Hello Listers Can anybody help here please?? Some family members appear to be missing from my PAINTER family, living in Caerleon, Newport 1841 Census. I can only find three of them - there should be several more - Edwards wife, another son and possibly a daughter. 1841 Census - Caerleon, Newport EDWARD PAINTER - 50yrs - Caerleon, Newport GEORGE PAINTER - 15yrs - Caerleon, Newport STEPHEN PAINTER - 12yrs - Caerleon, Newport Kind regards from Maree S. Gordon, New Zealnd

Do you know their names? >From: Maree Gordon <tappets@clear.net.nz> >Reply-To: tappets@clear.net.nz, monmouthshire@rootsweb.com >To: MONMOUTHSHIRE@rootsweb.com >Subject: [MON] Edward PAINTER 1841 Census >Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2007 07:57:44 +1200 > >Hello Listers >Can anybody help here please?? > >Some family members appear to be missing from my PAINTER family, living >in Caerleon, Newport 1841 Census. > >I can only find three of them - there should be several more - Edwards >wife, another son and possibly a daughter. > >1841 Census - Caerleon, Newport >EDWARD PAINTER - 50yrs - Caerleon, Newport >GEORGE PAINTER - 15yrs - Caerleon, Newport >STEPHEN PAINTER - 12yrs - Caerleon, Newport > >Kind regards from Maree S. Gordon, New Zealnd > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >MONMOUTHSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >quotes in the subject and the body of the message _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

Hello All, I would welcome any lister who has an interest in either of the above names to contact me. Also the surname of Evans in Newport originating from Linton, Herefordshire. Best regards,Kevin, Co Cork,Ireland. _________________________________________________________________ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

Hi Rachel, This was not be the place of death but the place of burial. Therefore, Ivor John could have died anywhere in the UK. I was told it was normal for servicemen who died in the UK to be returned to their hometown, while those who died abroad were usually burial in the area were they died. Note there are millions buried in France and Belgium. No, you are right no Freds dying at the right time. This is why it is possible his nickname was Freddy rather than his real name. It was common in the services to give people nicknames and, I have been assured, in many cases the name had no connection with the real name. I may be clutching at straws but if nothing comes up soon I will have to write by normal mail to Cranwell or phone them, which is a bit difficult from Japan. Best wishes, Charles ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rachel Boyd" <rachel-boyd@sbcglobal.net> To: <monmouthshire@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 8:58 PM Subject: Re: [MON] Ivor John JACKSON > OK Charles, following on your reasoning, I looked up the death index for > Ivor J. Jackson, and find that it was recorded in his home town of > Abergavenny, not at the base in Lincolnshire. > [1st qtr 1919 Abergavenny folio 11a page 88, he was age 23] > > On the same index page there are 2 Fred Jacksons about the right age, no > idea of course if they were in RAF or any other service, but just throwing > it out there in case anyone can illuminate: > [Jackson, Frederick, age 25, Derby, 7b, 904] > [Jackson, Frederick A., age 33, S. Shields, 10a, 1502] > > There are no Fred Jackson deaths of the right age in 2nd Qtr 1919 index. > > Rachel > CT, USA

Hi Rachel, The information came from the Commonwealth War Graves Commission and was backed up by an expert on the RAF. Actually three RAF JACKSONs died in 1919 and while a lot of JACKSONs in the services died in 1919 - 81 to be exact - only three of them were serving in the RAF. One of them was buried in France, so he doesn't count. The character who is supposed to be a ghost died two days before the photograph and buried the same day, therefore it means he is likely to have been buried in the UK. The choice of RAF staff was narrowed down to Sergeant Ivor John JACKSON and Private William JACKSON. Neither called Freddy officially but the armed servicemen and women often ended up with nicknames, usually based on a joke or something like that. One problem is that Cranwell until 1919 was run by the RNAS and called HMS Daedalus (after a training ship anchored in the Medway) and the servicemen and women at Cranwell were from all branches of the services including the Merchant Navy. I have also checked the BMDs but they are incomplete and William JACKSON isn't recorded on Ancestry or Free BMD, but he is on the CWGC and when you check the date on the images available on Ancestry he is there too. The servicemen and women became officially RAF when the RFC and RNAS joined together to create the RAF, so it was suggested to me that the three who were serving with the RAF are likely to be the best candidates for Freddy JACKSON. There were several Fredericks and some Alfreds in other services but none suited the information and some died abroad. Long answer but might be useful. I haven't got anywhere with Freddy and so I may have to contact Cranwell itself but they don't seem to have an e-mail address. Best wishes, Charles ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rachel Boyd" <rachel-boyd@sbcglobal.net> To: <monmouthshire@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [MON] Ivor John JACKSON > I'm curious where you got the information that only two RAF men died in UK > in 1919. (I'm not disputing, just wondering what your source is). Sorry I > can't help in your quest. > Rachel > CT, USA

Hi Lynda and John, Lynda, thanks for your suggestion but it would a rather expensive way of finding out, especially if it turns out Ivor wasn't Freddy. I'm not in any way related to JACKSON ~ I'm just making a series of interesting worksheet for my students. I thought I would look into the mystery. I checked with an expert on the RAF and a ghosthunter in Lincolnshire but neither could add to what was already on the Net. There's actually little on the Net though numerous sites ~ all give more or less the same story and some are so obviously copied as to be laughable. (A good few copied the instruction to click on the picture to make it larger as if they hadn't really read what the information said.) John, yes, it is an interesting story. The actual material seems to to come from an Air Marshal Sir Victor Goddard but not until 1975. Another witness quoted was a 97 year old woman who served at Cranwell and remembered Freddy. Though an interesting story, I have enlarged the photograph to fill my computer screen and I would say the ghostly face is the face of the man in front of it. It is possible he didn't have his cap on and put it on during the process of the photograph being taken. Remember this was 1919 and there weren't any digital cameras then. Many of the features of both faces are very similar and I'm pretty sure it is just a double exposure. However, I leave my students to decide. Still it would be nice to get to the bottom of it. Best wishes, Charles ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lynda Ahmad" <lynda@ahmad1.freeserve.co.uk> To: <monmouthshire@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 4:36 PM Subject: Re: [MON] Ivor John JACKSON > Hello Charles, > > Perhaps if you get the death certificate for Ivor you can see if the cause > of death matches Freddy. > > Best wishes, > Lynda ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Jones" <genes@genesrus.org> To: <monmouthshire@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 4:37 PM Subject: Re: [MON] Ivor John JACKSON > Hi Charles. > > Now thats what I call an interesting story, even if I can't help with any > answers. > > Hope you have some luck with this. > > John Jones

Harold Thank you for your e-mail and I apologise for the delay in response, I have been on holiday. I was actually brought up in Llanhilleth, although not born there. I would love to be able to help you in your research but I have no knowledge of the Toppin family, and can only point you in the direction of the usual sources such as ancestry.co.uk However I am puzzled as to Llanhilleth previously being called "Lanthil", as far as I am aware it was called "Llanhiddel" but not "Lanthil". Are we definitely talking about Llanhilleth now in Gwent formerly in Monmouthshire? Do you have the parish record of her birth? I may be able to clarify that detail for you. Regards Jane Dyer. "Harold W. Evans, M.D." <hldevans@medicine.nodak.edu> wrote: Jane, In the suject e-mail you wrote that you were born in Llanhilleth. Because of that, I have taken the liberty to write to you. My great-great-grandmother was born in Llanhilleth when its name was Lanthil. Perhaps you may be able to provide some information to me about her family. Frances Toppin, b. 1809, d. 8 Apr 1857 in Centre County, Pennsylvania, USA. 29 Jun 1828: Married John Croft in the Parish of Bedwellty, Monmouth. 1841: Lived in the Parish of Bedwellty, Monmouth. 1851: Emigrated to the USA on the Bark Laurens out of Bristol. John Croft, b. 1805 in the Parish of Bedwellty, Monmouth, d. in the USA 1841: Foreman or forgeman at the Ebbw Vale Ironworks Thanks, Harold W. Evans 293 Circle Hills Drive Grand Forks, North Dakota 58201 USA ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MONMOUTHSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Harold, I looked at the 1851 Census and I think the enumerator got tired of writing in 1851 and it should have been Llanhillleth which was also known as LLanhiddel but not Lanthil. In 1841 the Census Image shows they lived in the Hamlet of Manmoel and in 1851 they lived in the village of Ebbw Vale. Regards Barbara

Hi Listers, Make a visit in search of a ghost. Let me explain: I am making some worksheets for my students and wanted to do something on ghosts. I found a strange photograph which claims to have a ghostly airman on it. His name was given as Freddy JACKSON but no Freddy JACKSONs died in 1919 who were in the RAF. Only two men died in 1919 in the UK and were serving in the RAF and one was an Ivor John JACKSON, son of George and Melinda JACKSON of Abergavenny. I have found him on the 1901 Census but I wonder if anyone knows anymore about him. The photograph was taken at HMS Daedalus - actually Cranwell in Lincolnshire. It shows a group of mixed servicemen and women who were by then members of the RAF but yet to get standard uniforms. One man, looks like he had been a member of the Navy, has a strange ghostly face behind his head. Air Marshal GODDARD, who served at Cranwell, claimed this was the ghost of Freddy JACKSON who died two days before. Knowing the services, Freddy could be a nickname and only his surname may be exact. I would be happy with any details, even if in the negative, to find out if Ivor was Freddy or not. Freddy died by accident when he fell into the spinning propeller of an aircraft either in early or summer 1919. Ivor John died in March 1919 - details unknown. Can anyone help? Best wishes, Charles

Thank you Barbara. That's odd. Guess I'll keep looking. Judy ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

Jane, As I recall, it was more than a year ago that, in response to an inquiry about the CROFTSand TOPPINS, I received an e-mail from a man who wrote that he lived near Llanhilleth. He stated that the prior name was Lanthil. I have no other source. I obtained the data about Frances Toppin from the 1851 census for the Parish of Bedwellty. Perhaps that is available to you. I appreciate your interest. Harold JANE DYER wrote: >Harold > Thank you for your e-mail and I apologise for the delay in response, I have been on holiday. > I was actually brought up in Llanhilleth, although not born there. I would love to be able to help you in your research but I have no knowledge of the Toppin family, and can only point you in the direction of the usual sources such as ancestry.co.uk > However I am puzzled as to Llanhilleth previously being called "Lanthil", as far as I am aware it was called "Llanhiddel" but not "Lanthil". Are we definitely talking about Llanhilleth now in Gwent formerly in Monmouthshire? Do you have the parish record of her birth? I may be able to clarify that detail for you. > > Regards > Jane Dyer. >"Harold W. Evans, M.D." <hldevans@medicine.nodak.edu> wrote: > Jane, > >In the suject e-mail you wrote that you were born in Llanhilleth. >Because of that, I have taken the liberty to write to you. > >My great-great-grandmother was born in Llanhilleth when its name was >Lanthil. Perhaps you may be able to provide some information to me >about her family. > >Frances Toppin, b. 1809, d. 8 Apr 1857 in Centre County, >Pennsylvania, USA. >29 Jun 1828: Married John Croft in the Parish of Bedwellty, >Monmouth. >1841: Lived in the Parish of Bedwellty, Monmouth. >1851: Emigrated to the USA on the Bark Laurens out of Bristol. > >John Croft, b. 1805 in the Parish of Bedwellty, Monmouth, d. in the USA >1841: Foreman or forgeman at the Ebbw Vale Ironworks > >Thanks, > >Harold W. Evans >293 Circle Hills Drive >Grand Forks, North Dakota 58201 >USA > > > > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MONMOUTHSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MONMOUTHSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Hi Charles. Now thats what I call an interesting story, even if I can't help with any answers. Hope you have some luck with this. John Jones ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles" <evans_gunther@ybb.ne.jp> To: <MONMOUTHSHIRE@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 4:00 AM Subject: [MON] Ivor John JACKSON > Hi Listers, > Make a visit in search of a ghost. > > Let me explain: I am making some worksheets for my students and wanted to > do > something on ghosts. I found a strange photograph which claims to have a > ghostly airman on it. His name was given as Freddy JACKSON but no Freddy > JACKSONs died in 1919 who were in the RAF. > > Only two men died in 1919 in the UK and were serving in the RAF and one > was > an Ivor John JACKSON, son of George and Melinda JACKSON of Abergavenny. I > have found him on the 1901 Census but I wonder if anyone knows anymore > about > him. > > The photograph was taken at HMS Daedalus - actually Cranwell in > Lincolnshire. It shows a group of mixed servicemen and women who were by > then members of the RAF but yet to get standard uniforms. One man, looks > like he had been a member of the Navy, has a strange ghostly face behind > his > head. Air Marshal GODDARD, who served at Cranwell, claimed this was the > ghost of Freddy JACKSON who died two days before. Knowing the services, > Freddy could be a nickname and only his surname may be exact. > > I would be happy with any details, even if in the negative, to find out if > Ivor was Freddy or not. Freddy died by accident when he fell into the > spinning propeller of an aircraft either in early or summer 1919. Ivor > John > died in March 1919 - details unknown. > > Can anyone help? > > Best wishes, > Charles > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MONMOUTHSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.13.2/985 - Release Date: 02/09/2007 > 16:32 > >

Hello Charles, Perhaps if you get the death certificate for Ivor you can see if the cause of death matches Freddy. Best wishes, Lynda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles" I found a strange photograph which claims to have a > ghostly airman on it. His name was given as Freddy JACKSON but no Freddy > JACKSONs died in 1919 who were in the RAF. > > Only two men died in 1919 in the UK and were serving in the RAF and one > was > an Ivor John JACKSON> > I would be happy with any details, even if in the negative, to find out if > Ivor was Freddy or not. Freddy died by accident when he fell into the > spinning propeller of an aircraft either in early or summer 1919. Ivor > John > died in March 1919 - details unknown.

Hello Judy, Have you places and dates of birth for them, I have searched but there is no William and Eliza in 1861. Regards Barbara

OK Charles, following on your reasoning, I looked up the death index for Ivor J. Jackson, and find that it was recorded in his home town of Abergavenny, not at the base in Lincolnshire. [1st qtr 1919 Abergavenny folio 11a page 88, he was age 23] On the same index page there are 2 Fred Jacksons about the right age, no idea of course if they were in RAF or any other service, but just throwing it out there in case anyone can illuminate: [Jackson, Frederick, age 25, Derby, 7b, 904] [Jackson, Frederick A., age 33, S. Shields, 10a, 1502] There are no Fred Jackson deaths of the right age in 2nd Qtr 1919 index. Rachel CT, USA Charles <evans_gunther@ybb.ne.jp> wrote: Hi Listers, Make a visit in search of a ghost. Let me explain: I am making some worksheets for my students and wanted to do something on ghosts. I found a strange photograph which claims to have a ghostly airman on it. His name was given as Freddy JACKSON but no Freddy JACKSONs died in 1919 who were in the RAF. Only two men died in 1919 in the UK and were serving in the RAF and one was an Ivor John JACKSON, son of George and Melinda JACKSON of Abergavenny. I have found him on the 1901 Census but I wonder if anyone knows anymore about him. The photograph was taken at HMS Daedalus - actually Cranwell in Lincolnshire. It shows a group of mixed servicemen and women who were by then members of the RAF but yet to get standard uniforms. One man, looks

I'm curious where you got the information that only two RAF men died in UK in 1919. (I'm not disputing, just wondering what your source is). Sorry I can't help in your quest. Rachel CT, USA Charles <evans_gunther@ybb.ne.jp> wrote: Hi Listers, Make a visit in search of a ghost. Let me explain: I am making some worksheets for my students and wanted to do something on ghosts. I found a strange photograph which claims to have a ghostly airman on it. His name was given as Freddy JACKSON but no Freddy JACKSONs died in 1919 who were in the RAF. Only two men died in 1919 in the UK and were serving in the RAF and one was an Ivor John JACKSON, son of George and Melinda JACKSON of Abergavenny. I have found him on the 1901 Census but I wonder if anyone knows anymore about him. The photograph was taken at HMS Daedalus - actually Cranwell in Lincolnshire. It shows a group of mixed servicemen and women who were by then members of the RAF but yet to get standard uniforms. One man, looks like he had been a member of the Navy, has a strange ghostly face behind his head. Air Marshal GODDARD, who served at Cranwell, claimed this was the ghost of Freddy JACKSON who died two days before. Knowing the services, Freddy could be a nickname and only his surname may be exact. I would be happy with any details, even if in the negative, to find out if Ivor was Freddy or not. Freddy died by accident when he fell into the spinning propeller of an aircraft either in early or summer 1919. Ivor John died in March 1919 - details unknown. Can anyone help? Best wishes, Charles ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MONMOUTHSHIRE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am hoping to get help locating a William Pollard and wife Eliza Knowles Pollard on the 1861 census possibly in Monmouthshire. They were married in Abergavnny in 1859. Eliza is a widow when she marries Alfred Griffin in 1867 in Betwelty, Monmouthsire. So I'm hoping the first marriage is on a census in 1861. Thanks you for any help I can get. Judy ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

Would any lister be able to inform me if Pant-yr-yn Farm near to Newbridge still exists. Would there be any records held anywhere which might inform me who were all the occupants who were living there in 1911. Thankyou. Eirwen.

Dear Alice, saw the mention of the SMITH name on the Monmouthshire List and I thought - WOW, another ancestor of mine! Sadly not, no mention of any Michael in our tree, missing or otherwise and definately no BLACKs that are known of either! You raised my hopes......... Never mind, shall have to carry on on my SMITHs and wish you all the best on yours. Happy hunting, Michael McAllister ----- Original Message ----- From: <GG1531@aol.com> To: <MONMOUTHSHIRE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2007 10:12 AM Subject: [MON] Surname - SMITH - Given - Michael >I have been trying to locate the parents of John BLACK or parents of his > wife Sarah. In the year 1850 they were living in Lower St. Clair Township, > Allegheny County, Pennsylvania. > John BLACK age abt. 27 and a miner - b. Pennsylvania > Sarah age abt 22 - wife - b. Pennsylvania > Mary L age abt 3 - daughter - b. Pennsylvania > Thomas age abt 1 - son - b. Pennsylvania > Michael D. SMITH age abt 15 - b. Wales > > I realize this is almost an impossible task but thinking someone might > have > a young man missing from a SMITH family and haven't any idea what happened > to > him. > Families usually sent someone so young to stay with family members. So, he > might be related through Sarah (her maiden name) or through Johns mother > (her > maiden name). > > If I don't somehow connect with someone who might know who John BLACKs > parents were and where they came from I won't be able to continue my > fathers line > further. > > Thought I would give this a try, people on this list have a lot of > experience researching and coming up with answers. I am keeping my fingers > crossed. > > Alice > California > > > > > > > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL > at > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour > >

Hello Alice, Because John and Sarah were born in Pennsylvania and were born there before the 1841 UK Census, both their parents would also have been living in America and would not be recorded on any Census in the UK. Have you got details of their marriage which would give you the details at least of the fathers of both John and Sarah, our UK Civil Marriages Registrations started in July 1837, have you the same type records in the USA. Best of Luck Regards Barbara