1854 > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DR7Q-Q2C?i=2&cat=693328 > > > > G5/14/14 Item 2 Admission and Discharge Registers 1854-1857 > > G5/14/15 Item 3 Admission and Discharge Registers 1849-1851 > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > FHL Film 4427570 > > > > G5/14/16 Item 1 Admission and Discharge Registers 1859-1862 > > https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-D1WQ-F9Z?i=2&cat=693328 > > > > G5/16/1 Item 2 Birth Register 1836-1869 > > G5/18/1 Item 3 Death Register 1836-1870 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Peter > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > The List Guidelines > > > > http://new-zealand-l.blogspot.com/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/new-zealand@rootsweb.com > > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community