Please can I ask the List members a favour? Is it possible a kind soul can track down a John ATKIN in Scotland during the 1871 census? I have the following address from a birth record in Scotland. Residing at (what looks like) 6 Prisies Close, District Cannongate, Burgh of Edinburgh, Scotland. John Atkin Trade was a Goldbeater b1841 Salford Lancashire Wife Emma b1842 Salford son Thomas b1862 England Dau Matilda B1867 Salford Son William b1869 Salford Dau Sarah Ann born 21 March 1871 at above listed address in Scotland. Is Prisies Close the correct name for this street? Best wishes Mike Morris Toronto Canada -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.6.2 - Release Date: 3/4/05

Jane and Moira, Many thanks for your interest and suggestions. Yes, it is quite challenging but very interesting. My recent travels took me to Dumfries in search of an Alexander Murdoch who was drowned at Hull in 1868, about the time that 'my' Alexander vanished. The coroner's report made very interesting reading. I found that he was not mine but did have a cousin, also Alexander Murdoch ( a journeyman baker and a little nearer to the right age). Unfortunately (or fortunately, if I can find a connection), he seems to have left Dumfries between the 1851 and 61 censuses, without marrying. These Murdochs share an ancestor, Ebenezer Murdoch, with William McMaster Murdoch of 'Titanic' fame, so I am enjoying reading books on the subject, with a new interest! Yes, Jane, I have tried BURNETT and found several in the 1841 census for St Cuthberts Parish in Edinburgh, but no Charlottes. Yes, I also have details of the family in all censuses from 1861 to 1901. Alexander vanishes from the records after the birth of the last child in 1868, and I have not found a death for him in England. This child was born in Newcastle which is where the family remain. I also have a copy of one of the children's birth certificates but in England this gives only the parents names and not their marriage date. My latest thinking is that the elusive marriage may have taken place at sea. With a family of at least six brothers and cousins who were ships' captains, there would be no shortage of boats for either of the Dumfries' Alexanders! Perhaps, as you say, the '51 census for Edinburgh may help to locate Charlotte, when it comes online. Margaret.

The only data for your names on the disks from the FHC. I have no additional data. Bob BRYCE, William Christening Gender: Male Birth Date: 28 Feb 1820 Birthplace: , Whitburn, West Lothian, Scotland Recorded in: Whitburn, West Lothian, Scotland Father: Alexander BRYCE Mother: Marion RUSSELL Source: FHL Film 102998 + Dates: 1820 - 1855 ======================== J & M Edler wrote: <SNIP>

Might someone 'down under' have access to the above. If so I would very much appreciate a look-up on the following fellow: Andrew Douglas WATSON b. 20 May 1867 Edinburgh Scotland who moved to Brisbane where he was an Accountant. Andrew was the son of James WATSON (1830-1912) himself an accountant in Edinburgh. Thanks for your help Jim Arnott Canada

On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 23:06:57 -0500, "Lynn Polgar" <LPOLGAR@comcast.net> wrote: >I am looking for information about the existence of Saughton Hall Asylum, which was in Edinburgh in the mid-1800's. > >The medical superintendent was Sir John Batty Tuke. > >I have TAIT ancestors who worked for Dr. Tuke. Did you get that from a Google search? I ask because a Google search for "Saughton Hall Asylum" comes up with just two websites. The one at http://www.1902-encyclopedia.com/A/APH/aphasia.html says: Sir John Batty Tuke, M.D., D.Sc., M.P., Medical Superintendent, Saughton Hall Asylum, Edinburgh The other, at http://special.lib.gla.ac.uk/manuscripts/search/detailp.cfm?NID=11379&DID=37509&AID= says: Sir John Batty Tuke, 1835-1913. Medical Director, New Saughton Hall Asylum, Edinburgh. M.P., Edinburgh and St Andrews Universities. Note that there are references to him being involved with both Saughton Hall Asylum, and New Saughton Hall Asylum. Although it might be assumed that these referred to the same place, they were actually different establishments and many miles apart! Saughton Hall Asylum was originally a 17th century mansion called Saughton Hall, probably built for the wealthy merchant Robert Baird. It was sited in what is now Saughton Park Winter Gardens, which is bounded on three sides by Balgreen Road, Gorgie Road and Fords Road. See <http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=322033&y=671905&z=1&sv=322250,671750&st=4&ar=Y&mapp=newmap.srf&searchp=newsearch.srf> for a map, with an arrow pointing to where the house was. The entrance to the house was from Ford's Road. At the beginning of the 19th century it became a private mental asylum for "patients of the higher ranks", and by the middle of the 19th century boasted a botanic garden, airing courts for amusements and activities, baths, and airing galleries. The asylum came under the care of John Batty Tuke later in the century - Tuke himself came from a Yorkshire Quaker family noted for their humane treatment of the insane. Whilst "Batty" might be assumed to have just been a rather appropriate nickname for someone involved in his line of work, it is the name given in Who's Who, and his father was also called the same name. Tuke lived at Balgreen, which was then a mansion 1/4 mile north of Saughton Hall, and is now the site of Balgreen Primary School and Balgreen Public Library. Towards the end of the 19th century, Tuke expanded his interest in the insane and took over Mavisbank House, near Eskbank, which had been built in 1723. This also became a lunatic asylum, and rather confusingly, he called this New Saughton Hall! In 1900 The City Council became the owners of Saughton Hall and Balgreen House, and they turned the house and the grounds into a public gardens, which remain to this day. However the house was not maintained properly, and by the 1940s had become semi-derelict. It was demolished in 1952. Balgreen continued to be used by Sir John Tuke, who had been Knighted in 1898, until shortly before his death in 1913. After being used by the City as a children's home, it was demolished in 1932 to make way for the present-day school and library. New Saughton Hall (ie Mavisbank) continued as a medical institution after Sir John's death, but was ravaged by a fire in 1973. It has since been derelict, hoping that someone would come along and save it, and in 2003 it was one of the hopefuls put forward for the BBC TV series "Restoration", with an estimated repair bill of 7 million pounds. See http://www.geo.ed.ac.uk/scotgaz/features/featurefirst6413.html <http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2003/07_july/18/restoration_buildings_scot.pdf> Unfortunately for Mavisbank, it was beaten in the final by the Victorian Baths in Manchester. Forrest -- Forrest Anderson - British Military Genealogical Researcher. E-mail: forrest@military-researcher.com Website: www.military-researcher.com

Hi List I am trying to discover information on John Thomson and Margaret Johnstone who were married in Moffat 13 June 1891. John, a gardener, aged 26 was the son of John Thomson and Margaret Thomson ( ms Brice ) of Moffat. Margaret, a Domestic Servant, aged 26 was the daughter of George Johnstone and Janet Johnstone ( ms Cairns ) also of Moffat. Eunice Sutton New Zealand

Hi List I am trying to discover information on John Thomson and Margaret Johnstone who were married in Moffat 13 June 1891. John, a gardener, aged 26 was the son of John Thomson and Margaret Thomson ( ms Brice ) of Moffat. Margaret, a Domestic Servant, aged 26 was the daughter of George Johnstone and Janet Johnstone ( ms Cairns ) also of Moffat. Eunice Sutton New Zealand

Last week I posted a question about Edinburgh pre 1855 burials. Quite a number of people responded with some very helpful information. I think I have personally thanked all of them. If I missed anyone please take this note as my thanks. Other listers who may be looking for sources re pre 1855 Edinburgh burials can find some constructive information in the list archives. Alan P Sydney Australia

I am looking for information about the existence of Saughton Hall Asylum, which was in Edinburgh in the mid-1800's. The medical superintendent was Sir John Batty Tuke. I have TAIT ancestors who worked for Dr. Tuke. Any information greatly appreciated. Thanks for assistance. Lynn

I am still searching for clues to the marriage of Alexander Murdoch and Charlotte Branette in the 1850s ( their eldest living child was born in London in 1858) Alexander was born in Scotland and Charlotte in Edinburgh about 1835, though I am unable to identify either of their births, until I find details of their marriage. In fact, in the absence of any Branettes at all in Edinburgh, I presume the name is possibly Burnett. I have spent time at the Record Office in Edinburgh, to no avail. Can anyone suggest any stone which I may have left unturned as I do not want to make another wasted trip to Edinburgh? The only other clue to Alexander's identity is that he was a journeyman baker, but I don't seem to be able to trace the whereabouts of any apprenticeship records. Any ideas, please? Margaret in Cumbria.

Looks like a difficult one! I don't know about English records, do they have the same information as Scottish ones. If so you could find the details of one of the children's (Clara, Charles, Alexander or Lena) births. In Scotland this gives the place and date of the marriage but I have no idea about English records, moira margaret murdoch wrote: >I am still searching for clues to the marriage of Alexander Murdoch and >Charlotte Branette in the 1850s ( their eldest living child was born in >London in 1858) Alexander was born in Scotland and Charlotte in Edinburgh >about 1835, though I am unable to identify either of their births, until I >find details of their marriage. In fact, in the absence of any Branettes at >all in Edinburgh, I presume the name is possibly Burnett. > >I have spent time at the Record Office in Edinburgh, to no avail. Can anyone >suggest any stone which I may have left unturned as I do not want to make >another wasted trip to Edinburgh? > > The only other clue to Alexander's identity is that he was a journeyman >baker, but I don't seem to be able to trace the whereabouts of any >apprenticeship records. Any ideas, please? > >Margaret in Cumbria. > > > > >

I have lost my gr gr grandmother and would appreciate a lookup of 1841. Her parents married and had 3 children in Humbie 1816-1823. However, by 1841 they were gone from East Lothian and in 1851 they are in Stow Midlothian. They are not in either of these towns so I'm hoping that someone has an indexed version of 1841 that may help me out. Robert SYMINGTON b abt 1784 ?Lauder Janet (m.s. MURRAY) (wedding said of Stow) Elizabeth (or Betty) and Margaret (twins) b 1818 Humbie I have not found any birth references to Robert yet but would be happy to exchange info if a connection can be found to other SYMINGTONS or MURRAYS. Any help would be appreciated. Margaret Jenkin Christchurch, New Zealand -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.1 - Release Date: 27/02/2005

I understand that many Scottish pre 1855 burial records have not survived. However ............ Has any generous person(s) tried to compile and make available an index of known Edinburgh pre 1855 burials? If yes, what are the best ways to access the information? Alan P Sydney Australia

Thank you Ruth - the first part looks promising. I haven't had the opportunity to look at the 1841 Census yet. Daryl Stevenson ----- Original Message ----- From: <CBescoby@aol.com> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 4:05 AM Subject: Re: [MLN] HISLOP - STEVENSON > Hi Daryl, > Hope this can be of some help. > 1841 census for Stow shows a Christian HISLOP (female) could be Christina > but been mispelt, age 14, living in Brockhouse working as a servant for a > William Purves (an agricultural labourer). > There is also an Andrew Stevenson aged 15 working as a manservant to a > Margaret Darling in Bower. > If these are the right people they would have been quite young when they > married. > > The 1851 census for Stow shows: > Andrew Stevenson aged 27 head M Ag.Lab born:MLN Edinburgh Address Stow Old > Mill > Mary Stevenson aged 5 DA F scholar born: MLN Stow > William Stevenson aged 3 SO M born: Stow > Jeanie Stevenson aged 1 DA F born: Stow > > Again Christina is shown as Christian Hislop age 23 F WIFE born MLN Stow > Address Stow Old Mill (head of household Stevenson) but may have been visiting > family when the cesus was taken or recorded under maiden name. > > Hope you can make use of this > Ruth. >

Alan asked ... 'Has any generous person(s) tried to compile and make available an index of known Edinburgh pre 1855 burials? If only ... they would be very popular, wouldn't they? The Scottish Genealogy Website at http://www.scotsgenealogy.com/ does have a selection of M.I.s for sale in it's 'shop' section. The site http://www.ancestor.abel.co.uk/inv/mi1857.html does have some Inveresk M.I. transcriptions. The Edinburgh cemeteries site at http://www.headstones.fsnet.co.uk/ doesn't have many transcriptions, but does have some nice cemetery photos, opening dates and links (including one to Mortonhall Crematorium - which is where many of the old burial registers are kept). The catalogue search engine at the NAS website http://www.nas.gov.uk is also worth looking at, to see what burial records are held there. I found the original register for South Leith Kirkyard at General Register House, ref. CH2/716-121, and finally found the burial details of my 2 x great grandfather John ROSS. This particular volume included such detail as cause of death, age at death, and marital status, so you can imagine that I was well pleased. Good luck in your searches Alan, and please let me know if you ever find the all inclusive resource that you are looking for. Duncan, Dundee

Reposting my research list for Edinburgh and environs. Many thanks to those listers who have responded to my previous posts. CASSIE (Leith) mid to late 1700s CHALMERS mid to late 1700s DRUMMOND early 1700s GRIEVE mid to late 1700s HALL mid to late 1700s LAURISTON late 1700s MARSHALL (Cramond) late 1700s UMPHERSTON mid to late 1700s UMPHREY (Cramond) early to mid 1700s VEITCH mid to late 1700s WHITE mid to late 1700s YOUNG mid to late 1700s The primary family I am working on is VEITCH. My number one objective is to identify the parentage of a William VEITCH who married a Janet Umpherston at St Cuthbert's in 1782. Alan P Sydney Australia

Don't worry about Christian/Christina. They were used interchangeably at this time. (Unfortunately IGI does not recognise this!) Best wishes, Sheena Ireland -----Original Message----- From: CBescoby@aol.com [mailto:CBescoby@aol.com] Sent: 02 March 2005 17:35 To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MLN] HISLOP - STEVENSON Hi Daryl, Hope this can be of some help. 1841 census for Stow shows a Christian HISLOP (female) could be Christina but been mispelt, age 14, living in Brockhouse working as a servant for a William Purves (an agricultural labourer). There is also an Andrew Stevenson aged 15 working as a manservant to a Margaret Darling in Bower. If these are the right people they would have been quite young when they married. The 1851 census for Stow shows: Andrew Stevenson aged 27 head M Ag.Lab born:MLN Edinburgh Address Stow Old Mill Mary Stevenson aged 5 DA F scholar born: MLN Stow William Stevenson aged 3 SO M born: Stow Jeanie Stevenson aged 1 DA F born: Stow Again Christina is shown as Christian Hislop age 23 F WIFE born MLN Stow Address Stow Old Mill (head of household Stevenson) but may have been visiting family when the cesus was taken or recorded under maiden name. Hope you can make use of this Ruth. ______________________________

Dear Alan Thank you so much for giving me the info. you found on Google. I have just been experimenting by putting in variations of Joseph Hislop, opera singer and have gained a lot more information. I apologise for taking so long to acknowledge your help, unfortunately I've been too busy to go online till now - domestic chores. Thanks again Evelyn

Hallo Eleanor, I have been offered a complete death extract and a copy of the RCE which is on the back. Perhaps you should try: records@gro-scotland.gsi.gov.uk Good luck, Michael. -----Original Message----- From: Eleanor Robertson [mailto:eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk] Sent: 2. mars 2005 18:02 To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [MLN] QUESTION - EDINBURGH - INQUESTS 1913 I have also come across this but you have to get the film to view the details it does not come up on the computer, and to my knowledge you cannot get a copy. Regards Eleanor -----Original Message----- From: Archie Gilbert [mailto:agilbert@clara.co.uk] Sent: 01 March 2005 19:39 To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MLN] QUESTION - EDINBURGH - INQUESTS 1913 Michael, The note in the margin is the reference no. of the R(ecord) of C(orrected) E(ntry) - RCE. This will be the findings of the Procurator Fiscal's enquiry into the death. I think that the only way to view is by visiting New Register House in Edinburgh. It may be worth while writing or e-mailing them to see if they would send you a copy ( at a cost !).The e-mail address is records@gro-scotland.gov.uk Good Luck Archie Gilbert, Kinross. ----- Original Message ----- From: "sten" <michael.stenhouse@c2i.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 4:39 PM Subject: [MLN] QUESTION - EDINBURGH - INQUESTS 1913 > > Dear Listers, > > One of my grandfather's brothers accidentally died in 1913 from a dose > of poison. > > Would thee have been an Inquest regarding this death? > > I have his death certificate and there are notes in the margin which > make me believe there might have been one. > > Could somebody help me with his matter please. > > Where would I ask for such a document? > > Regards, > > From, > > Michael > in > Norway. > > > >

Hallo Archie, Thank you for your tip too. I sent a mail last night and received a reply today. Quick service don't you think? Michael in Norway -----Original Message----- From: Archie Gilbert [mailto:agilbert@clara.co.uk] Sent: 1. mars 2005 20:39 To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MLN] QUESTION - EDINBURGH - INQUESTS 1913 Michael, The note in the margin is the reference no. of the R(ecord) of C(orrected) E(ntry) - RCE. This will be the findings of the Procurator Fiscal's enquiry into the death. I think that the only way to view is by visiting New Register House in Edinburgh. It may be worth while writing or e-mailing them to see if they would send you a copy ( at a cost !).The e-mail address is records@gro-scotland.gov.uk Good Luck Archie Gilbert, Kinross. ----- Original Message ----- From: "sten" <michael.stenhouse@c2i.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 4:39 PM Subject: [MLN] QUESTION - EDINBURGH - INQUESTS 1913 > > Dear Listers, > > One of my grandfather's brothers accidentally died in 1913 from a dose > of poison. > > Would thee have been an Inquest regarding this death? > > I have his death certificate and there are notes in the margin which > make me believe there might have been one. > > Could somebody help me with his matter please. > > Where would I ask for such a document? > > Regards, > > From, > > Michael > in > Norway. > > > >