This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.2.1.2 Message Board Post: If our William Riley Massengale was born in 1840 he would have only been 15 when he married Abigail. She was 18.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.2.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: The probate records say that Phebebe? was Mathew and Betsey daughter. So was she only 9 years old when she got married? That would be young. Did you find your William Mathew Massengale in Missouri on the census anywhere in 1870 or 1880? Because I haven't but I can't find Washington and Phebe on the census after 1856. Who knows how the census taker spelled their name.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.2.1.1.1 Message Board Post: Ok. That was not the right Washington Grider. I have found a database that states George Washington Grider married Phebe Massingale on 03 Sep 1864 in Scott County, TN. It says she was born Nov 1855--a birthdate that conflicts with the deposition of Henry & Delilah Goodman. According to their deposition, Phebe was a daughter of Matthew Massengale and Patsy Thompson, however Matthew definitely was married to Elizabeth Anderson by 1850. If Phebe was indeed born in November 1855, she was a daughter of Elizabeth Anderson, not Patsy Thompson.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.2.1.1 Message Board Post: This is interesting. The 1860 Census shows Washington Grider already married to Mary Ann "Phebeber" Massengale. This means that Matthew III had to have been in the Russell County KY area by this time, however we have not been able to find him enumerated anywhere in 1860. The census taker used ditto marks down the place of birth column, which is an assumption he made that is not correct. It is highly unlikely that everyone on the page was born in Kentucky, and therefore it is probable that the place of birth for Washington Grider's wife is also incorrect. I checked the 1880 census, and it shows his wife to be Mary Ann, there, too. He is the only Washington Griter/Grider enumerated in the census records anywhere at any time. 1860 Federal Population Census Jamestown, Russell District, Russell County, Kentucky p. 10 69-69 Washington Grider 23 M Farmer Ky Mary Ann “ 23 F “ John W “ 4/12 M

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.2.1 Message Board Post: Regarding the probate records, they are the only complete lists that I know of, of the children of Matthew II and Matthew III. I do not know if any children may have been left off of either list. Something I just noticed on the 1880 census for Levi/William Riley is that it states his father was born in VA. IF this information is correct, it is a problem for you in that Matthew III (the one you call Matthew Jr who was married to Abigail) was born in Tennessee. His father Matthew II (the one you call Matthew Sr) was born in North Carolina. Matthew I (whom I call Matthew SR and the father of your Matthew SR) was born in Virginia, but was in his 80's in the 1830's. Additionally, the 1880 census states that he was born in 1840 in Tennessee, not 1837 in Iowa. This is actually good news for you, in that it places it within the realm of possibility that Matthew III was his father. HOWEVER, having said that, here is an abstract of the 1850 Scott County census, showing Matthew III, Henry and Jesse Massengale, three of Matthew II's sons, living next door to one another. William Riley, who would have been around 10-13 years old (if the census records are correct), is not in enumerated in any of these households. I do think William Riley somehow belongs to the family of Matthew II, but as with the Massengales in general, there is a tangle of misinformation to sort through to get to the truth. One thing I have discovered--when you find the missing puzzle piece, everything else falls into place. 1850 Federal Population Census District No 18, Scott County, Tennessee 27 September 1850 p. 379 258-258 M.[athew] Massingille40 M Farmer Tennessee Elizabeth Massengill 42 F Tennessee Nancy Massengill 19 F Tennessee Lewis Massengille 14 M Tennessee Henry Massengille 10 M Tennessee 259-259 H. [enry] Massengille 46 M Farmer Tennessee Mary Massengille 39 F Tennessee Mathew Massengill 18 M Tennessee Disea Massengille 13 F Tennessee Wm Massengille 9 M Tennessee Jessee Massengille 7 M Tennessee 260-260 Jessee Massengille 38 M Farmer Tennessee Disea Massengille 38 F Tennessee Elijah Massengille 2 M Tennessee Here is Milla Massengale, d/o Matthew III: 1850 Federal Population Census Perry Township, Marion County, Indiana p. 332 201-201 Meshack Laws 24 M Laborer Ky Amelia Laws 19 F Tenn Mary J Laws 7 F Tenn Washington Grider who would eventually marry Phebe? Phebeber? Massengale is enumerated in Russell Co, KY, age 13, the son of Wilkerson Grider. Matthew III was in Russell County in 1865. Phebeber is listed as Mary Ann in a later census.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.2 Message Board Post: Do you have any information on William Mathew Massengale living in Dawson other then the Probate Records? Do yo have any of the names of Mathew Sr.'s grandchild that weren't in the Probate Records? How many had kids named William could our William be one of those kids? I would think that he was either a son or grandson of Mathew Sr. because they all lived in Jefferson County and Decatur County, Iowa together. And Washington and William married sisters. What I really am looking for is Washington/Phebe and William/Abigail's descendants to try and see if they have information on our Randall line. Which has also been a brick wall. Maybe I want to much proof! Maybe that is why we can't get pass John Randall and Louisa!

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1.1 Message Board Post: William's daughter (Iva) said that her father died near Burlington Jct., Missouri which is just east of Dawson. Dawson isn't there anymore but that is where it was. Dawson was between Lincoln twp. and Burlington Jct. There are maps on the USGENWEB.COM if you go into the Missouri page then the county one for Nodaway there are maps. Then you can also go back to the Missouri page and down close to the bottom there is a link that says Find out what county a city is in ... Use the USGS/GNIS if you go into this site you can search for a town you are looking for and then on the next page click the town you want then it will take you to a page telling you what alll names it went by and at the bottom of that page click where it says Show feature location and it will take you to where you can see where it was. If you do these things you will see that Dawson was east of Lincoln Twp. and north of Green Twp. and very near Burlington Jct.. So to me it go along with the censuses for William and Abigail and also what William's daughter said about where he died. I wish I knew what to tell you but I don't. Could you tell me where your William and his wife were at on the censuses in 1870, 1880?

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1.1 Message Board Post: Mary, Yes I do understand that William Riley Massengale does not have a son named George. William Matthew Massengale does have a son named George and also a son named Harrison. What I am saying is that your William Riley Massengale cannot be the William who was the son of Matthew Massengale and Patsy Thompson. If William Riley Massengale was born in Iowa in 1837, his parents cannot be Matthew and Patsy Thompson, because Matthew Massengale and Patsy Thompson were in Anderson County, Tennessee, in 1837. If for some reason the information that William Riley Massengale was born in Iowa is incorrect and he was actually born in Tennessee, then he could be Matthew and Patsy's son. On the other hand, I submit William Matthew Massengale can be and is the son of Matthew by a wife he had before Patsy Thompson, because he was the William Massengale in Dawson, Missouri in 1883. Also, from what I have been able to find, William Riley Massengale did not live in Dawson; he lived in L! incoln.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2.1 Message Board Post: If you notice on that on the 1870 William and Abigail didn't have a child by the name of George and on the 1880 under Levi who is William after Abigail died in 1878 there still isn't any George. So that makes me think that your William isn't our William.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: The connection to our Randall family is where I am. The infromation comes from marriage records, censuses, and Probate records. The Mathew Jr. I am talking about is Patsey Thompson husband the probate records say that William was Mathew Jr. and Patsey Thompson son. It is on the attachments 6 and 7 I posted. It says Patsey was his 1st wife. William and Abigail married in Marion Co., Iowa. Name Spouse Marriage Date County State WILLIAM MASSENGALE ABIGAIL C. RANDALL 27 Sep 1855 Marion IA What I posted is all we know at this time and if we find anything else I will post it. I posted copies of the orignal Probate Records. It has Massengale Sr.s children and some grandchildren. We thought that William was Washington's brother until we found the probate records and maybe he was but the probate records say that Mathew Jr. who was married to Patsey Thompson was the father of William Massengale living in Dawson and that is where Abigail and William lived. I have posted all we know. I was hoping it would help others. Sorry if it hasn't. Mary

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.1.2 Message Board Post: I have been studying the Jefferson, IA, 1850 census with great interest, and a couple of things leap out at me that may raise more questions than answers at this point. One, who is the Wm. Massengale that was born in Ireland? Considering that he is immediately next to Matthew and his sons, he must be related; however the Massengales had been in America over 100 years by this time, so it's very intriguing to find this connection. Second, also neighbors to the Massengales are James Barger and Abraham Barger. It may mean nothing, but I find it highly coincidental that my William Matthew Massengale's son George married a daughter of Elizabeth Barger whose father was John Barger. It may be someting worth noting.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1.1.1.2 Message Board Post: When you say Matthew JR, I assume you are meaning Matthew III. I always think of Matthew II, because his father was SR.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: I don't believe he ever was. Remember, his brother had been his representative in the matter of Matthew II's estate.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: Another thing we haven't found Mathew Jr in Missouri or Iowa on anything.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1.2 Message Board Post: I also note that John Louis Massengale was born in TN in 1836. I'm not sure when Jesse was born--in fact, he and Kesiah are two of Matthew III's children we were not aware of. There was a Jesse Massengale tried for murder in Scott County, TN. I thought it was Henry's son Jesse born in 1843, but it could well have been Matthew III's son. P. 428 STATE VS JESSE MASSENGALE: MURDER Jesse Massongale alais Jesse Massengill on 2-11-1860 in the county of Scott, state of Tennessee without the fear of God and being seduced by the Devil, with force and arms in and upon one GEORGE SHOOPMAN, with a knife worth the value of $0.50 which said Jesse Massengale in his right hand then and there had and held the George Shoopman in and upon the right side of the belly, just below the short ribs of him the said George Shoopman, one mortal wound the breadth of one inch and the depth of three inches. (clipped) did kill and murder in the first degree, the said George Massengale. In another sentence it says the breadth is two inches. William Payne pros. Witnesses: Wilson W. Duncan, Calvin Duncan, Sampson McGee, Thomas McGee and Andy Shoopman. Campbell C. Reed foreman of the Jury. Jury was: 1. Elisha Daugherty, 2 John Potter Sr., 3. Fountian Sexton. 4. Joel Looper, 5. W. W. Cotton, 6. James Newport, 7. Elisha Slaven, 8. Emerson Looper, 9. Daniel Sexton, 10. Wesley Buttram, 11. John Brown, 12 Sterling McDonald. On 12-17-1869 this jury found Massengale not guilty, he was released and the state paid the cost.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: One chief problem I see with William Riley Massengale being the son of Matthew III is that he was born in Iowa in 1837. While Matthew II was in Iowa by that year (The 1856 Iowa State census says he had been living in Iowa for 19 years), Matthew III was still in Anderson County TN in 1840. He cannot have been in Tennessee and Iowa at the same time.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.2.1 Message Board Post: It IS confusing, isn't it. When I speak of William Massengale and his son Harrison, I am referring to William "Billy" Matthew Massengale, b. 01 Sep 1829 Morgan Co TN. His son Harrison Matthew Massengale was b. 05 Mar 1855 Wayne Co KY, son of Billy and Rosanah Jane Slagle. I am attaching a jpeg file of the photograph that was taken of them on their trip to Missouri. It was taken in Kansas City. Harrison married Nancy Mahala Neal in Wayne Co KY in 1878. He is my husband's ggg grandfather. They are definitely a different set of William and Harrison than your William and Harrison in Lincoln Twp.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.2 Message Board Post: Fay when you said that "William Massengale and his son Harrison traveled to Missouri for an extended length of time" who are they? Abigail's husband William and his son Harrison lived in Missouri. Iva (Massengale) Puett said her dad died near Burlington Jct., Missouri at the age of 85. The last post I send I put Iva's sister's name as Jennie Carmichael her real name was Nancy Jane (Massengale) Carmichael but she went by Jennie.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.3.1.1.1 Message Board Post: This is a book we found on Hesitage Quest on page 464 Mrs. Iva (Massengale) Puett gave infromation about her father. She said her father's name was William Riley Massengale that in the 70's they lived near Burlington Jct., Missouri there were 9 children in her family 3 still living when she wrote the information for this book she wrote it on Sept. 11,1930 She wrote it to Dr. S. E. Massengill in Bristol, Tenn. Iva Puett was living at 924 Lane St., Falls City, Nebraska at that time her brother James Alfred Massengale was living Sasakwa, Okla. and her sister Jennie Carmicheal was living at 2234 Q. St., Lincoln, Nebraska. Iva wrote the letter for her brother to Dr.S. E. Massengill. Here is the author's name and the name of the book. Author: Massengill, Samuel Evans The Massengills, Massengales and variants, 1472-1931 Briston, Tenn.: King Print. Co., c1931, 961 pgs. This is the 1870 census on William and Abagail's family. She died in 1878 for some reason William used the name Levi on the 1880 that is the only census that we found him using a different name then William. But we know it is him because all the kids are the same. Also Louisa was born in Iowa not Indiana. She was a baby on the 1856 census in Decatur County, Iowa. Anyway this is the 1870 Census Green Twp., Nodaway County, Missouri. Birth Year Birthplace Race Gender View Image Save This Abagail Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 30 1839 Indiana White Female Harrison Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 12 1857 Missouri White Male James A Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 4 1865 Missouri White Male Lewis E Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 9 1860 Missouri White Male Louisa Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 13 1856 Indiana White Female Nancy J Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 1 1868 Missouri White Female William Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 33 1836 Illinois White Male William S Massengale Green, Nodaway, MO 7 1862 Missouri White Male

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/BMB.2ACE/874.1.2.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1 Message Board Post: I think we found the 1890 Veteran Census at the library in Rockport, Missouri.