From: walkerjg@juno.com (James G. Walker) Received: from m25.boston.juno.com (m25.boston.juno.com [207.205.100.65]) by x3.boston.juno.com (8.8.6.Beta0/8.8.6.Beta0/2.0.kim) with ESMTP id BAAAA23079 for <walkerjg@juno.com>; Tue, 26 Aug 1997 01:33:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bl-14.rootsweb.com (bl-14.rootsweb.com [204.212.38.30]) by m25.boston.juno.com (8.8.6.Beta0/8.8.6.Beta0/2.0.kim) with ESMTP id BAAAA00738; Tue, 26 Aug 1997 01:33:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from slist@localhost) by bl-14.rootsweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA29285; Mon, 25 Aug 1997 22:31:44 -0700 (PDT) Return-path: <NEVILLE-L-request@rootsweb.com> Resent-From: NEVILLE-L@rootsweb.com Resent-Date: Mon, 25 Aug 1997 22:31:44 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Sender: NEVILLE-L-request@rootsweb.com Resent-Message-ID: <"L_BEuC.A.dJH.4omA0"@bl-14.rootsweb.com> Reply-To: NEVILLE-L@rootsweb.com J.P. (Jeanne I believe) We must be reading different British histories: "A Genealogical History of the Dormant, Abeyant, Forfieted and Extinct Peerages", published 1883 by Sir Bernard Burke, lists the various holders of Nevill titles and estates: These lists cover all the Barons of Raby and the Earls of Westmorland, the Barons Nevill of Essex, Furnival, Latimer, Fauconberg, Montagu, Northumberland, Salisbury, Warrick, Montacute, and Monthermer. All of thes lines ended up in forfeited titles and estates -- including those of Richard the Kingmaker, Ralf Nevill, and the Nevill Plantagenet lines you referred to. Every one a Nevill, no ending "e"s in the whole lot, according to this source. Another old source, "Account of the Noble Family of NEVILL, Particularly of the House of Abergavenny, with some Account of the Illustrious Family of the Beauchamp and others, through whom it Descended to the Present EARL OF ABERGAVENNY", by Daniel Rowland, Esq. London, 1830, throws in a springling of Nevilles, but still refer to the English Nevills, in aggregate, as The House of Nevill. Richard, the Kingmaker, and his father, the Earl of Salisbury, were both shown as Nevills. I must admit that the later history books tend to treat everybody equally -- adding an "e" to all those fine old House of Nevill names. Boogher must have started it. He called all the Americans, Nevilles, regardless. The other American genealogists seem to have followed suit. Joseph B Neville and SoJund also elected call everybody Neville in his narations, I think because that was how his own family spelled it. However, when setting down the genealogical records of the first four generations, he used the spellings as he found them in the early records. The original immigrant was John Nevill, all of the second generation children were Nevills. In the 3rd generation, there was one Neavill, one Nevil, one Neville, and six Nevills. In the fifth generation, Joseph B. Neville decided to standardize on Neville for all nine children of Joseph Nevill, Sr. However, that is not how my own ancestor, Joseph Nevill, Jr., spelled his name. He did not use the "e" and none of his children did either. Some of Joseph's letters have survived and he signed them "Nevill." When my ancestor Jones Green sued the heirs of Joseph Nevill to clear the title on some property he had bought from the General, the court records show all of Joseph's children as Nevills. Jones Green's wife was Mary Nevill. I do know that General John Neville, Joseph's brother, always used the "e", and so did his children. Still I see constant references to John Neville, the original immigrant, or General Joseph Neville. I don't understand why they do that. To me, it is a clearly a case of the bastardation of language over time. It is still the House of Nevill, no matter how far some individuals have strayed from the true name. In fact, even when they themselves did not stray, the modern historians are doing what they have become very good at, rewriting history to suit themselves. Nevills of the world arise!!!! Jim Walker