--WebTV-Mail-24420-1134 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Jean, are you aware that my MONCRIEF ancestors are Isaac and his father William CREEF/MONCRIEF? I'm certainly looking for everything I can get on him!! I've wondered if maybe land deeds might show a connection, so that's what I've been scouting for. Do you go to William? ********************************* Rockett's theory of relativity: If you go back far enough, we're all related. Please visit Rockett's Genealogy Web, a recommended website of The History Channel: http://www.kayrockett.com ******************************** --WebTV-Mail-24420-1134 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Message/RFC822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Received: from mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.45) by storefull-248.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:01:48 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: <MONCRIEF-L-request@rootsweb.com> Received: from bl-14.rootsweb.com (bl-14.rootsweb.com [209.85.6.30]) by mailsorter-101-11.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/ms.dwm.v7+dul2) with ESMTP id TAA06014 for <KayRockett@webtv.net>; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:01:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from slist@localhost) by bl-14.rootsweb.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA00762; Mon, 1 May 2000 19:01:07 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:01:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-Sender: jeantom@accucomm.net Mon May 1 19:01:05 2000 Message-ID: <003901bfb3da$840c3c20$89839bce@accucomm.net> From: "Jean & Tom Schroeder" <jeantom@accucomm.net> Old-To: <MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:02:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Subject: [MONCRIEF-L] William Creef Resent-Message-ID: <CdjL7.A.wL.ibjD5@bl-14.rootsweb.com> To: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com Resent-From: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com Reply-To: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com X-Mailing-List: <MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com> archive/latest/251 X-Loop: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: MONCRIEF-L-request@rootsweb.com I monitor this list looking for a connection between my Creef lines and the Moncreef's of Currituck Co., NC. One of the reasons I expect a connection is the abstract in Gordon Jones book of Currituck Co. Wills - Will Book 1, William Creef's will 16 March 1791. Names wife: Susanner; sons: Samuel MonCreef, Isaac MonCreef. Exrs: wife Susanner and Mr. James Brent: Wit by Joseph Poyner, James Brent, Elizabeth Brent. Will Book 2. A William Creef also witnesses the will of Richard Brent, 23 Dec 1793. This William Creef obviously dropped the "Mon", does anyone have anything on him??? I was told by another researcher some time ago that the Moncrief's who supported the revolution dropped the "Mon" during the War to distinguish themselves from the Moncrief's who supported the crown. Has anyone come across anything to support this theory. Jean ==== MONCRIEF Mailing List ==== RootsWeb forbids posting of copyrighted material without permission of the author. Read RootsWeb's Acceptable Use Policy at <http://www.rootsweb.com/rootsweb/aup.html> ============================== Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi --WebTV-Mail-24420-1134--

I monitor this list looking for a connection between my Creef lines and the Moncreef's of Currituck Co., NC. One of the reasons I expect a connection is the abstract in Gordon Jones book of Currituck Co. Wills - Will Book 1, William Creef's will 16 March 1791. Names wife: Susanner; sons: Samuel MonCreef, Isaac MonCreef. Exrs: wife Susanner and Mr. James Brent: Wit by Joseph Poyner, James Brent, Elizabeth Brent. Will Book 2. A William Creef also witnesses the will of Richard Brent, 23 Dec 1793. This William Creef obviously dropped the "Mon", does anyone have anything on him??? I was told by another researcher some time ago that the Moncrief's who supported the revolution dropped the "Mon" during the War to distinguish themselves from the Moncrief's who supported the crown. Has anyone come across anything to support this theory. Jean

Thanks for the thought Dennis, but I think the name was really Eliza as she had an aunt by that name also. I have found many nicknames for Elizabeth (Liza, Beth, Betsie, etc) but when I have found a Eliza in the past, Eliza has always been her name. Every other researcher has found her as "Eliza" also, I just like to get my documentation on computer and am just trying to get caught up doing that. I am more slack on documentation when it is not my direct line and she is not an ancestor - just trying to get things in a neat package since she was a sister to my ancestor. Before the day of the Internet, I did not worry too much about the side lines, but now one can read such wild stories that people make up about families without any documentation - just a wild imagination, that I have really gotten to be almost a fanatic on documentation. If you have found an Elizabeth for this couple that no one else has, I would really appreciate the information and documentation. Marlene

Many people were not called by their true names. All I ever heard my grandmonther called was Nanny Liza Hall. I didn't find out until I started my research on the family that her true full name was Nancy Elizabeth. Since then I have came across many people who had Nanny as the family name when their true name was Nancy. The same is true of Liza or Eliza. That was not their true name. It would be Elizabeth. It is often the case that the family name is far from the true name. That is what I was asking, implying nothing. Dennis -----Original Message----- From: Marlene Clark <marlene@eazylink.com> To: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com <MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 5:44 PM Subject: [MONCRIEF-L] Re: Documentation >Dennis, > >Like I said, it was Eliza Moncrief. After she married Campbell LeFlore, her >name was Eliza Moncrief LeFlore. If she had a middle name I am not aware of >it. > >Are you implying this particular Margaret Hall and Wm. Moncrief (b.20 Apr >1820 and s/o Sampson Moncrief & Sophia Brashears) had more than one child >named Eliza - - or - - that there was another Sampson Moncrief married to >another Sophia Brashears and that they also had a son born the same time >that also had an Eliza - - or - - that Campbell married different Eliza >Moncriefs? > >I am not sure what you are getting at as I thought I had pinned it down >pretty close. Since I did not have "her" birth date, I put her father's and >who her grandparents were. How many Elizas do you have that might fit into >the criteria that I gave in my original query? > >Marlene > > > > >==== MONCRIEF Mailing List ==== >How do you join Ancestry or do online shopping so that RootsWeb gets a percentage? Start here <http://www.rootsweb.com/~affiliate/> and click on the link for Genealogy, Autos, Books, etc. on the left side of the page. Support RootsWeb for free! > >============================== >The RootsWeb WorldConnect Project: >Tens of millions of individuals... and counting. >http://worldconnect.genealogy.rootsweb.com/ > >

Dennis, Like I said, it was Eliza Moncrief. After she married Campbell LeFlore, her name was Eliza Moncrief LeFlore. If she had a middle name I am not aware of it. Are you implying this particular Margaret Hall and Wm. Moncrief (b.20 Apr 1820 and s/o Sampson Moncrief & Sophia Brashears) had more than one child named Eliza - - or - - that there was another Sampson Moncrief married to another Sophia Brashears and that they also had a son born the same time that also had an Eliza - - or - - that Campbell married different Eliza Moncriefs? I am not sure what you are getting at as I thought I had pinned it down pretty close. Since I did not have "her" birth date, I put her father's and who her grandparents were. How many Elizas do you have that might fit into the criteria that I gave in my original query? Marlene

Marlene, What is Eliza's full name. Dennis -----Original Message----- From: Marlene Clark <marlene@eazylink.com> To: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com <MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com> Date: Sunday, April 30, 2000 7:33 PM Subject: [MONCRIEF-L] Re: Documentation >Speaking of documentation, I cannot find where I got the information that >Eliza Moncrief, the second wife of Campbell LeFlore, was also the child of >Margaret Hall and Wm. Moncrief (b.20 Apr 1820 and s/o Sampson Moncrief & >Sophia Brashears). My grand daughters really messed up my files and I had >not gotten that on my computer. Does anyone have that information? > >Marlene > > >==== MONCRIEF Mailing List ==== >How do you join Ancestry or do online shopping so that RootsWeb gets a percentage? Start here <http://www.rootsweb.com/~affiliate/> and click on the link for Genealogy, Autos, Books, etc. on the left side of the page. Support RootsWeb for free! > >============================== >Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. >RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. >http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi > >

Speaking of documentation, I cannot find where I got the information that Eliza Moncrief, the second wife of Campbell LeFlore, was also the child of Margaret Hall and Wm. Moncrief (b.20 Apr 1820 and s/o Sampson Moncrief & Sophia Brashears). My grand daughters really messed up my files and I had not gotten that on my computer. Does anyone have that information? Marlene

Hi Sylvia: I found the below in our list archives. Is this what you were referring to? I'll keep looking and see if I come up with anything else. Looks as if John is in this up to his neck, as it were, giggle, so maybe he needs to get the snorkle and wet suit out after all! Best, Sandi :) CNIDR Isearch-cgi 1.20.06 (File: 28) I wish I could tell you whether Thomas is real or not, but I don't know, either. I'm just shooting in the dark! I believe my work is pretty solid back to John, beyond that I have nothing but a folder with a big question mark on it and filled with speculative notes! The popular notion seems to be that John's father was a man named Thomas. I have yet to determine the source of this theory. As I indicated yesterday, the first American Moncrief document I have record of was a power of attorney made December 3, 1668, and proved June 15, 1669, by Thomas Moncreffe (an alderman of Londonderry). Rhonda, you are completely correct. Londonderry is a port city on the northern coast of Ireland. When James VI of Scotland succeeded Elizabeth I of England as James I in 1603, a formidable rebellion against English authority in northern Ireland was collapsing. The English government confiscated the lands of rebels ruthlessly and encouraged Englishmen and Scots to settle on them. A group of Lond! on merchants virtually took over the town of Derry, hence the name Londonderry. It became a place which attracted merchants from many parts of the British Isles, and it is certainly not surprising to find a man with an ancient Scottish name serving as an alderman in Londonderry in 1668 and trying to manage business interests in Virginia. I had assumed (since I had seen no evidence to the contrary) that Thomas was a Scotsman removed to Ireland. However, Sylvia posted yesterday (that) she thought Thomas of Londonderry was born in Ireland. And then along comes John Moncrief... Thomas Moncreffe may have sent him to Virginia to tend to the family's business interests. Certainly, John could hardly have avoided knowing Lawson (the man Thomas gives power of attorney to, in Virginia) even if he tried. Lawson's positions as justice and sheriff often required his presence at the courthouse. It is of interest that John on one occasion bought land in partnership with George Mosely. Lawson's second wife was the widow of William Mosely, and it is possible both George and William were members of a family with connections with the Moncriefs. It is also of interest that John named his oldest son Thomas, but the Moncriefs of Scotland so often named their sons Thomas, William, or John that one must use that kind of evidence cautiously. In fact, it is possible John's father was another Thomas Moncrief. Furthermore, it seems entirely possible (to me) that his father wasn't named Thomas, at all! All of this is, of course, speculati! ve. John may have been born in Virginia the son of parents of whom no record remains or he may have been born in Scotland. It should be noted that John Moncrief died in North Carolina four or five years before the first of the great Scotch-Irish emigrations from northern Ireland to British America began in 1717. A business connection or even some involvement in the Glorious Revolution may explain why he appeared in Virginia during the reign of William and Mary. And it's not much of a stretch to imagine his father having perhaps arrived stateside for either of the same reasons. That's why I find the "exiled" Thomas so appealing. I don't know whether he exists, or not, but it's just too darned neat a fit not to try to follow up on. The only notes we have on "exiled" Thomas, so far: First Generation in America ThomasMoncreiffe b 1610 Myerside, Perth, Scotland md1641 Lower Norfolk Co., Virginia d after 1650 Lower Norfolk Co., Virginia buried Lynnhaven Parish Church Cemetery, now under water. wife: Elizabeth 1 child John Moncrief wife Mary Thomas' brother was David. "Thomas was originally exiled to Orkney with his brother David for having kill ed a man named Jardine"... sorry, I'm paraphrasing since I couldn't get to my records last night, but I'm pretty sure I'm remembering correctly... John M. (by the way, Thanks, Deanna!) Problem is, I have no real source! However, in light of yesterdays preliminary findings, the note about the underwater cemetery certainly appears to have possibilities. The d.o.b. and date of marriage work for having a son (John) around 1650. The geography is right (Princess Anne County was formed in 1691 from Lower Norfolk County). And, Mary is the right name for the wife. Now, Deanna has graciously offered to forward the corroborating notations she has, as well as an address for Mr. Selby. Maybe, with a little luck, we'll be able to determine the source of his information. Rhonda, I don't mean to confuse things. I'm just thinking out loud (kind of an ugly process, isn't it?) I've never been on a mailing list before, and I don't know how to behave! If we're not supposed to try out ideas, somebody let me know. I can see where it might even be better just to exchange proven data. If I 've assumed too much, please let me know. Kindest regards, John

Hi Sylvia: You can search the list archives at: http://resources.rootsweb.com/surnames/m/o/MONCRIEF/ I'm glad you are still researching the Thomas/John question. Without documentation we can all just "assume", which isn't good. So, you go Girl! It looks like someone is going to get John in that swamp out east yet! LOL Best, Sandi :)

Posted on: MONCRIEF Bible Records Board URL: http://genconnect.rootsweb.com/genbbs.cgi/surnames/m/o/MONCRIEF/bible_records?read=12 Surname: MUNCREEFF, ADAMS, BRAILSFORD, LINDER, YOUNG, Steele, Matthews, Smith, Connor, Reynolds, Dart, Thompsons, Brown, Bowen, Motte, Bruton, Dewith, Felder, Parsons, Sykes, Smith, Brochett, Gray, Betham ------------------------- MONCRIEF (Muncreeff) FAMILYAndYoung, Linder, DuBose, Brailsford, Adams The following information on the above referenced surnames was copied from The HOLY BIBLE, Containing the Old and New TESTAMENTS: Newly Translated out of the ORIGINAL TONGUES: And with the Former TRANSLATIONS Diligently Compared and Revised By His Majestys Special Command. Appointed to be Read in CHURCHES , London: Printed by Mark Baskett, Printer to the King's most Excellent Majesty, and by the Assigns of Robert Baskett. M.DCC.LXIII. [1763]. [The handwritten information is in elegant old script and difficult to read....] [First page, left side after opening cover]: My Friend Mary Steele departed this life February 12 in her 35 year of age & left a baby. Mary Eth--- Steele whom I took into my home on Saturday 22nd of February 1800 at the particular desire of Doctr Steel - it was just 20 days old when I took it. Was born on the 3rd of the same mon th the Rev'd Edmund Matthews baptized the child on 25th Sponcers E--- M.---------------E th M(u)oncrieff Mary Eth Steele departed this lifeon the 19th Sept 1800 - aged 7 months 16 days. Richard M(u)oncrieff Linder was born August 3rd 1807 and was left by his father Rinchard Linder & given by his mother Ann Linder to Eth Muncreeff as her own child October 28, 1808. [Second page - right side. The righthand margin is well worn and torn inplaces]: William Young was Born October the (too faint to read). Mary Linder was Born March 6, 17_8 Was married together Thursday July the 9, 1752. William Young son to Willm & Mary wife ---- Was born Saturday May the 19th 1753 andMary their daughter was Born Wednesday November the 3rd, 1756, 9 oclock in the ----- Rebekah their daughter was born ----May 29, 1759, 2 oclock in the aftern---- Elizabeth their Daughter was bornSaturday July the 14, 1764 4 oclock ----- [Third page - left side.]Richard Muncreef Junr & Elizabe- --is wife ws married December the 7th ___by the Rev's Robert Smith. Elizabeth their daughter of Rd & Eth Muncreef was born Friday [Saturday is crossed out]the 19th November 1779 10 min after 8 o'clock____Elizabeth Muncrief had the small pox, July 1780____ Arabella Ann Dart the 4 daughter of T.L & Mary Dart was born Dec 22nd 1808 at 6 o'clockon Thursday morning. [Fourth page on right is blank][Fifth page on left] Elizabth Muncereef daughter of Rd & Elizth Born on Nov 1779. Had the small pox in July 1780. The meas--- in August 1783. (Died March 4th 1827 - aged 48 years 3 months& 13 days)_____ Susannah Young Muncreef their next daughter Born in Oct. 1782. Had the Measles in August 1783And the small pox in July 1785._____ 14th Sept 1784. A son was born but died 8 hours after_____ Mary was born the 5th March 1786 quarter after 3_____ Richard Muncrieff Junr departed this life November 26, 1801 aged 48 years 3 months & 16 days_____ Susannah Young Dubose depart this life Nov24th 1800 aged 18 years & 45 days_____ Caroline Young Muncrieff died 14 Nov aged 8 years & 14 days - with the whooping cough 1799._____ Ca--avine Muncrieff died August 25, 1788 aged6 months with the whooping cough _____Martha Ann Muncrieff departed this life Nov 21 1790 aged 2 months & 14 days - with the croop_____ O November what a dread full month tome thou art I dreadfull thee indeed [Sixth Page, on right, is Title Page of the Bible] [Seventh Page, on left, part of An INDEX to the HOLY BIBLE and has no family notations][Eighth Page, on right, at bottom of An Index..] William Young Muncreeff my adopted son was born July 16, 1812 & I took him as my own November 16th 1813- [Ninth Page, on left]Elizabeth Muncreeff & William Adams was married by Revd Mr. Connor on the 4th day of September 1794. # Wm Adams Died 6th Febry 1825Aged 62 years 6 months & 21 days. Brides Maids. Miss Martha Reynolds, Miss Grace Adams. Grooms men. W.D. Townsend & Mr. P. Brailsford Mary Muncreeff & Thomas Lynch Dart was married together the 9 March 1802 married bythe Revd Mr. Thompsons___ Eth Muncreeff Dart their first daughter Born Jan the 23 1803 Baptized by Mr. Mathw Bowens Sponcer Mrs. Isaac Dart Miss Sarah Brailsford & Mr James Brown - had the cow pox in March Eth M Dart died June 29th 1804 aged 17 months 13 days Martha Motte Dart their 2nd daughter born April 10th 1804 half past 10 oclock in the morning baptized by Mr. Bowens Sponcers Mrs. I Dart Mrs. C. M Adams & T. L.Dart -------Had the cow pox in March 1805. Susannah Muncreeff Dart their 3rdDaughter born August 3rd 1806 baptized [The following pages are separated by biblical text and without page numbers] Harriet C. A. Bruton widow of George Bruton Junr was married to Charles Dewith Junr of the state of Georgia on the 13th of Jany 1820 by Jos Howell My beloved Harriet C. A. Dewitt departed this life Dec 2nd 1829 aged 30 years 3 months & 4 days in child bed Harriet Caroline Adams Muncreeff & George Bruton was married together Feby 1st 1816 they were married by Charles Felder. Baptist minister ---- George Bruton died October 12th 1818[Next page] Eth Sarah A. Bruton first child of G. & HBruton was born Oct 14 1816 --1817 & Eth Muncreeff & Samuel Parsons wasmarried togather Nov 4th 1816 by Jacob Barr [On a blank page opposite the beginning of the Chapter APOCRYPHA and at the top of the Chapter page is recorded the following] Births of R. Muncreeff & Elizabeth Muncreeff's children Elizabeth their eldest daughter was Born on the 19th Nov 1779 10 minutes after 8 oclock and Baptized by Revd. Mr. Smith Jany 1st 1780. Sponcers Sus Muncrieff Mary Bochel Richard Muncrieff, Senior had the small pox July 80 measles 1783 Susannah Young Muncreeff their second daughter Born October 14 1782 half after 2 oclock A.M. Baptized by the Revd Mr. Smith July 25th 1783. Sponcers Elizabeth Brailsford, Susannah Dubose Jno Brailsford had the small pox in July 1785 measles in August 1783 Sept 14th 1784 Tuesday 7 oclock P.M. a son was born & died in 8 hours Mary their 3rd Daughter was Born March 5th 1786 a Quarter after 3 oclock A.M. Recvd private Baptixm by the Revd Mr. Smith April 81786 Kitty our 4th Daughter was Born 27th February 1788. 6 o'clock P.M. And died 25th August 1788 Martha Ann their 5th Daughter was born 7th Sept 1790. Recvd oruvate Baptism from Revd Mr. Sykes 2oth Nov. 1790. Died 21st Nov. 1790 Caroline Young Muncreeff their 6th Daughter was Born on the 3rd October 1791. 3 o'clock A. M. Baptized by the Revd M. Smith on Sunday 27th Nov. 91. Sponcers Elizabeth Rhump, Elizth Brailsford Jr. And John Brailsford Junior #George Bruton & Harriet Caroline Adams Muncreeff was married togather Feby 1st 1816 by Charles Feldera Baptist minister Richard Muncreeff and Elizth Young was Marr'ed Dec. 17th 1778 by the Rev. d Mr. Robert Smith Rector of St. Philips Charleston Samuel Parsons & Eth Muncreeff was married togather Nov 4th1816 by Jacob Barr [Last page of the Book of Malachi on the bottom is written] Benjamine Bruton & Sarah Rd Muncreeff was married togather August 27th 1812 by Charles Felder____ Willima James their first son was born July 18 1813 & he died August 15th 1816 aged 3 years & 28 days._____ Benjamine Ferdinan their 2nd son was born Feby 17th 1815_____ Ann Adams their 3rd child was born Nov 25th 1816. [Last page of Apocrypha. II.MACCABEES Apocrypha is written] December 14th 1782 was the most Glorious day when the British vacuated Charlestown and our Gallant Con- tinentals took possession of it. When the inhabitants were delivered from the most abjectslavery to perfect Freedom Mary Elizabeth Steele was born 3rd Feby 1800 being Monday. Baptized Sunday 25th May Sponcers Eth Moncreeff, Susanne Young Dubose & Richd Moncreeff by Mr. Edmund Matthews. E.M. took MES Feby 22 1800 [Bottom of page beginning of The New Testament is written] Sarah Rd Muncreeff & Benjn Bruton w.Married togather Aug. 27 1812 by th Baptist minister Charles Felder [Page opposite the beginning of The Gospel according to S.MATTHEW] died 26th Nov 1801 dreadfull day to me Richard Muncrief Junior was born August 19th 1755 Elizabeth Young was born July 14th 1764 Richd. Muncrief & Elizabeth Young was married Dec 17th 1778 by the Revd Robert Smith rector of St. Philips. Elizabeth Muncreef was Born November 19th 1779. Friday morning 10 minutes after 8 oclock. Baptized by the Revd. Mr. Smith Jany 1st 1780. Sponcers Mrs. Muncreef. Mary Bochett and Richard Muncrief Senr. (Had the small pox July 1780) Susannah Y. was born October 14th 1782 Half after 2 oclock Monday morning (Baptized by the Revd W. Smith July 25th 1783. Sponcers Elizabeth Brailsford & Susannah Dubose and John Brailsford died 24 Nov. 1800. Had the measles in August 1783 And the smallpox in July 1785 14th Sept 84. A son was born but died in 8 hours after Mary was born March 5th 1786 a quarter after 3 oclock A. M. received private Baptism by the Revd Wm Smith April 8th Sponcers Susa Muncreef Elizabeth Muncreef & R.d Muncreef Junior # Died Augt 1st 1810 Kitty was born February 27th 1788. Six oclock in the evening - died 25 August 1788 with the whooping coughbaptized by M. Sykes Martha Ann was born on Sept 7th half after Six oclock A.M. 1790 doed 25th Nov 1790 with the croop Wm Adams my good son died 6th of Feby 1825 aged 62 years 6 months& 2 days. Not lost but gone before me- [Page opposite An INDEX to the HOLY BIBLE, or an Account of the most remarkable passages in the Books of the Old and New Testament] Richard Muncreeff and Susannah C(G)raywas married by the Revd Robt Betham A. M. In Charlestown So Carolina Feby 28th 1746 Robert their first son was born Augt 13th 1748. Saturday Elizabeth their first Daughter born Oct. 13th 1751. Sunday Richard their 2nd Son born Aug 10th 1755. Sunday Susannah their 2nd Daughter born October 7 1758.

Hello again, Thanks for the encouragement, Sandi. I have another question for the group. Who has actually been to Currituck? The California researcher that I talked with had called but so far I haven't connected with anyone who has been there personally. He talked with someone that was local doing Moncrief search. As a professional information mover I am not satisfied that all bases have been covered. I do believe that the father of John if he was in the US was not in Currituck when he died. IF there is any truth to the murder story there is the possibility that the family chose to be removed from him. My reason for the new interest in the murder is I believe that would be traceable information. Also it isn't likely that John was an only child. Where are his siblings? Where was John born? Looks like John can drop me off on his way to the Virginia cemetery. Sylvia __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/

Hi, I've been working on another line but am so drawn to this mystery of Thomas. I was back at it yesterday. I read John's will and saw where John was in the militia and paid poll tax. Thomas his son is in the records also. I can't find emigration records for John. I can't find transportation records. I can't find evidence that Thomas or John's father was in Currituck. I keep wondering if we have the right name and if we came from Scotland. The earlier searchers I talked with believe these facts. Will whoever put the murder theory out please repeat it. I can't find it in my saved correspondence. I work in the LDS library one night a week and I am going to begin tracing some Moncrief's from the 1200's down to try to make a connection. That is, when I don't have to help someone else. I keep wondering if our records aren't a few miles away in Virginia. Men didn't live as long as we do now and pososibly John's father was deceased. All these people left wills. They had land in the new world. John left around 500 acres to his sons. There are no records of Thomas in Perth Scotland. Is the name Thomas? John had a son named Thomas but that name isn't carried in the line as often as other names. Guess you need to get the snorkle, John. Please whoever put the murder story out please repeat to the list or email me at slskip_sc@yahoo.com. Thanks. Sylvia PS Thanks for the Indian information, I have added a lot to the family tree. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/

Hi Marlene and all: That was a super find on your part and now we who have Samuel in our lines can change our records from Sampson and rest assured this has documentation. This is the the kind of genealogical information I like to see. I know that we all have some iffy information and information we've received from others and from the family through word of mouth, but, when possible documentation is the correct way to go. And, no Marlene, you did not sound angry. You sounded excited and eager to share with the group. Way to go Girl! Do I hear a round of applause? Best, Sandi :)

Posted on: MONCRIEF Biographies Board URL: http://genconnect.rootsweb.com/genbbs.cgi/surnames/m/o/MONCRIEF/biographies?read=3 Surname: COOK, GIBBS, MONCRIEF ------------------------- INDIAN PIONEER HISTORY MONCRIEF, BUNK INTERVIEW #8832 Field Worker's name: Thad Smith, Jr. This report made on: October 13, 1937 Name: Bunk Moncrief Post office address: Chickasha, Oklahoma Residence address: Route #1 Date of birth: January 13, 1879 Place of birth: Chickasaw-Choctaw Nation Name of father: William Moncrief Place of birth: Skullyville, Indian Territory Name of mother: Lina Maupin Place of birth: Kentucky I was born in the Chickasaw Nation, on Roaring Creek, in 1897. My father was a farmer and trader. He raised corn to feed his cows, horses, hogs and chickens. He bought his supplies at Pauls Valley. In 1886, when I was seven years old, I went to stay with my Grandmother Moncrief, who lived on the Little Washita River, about three miles south of where the Fred post office was. My grandmother had one of the first herds of Durham cattle that there was in the country and her brand was M+. The country was all open, but her cattle never strayed far. My grandmother was a widow, and the cowboys were kind enough to keep a watch over her cattle, even though they never worked for her. If they would find one of her cows several miles from home, they would bring or send it back. That is one outstanding thing about the frontier men; they would all help, and respect women. Dave and Scott Cook had the post office at Fred, and they ran a general merchandise store. Mail was delivered at Fred about once a week, being carried in a stage coach or hack. From Fred the stage coach went to Anadarko, and then back on its way to Pauls Valley and Caddo. I went to school in a little one room cottonwood box house in Fred. The benches we sat on and the tables we used for desks were made of cottonwood; the lumber used to build our school house and desks came from Bitter Creek, where there was a sawmill. There were about twenty-five school children going to school at Fred and most all of them rode to school horseback. Our teacher's name was Bud Gibbs. Our school books were made by McGuffey and we used a slate instead of pencil and paper. All of the children brought their lunches, which consisted mostly of biscuits and meat. After going to school at Fred several terms I was sent to Sacred Heart, a Catholic Missionary School in the Pottawatomie county. I was treated very nice there, and they fed us good. After going to school there one term, I quit school. In 1895, when I was sixteen years old, I saddled my horse and made a trip to Texas by myself, hunting work. The people along the way whom I stayed overnight with treated me nice, fed me and my horse and never charged me anything. I got a job in Texas working on a big cattle ranch, and stayed there one year then returned to my parents' home on the north side of the Washita river just north of Chickasha. I was allotted five miles northwest of Chickasha. I am one-eighth Chickasaw. Sandi Carter First cousin twice removed

Posted on: MONCRIEF Biographies Board URL: http://genconnect.rootsweb.com/genbbs.cgi/surnames/m/o/MONCRIEF/biographies?read=2 Surname: BOYD, DESCOMBUS, FRED, GREEN, HUME, HUNT, LAUGHLIN, MAUPIN, MILLER, MONCRIEF, MURRY, RYAN, SLAGLE, SMITH, STAR ------------------------- INDIAN PIONEER HISTORY MONCRIEF, BILL (MRS.) INTERVIEW #4189 Field Worker's name: Thad Smith, Jr. This report made on: May 27, 1937 Name: Mrs. Bill Moncrief nee LINA MAUPIN Post office address: Chickasha Residende address: 5 miles north of Chickasha Place of birth: Kentucky Name of father: JOHN MAUPIN Place of birth: Kentucky Name of mother: MARY JANE WILLIAMS Place of birth: Kentucky My folks and I came by train to Caddo in 1874. From there we traveled by covered wagon to Pauls Valley, in the Chickasaw Nation, where my father rented a farm and farmed for three years. He raised between forth and fifty bushels of corn to the acre and sold it for 15 cents a bushel. Mr. Miller and Mr. Green each had a general mercantile store in Pauls Valley. George Laughlin did the freighting for both stores from Caddo. There were no schools or churches at Pauls Valley in 1874 that I remember: but there was a Chickasaw Indian preacher south of Pauls Valley named Star. In 1875 the Masons sponsored a Fourth of July Celebration at Erin Springs. A barbecued beef dinner was enjoyed by all. That night there was a dance at the home of Frank Murry, near Erin Springs. In 1877 I married Bill Moncrief, a quarter-blood Choctaw Indian. We drove to a place near Ardmore in a hack and were married by Judge Boyd. We then made our home for some time on the Little Washita River. We did our trading at Erin Springs. The store was owned by Doctor Ryan, and church was held in the Masonic Hall. Our home was a log house covered with slabs chipped off of logs that had been sawed into two short lengths and then covered with dirt. There were all kinds of wild game with the exception of buffalo. We dried lots of beef by cutting it in strips, and salting it, then putting it in the sunshine. I have seen thousands of Texas Longhorn cattle come up the Chisholm Trail. They usually crossed the Washita at what was called Rock Crossing, southeast of Chickasha, then trailed in a northerly direction toward Silver City, (now a ghost town) where they crossed the Canadian River. In 1882 my husband and I moved to a place four miles northwest of where Chickasha now is. We crossed the river at the Maupin Crossing, near Pensee, then a store and post office run by Jacob Descombus. Meek Smith had one of the largest herds of cattle near Chickasha. His brand was called "Long O." I used to wash clothes for some of the cowboys and nearly all of them wore flannel shirts the year round. They also wore high top boots that reached to their knees. Not many of the cowboys in those days had razors and their whiskers and mustaches would grow out long. I have seen some of the cowboys cut their whiskers with a small pair of scissors. They could cut their whiskers so short that they would look like it hadn't been over two days since they had been shaved. Frank Fred had a store north of the Indian agency between the agency and the river, and he was a mighty fine man. Dr. Hume was the Government doctor at Anadarko. Colonel F. H. Hunt was the Indian Agent and Mr. Slagle was the Government blacksmith. I have seen the Government men issue cattle to the Indians for beef purposes. They would call out the Indian's name and then turn his beef out and the Indian would run it out a little way and shoot it down and have it dressed in a very short time. Sandi Carter GG niece

Posted on: MONCRIEF Obituaries Board URL: http://genconnect.rootsweb.com/genbbs.cgi/surnames/m/o/MONCRIEF/obituaries?read=5 Surname: MAUPIN, MONCRIEF ------------------------- In Memory of JOHN MONCRIEF Born Sept. 7, 1889 in Indian Territory. Passed away Dec. 22, 1968 in Phoenix, Ariz. Memorial services 1:00 P. M. Thursday, December 26, 1968 at the graveside, Glendale Memorial Park, the Rev. Richard Hanson officiating. Sandi Carter First cousin twice removed

Years ago, I spoke with the family of "Sam" Moncrief and they were very definite about two things. 1. Sam, born 28 January 1849, and son of Margaret Hall and William Moncrief and WAS married to another "Margaret Hall". 2. Sam's name was actually Samuel, not Sampson as many people erroneously stated and the error passed on by others "assuming" Sam stood for Sampson and not bothering to check for facts. Today, I received the information from the National Archives that accompanied the Census Roll Card for my family of Moncriefs which were Choctaw Indians. Among other things, there was the sworn statement of my great grandmother (Susan Moncrief Garvin) about her brother, "Samuel" Moncrief. I think these two facts should prove that Sam's name was Samuel. I hope I do not sound angry as I am not. The Internet has been great to me lately and I found a family for which people have been looking for about 40 years on my Chickasaw line. Marlene

In a message dated 4/25/00 12:17:42 PM, slskip_sc@yahoo.com writes: <<Samson is born in 1748. Would someone take the Sampson in the Choctaw story and starting in 1853 work back about two generations so I can place the story accurately. >> Hi Sylvia: Here are Sampson's grandparents and parents. Hope this helps. William Alexander MONCRIEF - Abt 1715 - Abt 1765 Elizabeth SIMMONS William A. MONCRIEF - 23 May 1744 - 27 Jan 1795 Martha Ferebee Sampson MONCRIEF Sophia BRASHEARS Best, Sandi :)

Yep, that's what I was typing! John ----- Original Message ----- From: SandKatC@aol.com To: MONCRIEF-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2000 2:35 PM Subject: [MONCRIEF-L] SAMPSON MONCRIEF In a message dated 4/25/00 12:17:42 PM, slskip_sc@yahoo.com writes: <<Samson is born in 1748. Would someone take the Sampson in the Choctaw story and starting in 1853 work back about two generations so I can place the story accurately. >> Hi Sylvia: Here are Sampson's grandparents and parents. Hope this helps. William Alexander MONCRIEF - Abt 1715 - Abt 1765 Elizabeth SIMMONS William A. MONCRIEF - 23 May 1744 - 27 Jan 1795 Martha Ferebee Sampson MONCRIEF Sophia BRASHEARS Best, Sandi :) ==== MONCRIEF Mailing List ==== TO SUBSCRIBE OR UNSUBSCRIBE from any RootsWeb-hosted mailing list, send an e-mail message with only the word SUBSCRIBE (or UNSUBSCRIBE) in the subject and the body of the message to [name of list]-L-request@rootsweb.com. (for mail mode) or to [name of list]-D-request@rootsweb.com (for digest mode). ============================== Free Web space. ANY amount. ANY subject. RootsWeb's Freepages put you in touch with millions. http://cgi.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/acctform.cgi

Hi, Thanks for all the good stuff you have been posting for us, Sandi. I enjoyed the Choctaw heritage information but got lost. We are all (for the most talkative anyway) from the John and Mary line. My Samson is born in 1748. Would someone take the Sampson in the Choctaw story and starting in 1853 work back about two generations so I can place the story accurately. Thanks. Sylvia Skipper __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com