Hi Ava, my name is John Hart Miller and my Hart ancestors lived in Hillsboro area from abt. 1754/5 - 1837. My wife has a Bledsoe ancestor and I would like to learn more about the McLaurin book(s) you mentioned below - do you know who published and where I could locate a copy? Thanks. John On Dec 13, 2008, at 6:33 AM, Ava H. Nackman wrote: > I also have Bledsoes in my family (Ga, from Va). I am assuming that > you are > both aware of the three volumes on the Bledsoes written by Banks > McLaurin? > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:ncdogs- > [email protected]] On > Behalf Of [email protected] > Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 7:34 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] BELVIN QUESTION > > Dear Bebe, > > Please send more information- I have a good bit of Belvin as well as > Bledsoe/Bletsoe information. > > When you say Nancy Belvin do you mean the Nancy Belvin who married > Tiller > Ship or another one? > > What are the dates involved? > > I cannot get beyond Robert Belvin who married Priscilla Bledsoe . He > died > in > 1782 and she is listed in the 1790 census with 3 slaves. I have > worked on > this lines for 30 years. There are some Belvin's in Virginia but I > have not > been > able to connect them. > > I look forward to hearing from you. > > My husband is Thomas Glenn Belvin from Durham. NC but we have lived in > Garner for 36 years. We are both 70. > > Lynne White Belvin > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 > 010) > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

I also have Bledsoes in my family (Ga, from Va). I am assuming that you are both aware of the three volumes on the Bledsoes written by Banks McLaurin? -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 7:34 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] BELVIN QUESTION Dear Bebe, Please send more information- I have a good bit of Belvin as well as Bledsoe/Bletsoe information. When you say Nancy Belvin do you mean the Nancy Belvin who married Tiller Ship or another one? What are the dates involved? I cannot get beyond Robert Belvin who married Priscilla Bledsoe . He died in 1782 and she is listed in the 1790 census with 3 slaves. I have worked on this lines for 30 years. There are some Belvin's in Virginia but I have not been able to connect them. I look forward to hearing from you. My husband is Thomas Glenn Belvin from Durham. NC but we have lived in Garner for 36 years. We are both 70. Lynne White Belvin **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 010) ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Bebe, Please send more information- I have a good bit of Belvin as well as Bledsoe/Bletsoe information. When you say Nancy Belvin do you mean the Nancy Belvin who married Tiller Ship or another one? What are the dates involved? I cannot get beyond Robert Belvin who married Priscilla Bledsoe . He died in 1782 and she is listed in the 1790 census with 3 slaves. I have worked on this lines for 30 years. There are some Belvin's in Virginia but I have not been able to connect them. I look forward to hearing from you. My husband is Thomas Glenn Belvin from Durham. NC but we have lived in Garner for 36 years. We are both 70. Lynne White Belvin **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010)

Message from Gwyneth Duncan below. Unfortunately, Rootsweb does not allow attachments to newslist messages. I have created a page on the D-OGS website with the information and image: http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ncdogs/orangecountync/marriage/marriagesoforangecountybook.html Question? What local libraries have this book? Durham County Library? Orange County Library? Chapel Hill Library? Wake County/Olivia Raney Library? Other? When I receive, I will add the location(s) available to the web page above. Thank you Gwyneth. And thanks to all of you for continuing this discussion. Paul ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gwyneth Duncan" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 12:19 PM Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Another bit of data. The records in Ancestry (Marriages of Orange County, North Carolina, 1779-1868) are based on a book of the same name by Brent Holcomb, published 1983. I've attached an image of his introduction, which says, among other things, that the marriage bonds of Orange County prior to 1779 no longer survive. Gwyneth --On Friday, December 12, 2008 12:12 AM -0500 "Ava H. Nackman" <[email protected]> wrote: > Jim, > I agree with you completely. Things just don't seem to be making sense. > The possibilities are numerous and include me being unfortunate enough to > get two inexperienced archivists on duty when I called who gave me some > inaccurate information. That is why I've decided to just pursue this > when I next get to the archives and can perhaps talk to the most senior > archivist and/or take a look at these early bond microfilms myself! > It is also certainly possible that LAND records were buried and lost, but > marriage bonds were not. I was talking to the archivist specifically > about marriage records. And if they indeed have microfilms of the > earliest bonds, then they certainly didn't go missing during the > Revolutionary War! Ava > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Jim Richmond > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 11:39 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > > I was born and raised in Orange County, searched land titles there for a > few years, and at that time the Register of Deeds explained, and I had > heard it before, that some land records prior to the Revolutionary war > were missing because they were buried when Hillsborough was occupied by > Cornwallis and his troops. Some of these records were re-recorded from > originals after his departure. This may just be another urban legend, > like many surrounding his occupation, debunked by modern historians. As I > understand what is being said in these e-mails the 1752 et seq. Orange > County marriage bond index has no entries of marriage bonds dated before > about 1781, that the DOA index of North Carolina's marriage bonds, > including Orange County, indicates that marriage bonds from Orange county > dated before 1781 were filed, indexed by WPA, microfilmed, but the > originals prior to 1781 cannot be found and DOA has no explanation of > where they have gotten to. Quite a mystery. If DOA received marriage > bonds from Orange County dated before 1781 why aren't they included in > the 1752 et seq. Orange County index to marriage bonds? Why are these > marriage bonds missing from the Orange County index but indexed and > microfilmed by DOA the ones they can't explain why the originals are > missing. Are there any clues to what happened when the microfilm of the > missing marriage bonds are examined? Or are we left with a situation where > there are no Orange County marriage bonds before about 1781 indexed by > Orange County or filed, indexed, and microfilmed by DOA? Maybe Cornwallis > made off with them after all. > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Ava H. Nackman > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 2:24 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > > The reason I piped up here is because I had to do a survey of Orange > County marriage records recently as a part of an assignment I was doing > for an NGS course I am taking. I spent a day at the vital records office > in Hillsborough. Here is what I wrote in my report regarding the earliest > marriage records (which were all bonds): > > Begin quote: > > While the indexes and photocopied volumes indicated, from their titles, > that records began in 1752 (the date of the county's formation), I > skimmed the entire first volume of the groom's index and could not locate > a single record dated earlier than 1781. There were, however, numerous > records for the year 1781 and for all subsequent years, with no obvious > lapses after the 1781 date. The records supervisor confirmed that > earlier records were extremely sparse, and attributed this to the > difficulties of early travel, which resulted in spotty official recording > during this time period. She felt, in fact, that the records could not > be considered really comprehensive until 1868. While I did not doubt > that numerous marriages occurred in earlier years without the benefit of > official sanction, I believed that the complete or almost complete > absence of records until the sudden appearance of numerous records in > 1781 more likely pointed to either the > destruction/loss of the earliest records or the absence of official laws > regarding the recording of marriage before that point in time. > > I determined, after a discussion with two archivists at the NC State > Archives, that Orange County did not suffer from early record destruction > due to burying of records during wars, fires, or other natural disasters. > The state of North Carolina did, indeed, require the posting of bonds and > the issuance of a license for all marriages from the county's inception. > However, these archivists revealed that the NC Archives does hold > additional very early records that, for one reason or another, were never > included in the indexes, photocopied volumes, or microfiche held at the > county Register of Deeds. They have microfilms of marriage bonds for > Orange County that do, indeed, cover the 1752-1781 timeframe. However, > the oldest original bonds held at the Archives date from 1779. The > archivists could not tell me what happened to the originals of the > 1752-1778 microfilmed bonds (!). > > End quote > > Now, I found this very curious. The microfilm copies (they may have been > microfiche -- the archivist said microfilm, but I'm not sure how specific > he was being) cannot have been made THAT long ago, so it is pretty > amazing that no one tracked the whereabouts of the originals since that > time. It is possible that there is a more experienced archivist who is > aware of what happened to these early bonds, but the people working when > I called had no clue, other than that they are not at the archives. > > By the way, my entire report is quite extensive. I am sending it in for > grading in a day or two. When I get it back I would be happy to give it > to DOGS for the website or to Trading Paths, as it might be very helpful > to researchers with ancestors in Orange County, particularly people > trying to do research long distance. I can't guarantee that it is 100% > accurate, but it would give someone a pretty good idea of what records > exist, how they are organized, and what information of genealogical value > is added to/deleted from them over time. > > Ava > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Richard Ellington > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:04 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > > Am I really sure? No, I am not at all sure that this index is that > complete. That is merely the title, as far as I am concerned. I have > heard that there are a few marriages registered in the originating > counties (Bladen, Granville & Johnston) after 1752 because it was more > convenient for folks to go where they had gone to do their governmental > duties before the creation of Orange County. According to the NCGENWEB > site for Orange, marriage bonds issued prior to 1779 are no longer > extant, but I don't know that for sure. > > - Richard > > > Ava H. Nackman wrote: >> Richard, >> Are you really sure that there ARE 1752 marriages in that index? I am >> curious, because the indexes that they had at the Vital Records Office in >> Hillsborough were LABELLED 1752-, but did not in actuality contain much > from >> before 1781. >> >> Marty, >> I did speak to archivists in Raleigh, and they indicated that they did > have >> microfilms of the earliest marriages, back to 1752, but did NOT have the >> originals of the very early ones. I found this odd, but the two > archivists >> there at the time had no idea what had become of them. Perhaps the more >> experienced archivists who might know weren't around to ask at that time. >> Next time I am there I hope to pursue this a bit further. >> >> Ava >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >> Behalf Of [email protected] >> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 3:18 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >> >> Richard, >> >> I'm not Jack, but would you look for male Bells before 1780 for me. I am >> particularly interested in Robert Bell, born in 1736. Thanks. >> >> Ann Myhre >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Richard Ellington <[email protected]> >> >> Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:57:42 >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >> >> >> Jack, I have a printed copy of the bride & groom indexes for Orange >> County from 1752-2004. If you will send me a list of the names you are >> looking for, I will check the indexes. >> >> - Richard >> >> >> Jack Ricketts wrote: >>> I haven't been able to find a listing of this on microfiche. Do you have >> the >>> name or number so I can look it up on familysearch.org? >>> >>> TIA >>> Jack Ricketts >>> >>> On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 4:11 PM, Martha Gujda >> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>> Hello Ava, >>>> >>>> The LDS church (Mormons) Family HIstory Centers have all the Marriage >>>> Bonds from N.C. from very early dates. (1752) I found all the records > I >>>> need from those. They are on Micro-fische and are filed by last name >>>> of Groom & also by Brides. I understand they got these from the NC > Archives >> & >>>> History Library. So,,,, they should be at the Library in Raleigh. Did >> you >>>> ask for the assistance of a genealogist who was on duty?? marty > gujda >>>> >>>> >>>> martydar >>>> >>>> >>>> --- On Sun, 11/23/08, Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> From: Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> >>>> Subject: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 2:25 PM >>>> >>>> Hi All, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I recently spent some time at the Register of Deeds on Churton Street >>>> surveying the marriage records for the county. I noticed that, while > the >>>> indexes and volumes holding the oldest records are dated from 1752, I >> could >>>> not find a single entry in the 1752-1911 index (I searched about ½ of > it) >>>> for a record earlier than 1781. However, there are numerous records >>>> for 1781 and subsequently. I know that Orange County was originally >>>> formed >> in >>>> 1752. Does anyone know if records were actually being kept from that >> date >>>> and all records earlier than 1781 somehow lost or destroyed? Or did > laws >>>> change around the 1781 timeframe that resulted in new records being >>>> kept >> in >>>> that year that just weren't collected before then? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Similarly, while marriage bonds (and a rare license or return) did > appear >>>> from 1781, the earliest marriage register (with copied returns) that I >> was >>>> able to find is dated from 1851. Does anyone know if there are > registers >>>> extant for the time period 1781-1850? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I can try to call the NC Archives in Raleigh to find out tomorrow, but >>>> thought someone in D-OGS who is doing local research might have some >> idea. >>>> The OC deputy registrar didn't seem to know. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Many thanks, >>>> >>>> Ava >>>> >>>> ************************* ---------------------------------------------------- Gwyneth Duncan Voice: 919-660-5860 Systems Librarian Fax: 919-684-2855 Perkins Library Email: [email protected] Box 90196 Duke University Durham, NC 27708-0196

The obvious conclusion is that many of these local vital records offices simply do not want to provide any records. They don't want to have the bother of locating and providing copies of records or of dealing with visitors or mail. They make the process so difficult, or impossible, that there is virtually no way for you to complete the process. I believe that one phrase to describe it is "Catch 22." The $25 per record from the state sounds very reasonable compared to the cost of trying to satisfy the processes instituted by the various offices. -- Dan Durham

I know exactly what you mean abt getting vital record - tis much harder than working on much older generations - I've tried to have living descendants who are directly related provide the needed work and then I usually spring for the fee and it does get pricey. A written account state by state and or county by county is unbelievable - -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Martha Gujda Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 2:21 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [NCDOGS] Getting a Death Certificate Hello Ava,   The reason that ALL OF THE STATES are now so demanding of PROOF  (of who you SAY you are on the telephone)   is-----BAD GUYS steal identities.    It used to be so easy to get any kind of birth/death/marr. records  just saying you were a genealogist.  But, NO MORE.    However, if you say you need any of these documents because of a law suit etc  then they are more likely to work with you---BUT they are still expensive.  THE LDS Family History Center & Library is still your best bet to get records of this type.   Isn't there an LDS FHC in or around Raleigh NC??     They have EVERYTHING.      marty gujda martydar --- On Thu, 12/11/08, Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> wrote: From: Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> Subject: [NCDOGS] Getting a Death Certificate To: [email protected] Date: Thursday, December 11, 2008, 12:35 PM This is simply an email sharing my frustrations at the hoops you now need to jump through to get a copy of a relative's death certificate. Thought fellow genealogists would be sympathetic. I have been trying to get a copy of my grandparents' death certificates in New Jersey. Boy, does NJ have problems! Getting any records from the state is extremely expensive ($25 a record), so I have been trying to deal with the local vital records offices. It seems that each one has its own, unique set of requirements that they seem to make up on the fly, despite there being official state rules on this. One office totally refuses to send any record to any relative other than the child of the deceased. If you happen to be a grandchild and no children are surviving you are out of luck. Another office told me that having a copy of my father's death certificate (which names me, the informant, as his daughter, and, of course, names his mother) is not good enough proof that I am the granddaughter of my grandmother. Apparently, they think I provided erroneous information for my father's 2004 certificate as part of a nefarious plot to, four years later, get my hands on my grandmother's 1972 death certificate. Hmmmm... In order to send me the certificate in question they demanded that I provide ALL of the following (I kid you not): my birth certificate, my marriage certificate, my driver's license, a recent bill showing the same name and address as on my driver's license, my father's death certificate, and another document linking my father to his mother (birth certificate, military service records, etc). Not to mention the check. Office number three (luckily the above town turned out to be the wrong one for my grandmother - she died just over the border in the next town) had no problem with me being the informant on my father's death certificate. All they wanted was that certificate, my birth record, and my driver's license. BUT, they wouldn't accept these items with a check and a letter. I had to first go through a formal application process. On the other hand, I have gotten another grandparent's death certificate ( as well as my mother's birth certificate, death records for two great grandparents, and numerous other records) from a fourth town. As long as I sent a copy of my driver's license, they would give me anything my little heart desired. BUT no checks are acceptable for them - it has to be a money order. I think I am going to start keeping notes - this could be a great comedy routine for the next DOGS birthday party. J Ava ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Lynn, I have a female Belvin who m. a Bledsoe in Wake Co., NC but haven't been able to take Nancy's Belvin line on back earlier.  If you know about your surname I would love to be in touch...thanks in advance. Bebe Fox  at [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 11:23 am Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Dear Richard, I checked the County Records book and the ORIGINAL MARRIAGE BONDS start at 1779 but the ones on MICROFILM start at 1752. I always used the original records because they were so easy to use I never checked the microfilm. Lynne Belvin **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I'm just curious, do they have a copy of Shirley's book at the NC Genealogy Library in Raleigh? Carol **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010)

I received the following info from Lynn Richardson at the Durham County Public Library. She is having trouble posting to the D-OGS listserv but wanted to share this with us: For the information of everyone looking for Orange County marriage bonds, here's what the NC Collection at the Durham County Library has: 1) "Index to marriage bonds filed in the North Carolina States Archives" on microfilm. 2) Ruth Herndon Shields' "Two hundred and two early marriages 1752-1800: found in Orange County, NC, wills which do not appear in the collected marriage bonds." Some general information about marriage bonds for NC: The marriage bonds for NC were abstracted in the 1930s by National Youth Administration Project workers. William Perry Johnson, who edited and published "The North Carolinian: A Quarterly Journal of Genealogy and History," says this about Orange County marriage bonds (v. 4, no. 1, March 1958): ORANGE CO. (formed 1752) -- All marriage bonds 1752-1778 are missing. There are around 8000 marriage bonds preserved for the 1779-1868 period; the originals are in the Archives in Raleigh. Marriage records in the courthouse date from 1851. He also says in a subsequent issue: "Less than 2500 marriage bonds have been preserved for the entire state of North Carolina for the 1741-1778 period. Approximately 7500 marriage bonds (75%) of all issued 1741-1778) have been lost or destroyed or are missing. Since only one-third of the marriages performed in North Carolina 1741-1778 were by license and bond (the other two-thirds were by banns), and since three-quarters of the marriage bonds are lost, this total of 2500 marriage bonds that have been preserved represents less than 10% of all marriage performed between 1741 and 1778." To all D-OGS members--please let me know if I can be of any help to you in your search. Lynn Lynn Richardson North Carolina Collection Durham County Library (919) 560-0171 -- Richard =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Richard K. Ellington ITS Data Centers Manager Information Technology Services University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu 919-698-8591 (voice) 919-843-9153 (fax) [email protected] "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". -Winston Churchill =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=

I talked to the Archives again -- a different person this time. They are now saying that THERE ARE NO EXTANT MARRIAGE BONDS FOR ORANGE COUNTY, EITHER ON MICROFILM OR THE ORIGINALS, PRIOR TO 1779. The gentleman said he could understand what the person was telling me the first time, because there is an error in their paperwork there, and it makes it look like they have microfilms from very early periods that they don't really have. Sorry if this is a disappointment to some DOGS members and I apologize for confusing everyone. I will now have to correct my report! Ava -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Richard Ellington Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 10:59 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Lynne, I am betting that the "1752" date is there simply because that is when Orange County was formed. It seems from what others have said that there may not actually be any records for the first few years. - Richard [email protected] wrote: > Dear Ava, > > I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some > marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was always > so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the > microfilm. > > There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. > > Lynne Belvin > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 010) > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Richard K. Ellington ITS Data Centers Manager Information Technology Services University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu 919-698-8591 (voice) 919-843-9153 (fax) [email protected] "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". -Winston Churchill =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Joy, I have seen this book in the Genealogy section at the Archives library. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 2:16 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Dear Dogs members: I work in the Genealogy library and am following your discussion with interest. Our library has a book of earlier marriages discovered from research into wills. The Archives may also have this book. The title is "Two Hundred and two Early Marriages Which have been Abstracted from Orange, North Carolina Will Books A,B, and C. . . [until the year] 1800. Authors Ruth Herndon Shield and Memory Alldredge Lester Call number GR [genealogy reference] 929.3 N8 or S555t Sincerely Joy Heitmann -----Original Message----- >From: "Ava H. Nackman" <[email protected]> >Sent: Dec 12, 2008 1:48 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > >OK, that's it. I'm calling the NC Archives back for another little chit >chat. Will keep you posted.... >Ava > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of Richard Ellington >Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 10:59 AM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > >Lynne, I am betting that the "1752" date is there simply because that is >when Orange County was formed. It seems from what others have said that >there may not actually be any records for the first few years. > >- Richard > > >[email protected] wrote: >> Dear Ava, >> >> I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some >> marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was >always >> so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the > >> microfilm. >> >> There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. >> >> Lynne Belvin >> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> >(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom0000 0 >010) >> ************************* >> Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message > >-- >=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= > > Richard K. Ellington > ITS Data Centers Manager > Information Technology Services > University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill > 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 > Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 > Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu > > 919-698-8591 (voice) > 919-843-9153 (fax) > [email protected] > > > "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken > or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". > > -Winston Churchill > >=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= >************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message > >************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Dogs members: I work in the Genealogy library and am following your discussion with interest. Our library has a book of earlier marriages discovered from research into wills. The Archives may also have this book. The title is "Two Hundred and two Early Marriages Which have been Abstracted from Orange, North Carolina Will Books A,B, and C. . . [until the year] 1800. Authors Ruth Herndon Shield and Memory Alldredge Lester Call number GR [genealogy reference] 929.3 N8 or S555t Sincerely Joy Heitmann -----Original Message----- >From: "Ava H. Nackman" <[email protected]> >Sent: Dec 12, 2008 1:48 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > >OK, that's it. I'm calling the NC Archives back for another little chit >chat. Will keep you posted.... >Ava > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of Richard Ellington >Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 10:59 AM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > >Lynne, I am betting that the "1752" date is there simply because that is >when Orange County was formed. It seems from what others have said that >there may not actually be any records for the first few years. > >- Richard > > >[email protected] wrote: >> Dear Ava, >> >> I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some >> marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was >always >> so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the > >> microfilm. >> >> There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. >> >> Lynne Belvin >> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> >(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 >010) >> ************************* >> Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message > >-- >=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= > > Richard K. Ellington > ITS Data Centers Manager > Information Technology Services > University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill > 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 > Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 > Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu > > 919-698-8591 (voice) > 919-843-9153 (fax) > [email protected] > > > "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken > or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". > > -Winston Churchill > >=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= >************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message > >************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

-----Original Message----- >From: "Ava H. Nackman" <[email protected]> >Sent: Dec 12, 2008 1:48 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > >OK, that's it. I'm calling the NC Archives back for another little chit >chat. Will keep you posted.... >Ava > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of Richard Ellington >Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 10:59 AM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > >Lynne, I am betting that the "1752" date is there simply because that is >when Orange County was formed. It seems from what others have said that >there may not actually be any records for the first few years. > >- Richard > > >[email protected] wrote: >> Dear Ava, >> >> I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some >> marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was >always >> so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the > >> microfilm. >> >> There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. >> >> Lynne Belvin >> **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and >> favorite sites in one place. Try it now. >> >(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 >010) >> ************************* >> Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message > >-- >=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= > > Richard K. Ellington > ITS Data Centers Manager > Information Technology Services > University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill > 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 > Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 > Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu > > 919-698-8591 (voice) > 919-843-9153 (fax) > [email protected] > > > "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken > or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". > > -Winston Churchill > >=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= >************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message > >************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

OK, that's it. I'm calling the NC Archives back for another little chit chat. Will keep you posted.... Ava -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Richard Ellington Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 10:59 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Lynne, I am betting that the "1752" date is there simply because that is when Orange County was formed. It seems from what others have said that there may not actually be any records for the first few years. - Richard [email protected] wrote: > Dear Ava, > > I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some > marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was always > so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the > microfilm. > > There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. > > Lynne Belvin > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000 010) > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Richard K. Ellington ITS Data Centers Manager Information Technology Services University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu 919-698-8591 (voice) 919-843-9153 (fax) [email protected] "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". -Winston Churchill =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I was checking my copy of "North Carolina Research" by Helen Leary (1st edition). In the section on county marriage records, it says: "There have been great losses of marriage bonds in many counties. In a series of articles beginning in the December, 1956, issue of the _North Carolinian_, William Perry Johnson described the availability of bonds from the several counties, with an excellent essay on bonds and marriage procedures of the colonial period ..." The Durham County Library has a copy of this journal. So do various university libraries and the Genealogy Library at the State Library. Duke has a copy, but I'm not at work today, so I can't check it just now. Gwyneth --On Friday, December 12, 2008 12:12 AM -0500 "Ava H. Nackman" <[email protected]> wrote: > Jim, > I agree with you completely. Things just don't seem to be making sense. > The possibilities are numerous and include me being unfortunate enough to > get two inexperienced archivists on duty when I called who gave me some > inaccurate information. That is why I've decided to just pursue this > when I next get to the archives and can perhaps talk to the most senior > archivist and/or take a look at these early bond microfilms myself! > It is also certainly possible that LAND records were buried and lost, but > marriage bonds were not. I was talking to the archivist specifically > about marriage records. And if they indeed have microfilms of the > earliest bonds, then they certainly didn't go missing during the > Revolutionary War! Ava > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Jim Richmond > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 11:39 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > > I was born and raised in Orange County, searched land titles there for a > few years, and at that time the Register of Deeds explained, and I had > heard it before, that some land records prior to the Revolutionary war > were missing because they were buried when Hillsborough was occupied by > Cornwallis and his troops. Some of these records were re-recorded from > originals after his departure. This may just be another urban legend, > like many surrounding his occupation, debunked by modern historians. As I > understand what is being said in these e-mails the 1752 et seq. Orange > County marriage bond index has no entries of marriage bonds dated before > about 1781, that the DOA index of North Carolina's marriage bonds, > including Orange County, indicates that marriage bonds from Orange county > dated before 1781 were filed, indexed by WPA, microfilmed, but the > originals prior to 1781 cannot be found and DOA has no explanation of > where they have gotten to. Quite a mystery. If DOA received marriage > bonds from Orange County dated before 1781 why aren't they included in > the 1752 et seq. Orange County index to marriage bonds? Why are these > marriage bonds missing from the Orange County index but indexed and > microfilmed by DOA the ones they can't explain why the originals are > missing. Are there any clues to what happened when the microfilm of the > missing marriage bonds are examined? Or are we left with a situation where > there are no Orange County marriage bonds before about 1781 indexed by > Orange County or filed, indexed, and microfilmed by DOA? Maybe Cornwallis > made off with them after all. > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Ava H. Nackman > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 2:24 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > > The reason I piped up here is because I had to do a survey of Orange > County marriage records recently as a part of an assignment I was doing > for an NGS course I am taking. I spent a day at the vital records office > in Hillsborough. Here is what I wrote in my report regarding the earliest > marriage records (which were all bonds): > > Begin quote: > > While the indexes and photocopied volumes indicated, from their titles, > that records began in 1752 (the date of the county’s formation), I > skimmed the entire first volume of the groom’s index and could not locate > a single record dated earlier than 1781. There were, however, numerous > records for the year 1781 and for all subsequent years, with no obvious > lapses after the 1781 date. The records supervisor confirmed that > earlier records were extremely sparse, and attributed this to the > difficulties of early travel, which resulted in spotty official recording > during this time period. She felt, in fact, that the records could not > be considered really comprehensive until 1868. While I did not doubt > that numerous marriages occurred in earlier years without the benefit of > official sanction, I believed that the complete or almost complete > absence of records until the sudden appearance of numerous records in > 1781 more likely pointed to either the > destruction/loss of the earliest records or the absence of official laws > regarding the recording of marriage before that point in time. > > I determined, after a discussion with two archivists at the NC State > Archives, that Orange County did not suffer from early record destruction > due to burying of records during wars, fires, or other natural disasters. > The state of North Carolina did, indeed, require the posting of bonds and > the issuance of a license for all marriages from the county’s inception. > However, these archivists revealed that the NC Archives does hold > additional very early records that, for one reason or another, were never > included in the indexes, photocopied volumes, or microfiche held at the > county Register of Deeds. They have microfilms of marriage bonds for > Orange County that do, indeed, cover the 1752-1781 timeframe. However, > the oldest original bonds held at the Archives date from 1779. The > archivists could not tell me what happened to the originals of the > 1752-1778 microfilmed bonds (!). > > End quote > > Now, I found this very curious. The microfilm copies (they may have been > microfiche -- the archivist said microfilm, but I'm not sure how specific > he was being) cannot have been made THAT long ago, so it is pretty > amazing that no one tracked the whereabouts of the originals since that > time. It is possible that there is a more experienced archivist who is > aware of what happened to these early bonds, but the people working when > I called had no clue, other than that they are not at the archives. > > By the way, my entire report is quite extensive. I am sending it in for > grading in a day or two. When I get it back I would be happy to give it > to DOGS for the website or to Trading Paths, as it might be very helpful > to researchers with ancestors in Orange County, particularly people > trying to do research long distance. I can't guarantee that it is 100% > accurate, but it would give someone a pretty good idea of what records > exist, how they are organized, and what information of genealogical value > is added to/deleted from them over time. > > Ava > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Richard Ellington > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:04 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County > > Am I really sure? No, I am not at all sure that this index is that > complete. That is merely the title, as far as I am concerned. I have > heard that there are a few marriages registered in the originating > counties (Bladen, Granville & Johnston) after 1752 because it was more > convenient for folks to go where they had gone to do their governmental > duties before the creation of Orange County. According to the NCGENWEB > site for Orange, marriage bonds issued prior to 1779 are no longer > extant, but I don't know that for sure. > > - Richard > > > Ava H. Nackman wrote: >> Richard, >> Are you really sure that there ARE 1752 marriages in that index? I am >> curious, because the indexes that they had at the Vital Records Office in >> Hillsborough were LABELLED 1752-, but did not in actuality contain much > from >> before 1781. >> >> Marty, >> I did speak to archivists in Raleigh, and they indicated that they did > have >> microfilms of the earliest marriages, back to 1752, but did NOT have the >> originals of the very early ones. I found this odd, but the two > archivists >> there at the time had no idea what had become of them. Perhaps the more >> experienced archivists who might know weren't around to ask at that time. >> Next time I am there I hope to pursue this a bit further. >> >> Ava >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >> Behalf Of [email protected] >> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 3:18 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >> >> Richard, >> >> I'm not Jack, but would you look for male Bells before 1780 for me. I am >> particularly interested in Robert Bell, born in 1736. Thanks. >> >> Ann Myhre >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Richard Ellington <[email protected]> >> >> Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:57:42 >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >> >> >> Jack, I have a printed copy of the bride & groom indexes for Orange >> County from 1752-2004. If you will send me a list of the names you are >> looking for, I will check the indexes. >> >> - Richard >> >> >> Jack Ricketts wrote: >>> I haven't been able to find a listing of this on microfiche. Do you have >> the >>> name or number so I can look it up on familysearch.org? >>> >>> TIA >>> Jack Ricketts >>> >>> On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 4:11 PM, Martha Gujda >> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>> Hello Ava, >>>> >>>> The LDS church (Mormons) Family HIstory Centers have all the Marriage >>>> Bonds from N.C. from very early dates. (1752) I found all the records > I >>>> need from those. They are on Micro-fische and are filed by last name >>>> of Groom & also by Brides. I understand they got these from the NC > Archives >> & >>>> History Library. So,,,, they should be at the Library in Raleigh. Did >> you >>>> ask for the assistance of a genealogist who was on duty?? marty > gujda >>>> >>>> >>>> martydar >>>> >>>> >>>> --- On Sun, 11/23/08, Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> From: Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> >>>> Subject: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 2:25 PM >>>> >>>> Hi All, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I recently spent some time at the Register of Deeds on Churton Street >>>> surveying the marriage records for the county. I noticed that, while > the >>>> indexes and volumes holding the oldest records are dated from 1752, I >> could >>>> not find a single entry in the 1752-1911 index (I searched about ½ of > it) >>>> for a record earlier than 1781. However, there are numerous records >>>> for 1781 and subsequently. I know that Orange County was originally >>>> formed >> in >>>> 1752. Does anyone know if records were actually being kept from that >> date >>>> and all records earlier than 1781 somehow lost or destroyed? Or did > laws >>>> change around the 1781 timeframe that resulted in new records being >>>> kept >> in >>>> that year that just weren't collected before then? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Similarly, while marriage bonds (and a rare license or return) did > appear >>>> from 1781, the earliest marriage register (with copied returns) that I >> was >>>> able to find is dated from 1851. Does anyone know if there are > registers >>>> extant for the time period 1781-1850? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I can try to call the NC Archives in Raleigh to find out tomorrow, but >>>> thought someone in D-OGS who is doing local research might have some >> idea. >>>> The OC deputy registrar didn't seem to know. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Many thanks, >>>> >>>> Ava >>>> >>>> ************************* >>>> Visit the D-OGS web site: >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7Encdogs/> >>>> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >>>> >> > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7E > ncd >> ogs/memquery.html> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ************************* >>>> Visit the D-OGS web site: >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7Encdogs/> >>>> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >>>> >> > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7E > ncd >> ogs/memquery.html> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes >>>> in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>> ************************* >>> Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ >>> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > -- > =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= > > Richard K. Ellington > ITS Data Centers Manager > Information Technology Services > University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill > 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 > Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 > Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu > > 919-698-8591 (voice) > 919-843-9153 (fax) > [email protected] > > > "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken > or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". > > -Winston Churchill > > =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ---------------------------------------------------- Gwyneth Duncan Voice: 919-660-5860 Systems Librarian Fax: 919-684-2855 Perkins Library Email: [email protected] Box 90196 Duke University Durham, NC 27708-0196

For the information of everyone looking for Orange County marriage bonds, here's what the NC Collection at the Durham County Library has: 1) "Index to marriage bonds filed in the North Carolina States Archives" on microfilm. 2) Ruth Herndon Shields' "Two hundred and two early marriages 1752-1800: found in Orange County, NC, wills which do not appear in the collected marriage bonds." Some general information about marriage bonds for NC: The marriage bonds for NC were abstracted in the 1930s by National Youth Administration Project workers. William Perry Johnson, who edited and published "The North Carolinian: A Quarterly Journal of Genealogy and History," says this about Orange County marriage bonds (v. 4, no. 1, March 1958): ORANGE CO. (formed 1752) -- All marriage bonds 1752-1778 are missing. There are around 8000 marriage bonds preserved for the 1779-1868 period; the originals are in the Archives in Raleigh. Marriage records in the courthouse date from 1851. He also says in a subsequent issue: "Less than 2500 marriage bonds have been preserved for the entire state of North Carolina for the 1741-1778 period. Approximately 7500 marriage bonds (75%) of all issued 1741-1778) have been lost or destroyed or are missing. Since only one-third of the marriages performed in North Carolina 1741-1778 were by license and bond (the other two-thirds were by banns), and since three-quarters of the marriage bonds are lost, this total of 2500 marriage bonds that have been preserved represents less than 10% of all marriage performed between 1741 and 1778." To all D-OGS members--please let me know if I can be of any help to you in your search. Lynn Lynn Richardson North Carolina Collection Durham County Library (919) 560-0171 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jim Richmond Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 8:52 AM To: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County It might be helpful to Google North Carolina Marriage Bonds, which will take you to the North Carolina Department of Archives website on the subject. Marriage bonds were posted in the bride's county of residence by the groom prior to an impending marriage to guarantee there was no legal impediment to the marriage. Archives has thousands of these bonds from all over the state which it has indexed - a master index. Some counties are missing but not Orange. It was not until the 19th century marriage certificates were filed with the bond. Another document is the Orange County index to its bonds. Since the County was founded in 1752 that may be why the index is so dated. Some early Orange County records were lost and never made it to Archives. Archives may or may not have the bond but the master index should let you know whether they have it. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ava H. Nackman Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 12:09 AM To: [email protected]; ncd[email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Richard, Are you really sure that there ARE 1752 marriages in that index? I am curious, because the indexes that they had at the Vital Records Office in Hillsborough were LABELLED 1752-, but did not in actuality contain much from before 1781. Marty, I did speak to archivists in Raleigh, and they indicated that they did have microfilms of the earliest marriages, back to 1752, but did NOT have the originals of the very early ones. I found this odd, but the two archivists there at the time had no idea what had become of them. Perhaps the more experienced archivists who might know weren't around to ask at that time. Next time I am there I hope to pursue this a bit further. Ava -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 3:18 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Richard, I'm not Jack, but would you look for male Bells before 1780 for me. I am particularly interested in Robert Bell, born in 1736. Thanks. Ann Myhre Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Richard Ellington <[email protected]> Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:57:42 To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County Jack, I have a printed copy of the bride & groom indexes for Orange County from 1752-2004. If you will send me a list of the names you are looking for, I will check the indexes. - Richard Jack Ricketts wrote: > I haven't been able to find a listing of this on microfiche. Do you have the > name or number so I can look it up on familysearch.org? > > TIA > Jack Ricketts > > On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 4:11 PM, Martha Gujda <[email protected]>wrote: > >> Hello Ava, >> >> The LDS church (Mormons) Family HIstory Centers have all the Marriage >> Bonds from N.C. from very early dates. (1752) I found all the records I >> need from those. They are on Micro-fische and are filed by last name of >> Groom & also by Brides. I understand they got these from the NC Archives & >> History Library. So,,,, they should be at the Library in Raleigh. Did you >> ask for the assistance of a genealogist who was on duty?? marty gujda >> >> >> martydar >> >> >> --- On Sun, 11/23/08, Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> From: Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> >> Subject: [NCDOGS] Question Re Marriage Records in Orange County >> To: [email protected] >> Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 2:25 PM >> >> Hi All, >> >> >> >> I recently spent some time at the Register of Deeds on Churton Street >> surveying the marriage records for the county. I noticed that, while the >> indexes and volumes holding the oldest records are dated from 1752, I could >> not find a single entry in the 1752-1911 index (I searched about ½ of it) >> for a record earlier than 1781. However, there are numerous records for >> 1781 and subsequently. I know that Orange County was originally formed in >> 1752. Does anyone know if records were actually being kept from that date >> and all records earlier than 1781 somehow lost or destroyed? Or did laws >> change around the 1781 timeframe that resulted in new records being kept in >> that year that just weren't collected before then? >> >> >> >> Similarly, while marriage bonds (and a rare license or return) did appear >> from 1781, the earliest marriage register (with copied returns) that I was >> able to find is dated from 1851. Does anyone know if there are registers >> extant for the time period 1781-1850? >> >> >> >> I can try to call the NC Archives in Raleigh to find out tomorrow, but >> thought someone in D-OGS who is doing local research might have some idea. >> The OC deputy registrar didn't seem to know. >> >> >> >> Many thanks, >> >> Ava >> >> ************************* >> Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7Encdogs/> >> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7Encd ogs/memquery.html> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> >> ************************* >> Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7Encdogs/> >> Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: >> http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html<http://www.rootsweb.com/%7Encd ogs/memquery.html> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Richard K. Ellington ITS Data Centers Manager Information Technology Services University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu 919-698-8591 (voice) 919-843-9153 (fax) [email protected] "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". -Winston Churchill =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Richard, I checked the County Records book and the ORIGINAL MARRIAGE BONDS start at 1779 but the ones on MICROFILM start at 1752. I always used the original records because they were so easy to use I never checked the microfilm. Lynne Belvin **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010)

Hello Ava,   The reason that ALL OF THE STATES are now so demanding of PROOF  (of who you SAY you are on the telephone)   is-----BAD GUYS steal identities.    It used to be so easy to get any kind of birth/death/marr. records  just saying you were a genealogist.  But, NO MORE.    However, if you say you need any of these documents because of a law suit etc  then they are more likely to work with you---BUT they are still expensive.  THE LDS Family History Center & Library is still your best bet to get records of this type.   Isn't there an LDS FHC in or around Raleigh NC??     They have EVERYTHING.      marty gujda martydar --- On Thu, 12/11/08, Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> wrote: From: Ava H. Nackman <[email protected]> Subject: [NCDOGS] Getting a Death Certificate To: [email protected] Date: Thursday, December 11, 2008, 12:35 PM This is simply an email sharing my frustrations at the hoops you now need to jump through to get a copy of a relative's death certificate. Thought fellow genealogists would be sympathetic. I have been trying to get a copy of my grandparents' death certificates in New Jersey. Boy, does NJ have problems! Getting any records from the state is extremely expensive ($25 a record), so I have been trying to deal with the local vital records offices. It seems that each one has its own, unique set of requirements that they seem to make up on the fly, despite there being official state rules on this. One office totally refuses to send any record to any relative other than the child of the deceased. If you happen to be a grandchild and no children are surviving you are out of luck. Another office told me that having a copy of my father's death certificate (which names me, the informant, as his daughter, and, of course, names his mother) is not good enough proof that I am the granddaughter of my grandmother. Apparently, they think I provided erroneous information for my father's 2004 certificate as part of a nefarious plot to, four years later, get my hands on my grandmother's 1972 death certificate. Hmmmm... In order to send me the certificate in question they demanded that I provide ALL of the following (I kid you not): my birth certificate, my marriage certificate, my driver's license, a recent bill showing the same name and address as on my driver's license, my father's death certificate, and another document linking my father to his mother (birth certificate, military service records, etc). Not to mention the check. Office number three (luckily the above town turned out to be the wrong one for my grandmother - she died just over the border in the next town) had no problem with me being the informant on my father's death certificate. All they wanted was that certificate, my birth record, and my driver's license. BUT, they wouldn't accept these items with a check and a letter. I had to first go through a formal application process. On the other hand, I have gotten another grandparent's death certificate ( as well as my mother's birth certificate, death records for two great grandparents, and numerous other records) from a fourth town. As long as I sent a copy of my driver's license, they would give me anything my little heart desired. BUT no checks are acceptable for them - it has to be a money order. I think I am going to start keeping notes - this could be a great comedy routine for the next DOGS birthday party. J Ava ************************* Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Lynne, I am betting that the "1752" date is there simply because that is when Orange County was formed. It seems from what others have said that there may not actually be any records for the first few years. - Richard [email protected] wrote: > Dear Ava, > > I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some > marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was always > so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the > microfilm. > > There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. > > Lynne Belvin > **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and > favorite sites in one place. Try it now. > (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010) > ************************* > Visit the D-OGS web site: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/ > Please post all queries using the D-OGS query form: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncdogs/memquery.html > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Richard K. Ellington ITS Data Centers Manager Information Technology Services University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill 440 W. Franklin St., CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599-1150 Control Center - http://control-center.unc.edu 919-698-8591 (voice) 919-843-9153 (fax) [email protected] "We shall not fail or falter; we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools and we will finish the job". -Winston Churchill =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=

Dear Ava, I just checked the Guide to County Records and they do indeed have some marriage bonds on microfilm in Orange County that start in 1752. It was always so easy to get them by using the original records I never messed with the microfilm. There are 10 reels from 1752 to 1868 on microfilm. Lynne Belvin **************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and favorite sites in one place. Try it now. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010)