And who may I ask, was your Grandmother? Silllyearn had an Innes on it at one point....Crannoch had other Inneses, though not mine. Goldie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Melvyn Hunter" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 11:03 PM Subject: Re: [MORAY] Easter Crannich & Waster Limekills > Dear Dorothy, > > Not sure exactly where you are, but my great-grandmother was both at the > Crannoch and earlier ancestors lived and worked at Limehillocks: both are > in > the Sillyearn region to the north and east of Grange in Banffshire (as > was). > If you find Portsoy on a map and go due south until you are east of Keith, > then you are right in the middle of the area. > Hope this helps. > > Melvyn. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On > Behalf Of Dorothy Pollard > Sent: 05 December 2007 19:32 > To: [email protected] > Subject: [MORAY] Easter Crannich & Waster Limekills > > On their OPR marriage record for Cromdale and Inverallan, Donald > Cruickshank is listed as of Easter Crannich and his bride Sarah > Davidson is listed as of Waster Limekills. Both Crannich and > Limekills are rather faint, but I think I have copied them correctly, > but am certainly open to correction. I have looked on Old Maps but > have been unable to find either. Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Dorothy > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in > the subject and the body of the message > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.14/1172 - Release Date: > 05/12/2007 > 08:41 > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.14/1172 - Release Date: > 05/12/2007 > 08:41 > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

> Not sure exactly where you are, but my great-grandmother was > both at the > Crannoch and earlier ancestors lived and worked at > Limehillocks: both are in > the Sillyearn region to the north and east of Grange in > Banffshire (as was). You are quite right about the Crannoch and Limehillock in the parish of Grange, but as they are not in the parish of Cromdale Inverallan and Advie they aren't the ones where Dorothy's family lived. There are lots of places all over Scotland with the same or similar names! If you look on www.streetmap.co uk you will find seven places named Crannach/Crannaich/Crannich/Crannoch besides all sorts of other variations of Crannog, two Limekilns and the Limehillock to which you refer. This does not include any with a prefix such as 'East' or 'West', and it only lists those on the contemporary map, so lost and abandoned ones are not included. For instance the 1881 Census lists places named Limekilns or variants in Cromdale, Cairnie, Beath and Avoch and a Limehills in Cults, Fife*, none of which are on Streetmap. *I had to specify that it is the Cults in Fife, because there are also places named Cults in the parishes of Kirkmichael (Banffshire**), Kennethmont and Banchory-Devenick (the latter is the village on the western outskirts of Aberdeen). **Similarly, it is necessary to specify Banffshire because there are parishes of the same name in Ayrshire, Perthshire and Dumfries-shire. As a general point I cannot emphasise too strongly that the unit on which all older records is based is the **parish**, so if you are looking for your ancestors' homes the very first thing you have to know is which parish (and, if it's Kirkmichael, which county!) to look in. Without this information you risk setting off on a wild goose chase. Anne

Melvyn Hunter wrote: >Dear Dorothy, > >Not sure exactly where you are, but my great-grandmother was both at the >Crannoch and earlier ancestors lived and worked at Limehillocks: both are in >the Sillyearn region to the north and east of Grange in Banffshire (as was). >If you find Portsoy on a map and go due south until you are east of Keith, >then you are right in the middle of the area. >Hope this helps. > > I suspect it may confuse! The places you mention certainly do exist - there is a Crannach/Crannoch and two different places both called Limehillock in the Banffshire parish of Grange. But there are also Easter and Wester Limekilns and Easter and Wester Crannich in the Moray parish of Cromdale, Inverallan and Advie, a mile or two to the east of Lochindorb. Which illustrates yet again the inconvenient fact that Scottish placenames are seldom unique. Gavin Bell

Dear Dorothy, Not sure exactly where you are, but my great-grandmother was both at the Crannoch and earlier ancestors lived and worked at Limehillocks: both are in the Sillyearn region to the north and east of Grange in Banffshire (as was). If you find Portsoy on a map and go due south until you are east of Keith, then you are right in the middle of the area. Hope this helps. Melvyn. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dorothy Pollard Sent: 05 December 2007 19:32 To: [email protected] Subject: [MORAY] Easter Crannich & Waster Limekills On their OPR marriage record for Cromdale and Inverallan, Donald Cruickshank is listed as of Easter Crannich and his bride Sarah Davidson is listed as of Waster Limekills. Both Crannich and Limekills are rather faint, but I think I have copied them correctly, but am certainly open to correction. I have looked on Old Maps but have been unable to find either. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Dorothy ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.14/1172 - Release Date: 05/12/2007 08:41 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.14/1172 - Release Date: 05/12/2007 08:41

On their OPR marriage record for Cromdale and Inverallan, Donald Cruickshank is listed as of Easter Crannich and his bride Sarah Davidson is listed as of Waster Limekills. Both Crannich and Limekills are rather faint, but I think I have copied them correctly, but am certainly open to correction. I have looked on Old Maps but have been unable to find either. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Dorothy

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: DeniseThompson77 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/1291.2.1.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Hello David, Thank you for your response which is greatly appreciated. I share an ancestry with this family, providing Elizabeth Kellie who married Alexander Fortieth was a sister of Mary Kellie, daughter of John Kellie and Elizabeth Falconer. Elizabeth was in the right place at the right time, but I have not yet found a birth or baptism for her. I believe there were two John Kellys in Alves at the time, one married to Elizabeth Falconar and the other married to Isabelle Watson. I need to take another look at the birth record of Elizabeth Kelly in Alves in 1715 and make note of the witnesses. Yes, I would love a scanned copy of Newton House please. Regards, Denise Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: DavidGregory118 Surnames: FORTEATH FORTIETH Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/1291.2.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Hi Denise There is an IGI entry for ISOBEL FORTIETH's christening 21/10/1754 (Elgin, Morayshire) which suggests that she is the daughter of Alexander Fortieth and his spouse Elizabeth Kellie (or Kelly). The IGI suggests that ISOBEL had an elder sister MARY (christened 1751), a sibling (ELSPET) who was also christened in 1754 and a younger brother (christened 1759). You have no doubt seen the IGI marriage of ALEXANDER FORTEITH and ELIZAB. in 1739. The place given is Alves, Moray, Scotland. I think that this may mean a birth at "Newton House", the home of several "Lairds of Newton". My understanding is that the right to the title "Laird of Newton" was ISOBEL's. This title passed to their eldest son - my records have him as "Alexander Forteath (nee Williamson)" so perhaps it was required (or simply tradition) which kept alive her family name. I can email you some photos of Newton House if you wish. Most are of it post a fire in 1992 (if I recall correctly) but I do have a "not terribly good quality" picture of Newton House when intact that I can photograph and send. By the way I am not a descendant. I too am keen to hear from one of them. David Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

It is probably Wester not Waster. I always try www.geograph.org first because some of the photos reference places that are hard to find on a map. I searched for Easter Crannich and found this http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/114063 You will see part of a map but if you click on the grid ref (NJ0034) it will give you links to various current map sites. If you click on "find images nearby" you will find a picture of Wester Limekilns. http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/59560 Now I'm off to look at the photos of Loch Mhic Leoid Robin -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dorothy Pollard Sent: December 5, 2007 2:32 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [MORAY] Easter Crannich & Waster Limekills On their OPR marriage record for Cromdale and Inverallan, Donald Cruickshank is listed as of Easter Crannich and his bride Sarah Davidson is listed as of Waster Limekills. Both Crannich and Limekills are rather faint, but I think I have copied them correctly, but am certainly open to correction. I have looked on Old Maps but have been unable to find either. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Dorothy

> Can anyone offer any help or suggestions towards identifying > the parents of > an Elizabeth McGregor, born late 1840s, in or near Morayshire, > Scotland? > Joseph Hardie and Elizabeth McGregor had a daughter, Isabella > Bell Hardie, > Lewis McGregor m. Isabel Bell 24 Mar 1843 Forres, Moray, had > daughter > Elizabeth b. c1845 Forres, Moray. I think that the name of her first daughter is a strong pointer to her being the daughter of Lewis MacGregor and Isabel Bell. HTH Anne

Thank you Judy. I look forward to it. How did you get hold of (the copy) of the diary? It will give an insight to the conditions of sailing in those demanding conditions. I'm pretty sure that my g-grandfather Wm Harvey (or MacDuff, to which he changed his name on the way to NZ) would have been crewing out of Banff through the town of McDuff. It would be thrilling if one could find a diary relating to his exploits. However, I don't have time now at age 75, I must get on with the bulk of my family book. I worked in North Sea Oil and Gas extraction, going offshore from Peterhead by sea and from Dyce by chopper over 1979 to 1984, to lay submarine pipelines from NS fields to Scotland. Kind regards, Ray C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Judy Acaster" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 10:11 PM Subject: [MORAY] Carrier Dove > Dear Ray, > > If can work out how to scan and copy it to a file, I could then send it in > an attachment - off List of course. > > Leave it with me - I WILL get to it when things quieten down this end. > Never know your luck! > > Cheers!.........Judy. Perth W.Australia > >> Message: 5 >> Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:30:08 +1300 >> From: "Ray Christmas" <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [MORAY] Ship 'Carrier Dove' >> To: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> >> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; >> reply-type=original >> >> Dear Judy, >> >> Any chance of anyone else getting a copy of the diary? >> TIA, >> Ray Christmas, New Zealand. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:49 PM >> Subject: Re: [MORAY] Ship 'Carrier Dove' >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.13/1164 - Release Date: > 12/2/2007 11:30 AM > >

Hello, Can anyone offer any help or suggestions towards identifying the parents of an Elizabeth McGregor, born late 1840s, in or near Morayshire, Scotland? The International Genealogical Index, and the 1841 to 1881 census records available online have helped me to tentatively rule out a few candidates, but there are still too many possibilities to allow me to determine with any certainty which Elizabeth McGregor was my great great grandmother. Following is what I do know about her. Elizabeth McGregor was born c1848 in or near Morayshire. She immigrated on 25 Jan 1873 to New York, arriving from Glasgow on the Steamship India, listed as age 25, born in Scotland. She died on 8 May 1898 in Monmouth, Warren Co., Illinois. Elizabeth may have had a sister Christine or Christina, and may also have had relatives in South Africa. She was married to Joseph Hardie on 4 Feb 1873 in Monmouth, Warren Co., Illinois. Joseph Hardie (son of James Hardie Sr. and Ann Souter) was born c1840 in Dallas, Moray, Scotland. He immigrated on 15 Oct 1870 to New York, arriving from Glasgow, on board the Steamship Britannia, listed as a plasterer, age 26, born in Scotland. He became a U.S. citizen on 1 Nov 1884 in Monmouth, Warren Co., Illinois. He died on 22 Sep 1895 in Monmouth Twp., Warren Co., Illinois, after a team of horses pulled a loaded wagon over him. Joseph Hardie and Elizabeth McGregor had a daughter, Isabella Bell Hardie, born on 7 Jul 1870 in Aberdeen. She appeared in the 1871 census, at 9 (4) Moss Street, Elgin, Elgin, Moray, ED 10, p. 4, listed as Isabella Hardy, age 7 months, Infant Nursing, born Coul, Aberdeenshire, living in the household of Thomas Cooper, age 37, Tailor, born Forres, Elginshire. I believe, but cannot be certain, that Isabella's mother Elizabeth, is the one appearing in the 1871 census at Village Of Coincourt, Edinkillie, Moray, ED 2, p. 1, listed as Elizabeth McGregor, age 22, General Servant, born Fouer (is this a mistranscription of Forres?), enumerated in the household of Charles Forsythe, age 40, Retired Farmer, born Edinkillie, Morayshire. Elizabeth McGregor and Joseph Hardie, had six more children, Jessie Ann Hardie, Margaret Barr Hardie, Edward Hardie, Jane Graham Hardie, Robert Hardie, and Christine Lee Hardie, all born in Illinois. Does anyone have any information which may point to the parents of this Elizabeth McGregor? OR, does anyone have any helpful information regarding any of the following families, such as any records which might strengthen or eliminate them as candidates? Lewis McGregor m. Isabel Bell 24 Mar 1843 Forres, Moray, had daughter Elizabeth b. c1845 Forres, Moray. William McGregor m. Elspet McKenzie, date and location unknown, had daughter Elspet b. 06 Feb 1848, chr. 23 Feb 1848 Kinloss, Moray. William McGregor m. Anne McGregor 18 Dec 1834 Duthil, Inverness, had daughter Elspet b. May 1846 Duthil, Inverness. Any help anyone can offer will be very greatly appreciated! Donna Mendelsohn, [email protected] Box 98, Fort Assiniboine, AB, Canada T0G 1A0

Dear Ray, If can work out how to scan and copy it to a file, I could then send it in an attachment - off List of course. Leave it with me - I WILL get to it when things quieten down this end. Never know your luck! Cheers!.........Judy. Perth W.Australia > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 16:30:08 +1300 > From: "Ray Christmas" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [MORAY] Ship 'Carrier Dove' > To: <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Dear Judy, > > Any chance of anyone else getting a copy of the diary? > TIA, > Ray Christmas, New Zealand. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:49 PM > Subject: Re: [MORAY] Ship 'Carrier Dove' > >

Dear Judy, Any chance of anyone else getting a copy of the diary? TIA, Ray Christmas, New Zealand. ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [MORAY] Ship 'Carrier Dove' > This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. > > Author: JudithAcaster > Surnames: > Classification: queries > > Message Board URL: > > http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/2289.2.1.2.3.1.1.1.1.1/mb.ashx > > Message Board Post: > > Maxinc > > Happy to send you a copy of the Diary which I handcopied and then typed > up, some years ago. Not sure how I can contact you, direct. If you > post a message on the Moray-L Rootsweb List, then I can pick it up for a > personal reply. > Judy > > Important Note: > The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you > would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link > above and respond on the board. > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.13/1164 - Release Date: > 12/2/2007 11:30 AM > >

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: JudithAcaster Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/2289.2.1.2.3.1.1.1.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Maxinc Happy to send you a copy of the Diary which I handcopied and then typed up, some years ago. Not sure how I can contact you, direct. If you post a message on the Moray-L Rootsweb List, then I can pick it up for a personal reply. Judy Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: maxinc159 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/2289.2.1.2.3.1.1.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Hi Judy Sorry for my delay in replying. I have tried sending you a message via your email address but it keeps bouncing back. I would really love it if you could send me a copy via snail mail If you send me an email via my email address I will send you my address details. Thanks Maxinc Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: scatchpole12 Surnames: Hill Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/2315/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Searching for relatives Brian Hill and have found out he had two children Jeremy and Alison and three grandchildren Nicola, Sarah and Claire. Ring any bells? As Hill seems to be a very common name it is very hard to trace them. I know Brian lived in Oran Cottage Buckie in 1996 but have no information after that. Any information or ideas would be appreciated. THANKS Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

Hi all I have an Alexander Scott born 1798 at Tulloch, Bellie to Alexander Scott and Helen Todd who married at Bellie in 1796. The Bellie OPR fortunately lists deaths/burials and in 1825 there is an entry showing that a burial of a dead born child of Alexander Scott, Cabinet Maker in Fochabers took place. As the child was still born there is no record of a birth/christening although the IGI shows the birth of a child 'Scott' whose father was Alexander Scott but no mother's name. This entry was probably generated from the burial entry in the OPR. The\re is no trace of a marriage for Alexander so the child was probably illegitimate. In the 1841 Census there is an Alexander Scott, aged 40, Cabinetmaker, living in Fochabers and domiciled with him at the time of the Census was a Jannet Dustan aged 65 who was described as being of independent means. By 1851 Alexander was living in Market Street/Place in Fochabers aged 52 but there is no sign of Jannet Dustan. A search of the Bellie OPR revealed that she was buried at Bellie Churchyard on 27 March 1848 aged 76 which would tie in with the 1841 Census in which ages were rounded down to the nearest 5 years and her age at that time could have been 69. By 1861 Alexander aged 62 was still living in Fochabers at the same address and 10 years later in 1871 the same applied with his age given as 72. In 1881 there is no trace of him in the Census which suggests that he may have moved from Fochabers or died but a wider search of the Census using many spelling variations of his name together with his occupation produced no results. A similar style of search on scotlandspeople for his death after 1871 to 1900 again shows nothing which matches. The Moray Heritage Centre's LIBINDX was used to search for Cabinet Makers on their database but again this proved fruitless although there were many listed. Finally, the Monumental Inscriptions for Bellie Churchyard and New Cemetery were examined but although Jannet Dustan was buried there no headstone exists for her nor is there any trace of Alexander or his still born child in that publication. This has truly become a brick wall and I would be delighted if anyone out there can shed any light on this mystery. I felt certain I would have found a death entry for Alexander on scotlandspeople. Ian A C Scott

Dear Ray, Sorry, neither a MacDuff or a William Harvey amongst the 'Unassisted Passengers' on board the 'Carrier Dove'. I do not have a List of 'Steerage Passengers' or crew. Good luck in your search. Judy.....Perth. W.Australia > From: "Ray Christmas" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [MORAY] Ship 'Carrier Dove' > > Dear Judith, > I was not 'in' on the exchange of e-mails on this ship. I don't know how I > missed out on what would appear the first ones. > Are you able to see if there was a William MacDuff or a William Harvey among > any of the passengers? > Thanks in anticipation > > Ray Christmas, New Zealand. > ----- Original Message ----- >

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: gbell152 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/2313.1.1.1.2.1.2/mb.ashx Message Board Post: "... A person could acquire settlement in a parish either by being born there, or being the wife of a man born there, or by living there continuously for the prescribed number of years (five, I think it was)." The period of time was three years, but one rather unpleasant effect of the rules was that it was quite possible to end up with no settlement anywhere. If you moved around, following work, but not staying in any one parish continuously for three years, then the situation could arise that no parish would admit responsibility for you. This happened to an ancestor of mine. Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: Forfarian Surnames: Douglas, Smith, Brander Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/2313.1.1.1.2.1.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: First thought is that divorce records are kept in the National Archives of Scotland www.nas.gov.uk. However the online index does not list any documents relating to Penuel Smith. It used to be the case that a divorce resulted in a correction being made to the original marriage certificate, so it would show up as a reference to the RCE and would automatically be flagged up on Scotland's People when you view the marriage certificate. I've come across quite a few of these, more recently that 1900, but I can't say for certain exactly when this began or ended. As I understand it divorce was hideously expensive in the 19th century because getting a divorce required an Act of Parliament, so divorces tended to be the preserve of the super-rich. I don't know exactly when this was changed, but I do have one fairly ordinary couple who were divorced in 1896. I found that from the newspaper report, which is indexed in LIBINDX. (the divorced wife's middle name was Brander, as it happens!) I have just searched the online index to the National Archives of Scotland to see if it has anything relating to this 1896 divorce, and it does not. I cannot say whether this means there is no record, or whether there is but it has not yet been indexed. (While doing this I stumbled on the divorcée's divorce from her second husband, whom she married just three months after her first divorce, so thank you for setting me on this track, even if it doesn't help you!) I don't know where the NZ reference to Penuel in LIBINDX came from. I'll re-check the Parochial Board entry when I get a chance just in case I missed it when transcribing the record. It is the sort of thing that the Inspector of Poor usually noted. Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.