North Carolina didn't start issuing Death Certificates until 1913 so there would be no official death record like that available. The best you might do is possibly a record of vital statistics that some of the counties keep in their court houses or perhaps at the State Archives which might list the persons name. You may find something in the Raleigh Register for that time period, check out the Warren County US Genweb Site to see a list of the papers that were around at the time that might have obits for Warren County http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncwarren/deaths/deaths-np1.htm There is a will for STEPHEN SHELL probated in February Court 1821 which it sounds like you are aware of. If you don't have it, I do have the abstract I can quote you via email if you would like. Just let me know. Deloris Williams ----- Original Message ----- From: <Allen1252@aol.com> To: <NCWARREN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 5:06 PM Subject: [NCWARREN-L] Re: Death info > My 3rd GGrandfather (Stephen Shell) lived in Warren County, North Carolina > and died in Feb 1821. Can someone tell me how to go about obtaining information > that would be listed on his death certificate. > Also is there a local newspaper that would also have this information ? > What is address of County Seat ? > > Lawrence..............Lawrence902@aol.com............or.....Allen1252@aol.co m > > > ==== NCWARREN Mailing List ==== > Welcome to the Warren County NC Mailing list. Let's hear what you have to say! Send information regarding YOUR surnames of interest. Have a question about Warren County History? This is the place! Need information regarding a city in Warren County, THIS is where you need to be. Make your subject lines as clear as you possibly can. This will help you get the information you need. Questions? Contact nduffy@patch.net > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.620 / Virus Database: 399 - Release Date: 3/11/2004

My 3rd GGrandfather (Stephen Shell) lived in Warren County, North Carolina and died in Feb 1821. Can someone tell me how to go about obtaining information that would be listed on his death certificate. Also is there a local newspaper that would also have this information ? What is address of County Seat ? Lawrence..............Lawrence902@aol.com............or.....Allen1252@aol.com

On Friday, March 12, 2004, at 03:55 PM, Dukes, Kevin wrote: > There will be many more surprises, to many of us, in the genealogical > world to come. We will have to be big enough to admit we were wrong, > and swallow our pride. The DNA does not lie. While I agree for the most part, I do think it's worth mentioning that while DNA may not "lie," the process and results of genetic testing are still subject to "human error." ;-) It's not as if no lab has ever made a mistake....or ever will again. The testing seems to me to represent a new milestone and a significant "tool" in the process of historical/genealogical research. Still, as with many other pieces of evidence, we have to acknowledge that we're making certain "assumptions." We "assume" the test was properly conducted, (no contaminations or other compromises occurred), that is was properly/correctly analyzed, and the results were correctly reported. Those are perfectly valid assumptions until evidence surfaces to bring them into question. It's not unlike our valid "assumption" that the information on our own birth certificates, or on a 1950s death certificate, is correct. Most likely it is.....but that's not a "given." So even with DNA testing, I think the accurate documentation would be something like, "According to the results of DNA testing conducting by _____ on _____ , this line does not relate to........" rather than "This line is definitely proven by DNA testing not to relate to ______." Sure as you say the latter, Murphy's Law says somebody else's DNA test is going to produce a different result. ;-) -Sandy

Kevin, At the risk of being slightly "off-topic," I wanted to say "thanks" for sharing this with all of us. I think DNA testing is likely to become far more widespread in the coming years, and may well refute much of what many of us "think we know." Indeed, when it comes to compilations and narratives of an historical nature, (including genealogy), what we have is not so much what we "know" as what we "think" we know. ;-) "Why" we think we know it is critically important. We "think we know" based upon a variety of evidence which we must record in the event contradictory evidence surfaces (as it inevitably will). Through documentation, we are able to re-examine the "how and why" of our previous conclusions. Perhaps more importantly, future researchers will be able to do the same. I happen to be aware that through your own documentation, you're already able to identify a likely point at which your research went down the "wrong branch," so-to-speak. By example, you've reminded us that our research is not an exact or precise science. From hereon, DNA testing may prove any or all of us wrong - but it won't tell us where we *went* wrong. Only our own meticulous documentation and continued questioning will enable us - or those who follow - to identify where errors likely occurred and to "get it right." Best of luck as you continue your research. Please keep us posted. -Sandy On Tuesday, March 9, 2004, at 05:21 PM, Dukes, Kevin wrote: > There is some new DNA technology available for genealogical research. I > recently had my DNA tested and the results show that I am not related to > the Col.Henry- Capt.Henry- William Duke-Samuel Duke family from NC that > spread throughout the South. > This is in conflict with the book I wrote on my family > history, and takes me back to square one, where I was at 3 years ago > regarding my family history. <snip>

Sandy, Thanks for your insight. This new DNA technology has created the dawn of a new era in genealogical research. It is so new that even the "experts" are still debating some of aspects of it, such as how often a mutation occurs in the y-DNA passed down through the male line. The traditional thinking was that it only occurs randomly about every 500 generations, but they have recently found that it varies in different families. Since my posting on several different forums a few days ago, I have already heard from several different sources, that DNA testing has blown away everything they thought they knew about their ancestry. Such was the case with me, 4 generations back. My mistake was in copying a census file which had 2 James R. Dukes born the same year in Muhlenberg Co KY. It turned out my gggrandfather James R Dukes was the third James R. born the same year, in an adjoining county, Ohio Co KY, although he spent his entire life, after age 17, in Muhlenberg Co. This is a good example of making a logical assumption, which turns out to be incorrect. There will be many more surprises, to many of us, in the genealogical world to come. We will have to be big enough to admit we were wrong, and swallow our pride. The DNA does not lie. PS. I haven't heard from any of the NC Duke male descendants. Does anyone know if there are some still around in the Warren, Franklin, Orange Co area? Kevin Dukes -----Original Message----- From: Sandy [mailto:teylu@earthlink.net] Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 1:46 PM To: Dukes, Kevin Cc: NCWARREN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [NCWARREN-L] Duke family DNA testers wanted Kevin, At the risk of being slightly "off-topic," I wanted to say "thanks" for sharing this with all of us. I think DNA testing is likely to become far more widespread in the coming years, and may well refute much of what many of us "think we know." Indeed, when it comes to compilations and narratives of an historical nature, (including genealogy), what we have is not so much what we "know" as what we "think" we know. ;-) "Why" we think we know it is critically important. We "think we know" based upon a variety of evidence which we must record in the event contradictory evidence surfaces (as it inevitably will). Through documentation, we are able to re-examine the "how and why" of our previous conclusions. Perhaps more importantly, future researchers will be able to do the same. I happen to be aware that through your own documentation, you're already able to identify a likely point at which your research went down the "wrong branch," so-to-speak. By example, you've reminded us that our research is not an exact or precise science. From hereon, DNA testing may prove any or all of us wrong - but it won't tell us where we *went* wrong. Only our own meticulous documentation and continued questioning will enable us - or those who follow - to identify where errors likely occurred and to "get it right." Best of luck as you continue your research. Please keep us posted. -Sandy On Tuesday, March 9, 2004, at 05:21 PM, Dukes, Kevin wrote: > There is some new DNA technology available for genealogical research. I > recently had my DNA tested and the results show that I am not related to > the Col.Henry- Capt.Henry- William Duke-Samuel Duke family from NC that > spread throughout the South. > This is in conflict with the book I wrote on my family > history, and takes me back to square one, where I was at 3 years ago > regarding my family history. <snip>

----- Original Message ----- From: "Jan Reese" <reese@ncol.net> To: "Sandy" <teylu@earthlink.net> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 4:59 PM Subject: Re: [NCWARREN-L] Satterwhite's Mill Pond - Martin's Creek ? > I have a copy of a 1874 Map of Warren County, Surveyed By R.D. Paschall. It > shows Satterwhite's Mill located in Sandy Creek Township, 1/2 scale mile > South from Mount Carmel Church. Mount Carmel Church now is located in Vance > County across the road from Southern Vance High. I hope this helps. > Jan E. Reese > ---- Original Message ----- > From: "Sandy" <teylu@earthlink.net> > To: <NCWARREN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 8:25 PM > Subject: [NCWARREN-L] Satterwhite's Mill Pond - Martin's Creek ? > > > > Does anyone know where Satterwhite's Mill Pond is (or was?) in old > > Warren Co .... I think it's in that part of Sandy Creek Township which > > became Vance County...I *think* probably in the area around Vicksboro, > > or maybe between Vicksboro & Gillburg? > > > > It should be along - or near - "Martin's Creek." > > Anyone know where Martin's Creek is? > > > > Both Satterwhite's Mill Pond and Martin's Creek are named as part of a > > property description in an 1846 Warren County deed. However, I > > *think* the mill pond was still in existence at least up to the 1920s or > > so (possibly even still today). I also think there were some baptisms > > held there in the 1900s, at least. > > > > I'm trying to figure out this location in "modern-day" terms. Does > > anyone know where it might be in relation to Southerland's Millpond, > > because I know where that is. > > > > Thanks for any help, > > > > -Sandy > > listowner, NCVance-L > > > > > > ==== NCWARREN Mailing List ==== > > To unsubscribe from the Warren County list, send email to > NCWARREN-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM with UNSUBSCRIBE in the text area. If you > have any questions, contact me at nduffy@patch.net > > > > > ------------------------------------- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by NCOL.NET, and is believed to be clean.

Trying to locate Pigeon River Creek area. This is the name circa 1800, more than likely changed over the years. Should be close to the Brunswick Co., Va. border. Any help appreciated. A descendant of NC. allen1252@aol.com

There is some new DNA technology available for genealogical research. I recently had my DNA tested and the results show that I am not related to the Col.Henry- Capt.Henry- William Duke-Samuel Duke family from NC that spread throughout the South. This is in conflict with the book I wrote on my family history, and takes me back to square one, where I was at 3 years ago regarding my family history. This technology is available for any member of any family that wants to be tested. However, it is only good for genealogical research in the male DNA which remains constant over time. Thus far, over 20,000 people have been tested worldwide. We have had 12 male Dukes tested in the past 3 months, however, none of them were certain to be from the William Duke (1701-1773) line from Warren Co.NC. We need a male Duke volunteer from this family, with definite lineage back to this ancestor. It only takes one, and it does not involve blood or needles, only a swab of the inside of your mouth. I would like to verify the DNA of this family from the William Duke line of the family. Eventually, we may even be able to verify lineage back to Capt. Henry Duke and Col. Henry. This is not a solicitation, and neither I nor any member of my family will benefit financially from this testing. It is purely for genealogical research. The cost of the test is $100. For more info go to: http://www.familytreedna.com/ or the Duke family genforum at http://genforum.genealogy.com/duke/ Kevin Dukes ============================== Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237

Ladies and/or Gentlemen, The Harris Family of Macon, Warren County, North Carolina will be having its 3rd reunion in Littleton, North Carolina on Saturday, August 7th, 2004. This gathering will bring together the descendants of "Harriet" and her two sons, Alfred J. and Richard Dick Harris and their wives. This very website started it all! Over 700 descendants to this branch as been traced. If you should feel that you are related and interested in attending the reunion or would like to know more about this blood line, please contact Stephanie Mills Trice @ kinfoks@aol.com.

Does anyone know where Satterwhite's Mill Pond is (or was?) in old Warren Co .... I think it's in that part of Sandy Creek Township which became Vance County...I *think* probably in the area around Vicksboro, or maybe between Vicksboro & Gillburg? It should be along - or near - "Martin's Creek." Anyone know where Martin's Creek is? Both Satterwhite's Mill Pond and Martin's Creek are named as part of a property description in an 1846 Warren County deed. However, I *think* the mill pond was still in existence at least up to the 1920s or so (possibly even still today). I also think there were some baptisms held there in the 1900s, at least. I'm trying to figure out this location in "modern-day" terms. Does anyone know where it might be in relation to Southerland's Millpond, because I know where that is. Thanks for any help, -Sandy listowner, NCVance-L

Please note that in the next few weeks my email address is permanently changing from nats@efn.org to lindagshields@hotmail.com. Many of you have sent/received emails to/from me regarding genealogy research. Apologies to anyone receiving this email who, well, could care less :-). Assuming you do care, please update your address book and/or email blocking settings. Going forward you will only receive email from me from lindagshields@hotmail.com. I will be checking received email in nats@efn.org for a few more weeks and then permanently shutting down that account thereafter. Thanks, Linda lindagshields@hotmail.com

Wanda, I've checked both the Warren & Halifax County Will Abstracts and there are no wills for any Groves names in either of them. Perhaps they left the area? Have you checked for deeds after the Bute County records? Deloris Williams ----- Original Message ----- From: <FLYFISHW@aol.com> To: <NCWARREN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 2:54 PM Subject: [NCWARREN-L] Groves /Grose 1765-1800 > Seeking anyone who may have knowlege of an Allen Groves , Thomas Groves, or > John Ezzell from Warren county in the middle to late 1700's. > I am especially interested in wills, deeds or anything that may show a > relationship to a Robert Kelly Groves of Halifax county, or to a Joseph Kelly Groves > of Duplin County. >

Seeking anyone who may have knowlege of an Allen Groves , Thomas Groves, or John Ezzell from Warren county in the middle to late 1700's. I am especially interested in wills, deeds or anything that may show a relationship to a Robert Kelly Groves of Halifax county, or to a Joseph Kelly Groves of Duplin County. Thanks Wanda

I have the history book by Wellman from 1586-1917. Does anyone know if any other book was written about Warrenton that covers the period after 1917? Also, what would be the best way to find out the cause of death on an ancestor? Does anyone know who keeps the burial/obituary records of the Fair View Cemetary in Warrenton? I am looking for the burial or obituary records so I can determine who fathers and mothers were. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Sincerely, Carol Simpson, surname Dowtin

Wondering if anyone is able to lookup death dates. Surname is Dowtin and father to the below was Samuel W.: John A. Dowtin b. 09/23/1866 in Warrenton, Died? Samuel, Jr. Dowtin b. 09/17/1870 in Warrenton, Died? Sarah Dowtin b. 07/18/1872 in Warrenton, Died in Norlina? Jospeph Cook Dowtin b. 03/31/1878 in Warrenton, Died? Thomas Dowtin b. 12/09/1973, Died? Any help would be appreciated. Sincerely, Carol

Have posted the Estate Papers for Matthew Evans, who died in Warren County, North Carolina to the Warren County USGenweb Site. Click onto the following link, then click the "New" tab at the top which will link you to the page of new listings. http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncwarren/ Deloris Williams

Carol, First-off, if you've got Manly Wade Wellman's book, then you just need to consult the inside binding of either the front or back cover where there's a map. ;-) #38 is labeled as the site of the old Shocco Springs Hotel (1815-1875). #36 is labeled as the site of the Jones' White Sulphur Springs Hotel (1810-1875). You'll also see Shocco Creek drawn in. As for finding this in "today's" terms..... these locations are not far from what is known today as the "Vicksboro" Community which is found right on the Vance/Warren line - southeastern Vance/southwestern Warren. You'll see Shocco Creek near there on maps that label creeks & rivers. The hands-down best source for locations of places both long-ago forgotten, as well as recent, is: "The North Carolina Gazetteer, A Dictionary of Tar Heel Places," by Dr. William S. Powell, and published by the University of North Carolina Press. If you don't have it, I highly recommend it (it is available in paperback - $19.95 from the publisher, but Amazon has is for a little under $14. If you go to the publisher's website and run a search for "Gazetteer," a description will come up: http://uncpress.unc.edu Anyway, the following from Dr. Powell's book may help, and also offers insight into the Indian background of the name "Shocco" -- Shocco Springs: former health resort in s(outh) Warren County on Shocco Creek. Located approx. 9 mi. s(outh) of the city of Warrenton, it was famous in the nineteenth century as a social, recreational, and health resort built around mineral springs. Shocco Male Academy was located here. Neither is in existence any longer. Shocco Springs had a post office from 1832 until 1866, and was shown on the Price map, 1808. Shocco Township, s(outh) Warren County. Shocco Creek rises in e(ast) Vance County and flows se through Warren County onto the Franklin -Warren County line where it enters Fishing Creek. Shown on the Price map, 1808. Named for the Shoccoree Indian Tribe. Sorry, but Dr. Powell does not seem to list Jones' Springs. I hope the Shocco Springs/ Creek information proves useful. -Sandy --------------->>> On Thursday, January 15, 2004, at 06:45 AM, carol_simpson@springmail.com wrote: > I am looking for the location and history of Shocco Springs and Jones > Springs as talked about in The County of Warren, North Carolina, > 1586-1917 by Wellman. The only Shocco Springs I fond on the internet is > in Alabama. Would like to know the location of some of the inns and > hotels the travelers used at these areas. <snip>

There was a thread back in August on the list regarding the location of Jones and Shocco Springs. You can find the answer here: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/NCWARREN/2003-08/1060657746 Ann ----- Original Message ----- From: <carol_simpson@springmail.com> To: <NCWARREN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 7:45 AM Subject: [NCWARREN-L] history and book > I am looking for the location and history of Shocco Springs and Jones Springs as talked about in The County of Warren, North Carolina, 1586-1917 by Wellman. The only Shocco Springs I fond on the internet is in Alabama.

Carol, The bookstore is Oldtimer and Lily. 123 S Main St, Warrenton, NC 27589 Ph (252) 257-6125 Fax (252) 257-0123 Gerry & Sue Kurowski, Proprietors There is a book called Old Shocco: Historical and Genealogical Research which I bought several years ago at the bookstore. It was originally published in 1909 and 1910. I do not know it's current availability status. By the way, the Wellman book has listed on Barnes and Noble used books for about $700. If you have it, you are lucky!! Sincerely, Marge in MD (with roots in Warren) ----- Original Message ----- From: <carol_simpson@springmail.com> To: <NCWARREN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 7:45 AM Subject: [NCWARREN-L] history and book > I am looking for the location and history of Shocco Springs and Jones Springs as talked about in The County of Warren, North Carolina, 1586-1917 by Wellman. The only Shocco Springs I fond on the internet is in Alabama. Would like to know the location of some of the inns and hotels the travelers used at these areas. > > I am also looking for the name of the bookstore/gift shop and phone next to the courthouse in Warrenton. I would like to find a copy of Confederate History of Warren County by Twitty, and a copy of the Diary of Anne Pritchard. > > I would also like to find the complete poem of Verses to the Confederate Dead of Warren County by Tasker Polk. Two of the verses are in the front introduction of the history of Warren book listed above by Wellman. > > By the way, EVERYONE should read the above book by Wellman. It is a fasinating history of our heritage and so exciting, I can hardly put it down. I am amazed at the depth and detail in this book put together by everyone who contributed. Wellman just did an exceptional research to find all that he did. I have learned so much more from this book! > > Your help with any of the above would be greatly appreciated. My surname is Dowtin from 1780 in Warren County. > Sincerely, > Carol Simpson > > > ==== NCWARREN Mailing List ==== > Welcome to the Warren County NC Mailing list. Let's hear what you have to say! Send information regarding YOUR surnames of interest. Have a question about Warren County History? This is the place! Need information regarding a city in Warren County, THIS is where you need to be. Make your subject lines as clear as you possibly can. This will help you get the information you need. Questions? Contact nduffy@patch.net >

I am looking for the location and history of Shocco Springs and Jones Springs as talked about in The County of Warren, North Carolina, 1586-1917 by Wellman. The only Shocco Springs I fond on the internet is in Alabama. Would like to know the location of some of the inns and hotels the travelers used at these areas. I am also looking for the name of the bookstore/gift shop and phone next to the courthouse in Warrenton. I would like to find a copy of Confederate History of Warren County by Twitty, and a copy of the Diary of Anne Pritchard. I would also like to find the complete poem of Verses to the Confederate Dead of Warren County by Tasker Polk. Two of the verses are in the front introduction of the history of Warren book listed above by Wellman. By the way, EVERYONE should read the above book by Wellman. It is a fasinating history of our heritage and so exciting, I can hardly put it down. I am amazed at the depth and detail in this book put together by everyone who contributed. Wellman just did an exceptional research to find all that he did. I have learned so much more from this book! Your help with any of the above would be greatly appreciated. My surname is Dowtin from 1780 in Warren County. Sincerely, Carol Simpson