Elaine, Gorgie Mains, situated to the East of Primrose Terrace, was so named around 1815, as a replacement for Gorgie Muir. The name Gorgie comes from 'Gor Gyn' or upper wedge, supposedly a reference to the tapering shape of the land between the river and the Craiglockart Hills. Grange Toll was originally a place to the North end of Mayfield Road, which is in the Liberton area, just to the East of Gorgie. Duncan, Dundee

Mike, nowadays you wouldnt want to visit Hulme, and if you did, you sure wouldnt recognise it - all 60s built flats and drugs and drive by shooting - al ot of good positive stuff going on there as well, but it is a bad area now Liz >From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [MLN] Edinburgh census ATKIN family >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:01:41 -0500 > >I lived with my grandmother, mom and dad and younger brother for a short >time during the war in Hulme, Manchester, Lancashire England. > >My gran lived in a one up and one down terraced house dating from around >1850. It had a small scullery with a door leading to a very small back yard >which housed a toilet in a small building in the back yard. There was no >cellar. The ground floor flooring was sand stone paving stones. She had one >cold water tap and a two ring gas burner with a grill. The oven was part of >her fireplace. She made wonderful Sunday dinners, baked excellent pies >although fruit and sugar were scarce. The lighting was one gas lamp in the >downstairs room. This was one of many terraced homes in the south part of >Manchester. > >A lot of them were infested with large red flat bed bugs. I was told many >years later this was due to them using horse hair to bond the plaster to >the >wood lathes on the walls and ceilings. But the war of the bugs is another >story :)) > >Thanks for the memories......... :)) > >Mike Morris >Toronto Canada >----- Original Message ----- >From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:23 PM >Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > > Roger: No wonder its called a close, thats 8 people in two rooms. > > > > Gordon > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> > > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > > > > > Hi Mike, > > > Here is what I read before I had the advantage of your email! There >was >an > > > S on ATKIN > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > Edinburgh, Canongate > > > 685/3/31 page 5 > > > Old Church except North(?) Side from 242 - 254, inclusive. Embracing > > > Pirrie's Close and Gibb's Close. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>. > > > 4 Pirrie's Close - 2 rooms with one window or more. > > > John ATKINS Head, M, 30.. ..Gold Beater, born England > > > Emma ATKINS, wife, M, 29...........born England > > > Matilda ATKINS, daur, 4, scholar... born England > > > William ATKINS, son, 2,.... born England > > > Eugenie (?) ATKINS daur, 1mo,.... born Edinburgh > > > John BRANNON, Boarder, M 29, Gold Beater ...born Edinburgh > > > Maud(?) BRANNON, Boarder, M, 25, Boarder.. born Manchester > > > Emma BRANNON Boarder, 11months..... born Edinburgh. > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > (?) means I stuggled with the word and it is open to interpretation. 2 >of > > > us looked at Eugenie. > > > So we should have read Sarah! > > > I wrote no 4. Perhaps it was 6. There were several households at each > > > number. > > > I didn't see Thomas. I looked at the rest of Pirrie's Close and didn't > > > notice any other ATKINs. > > > > > > Hope this helps but I could look again another time if you want me to > > > check or try to send you a copy. The machines with printers were busy. > > > > > > Best Wishes, > > > Jane > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> > > > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:53 PM > > > Subject: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > > > > > > >> Hi Jane, > > >> Thank you for your generous offer. I really would appreciate it if >you > > >> can > > >> spare the time to look this up. > > >> > > >> The family lived at #6 Pirrie's Close in March of 1871. District > > >> Cannongate, > > >> Burgh of > > >> Edinburgh, Scotland. > > >> > > >> John Atkin Trade was a Goldbeater b1841 Salford Lancashire > > >> Wife Emma b1842 Salford > > >> Son Thomas b1862 England > > >> Dau Matilda B1867 Salford > > >> Son William b1869 Salford > > >> Dau Sarah Ann born 21 March 1871 at above listed address in Scotland. > > >> > > >> Please could you also see if there are any other ATKIN families >living >in > > >> Pirrie's Close. I am curious to see if John ATKIN'S parents John and >Mary > > >> ATKIN might be near by or some of his siblings. > > >> > > >> Best wishes > > >> Mike Morris > > >> Toronto Canada > > >> > > >> > > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > >> From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> > > >> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > >> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:41 AM > > >> Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > >> > > >> > > >>> Hi Mike, > > >>> > > >>> If no previous offers, I will happily look up the 1871 Pirrie's >Close, > > >>> in > > >> my > > >>> lunch hour. > > >>> > > >>> Best Wishes, > > >>> Jane <snip> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> No virus found in this outgoing message. > > >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > > > > > > >-- >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >

Mike: Is it really that long a drive fron Toronto to Quebec City? I have driven all over the Martime provinces several times. I fly to Manchester, Maine and pick up a rental car and put 1800 miles on it over the next 2-3 weeks, usually end up in Montreal and then drive back to Maine and dump the car and fly back to Baltimore (600 miles) Gordon I could supply a guided tour of all the breweries from Halifix to Montreal!! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 8:00 PM Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > Hi Gordon, > I think its almost a 9 hour drive from Toronto to Quebec city. <grin> > > However, I do remember some of these quaint back streets the last time I > visited Quebec City. > > Kind regards > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:21 PM > Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > >> Mike: Actually you don't live too far from what could be called a close. > In >> Quebec in the old city and near the central square is a little street >> with >> houses behind each other. <snip> > > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.0 - Release Date: 3/21/05 > > >

Sounds like Baltimore, Maryland, they have nightly drive bye and also walk bye shootings. They only have about 65,000 drug addicts(10% of population) and only 52% of the non white males have prison records. Needless to say I live in the County and seldom visit that esteemed city. Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 7:54 PM Subject: Re: [MLN] Edinburgh census ATKIN family > and I thought Moss Side was bad....<GRIN> > > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Liz Parkinson" <parkinsonliz@hotmail.com> > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 4:14 PM > Subject: RE: [MLN] Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > >> Mike, nowadays you wouldnt want to visit Hulme, and if you did, you sure >> wouldnt recognise it - all 60s built flats and drugs and drive by > shooting - >> al ot of good positive stuff going on there as well, but it is a bad area >> now >> >> Liz >> >> >From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> >> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> >Subject: [MLN] Edinburgh census ATKIN family >> >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:01:41 -0500 >> > >> >I lived with my grandmother, mom and dad and younger brother for a short >> >time during the war in Hulme, Manchester, Lancashire England. >> > >> >My gran lived in a one up and one down terraced house dating from around >> >1850. It had a small scullery with a door leading to a very small back > yard >> >which housed a toilet in a small building in the back yard. There was no >> >cellar. The ground floor flooring was sand stone paving stones. She had > one >> >cold water tap and a two ring gas burner with a grill. The oven was part > of >> >her fireplace. She made wonderful Sunday dinners, baked excellent pies >> >although fruit and sugar were scarce. The lighting was one gas lamp in > the >> >downstairs room. This was one of many terraced homes in the south part >> >of >> >Manchester. >> > >> >A lot of them were infested with large red flat bed bugs. I was told >> >many >> >years later this was due to them using horse hair to bond the plaster to >> >the >> >wood lathes on the walls and ceilings. But the war of the bugs is >> >another >> >story :)) >> > >> >Thanks for the memories......... :)) >> > >> >Mike Morris >> >Toronto Canada >> >----- Original Message ----- >> >From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> >> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:23 PM >> >Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family >> > >> > >> > > Roger: No wonder its called a close, thats 8 people in two rooms. >> > > >> > > Gordon >> > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> >> > > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >> > > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:54 PM >> > > Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family >> > > >> > > >> > > > Hi Mike, >> > > > Here is what I read before I had the advantage of your email! There >> >was >> >an >> > > > S on ATKIN >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > Edinburgh, Canongate >> > > > 685/3/31 page 5 >> > > > Old Church except North(?) Side from 242 - 254, inclusive. >> > > > Embracing >> > > > Pirrie's Close and Gibb's Close. >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>. >> > > > 4 Pirrie's Close - 2 rooms with one window or more. >> > > > John ATKINS Head, M, 30.. ..Gold Beater, born England >> > > > Emma ATKINS, wife, M, 29...........born England >> > > > Matilda ATKINS, daur, 4, scholar... born England >> > > > William ATKINS, son, 2,.... born England >> > > > Eugenie (?) ATKINS daur, 1mo,.... born Edinburgh >> > > > John BRANNON, Boarder, M 29, Gold Beater ...born Edinburgh >> > > > Maud(?) BRANNON, Boarder, M, 25, Boarder.. born Manchester >> > > > Emma BRANNON Boarder, 11months..... born Edinburgh. >> > > > >> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > > > (?) means I stuggled with the word and it is open to >> > > > interpretation. > 2 >> >of >> > > > us looked at Eugenie. >> > > > So we should have read Sarah! >> > > > I wrote no 4. Perhaps it was 6. There were several households at > each >> > > > number. >> > > > I didn't see Thomas. I looked at the rest of Pirrie's Close and > didn't >> > > > notice any other ATKINs. >> > > > >> > > > Hope this helps but I could look again another time if you want me > to >> > > > check or try to send you a copy. The machines with printers were > busy. >> > > > >> > > > Best Wishes, >> > > > Jane >> > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > > From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> >> > > > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >> > > > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:53 PM >> > > > Subject: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> Hi Jane, >> > > >> Thank you for your generous offer. I really would appreciate it if >> >you >> > > >> can >> > > >> spare the time to look this up. >> > > >> >> > > >> The family lived at #6 Pirrie's Close in March of 1871. District >> > > >> Cannongate, >> > > >> Burgh of >> > > >> Edinburgh, Scotland. >> > > >> >> > > >> John Atkin Trade was a Goldbeater b1841 Salford Lancashire >> > > >> Wife Emma b1842 Salford >> > > >> Son Thomas b1862 England >> > > >> Dau Matilda B1867 Salford >> > > >> Son William b1869 Salford >> > > >> Dau Sarah Ann born 21 March 1871 at above listed address in > Scotland. >> > > >> >> > > >> Please could you also see if there are any other ATKIN families >> >living >> >in >> > > >> Pirrie's Close. I am curious to see if John ATKIN'S parents John > and >> >Mary >> > > >> ATKIN might be near by or some of his siblings. >> > > >> >> > > >> Best wishes >> > > >> Mike Morris >> > > >> Toronto Canada >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> ----- Original Message ----- >> > > >> From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> >> > > >> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >> > > >> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:41 AM >> > > >> Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >>> Hi Mike, >> > > >>> >> > > >>> If no previous offers, I will happily look up the 1871 Pirrie's >> >Close, >> > > >>> in >> > > >> my >> > > >>> lunch hour. >> > > >>> >> > > >>> Best Wishes, >> > > >>> Jane <snip> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> -- >> > > >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> > > >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> > > >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > No virus found in this incoming message. >> > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> > > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> >-- >> >No virus found in this outgoing message. >> >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> >Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> > >> >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> >> > > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.0 - Release Date: 3/21/05 > > >

Actually it is 800KM or 500 miles, from Toronto to Quebec, I guess this is close. :-) Bob ================== gordon wrote: > Mike: Actually you don't live too far from what could be called a > close. In Quebec in the old city and near the central square is a > little street with houses behind each other. I took photos of that > some years back.. >

Liz: I had to laugh at your Japanese tourists. A few yearsback our local library had an article published about them in Japan. It's very advanced and modern library with computer labs etc. For the next two years we could hardly get into the front door because of Japanese tourists! Gordon From: "Liz Parkinson" <parkinsonliz@hotmail.com> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 3:25 PM Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > it is pretty bustley now Mike - but with tourists of course. when i was > on the royal mile a week or two back it was full of Japanese tourists, > plus a few European ones. > > Liz > >>From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> >>Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >>Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:10:46 -0500 >> >>I just want to say, thank you, I found this subject about what is a Close >>etc was very interesting. I have seen the map, the area has an interesting >>layout, not quite like a fishes bones and yet very Close (forgive the pun) >>I >>would have loved to have seen the hustle and bustle that went on in these >>places 150 years ago. >> >>I assume Cannon gate wound its way down a hill with these 'Close's' >>running >>off on each side of Cannon gate. >> >>Cheers >>Mike Morris >>Toronto Canada >> >> >> >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "Liz Parkinson" <parkinsonliz@hotmail.com> >>To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >>Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 12:56 PM >>Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> >> >> > yes I have heard of the Battle of Bannockburn, I just thought perhaps >>there >> > was particular thing going on. I know there was trouble in >> > Tudor/Stuart >> > times, but not too knowledgeable generally on Scottish history >> > >> > Liz >> > >> > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >> > >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> > >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 17:43:52 -0000 >> > > >> > >In those days there was always fighting have you never heard of the >>Battle >> > >of Bannockburn >> > > >> > >-----Original Message----- >> > >From: Liz Parkinson [mailto:parkinsonliz@hotmail.com] >> > >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:47 >> > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> > > >> > >excuse my ignorance of Scottish hoistory - what invasion >> > > >> > >Liz >> > > >> > > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >> > > >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> > > >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:15:59 -0000 >> > > > >> > > >Think of the Royal Mile as the spine of a fish. >> > > >Building was done on either side and down the closes. >> > > >People only lived in the High Street so they needed as many houses >> > > >as >> > > >possible that is why the houses were built so high. >> > > >Once you get to the Canongate things change as that was out side the >>city >> > > >walls. They then built houses with more space between them, but this >>was >> > > >not >> > > >popular at the time as people were afraid to live out side the gates >>for >> > > >fear of the invasion mainly. >> > > >Hope you understand this. >> > > >Regards >> > > >Eleanor >> > > > >> > > >-----Original Message----- >> > > >From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >> > > >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:04 >> > > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > > >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> > > > >> > > >Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me >> > > >is >>why >> > > >they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial >>gems >> > >and >> > > >what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have >> > > >buildings built in front of them. >> > > > >> > > > Gordon >> > > >----- Original Message ----- >> > > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >> > > >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >> > > >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM >> > > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the >>same >> > >way >> > > > > as >> > > > > you came in. >> > > > > Hope this helps >> > > > > Regards >> > > > > Eleanor >> > > > > >> > > > > -----Original Message----- >> > > > > From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >> > > > > Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 >> > > > > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >> > > > > Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> > > > > >> > > > > Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the >> > > > > first >> > > >place, >> > > > > shortage of flat land or what? >> > > > > >> > > > > Gordon >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > No virus found in this incoming message. >> > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> > >> > >> >> >> >>-- >>No virus found in this outgoing message. >>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >>Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> > > >

it is pretty bustley now Mike - but with tourists of course. when i was on the royal mile a week or two back it was full of Japanese tourists, plus a few European ones. Liz >From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:10:46 -0500 > >I just want to say, thank you, I found this subject about what is a Close >etc was very interesting. I have seen the map, the area has an interesting >layout, not quite like a fishes bones and yet very Close (forgive the pun) >I >would have loved to have seen the hustle and bustle that went on in these >places 150 years ago. > >I assume Cannon gate wound its way down a hill with these 'Close's' running >off on each side of Cannon gate. > >Cheers >Mike Morris >Toronto Canada > > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Liz Parkinson" <parkinsonliz@hotmail.com> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 12:56 PM >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > yes I have heard of the Battle of Bannockburn, I just thought perhaps >there > > was particular thing going on. I know there was trouble in Tudor/Stuart > > times, but not too knowledgeable generally on Scottish history > > > > Liz > > > > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> > > >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 17:43:52 -0000 > > > > > >In those days there was always fighting have you never heard of the >Battle > > >of Bannockburn > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: Liz Parkinson [mailto:parkinsonliz@hotmail.com] > > >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:47 > > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > > >excuse my ignorance of Scottish hoistory - what invasion > > > > > >Liz > > > > > > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> > > > >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:15:59 -0000 > > > > > > > >Think of the Royal Mile as the spine of a fish. > > > >Building was done on either side and down the closes. > > > >People only lived in the High Street so they needed as many houses as > > > >possible that is why the houses were built so high. > > > >Once you get to the Canongate things change as that was out side the >city > > > >walls. They then built houses with more space between them, but this >was > > > >not > > > >popular at the time as people were afraid to live out side the gates >for > > > >fear of the invasion mainly. > > > >Hope you understand this. > > > >Regards > > > >Eleanor > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > > >From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] > > > >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:04 > > > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > > >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > > > > >Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me is >why > > > >they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial >gems > > >and > > > >what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have > > > >buildings built in front of them. > > > > > > > > Gordon > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> > > > >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM > > > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > > > > > > > > > > Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the >same > > >way > > > > > as > > > > > you came in. > > > > > Hope this helps > > > > > Regards > > > > > Eleanor > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] > > > > > Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 > > > > > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > > > > > > > Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the first > > > >place, > > > > > shortage of flat land or what? > > > > > > > > > > Gordon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > > > > > > >-- >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >

well yes me might of! Liz >From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 14:53:20 -0400 > >O Liz: You opened the door for this one! "Maybe the English having gotten >tired of all the heatheran invasions by those North of the Roman wall might >have invaded in return! > > Gordon >----- Original Message ----- From: "Liz Parkinson" ><parkinsonliz@hotmail.com> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 11:47 AM >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > >>excuse my ignorance of Scottish hoistory - what invasion >> >>Liz >> >>>From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >>>Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>>To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>>Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >>>Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:15:59 -0000 >>> >>>Think of the Royal Mile as the spine of a fish. >>>Building was done on either side and down the closes. >>>People only lived in the High Street so they needed as many houses as >>>possible that is why the houses were built so high. >>>Once you get to the Canongate things change as that was out side the city >>>walls. They then built houses with more space between them, but this was >>>not >>>popular at the time as people were afraid to live out side the gates for >>>fear of the invasion mainly. >>>Hope you understand this. >>>Regards >>>Eleanor >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >>>Sent: 21 March 2005 15:04 >>>To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>>Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >>> >>>Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me is why >>>they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial gems >>>and >>>what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have >>>buildings built in front of them. >>> >>> Gordon >>>----- Original Message ----- >>>From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >>>To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >>>Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM >>>Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >>> >>> >>> > Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the same > >>>way >>> > as >>> > you came in. >>> > Hope this helps >>> > Regards >>> > Eleanor >>> > >>> > -----Original Message----- >>> > From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >>> > Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 >>> > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>> > Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >>> > >>> > Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the first >>>place, >>> > shortage of flat land or what? >>> > >>> > Gordon >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > >

Hi Gordon, I think its almost a 9 hour drive from Toronto to Quebec city. <grin> However, I do remember some of these quaint back streets the last time I visited Quebec City. Kind regards Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > Mike: Actually you don't live too far from what could be called a close. In > Quebec in the old city and near the central square is a little street with > houses behind each other. <snip> -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.0 - Release Date: 3/21/05

Hi Mike, Here is what I read before I had the advantage of your email! There was an S on ATKIN >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Edinburgh, Canongate 685/3/31 page 5 Old Church except North(?) Side from 242 - 254, inclusive. Embracing Pirrie's Close and Gibb's Close. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>. 4 Pirrie's Close - 2 rooms with one window or more. John ATKINS Head, M, 30.. ..Gold Beater, born England Emma ATKINS, wife, M, 29...........born England Matilda ATKINS, daur, 4, scholar... born England William ATKINS, son, 2,.... born England Eugenie (?) ATKINS daur, 1mo,.... born Edinburgh John BRANNON, Boarder, M 29, Gold Beater ...born Edinburgh Maud(?) BRANNON, Boarder, M, 25, Boarder.. born Manchester Emma BRANNON Boarder, 11months..... born Edinburgh. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (?) means I stuggled with the word and it is open to interpretation. 2 of us looked at Eugenie. So we should have read Sarah! I wrote no 4. Perhaps it was 6. There were several households at each number. I didn't see Thomas. I looked at the rest of Pirrie's Close and didn't notice any other ATKINs. Hope this helps but I could look again another time if you want me to check or try to send you a copy. The machines with printers were busy. Best Wishes, Jane ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:53 PM Subject: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > Hi Jane, > Thank you for your generous offer. I really would appreciate it if you can > spare the time to look this up. > > The family lived at #6 Pirrie's Close in March of 1871. District > Cannongate, > Burgh of > Edinburgh, Scotland. > > John Atkin Trade was a Goldbeater b1841 Salford Lancashire > Wife Emma b1842 Salford > Son Thomas b1862 England > Dau Matilda B1867 Salford > Son William b1869 Salford > Dau Sarah Ann born 21 March 1871 at above listed address in Scotland. > > Please could you also see if there are any other ATKIN families living in > Pirrie's Close. I am curious to see if John ATKIN'S parents John and Mary > ATKIN might be near by or some of his siblings. > > Best wishes > Mike Morris > Toronto Canada > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:41 AM > Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > >> Hi Mike, >> >> If no previous offers, I will happily look up the 1871 Pirrie's Close, in > my >> lunch hour. >> >> Best Wishes, >> Jane <snip> > > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > >

and I thought Moss Side was bad....<GRIN> Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "Liz Parkinson" <parkinsonliz@hotmail.com> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 4:14 PM Subject: RE: [MLN] Edinburgh census ATKIN family > Mike, nowadays you wouldnt want to visit Hulme, and if you did, you sure > wouldnt recognise it - all 60s built flats and drugs and drive by shooting - > al ot of good positive stuff going on there as well, but it is a bad area > now > > Liz > > >From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> > >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: [MLN] Edinburgh census ATKIN family > >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:01:41 -0500 > > > >I lived with my grandmother, mom and dad and younger brother for a short > >time during the war in Hulme, Manchester, Lancashire England. > > > >My gran lived in a one up and one down terraced house dating from around > >1850. It had a small scullery with a door leading to a very small back yard > >which housed a toilet in a small building in the back yard. There was no > >cellar. The ground floor flooring was sand stone paving stones. She had one > >cold water tap and a two ring gas burner with a grill. The oven was part of > >her fireplace. She made wonderful Sunday dinners, baked excellent pies > >although fruit and sugar were scarce. The lighting was one gas lamp in the > >downstairs room. This was one of many terraced homes in the south part of > >Manchester. > > > >A lot of them were infested with large red flat bed bugs. I was told many > >years later this was due to them using horse hair to bond the plaster to > >the > >wood lathes on the walls and ceilings. But the war of the bugs is another > >story :)) > > > >Thanks for the memories......... :)) > > > >Mike Morris > >Toronto Canada > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> > >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:23 PM > >Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > > > > > Roger: No wonder its called a close, thats 8 people in two rooms. > > > > > > Gordon > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> > > > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > > > > > > > > Hi Mike, > > > > Here is what I read before I had the advantage of your email! There > >was > >an > > > > S on ATKIN > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > Edinburgh, Canongate > > > > 685/3/31 page 5 > > > > Old Church except North(?) Side from 242 - 254, inclusive. Embracing > > > > Pirrie's Close and Gibb's Close. > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>. > > > > 4 Pirrie's Close - 2 rooms with one window or more. > > > > John ATKINS Head, M, 30.. ..Gold Beater, born England > > > > Emma ATKINS, wife, M, 29...........born England > > > > Matilda ATKINS, daur, 4, scholar... born England > > > > William ATKINS, son, 2,.... born England > > > > Eugenie (?) ATKINS daur, 1mo,.... born Edinburgh > > > > John BRANNON, Boarder, M 29, Gold Beater ...born Edinburgh > > > > Maud(?) BRANNON, Boarder, M, 25, Boarder.. born Manchester > > > > Emma BRANNON Boarder, 11months..... born Edinburgh. > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > (?) means I stuggled with the word and it is open to interpretation. 2 > >of > > > > us looked at Eugenie. > > > > So we should have read Sarah! > > > > I wrote no 4. Perhaps it was 6. There were several households at each > > > > number. > > > > I didn't see Thomas. I looked at the rest of Pirrie's Close and didn't > > > > notice any other ATKINs. > > > > > > > > Hope this helps but I could look again another time if you want me to > > > > check or try to send you a copy. The machines with printers were busy. > > > > > > > > Best Wishes, > > > > Jane > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> > > > > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > > > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:53 PM > > > > Subject: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > > > > > > > > > >> Hi Jane, > > > >> Thank you for your generous offer. I really would appreciate it if > >you > > > >> can > > > >> spare the time to look this up. > > > >> > > > >> The family lived at #6 Pirrie's Close in March of 1871. District > > > >> Cannongate, > > > >> Burgh of > > > >> Edinburgh, Scotland. > > > >> > > > >> John Atkin Trade was a Goldbeater b1841 Salford Lancashire > > > >> Wife Emma b1842 Salford > > > >> Son Thomas b1862 England > > > >> Dau Matilda B1867 Salford > > > >> Son William b1869 Salford > > > >> Dau Sarah Ann born 21 March 1871 at above listed address in Scotland. > > > >> > > > >> Please could you also see if there are any other ATKIN families > >living > >in > > > >> Pirrie's Close. I am curious to see if John ATKIN'S parents John and > >Mary > > > >> ATKIN might be near by or some of his siblings. > > > >> > > > >> Best wishes > > > >> Mike Morris > > > >> Toronto Canada > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > > >> From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> > > > >> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > > > >> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:41 AM > > > >> Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > > >> > > > >> > > > >>> Hi Mike, > > > >>> > > > >>> If no previous offers, I will happily look up the 1871 Pirrie's > >Close, > > > >>> in > > > >> my > > > >>> lunch hour. > > > >>> > > > >>> Best Wishes, > > > >>> Jane <snip> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -- > > > >> No virus found in this outgoing message. > > > >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > > > > > > > > > > > > >-- > >No virus found in this outgoing message. > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > >Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.0 - Release Date: 3/21/05

Thanks, Alistair! So the occupier was the lessor, as opposed to a sub-lessor or tenant? I'd never heard of this term in the U.S. All the best, Sonia -----Original Message----- From: Alistair Cameron [mailto:acameron@hinet.net.au] Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 1:56 PM To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MLN] Occupier - need definition Gil & Sonia Murray wrote: > > I think an "occupier" was a tenant. Maybe he was her father - or it > could be, his wife was paid to board the child? The land tax ie VALUATION ROLLS records provide three columns re those with an interest, against each property These are headed PROPRIETOR ie the owner TENANT the person who rents or leases the place from the Proprietor OCCUPIER the resident- usually the head of the family living there Cheers, ALISTAIR M. CAMERON A.A.G.R.A. Professional Genealogist http://quozl.netrek.org/cameron-research/ PO Box 215 BUNDANOON NSW 2578 AUSTRALIA

yes I have heard of the Battle of Bannockburn, I just thought perhaps there was particular thing going on. I know there was trouble in Tudor/Stuart times, but not too knowledgeable generally on Scottish history Liz >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 17:43:52 -0000 > >In those days there was always fighting have you never heard of the Battle >of Bannockburn > >-----Original Message----- >From: Liz Parkinson [mailto:parkinsonliz@hotmail.com] >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:47 >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > >excuse my ignorance of Scottish hoistory - what invasion > >Liz > > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> > >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:15:59 -0000 > > > >Think of the Royal Mile as the spine of a fish. > >Building was done on either side and down the closes. > >People only lived in the High Street so they needed as many houses as > >possible that is why the houses were built so high. > >Once you get to the Canongate things change as that was out side the city > >walls. They then built houses with more space between them, but this was > >not > >popular at the time as people were afraid to live out side the gates for > >fear of the invasion mainly. > >Hope you understand this. > >Regards > >Eleanor > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] > >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:04 > >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > >Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me is why > >they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial gems >and > >what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have > >buildings built in front of them. > > > > Gordon > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> > >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM > >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > > > > Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the same >way > > > as > > > you came in. > > > Hope this helps > > > Regards > > > Eleanor > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] > > > Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 > > > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > > Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > > > Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the first > >place, > > > shortage of flat land or what? > > > > > > Gordon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

In those days there was always fighting have you never heard of the Battle of Bannockburn -----Original Message----- From: Liz Parkinson [mailto:parkinsonliz@hotmail.com] Sent: 21 March 2005 15:47 To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh excuse my ignorance of Scottish hoistory - what invasion Liz >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:15:59 -0000 > >Think of the Royal Mile as the spine of a fish. >Building was done on either side and down the closes. >People only lived in the High Street so they needed as many houses as >possible that is why the houses were built so high. >Once you get to the Canongate things change as that was out side the city >walls. They then built houses with more space between them, but this was >not >popular at the time as people were afraid to live out side the gates for >fear of the invasion mainly. >Hope you understand this. >Regards >Eleanor > >-----Original Message----- >From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:04 >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > >Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me is why >they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial gems and >what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have >buildings built in front of them. > > Gordon >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the same way > > as > > you came in. > > Hope this helps > > Regards > > Eleanor > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] > > Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 > > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the first >place, > > shortage of flat land or what? > > > > Gordon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

...not to mention that Gorgie Road is the home of Hearts Football Club, or at least it was when I was a teenager attending home games. Are they still there? And do you think that teenage girls could attend football games on their own today? moira Duncan Smith wrote: >Elaine, > >Gorgie Mains, situated to the East of Primrose Terrace, was so named around 1815, as a replacement for Gorgie Muir. The name Gorgie comes from 'Gor Gyn' or upper wedge, supposedly a reference to the tapering shape of the land between the river and the Craiglockart Hills. > >Grange Toll was originally a place to the North end of Mayfield Road, which is in the Liberton area, just to the East of Gorgie. > >Duncan, Dundee > > > > >

On the subject of Close's, can someone explain to me just exactly what a "Close" is??? Thanks, gretchen

Many thanks, Alistair. I happily accept this definition. There is much to learn. -- Alice in Rockville, Maryland, USA In a message dated 3/21/2005 2:56:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, acameron@hinet.net.au writes: PROPRIETOR ie the owner TENANT the person who rents or leases the place from the Proprietor OCCUPIER the resident- usually the head of the family living there Cheers, ALISTAIR M. CAMERON A.A.G.R.A.

excuse my ignorance of Scottish hoistory - what invasion Liz >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 15:15:59 -0000 > >Think of the Royal Mile as the spine of a fish. >Building was done on either side and down the closes. >People only lived in the High Street so they needed as many houses as >possible that is why the houses were built so high. >Once you get to the Canongate things change as that was out side the city >walls. They then built houses with more space between them, but this was >not >popular at the time as people were afraid to live out side the gates for >fear of the invasion mainly. >Hope you understand this. >Regards >Eleanor > >-----Original Message----- >From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >Sent: 21 March 2005 15:04 >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > >Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me is why >they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial gems and >what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have >buildings built in front of them. > > Gordon >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Eleanor Robertson" <eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the same way > > as > > you came in. > > Hope this helps > > Regards > > Eleanor > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] > > Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 > > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > > > Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the first >place, > > shortage of flat land or what? > > > > Gordon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Roger: No wonder its called a close, thats 8 people in two rooms. Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:54 PM Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > Hi Mike, > Here is what I read before I had the advantage of your email! There was an > S on ATKIN >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Edinburgh, Canongate > 685/3/31 page 5 > Old Church except North(?) Side from 242 - 254, inclusive. Embracing > Pirrie's Close and Gibb's Close. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>. > 4 Pirrie's Close - 2 rooms with one window or more. > John ATKINS Head, M, 30.. ..Gold Beater, born England > Emma ATKINS, wife, M, 29...........born England > Matilda ATKINS, daur, 4, scholar... born England > William ATKINS, son, 2,.... born England > Eugenie (?) ATKINS daur, 1mo,.... born Edinburgh > John BRANNON, Boarder, M 29, Gold Beater ...born Edinburgh > Maud(?) BRANNON, Boarder, M, 25, Boarder.. born Manchester > Emma BRANNON Boarder, 11months..... born Edinburgh. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > (?) means I stuggled with the word and it is open to interpretation. 2 of > us looked at Eugenie. > So we should have read Sarah! > I wrote no 4. Perhaps it was 6. There were several households at each > number. > I didn't see Thomas. I looked at the rest of Pirrie's Close and didn't > notice any other ATKINs. > > Hope this helps but I could look again another time if you want me to > check or try to send you a copy. The machines with printers were busy. > > Best Wishes, > Jane > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mike Morris" <morrisind@rogers.com> > To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:53 PM > Subject: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family > > >> Hi Jane, >> Thank you for your generous offer. I really would appreciate it if you >> can >> spare the time to look this up. >> >> The family lived at #6 Pirrie's Close in March of 1871. District >> Cannongate, >> Burgh of >> Edinburgh, Scotland. >> >> John Atkin Trade was a Goldbeater b1841 Salford Lancashire >> Wife Emma b1842 Salford >> Son Thomas b1862 England >> Dau Matilda B1867 Salford >> Son William b1869 Salford >> Dau Sarah Ann born 21 March 1871 at above listed address in Scotland. >> >> Please could you also see if there are any other ATKIN families living in >> Pirrie's Close. I am curious to see if John ATKIN'S parents John and Mary >> ATKIN might be near by or some of his siblings. >> >> Best wishes >> Mike Morris >> Toronto Canada >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "roger kelly" <roger.kelly1@virgin.net> >> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 2:41 AM >> Subject: Re: [MLN] 1871 Edinburgh census ATKIN family >> >> >>> Hi Mike, >>> >>> If no previous offers, I will happily look up the 1871 Pirrie's Close, >>> in >> my >>> lunch hour. >>> >>> Best Wishes, >>> Jane <snip> >> >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.7.4 - Release Date: 3/18/05 >> >> > > > >

probably space in an expanding city - the actual "old city" is small and cramped, and the outskirts would have been hard to build on in those days without JCBs etc - Just an opinion tho Liz >From: "gordon crooks" <glcrooks@bcpl.net> >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 11:04:04 -0400 > >Eleanor: I had figured that much out, but what really interests me is why >they were made in the first place, some appear to be architeckial gems and >what prompted them to be build behind existing buildings or to have >buildings built in front of them. > > Gordon >----- Original Message ----- From: "Eleanor Robertson" ><eleanor.robertson@blueyonder.co.uk> >To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> >Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 10:56 AM >Subject: RE: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh > > >>Close means a closed ending there is only one way out it is the same way >>as >>you came in. >>Hope this helps >>Regards >>Eleanor >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] >>Sent: 21 March 2005 12:21 >>To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >>Subject: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >> >>Can anyone explain the reason for building "Close's" in the first place, >>shortage of flat land or what? >> >> Gordon >> >> >> >> >> >> > >