Some more Davidsons: Alexander Davidson m. Marion Margaret Grant, 27 Nov 1840. In the IGI records the marriage is listed twice on the same date in both Elgin, and in Cromdale and Inverallan and Advie. I understand it was common for the churches of both the bride and groom to record the marriage in this way. The family lived in Elgin and so I assume Alexander was from Elgin and Marion from the Cromdale area. They had at least 6 children: Robert, b 1841 John, 1843 Margaret Marion, 1847 who emigrated to NZ (my ggm) Marjory, 1849 Grace, 1854 Alexander, 1856 I know very little about the family and would appreciate any information or leads. I initially had a false lead from a family member who thought that the parents of Margaret, my ggm, were James Davidson and Anne Souter of Elgin. Consequently I do have some information on this family should anyone be interested. Murray Christchurch, New Zealand >-----Original Message----- >From: Avalonwilli@aol.com [mailto:Avalonwilli@aol.com] >Sent: Tuesday, 21 December 2004 11:55 >To: MORAY-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [MORAY] RE: Davidson > >I have Peter Davidson married Ann Morrison both born about 1800 , >Rayne. Next is Alexander Davidson married Mary Carle >February 23 , 1861 My connection comes down >to >the Andersons from Aberdeen >William > >______________________________ > > >==== MORAY Mailing List ==== >If you need to unsub for your holidays, change your email address, or report anything to the admin of the list - all this information can be found at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/SCT/MORAY.html > >============================== >View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find >marriage announcements and more. Learn more: >http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx > > > > > >

I'm interested in Murray's theory about marriage records appearing in two parishes. I was always under the impression that two marriages took place because one of the parties was Roman Catholic. To make the marriage legal, a marriage had to take place in the Church of Scotland. That explained one marriage. Then, the couple might get married a second time in a Catholic Church. I know that this happened in my own Davidson family. Would anybody care to comment? Murray, do you have exact dates and places of births for the children you mention? I have a large data base of Davidsons but yours don't appear on it, probably because I've researched mainly in Banffshore. I'd like to add them. Alex Davidson, Cromarty, Scotland. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Murray Lynn" <m.lynn@paradise.net.nz> To: <MORAY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 11:17 AM Subject: Re: [MORAY] RE: Davidson/Grant > Some more Davidsons: > Alexander Davidson m. Marion Margaret Grant, 27 Nov 1840. In the IGI > records the marriage is listed twice on the same date in both Elgin, and > in Cromdale and Inverallan and Advie. I understand it was common for the > churches of both the bride and groom to record the marriage in this > way. The family lived in Elgin and so I assume Alexander was from Elgin > and Marion from the Cromdale area. > > They had at least 6 children: > Robert, b 1841 > John, 1843 > Margaret Marion, 1847 who emigrated to NZ (my ggm) > Marjory, 1849 > Grace, 1854 > Alexander, 1856 > > I know very little about the family and would appreciate any information > or leads. > > I initially had a false lead from a family member who thought that the > parents of Margaret, my ggm, were James Davidson and Anne Souter of > Elgin. Consequently I do have some information on this family should > anyone be interested. > > Murray > > Christchurch, New Zealand > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Avalonwilli@aol.com [mailto:Avalonwilli@aol.com] > >Sent: Tuesday, 21 December 2004 11:55 > >To: MORAY-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [MORAY] RE: Davidson > > > >I have Peter Davidson married Ann Morrison both born about 1800 , > >Rayne. Next is Alexander Davidson married Mary Carle > >February 23 , 1861 My connection comes down > >to > >the Andersons from Aberdeen > >William > > > >______________________________ > > > > > >==== MORAY Mailing List ==== > >If you need to unsub for your holidays, change your email address, or report anything to the admin of the list - all this information can be found at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/SCT/MORAY.html > > > >============================== > >View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find > >marriage announcements and more. Learn more: > >http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== MORAY Mailing List ==== > If you need to unsub for your holidays, change your email address, or report anything to the admin of the list - all this information can be found at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/SCT/MORAY.html > > ============================== > View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find > marriage announcements and more. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx >

Hi Alex Because I was on the wrong track until recently I don't have any solid info yet apart from IGI records. I have included what I do have below. All records are for Elgin, Moray, Scotland: Marriage(s): ALEXANDER DAVIDSON m. MARION MARGARET GRANT, 27 NOV 1840, Cromdale And Inverallan And Advie, Inverness, Scotland ALEXANDER DAVIDSON m. MARION GRANT, 27 NOV 1840, Elgin, Moray, Scotland Births & Christenings: Robert Davidson (12 Sep 1841 - ) Chr: 26 Sep 1841 John Davidson (01 Sep 1843 - ) Chr: 17 Sep 1843 Margaret Marion Davidson (06 Jun 1847 - 1 Jun 1932) Chr: 20 Jun 1847 Emigrated to NZ, leaving London 3 July 1869 on the Hydaspes where she married Beriah Robinson of Scottish-Irish origins. Marjory Davidson (04 Jul 1849 - ) Chr: 22 Jul 1849 Grace Davidson (10 May 1854 - ) Chr: 23 Jul 1854 Alexander Davidson (8 Oct 1856 - ) ---------------------------------------------------------- The topics of Banns and also of marriages a few months before the first child was born, are very interesting and you have introduced another slant to it. Ian Scott sent me this extremely informative note on Banns which I'm sure he won't mind me copying here: Hi Murray Proclamations of Banns (Intentions to marry) were made to enable anyone, who had any knowledge why the couple should not be married, to raise an objection and it would be particularly necessary if they lived in different Parishes that it take place in both. I believe that where an objection was raised and the Clergyman refused to perform the ceremony the couple could appeal to the Sheriff and if successful the Clergyman was required to do as the Sheriff ordered. I am currently looking at the Bellie OPR and the detail of the entries varies depending on who wrote them over the years and I would say this is quite normal as regards the OPRs. You can find a simple statement that Joe Bloggs & Mary Smith offered their names for proclamation with a view to marriage and nothing more. In others there will be words to the same effect with the addition 'and were afterwards married' or 'and were married on (date)' and on a few occasions the name of the minister is given. I have also come across entries which state a pledge has been given and my understanding of that is there was a pledge of money made at the time and this would be returned if no child was born within the nine month period following the marriage. Otherwise the pledge fell to the Kirk's coffers. In my own Tree I have the following entry in 1796 in the Parish of Bellie: Alexander Scott and Helen Todd were contracted into matrimony on 2nd July 1796 and were married two days later by the Minister of the Parish of Bellie, Rev William Gordon. I am not certain about the significance of the contracted into matrimony bit but, suffice it to say, their first child was born in October 1796 and I assume that there will have been some intervention by the Kirk Session which is something I must take time to check out at the National Archives. In this case, as it would be obvious that Helen Todd was pregnant there would be no point in any pledge being given and it could be that 2nd July 1796 was the day they appeared before the Kirk Session and entered into the marriage contract. Finally, just to confuse you more not all Proclamations were followed by a marriage and it could be that if you find an entry in respect of a marriage (which is more probably the banns) but find no children of the marriage then it may be the marriage did not take place. Equally so the couple may have emigrated soon after they married and the family were born abroad and you may need to broaden your area of research. I, personally, think it is a bit of a minefield but back in those days it is all we have to go on and all the possibilities should be kept in front of you when researching. Regards Ian davidsonanl@lineone.net wrote: >I'm interested in Murray's theory about marriage records appearing in two >parishes. > >I was always under the impression that two marriages took place because one >of the parties was Roman Catholic. To make the marriage legal, a marriage >had to take place in the Church of Scotland. That explained one marriage. >Then, the couple might get married a second time in a Catholic Church. I >know that this happened in my own Davidson family. > >Would anybody care to comment? > >Murray, do you have exact dates and places of births for the children you >mention? I have a large data base of Davidsons but yours don't appear on >it, probably because I've researched mainly in Banffshore. I'd like to add >them. > >Alex Davidson, Cromarty, Scotland. > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Murray Lynn" <m.lynn@paradise.net.nz> >To: <MORAY-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2004 11:17 AM >Subject: Re: [MORAY] RE: Davidson/Grant > > > > >>Some more Davidsons: >>Alexander Davidson m. Marion Margaret Grant, 27 Nov 1840. In the IGI >>records the marriage is listed twice on the same date in both Elgin, and >>in Cromdale and Inverallan and Advie. I understand it was common for the >>churches of both the bride and groom to record the marriage in this >>way. The family lived in Elgin and so I assume Alexander was from Elgin >>and Marion from the Cromdale area. >> >>They had at least 6 children: >>Robert, b 1841 >>John, 1843 >>Margaret Marion, 1847 who emigrated to NZ (my ggm) >>Marjory, 1849 >>Grace, 1854 >>Alexander, 1856 >> >>I know very little about the family and would appreciate any information >>or leads. >> >>I initially had a false lead from a family member who thought that the >>parents of Margaret, my ggm, were James Davidson and Anne Souter of >>Elgin. Consequently I do have some information on this family should >>anyone be interested. >> >>Murray >> >>Christchurch, New Zealand >> >> >> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: Avalonwilli@aol.com [mailto:Avalonwilli@aol.com] >>>Sent: Tuesday, 21 December 2004 11:55 >>>To: MORAY-L@rootsweb.com >>>Subject: Re: [MORAY] RE: Davidson >>> >>>I have Peter Davidson married Ann Morrison both born about 1800 >>> >>> >, > > >>>Rayne. Next is Alexander Davidson married Mary Carle >>>February 23 , 1861 My connection comes >>> >>> >down > > >>>to >>>the Andersons from Aberdeen >>>William >>> >>>______________________________ >>> >>> >>>==== MORAY Mailing List ==== >>>If you need to unsub for your holidays, change your email address, or >>> >>> >report anything to the admin of the list - all this information can be found >at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/SCT/MORAY.html > > >>>============================== >>>View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find >>>marriage announcements and more. Learn more: >>>http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>==== MORAY Mailing List ==== >>If you need to unsub for your holidays, change your email address, or >> >> >report anything to the admin of the list - all this information can be found >at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/SCT/MORAY.html > > >>============================== >>View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find >>marriage announcements and more. Learn more: >>http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx >> >> >> > > >==== MORAY Mailing List ==== >Don't forget that if you delete a message, you can always visit the archives of this list http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/MORAY/. The archives are also worth looking at, whether you be a new or established lister. > >============================== >Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the >last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx > > > > > >

> I'm interested in Murray's theory about marriage > records appearing in two > parishes. > > I was always under the impression that two marriages > took place because one > of the parties was Roman Catholic. To make the > marriage legal, a marriage > had to take place in the Church of Scotland. That > explained one marriage. > Then, the couple might get married a second time in > a Catholic Church. I > know that this happened in my own Davidson family. > > Would anybody care to comment? Absolutely not the case at all. What makes a marriage legal is that it is witnessed by two other people - hence the custom of marriage by declaration, which was fairly common until it was abolished some time around 1930-ish. It was not necessary to have a clergyman perform the ceremony, and it was unusual for the ceremony to take place in the church. There has never been a legal requirement for a marriage to take place in a Church of Scotland - far from it, in fact; until the early 20th century most wedding ceremonies did not take place in church. The reason for any marriage appearing twice in the IGI or GROS indexes is that the banns were called in two different parishes, because the couple's residences were in those two parishes, and the proclamation was recorded in both. I have actually seen all but a tiny handful of the 5000-odd original marriage entries in my tree, and, without exception, if there are two records in the IGI or any other index the original has told me that the parties lived in different parishes, and which one lived in which parish. There are certain countries where a church (notably the RC Church) or one religious denomation or another does not recognise civil marriages, and I believe there are some, not including Scotland, where a civil ceremony is required as well as a religious ceremony. I know of cases where a marriage conducted under protestant rites was followed by a subsequent ceremony (usually a blessing rather than a second marriage ceremony) in a RC church precisely because the RC church did not recognise the validity of the protestant marriage ceremony. If two parties in the same parish, one RC and the other Protestant, wished to marry, the banns would be called in both churches, but the parish register would contain only one entry because that would suffice within that parish, so cross-denomination marriages would only produce double records if the index also included the RC records, which, generally speaking, neither the IGI nor the GROS index does. HTH Anne

In my research I have found that in every case where a marriage was recorded twice the reason was that the parties lived in different parishes and consequently the banns had to be called in each parish. Harry Montgomery.