Patrick I suggest you contact the Nairn Museum which I have found very helpful when researching my Nairn ancestors. You can write to Fiona Barnes the Museum manager at manager@nairnmuseum.co.uk At the very least I am sure they will be very interested in your story. Rhoda

Sorting through old files I came across the following information from a gentleman who is no longer with us. Some of the writing is difficult to decipher, so when reading my notes please bear this in mind. Thomas Fraser DUNBAR was born in Edinburgh in 1913. He attended George Heriot's School, served in the Royal Navy as a Writer, became a Petty Officer, was awarded the BEM and was Mentioned in Despatches. He married Thora Phyliss GEEVES. There were no children of the marriage, and Thomas believed he was the last of his line. Thomas's father George DUNBAR, possibly born in Nairn, was an RSM in the Seaforth Highlanders just before the outbreak of the 1914-18 war. His un-named mother may have beeb born in Dingwall. Thomas wrote the following - 'Understand early 19th. century there were two brothers, one an absolute rogue who pillaged the countryside. The other one ecclesiastical high links in his church in Nairn who never failed to inform the world of his infamous brother. In the end the rogue cut his brother's throat on the steps of his church in Nairn.' Such a story must be part of local legend. Has anyone heard of it? Does anyone have details of the family? Patrick. R. L. Dunbar Organiser, Dunbar Family Society, UK Member, Aberdeen & NE Scotland FHS. Member Guild of One-Name Studies. Email - dunbarATone-name.org (Replace AT with @) Web Page, family history - www.dunbarfamilysociety.org.uk Web Page, Art - www.debbiedunbar.net Skypename - pibrochpat

Please let the list know the outcome. I love stories like this one!! Good Luck, Goldie ----- Original Message ----- From: "CandROverson" <overson12@btinternet.com> To: <dunbar@one-name.org>; <moray@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 3:20 PM Subject: Re: [MORAY] An interesting Nairn tale? > Patrick > > I suggest you contact the Nairn Museum which I have found very helpful > when > researching my Nairn ancestors. You can write to Fiona Barnes the Museum > manager at manager@nairnmuseum.co.uk At the very least I am sure they > will > be very interested in your story. > > Rhoda > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MORAY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

I am interested in finding James Sinclair, born about 1807 in Wick, Caithness who married Elizabeth Grant in about 1827. Elizabeth was born in Forres, Moray. Three known children were Janet, Christina and Alexander. His occupation was a ship carpenter. (That opens up all kinds of possibilities!) Elizabeth was listed in a record in Perth, Perth as a widow in 1852. Hopefully, someone can help me with records to help me verify this info and any additional information. Then I will beable to move forward on my family history dead end! Thanks!! Marianne

In a message dated 05/08/2009 2:03:21 GMT Daylight Time, jecroft@att.net writes: As the rest of James & Georgina's children are registered with the Church of Scotland, it is doubtful that they were Free Church members. It is much more likely that the record was not made (illness/forgetfulness of recorder) or the record is illegible (handwriting/deterioration of ink). There is certainly nothing written in tablets of stone regarding these records. I have a family where the parents were members of different denominations and I found that some of their children were baptised in the Church of Scotland and others in the Free Church. In the main the boys are found in the Church of Scotland records while the girls records can be found in the Free Church records. I say, in the main, because one girl appears in both sets of records. Ian A C Scott

jecroft@att.net wrote: >Jean, > >As the rest of James & Georgina's children are registered with the Church of Scotland, it is doubtful that they were Free Church members. It is much more likely that the record was not made (illness/forgetfulness of recorder) ... > The fault did not necessarily lie with the keeper of the Register - there was a theoretical obligation on parents to register, but there was no mechanism for enforcing it (unlike the situation from 1855, from which date failure to report births, deaths or marriages to the civil Registrar was punishable by a fine). There were many reasons why parents might not register a child's baptism, not least the fact that a fee was normally payable to the Session Clerk for recording it. >or the record is illegible (handwriting/deterioration of ink). > > That is unlikely to be a significant problem for mid-19th century baptisms. The style of handwriting is not too far from today's, and even if the clerk wrote inelegantly, looking at surrounding records in the same hand, together with reasonable background knowledge of the terminology used and the local names, both place and personal, will generally give sufficient clues to allow difficult entries to be deciphered. I think the original query concerned "missing" baptisms in a range of parishes along the Moray coast? One reason for baptisms slipping between the cracks in this part of the country could be the relatively large number of "chapels of ease". The typical parish had a single kirk which the whole population attended, and would consequently be under the eye of the Minister. But in extensive and populous parishes like Fordyce and Rathven, there were numerous subsidiary kirks, to cater for parts of the parish more remote from the parish kirk, but these did not keep their own registers unless and until they were declared to be "quoad sacra" parishes in their own right. So if a harrassed new father could not be bothered to take the time to traipse over to what might have been an unfamiliar "official" parish kirk to register his new child, who can blame him? Gavin Bell

Jean, As the rest of James & Georgina's children are registered with the Church of Scotland, it is doubtful that they were Free Church members. It is much more likely that the record was not made (illness/forgetfulness of recorder) or the record is illegible (handwriting/deterioration of ink). On familysearch, James Stewart, son of James & Georgina, is shown as marrying Helen Marshall on 16 Oct 1874 in Buckie. If your James married Helen, then there is your proof of parentage, although you might never get an exact date of birth. -- Jo-Ann Croft

Thanks for your info Jo-Ann. I have a lot of family info but not the exaact date and place of James my grandfather. My father was from his second marriage to Margaret Douglas. Think I shall have to give up on date and place - a daughter of one of his sons from the first marriage said he was born in Lossiemouth - so I will have to be satisfied with that unofficial info. Again, thanks. Jean Stewart ----- Original Message ----- From: <jecroft@att.net> To: <moray@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 7:02 PM Subject: Re: [MORAY] Free Church > Jean, > > As the rest of James & Georgina's children are registered with the Church > of Scotland, it is doubtful that they were Free Church members. It is > much more likely that the record was not made (illness/forgetfulness of > recorder) or the record is illegible (handwriting/deterioration of ink). > > On familysearch, James Stewart, son of James & Georgina, is shown as > marrying Helen Marshall on 16 Oct 1874 in Buckie. If your James married > Helen, then there is your proof of parentage, although you might never get > an exact date of birth. > > -- > Jo-Ann Croft > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MORAY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Jean What time frame are you looking at? After 1855 when civil registration commenced all registrations would be on Scotlandspeople. Andy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Stewart" <jean46@telus.net> To: <MORAY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 12:02 PM Subject: [MORAY] Free Church > I'm wondering if someone would point me in the right direction to find > registrations for births, deaths, etc. within the Free Church for areas > around Rathven, Buckie, Loosiemouth etc. I realize this includes several > different Parishes. Thanks for any advice > > Jean Stewart > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MORAY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >

> I'm wondering if someone would point me in the right direction > to find > registrations for births, deaths, etc. within the Free Church > for areas around > Rathven, Buckie, Loosiemouth etc. I realize this includes > several different > Parishes. Thanks for any advice Buckie is in Rathven, and Lossiemouth is in Drainie, so that's only two parishes. The National Archives of Scotland has records of Drainie Free Church from 1845 to 1961. However the catalogue entry (CH3/745) does not specify whether or not they contain baptism, banns or burial records. There are also various records of Free Churches in Buckie, catalogue entry CH3/1524, starting in 1843. Again, the catalogue entry does not say whether or not they contain baptism, banns or burial records. As far as I am aware there were no separate Free Church burial grounds. If I am wrong no doubt someone will correct me. There might be microfilms of these records in the Local Heritage Centre in Elgin, but you'd have to ask about that. I don't recall having seen them. Unless you specifically want the church records, you can get all the necessary informatio after 1855 from the civil records of birth, marriage and death at www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk HTH Anne

> Someone will correct me if I am wrong but I seem to recall the > Free Church > and Free Presbyterian Church forbad the LDS filming any of > their records > because they fundamentally disagree with the reason why the > records were > being filmed i.e. the re-baptising of ancestors. I thought that the same applied to the Roman Catholic Church as well. Anne

Jean, Someone will correct me if I am wrong but I seem to recall the Free Church and Free Presbyterian Church forbad the LDS filming any of their records because they fundamentally disagree with the reason why the records were being filmed i.e. the re-baptising of ancestors. Mark

Jean Stewart wrote: >I'm wondering if someone would point me in the right direction to find registrations for births, deaths, etc. within the Free Church for areas around Rathven, Buckie, Loosiemouth etc. I realize this includes several different Parishes. Thanks for any advice > > Such records as survive are most likely to held by the National Archives of Scotland, although some are in local archives. There is a useful volume by Diane Baptie: "Registers of the Secession Churches in Scotland" (ISBN 0-874722-16-1 published by the Scottish Association of Family History Societies) which gives information on surviviving Registers from various of the breakaways from the Kirk of Scotland, of which the "Disruption" or foundation of the Free Kirk in 1843 was the last and largest. Various of these splinter groups subsequently merged in the later 19th and early 20th century, so some Registers of the Free Kirk for the period 1843-1855 may well have ended up with different denominations. The surviving records most commonly include baptisms, some have marriages, but very few list deaths. Gavin Bell

Thanks to everyone who answered my query - lots of avenues to check. Trying to find birth place and date of my Grandfather - James Stewart born in 1846 - have had several people look to no avail -. Family legend is that he was born in Buckie or Lossiemouth son of James Stewart and Georgina Munro who were married in Buckie. Guess it wouldn't be any fun if it was easy? Again thanks Jean Stewart - Brooks, Alberta

I'm wondering if someone would point me in the right direction to find registrations for births, deaths, etc. within the Free Church for areas around Rathven, Buckie, Loosiemouth etc. I realize this includes several different Parishes. Thanks for any advice Jean Stewart

Hello Thiara - Yes, he had a son John. His wife was Margaret...........(could be Legg). Regards, Lesley

Hello, Do you by any change know if this gentleman had a son called John Allan who married a Cantlie? Thanks Thiara -----Original Message----- From: moray-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:moray-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Anne Burgess Sent: 29 July 2009 14:36 To: moray@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MORAY] Keith burial lookup > >Hello, Could someone please do a lookup for a JOHN > ALLAN who died between the Census of 1851 and 1861 in > Keith.  He was born in Grange abt. 1770-1773.  > Married to Elspet Barclay in 7.7.1795 in Keith.  > > > > If you are looking for burial data, then you will need to > contact Moray > Council.  I have not managed, via their website, to > discover what burial > records exist, but you will get basic points of contact > at: > >     http://www.moray.gov.uk/moray_standard/page_39980.html > > I imagine you would have to email or write with your query > - burial > records are not often online or even computerised. The Moray Local Heritage Centre has microfilm of all the burial books for the present district of Moray. These include the Old Cemetery at Keith, and Broomhill Cemetery on the outskirts of the town. The Old Cemetery burial records have mostly been indexed and are available online at http://libindx.moray.gov.uk/mainmenu.asp Indexing of the Keith Broomhill burial records is in progress, and records indexed so far are on the same web site. LIBINDX also contains an index to all Moray gravestone inscriptions found and transcribed in 1978/9. This includes much of the County of Banff, and specifically Keith. Anne ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MORAY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

> >Hello, Could someone please do a lookup for a JOHN > ALLAN who died between the Census of 1851 and 1861 in > Keith.  He was born in Grange abt. 1770-1773.  > Married to Elspet Barclay in 7.7.1795 in Keith.  > > > > If you are looking for burial data, then you will need to > contact Moray > Council.  I have not managed, via their website, to > discover what burial > records exist, but you will get basic points of contact > at: > >     http://www.moray.gov.uk/moray_standard/page_39980.html > > I imagine you would have to email or write with your query > - burial > records are not often online or even computerised. The Moray Local Heritage Centre has microfilm of all the burial books for the present district of Moray. These include the Old Cemetery at Keith, and Broomhill Cemetery on the outskirts of the town. The Old Cemetery burial records have mostly been indexed and are available online at http://libindx.moray.gov.uk/mainmenu.asp Indexing of the Keith Broomhill burial records is in progress, and records indexed so far are on the same web site. LIBINDX also contains an index to all Moray gravestone inscriptions found and transcribed in 1978/9. This includes much of the County of Banff, and specifically Keith. Anne

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: jebarker1406 Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.mor.general/493.510.512.517.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: I hope you still read these after 9 years. I am related to the Cummings. I would enjoy hearing from you.James and Dinah were my 3X great grandparents. John Barker Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

Hi Everyone, Many thanks to those for their help in trying to find my elusive John Allan......All the best, Lesley