List Members, Back again with another update to my website. http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~hiflyte/ <http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/%7Ehiflyte/> The Ireland Marriages INDEX files have been added for selected surnames. Read the header, If it says for all Ireland all from the index films are included. For Donegal means All for Dongegal but with some others showing. Happy Easter Enjoy Bob Cdn.

Gretings, Could some kind soul please explain the reference to " 'Deaf' BURKE and HARE", mentioned in the newspaper memorium to my ggmother, Elizabeth ATKIN/S nee Mearns/LAW here in OZ in 1877? regards, Don HORSEY researching ATKINS, LAW, MEARNS from Canongate.

"Burke and Hare were a terrible pair"------ sold corpses, usually produced by themselves, to doctors in Edinburgh so the doctors could practice their work, etc. They were eventually caught and, I believe, hanged. George Stephens ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Horsey" <dhorsey@mcmedia.com.au> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 8:35 PM Subject: [MLN] BURKE and HARE > Gretings, > > Could some kind soul please explain the reference to " 'Deaf' BURKE > and HARE", mentioned in > the newspaper memorium to my ggmother, Elizabeth ATKIN/S nee Mearns/LAW > here in OZ in 1877? > > regards, > > Don HORSEY > > researching ATKINS, LAW, MEARNS from Canongate. > >

I am also researching ATKINS who lived in Cannongate during the 1871 census. Cheers Mike Morris Toronto Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Horsey" <dhorsey@mcmedia.com.au> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 PM Subject: [MLN] BURKE and HARE > Gretings, > > Could some kind soul please explain the reference to " 'Deaf' BURKE and HARE", mentioned in > the newspaper memorium to my ggmother, Elizabeth ATKIN/S nee Mearns/LAW here in OZ in 1877? > > regards, > > Don HORSEY > > researching ATKINS, LAW, MEARNS from Canongate. > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.3 - Release Date: 3/25/05 > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.3 - Release Date: 3/25/05

If some kind soul happens to have a copy of the 1861 census would they please see if they can locate a John Atkin born 1841 in Salford, Lancashire , England. He might be listed as either a Gold Beater or a Fustian cutter. In this time period he would be listed as a single person. (he married in 1865) The 1851 Salford census has John residing at ? Pollitt Court, Salford. Ref No. 2224/50/132. But he is not listed with his parents in the 1861 census. John ATKIN my great great grandfather was by trade a Gold beater. But the family we have him associated with during the 1851 census has him listed as a Fustian Cutter. I am hoping they are his parents John and Mary ATKIN. Or it might turn out that I have the wrong set of parents. Please can someone help me locate John? John did move a lot between Salford, England, Edinburgh and the Glasgow areas as a Gold beater. I thought perhaps he might have learnt his trade in either of these two cities in Scotland. I find it strange that he started out as a Fustian cutter but finished up as a Gold beater. Unless Gold beating was not an apprenticed trade and it was easy to move into this kind of work. All my best Mike Morris Toronto Canada -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.8.3 - Release Date: 3/25/05

I wish I'd worn a hat! Helen ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gil & Sonia Murray" <happyman70@bellsouth.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 12:18 PM Subject: RE: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL > This 71 year old "Lady" married a 57 year old man - a 14 year wrong-way > age > disparity. Obviously, her years didn't show. In the 19th century ladies > wore hats and gloves to shelter them from the sun - no tanning then! - and > carried sunshades, so their skin stayed soft and young looking far longer > than our skin does today. > > When Karenhappuch Brown married William R. J. Chapman in 1887 in Norfolk, > both were listed on the certificate as "of full age." It would have been > a > brave minister who asked the couple's ages - the groom was 23, the bride > 37. > I wonder if William ever knew Cary's true age! > > Happy hunting, > > Sonia > > -----Original Message----- > From: Helen Ulmann [mailto:hulmann@tca-online.com.au] > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 4:58 PM > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL > > Somehow or other, last night, I Filed this opus to Sonia (of Clutching at > Straws) instead of Sending, and now, instead of continuing the clutching > at > straws thread, what the hell, I'll ask for help with my CONNELL mob, but > this is what I meant to send. > > Sonia - here's another one, and of Midlothian origins at that, where the > lady gets a younger man and with a vengeance. . In Melbourne in 1854, > Agnes > Georgina SWAYNE, a widow and a "Lady", married my widowed, 57 year old and > rather rich ggggrandfather James CONNELL (b. "Newton" near Edinburgh > abt.1796 according to Chelsea Pensioner papers but "Newtown" on second > marriage certificate) stating that she was 47. The wedding was witnessed > by > her (we think) niece, Jean HILL nee YOUNG. Five years later, having > inherited from James to the detriment of James' only child Mary Ann, Agnes > Georgina died and was stated to be 67, the informant just happening to be > niece's husband, who inherited all. A rapid ageing of 15 years in 5. > > The truly astounding thing to discover was that Agnes Georgina was in fact > 71 when she married James. She had been christened at St. Cuthberts, > Edinburgh, in 1783, daughter of James Lieutenant PEDDIE and Elizabeth > YOUNG, married John WRIGHT in 1810, John SWAYNE in 1825, and came out to > Australia (stated age 50 on the ship's list) with daughter Christiana in > 1853. I wondered if I had missed another Agnes Georgina Peddie but the > names > of parents, place of birth, and number of children as given on her > marriage > certificate all accord with the above. Only the DOB/age is 24 years out! > > My cousin, a barrister, always thought there was something fishy about > Agnes > and the inheritance, but he didn't know that the discrepancy in age was 24 > years not 15. How did she do it!!! What was going on? Did James Connell > know? > > If anyone on the list has connections to any of the above, I would love to > get in touch. > > To confuse things even further, there is the birth of a James Connell in > Jan.1827 at Neilston, Renfrew, son of James Connell and Mary Young. In > 1826, James may well have been in Scotland as he had contracted varicose > veins "on the long march in Ireland" with his regiment, the 42nd, and was > en > route with first wife Mary SHINE of Adare Co. Limerick and daughter Mary > Ann > to Gibraltar where the rest of his regiment had already arrived. This may, > of course, be sheer coincidence, but after unravelling the foregoing I > don't > know! > > Helen > Australia. > >

Thanks for tthat, I have checked everything that I can find, alternative spellings etc. I am lucky enough to be able to visit Edinburgh but have still had no luck other than the birth entry you have provided. Tricia Stewart

Don't we all! Sonia Snip> I wish I'd worn a hat! Helen Snip> In the 19th century ladies > wore hats and gloves to shelter them from the sun - no tanning then! - and > carried sunshades, so their skin stayed soft and young looking far longer > than our skin does today. >

Anne wrote here: > > Hello Cameron, > > I saw you email relating to the indexing of the 1851 census of Edinburgh, > and query as to whether Gorbals and Glasgow have also been done. I am > looking for the entries of my Dingwall family. Yes the 1851 and 1841 Census records of Glasgow have been name indexed. I am uncertain how completely! I'll email you separately re surname DINGWALL. Cheers, ALISTAIR M. CAMERON http://quozl.netrek.org/cameron-research/ PO Box 215 BUNDANOON NSW 2578 AUSTRALIA

The age difference, with the bride being so much older than the groom, wouldn't be considered that out of place, nowadays. Sharon

Jenny, First, this could be his sister, all other data fits the picture. Could not connect any other dots. Luck Bob ===================================== SHEARER, Janet Christening Gender: Female Birth Date: 11 Oct 1831 Birthplace: Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland Recorded in: Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland Father: James SHEARER Mother: Janet LAURIE Source: FHL Film 1066691 Dates: 1809 - 1855 ---------------------------------------------------- Jennifer wrote:<SNIP> >James Shearer born c1834 in Edinburgh married Mary Irvine of Glasgow and moved around Scotland. His father is James Shearer a grocer who I believe to have died prior to 1841. I believe that his mother could be Jane(t) Laurie and brother Thomas born c1827, but I have some more investigating to do!! 3 of James's children were born in Leith - William Charters Shearer 1864, Isabella 1866 and John 1869. > >

Here is the birth of Margaret which you have. Have you checked the Death Index for data and also the spelling as Lang, Lyll, Lyell would suggest looking at the FHC Sct Death Index films, assumming they have them in-house on permanent loan. Would check the films for you but will not be at the FHC for awhile. Bob Cdn. ================= LYALL, Margaret Christening Gender: Birth Date: 24 Dec 1841 Birthplace: , Currie, Midlothian, Scotland Recorded in: Currie, Midlothian, Scotland Father: James LYALL Mother: Margaret LAING Source: FHL Film 1066678 Dates: 1728 - 1855 ============================ Tricias4354@ wrote: I have hit a brick wall with James Lyle and Margaret Laing from Currie. They

Hello group, As a new member I would like to register my name interest of SHEARER in this area. My information at the moment is a bit scant as they are proving hard to track down!! James Shearer born c1834 in Edinburgh married Mary Irvine of Glasgow and moved around Scotland. His father is James Shearer a grocer who I believe to have died prior to 1841. I believe that his mother could be Jane(t) Laurie and brother Thomas born c1827, but I have some more investigating to do!! 3 of James's children were born in Leith - William Charters Shearer 1864, Isabella 1866 and John 1869. Not much to go on unfortunately but if you think we are tracking the same family I would love to hear from you. Many Thanks, Jenny

It was a rare given name. When I looked for her in GRO records, I only found one other Karenhappuch surnamed Brown - and Brown is such a very common surname! Sonia -----Original Message----- From: gordon crooks [mailto:glcrooks@bcpl.net] Sent: Friday, March 25, 2005 6:29 AM To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL I was sure that i had seen every strangulation of English and old given names until is saw:Karenhappuch. I have soime dillies in my lines but none beats this!! Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gil & Sonia Murray" <happyman70@bellsouth.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 9:18 PM Subject: RE: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL > This 71 year old "Lady" married a 57 year old man - a 14 year wrong-way > age > disparity. Obviously, her years didn't show. In the 19th century ladies > wore hats and gloves to shelter them from the sun - no tanning then! - and > carried sunshades, so their skin stayed soft and young looking far longer > than our skin does today. > > When Karenhappuch Brown married William R. J. Chapman in 1887 in Norfolk, > both were listed on the certificate as "of full age." It would have been > a > brave minister who asked the couple's ages - the groom was 23, the bride > 37. > I wonder if William ever knew Cary's true age! > > Happy hunting, > > Sonia > > -----Original Message----- > From: Helen Ulmann [mailto:hulmann@tca-online.com.au] > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 4:58 PM > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL > > Somehow or other, last night, I Filed this opus to Sonia (of Clutching at > Straws) instead of Sending, and now, instead of continuing the clutching > at > straws thread, what the hell, I'll ask for help with my CONNELL mob, but > this is what I meant to send. > > Sonia - here's another one, and of Midlothian origins at that, where the > lady gets a younger man and with a vengeance. . In Melbourne in 1854, > Agnes > Georgina SWAYNE, a widow and a "Lady", married my widowed, 57 year old and > rather rich ggggrandfather James CONNELL (b. "Newton" near Edinburgh > abt.1796 according to Chelsea Pensioner papers but "Newtown" on second > marriage certificate) stating that she was 47. The wedding was witnessed > by > her (we think) niece, Jean HILL nee YOUNG. Five years later, having > inherited from James to the detriment of James' only child Mary Ann, Agnes > Georgina died and was stated to be 67, the informant just happening to be > niece's husband, who inherited all. A rapid ageing of 15 years in 5. > > The truly astounding thing to discover was that Agnes Georgina was in fact > 71 when she married James. She had been christened at St. Cuthberts, > Edinburgh, in 1783, daughter of James Lieutenant PEDDIE and Elizabeth > YOUNG, married John WRIGHT in 1810, John SWAYNE in 1825, and came out to > Australia (stated age 50 on the ship's list) with daughter Christiana in > 1853. I wondered if I had missed another Agnes Georgina Peddie but the > names > of parents, place of birth, and number of children as given on her > marriage > certificate all accord with the above. Only the DOB/age is 24 years out! > > My cousin, a barrister, always thought there was something fishy about > Agnes > and the inheritance, but he didn't know that the discrepancy in age was 24 > years not 15. How did she do it!!! What was going on? Did James Connell > know? > > If anyone on the list has connections to any of the above, I would love to > get in touch. > > To confuse things even further, there is the birth of a James Connell in > Jan.1827 at Neilston, Renfrew, son of James Connell and Mary Young. In > 1826, James may well have been in Scotland as he had contracted varicose > veins "on the long march in Ireland" with his regiment, the 42nd, and was > en > route with first wife Mary SHINE of Adare Co. Limerick and daughter Mary > Ann > to Gibraltar where the rest of his regiment had already arrived. This may, > of course, be sheer coincidence, but after unravelling the foregoing I > don't > know! > > Helen > Australia. > > > > >

Gretchen, I don't know of many online burial transcription sites for Midlothian, but this one is an exception http://www.ancestor.abel.co.uk/ It covers Inveresk, Duddingston, Liberton & Newton in various ways, and has some transcriptions. Duncan, Dundee

Somehow or other, last night, I Filed this opus to Sonia (of Clutching at Straws) instead of Sending, and now, instead of continuing the clutching at straws thread, what the hell, I'll ask for help with my CONNELL mob, but this is what I meant to send. Sonia - here's another one, and of Midlothian origins at that, where the lady gets a younger man and with a vengeance. . In Melbourne in 1854, Agnes Georgina SWAYNE, a widow and a "Lady", married my widowed, 57 year old and rather rich ggggrandfather James CONNELL (b. "Newton" near Edinburgh abt.1796 according to Chelsea Pensioner papers but "Newtown" on second marriage certificate) stating that she was 47. The wedding was witnessed by her (we think) niece, Jean HILL nee YOUNG. Five years later, having inherited from James to the detriment of James' only child Mary Ann, Agnes Georgina died and was stated to be 67, the informant just happening to be niece's husband, who inherited all. A rapid ageing of 15 years in 5. The truly astounding thing to discover was that Agnes Georgina was in fact 71 when she married James. She had been christened at St. Cuthberts, Edinburgh, in 1783, daughter of James Lieutenant PEDDIE and Elizabeth YOUNG, married John WRIGHT in 1810, John SWAYNE in 1825, and came out to Australia (stated age 50 on the ship's list) with daughter Christiana in 1853. I wondered if I had missed another Agnes Georgina Peddie but the names of parents, place of birth, and number of children as given on her marriage certificate all accord with the above. Only the DOB/age is 24 years out! My cousin, a barrister, always thought there was something fishy about Agnes and the inheritance, but he didn't know that the discrepancy in age was 24 years not 15. How did she do it!!! What was going on? Did James Connell know? If anyone on the list has connections to any of the above, I would love to get in touch. To confuse things even further, there is the birth of a James Connell in Jan.1827 at Neilston, Renfrew, son of James Connell and Mary Young. In 1826, James may well have been in Scotland as he had contracted varicose veins "on the long march in Ireland" with his regiment, the 42nd, and was en route with first wife Mary SHINE of Adare Co. Limerick and daughter Mary Ann to Gibraltar where the rest of his regiment had already arrived. This may, of course, be sheer coincidence, but after unravelling the foregoing I don't know! Helen Australia.

I was sure that i had seen every strangulation of English and old given names until is saw:Karenhappuch. I have soime dillies in my lines but none beats this!! Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gil & Sonia Murray" <happyman70@bellsouth.net> To: <MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 9:18 PM Subject: RE: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL > This 71 year old "Lady" married a 57 year old man - a 14 year wrong-way > age > disparity. Obviously, her years didn't show. In the 19th century ladies > wore hats and gloves to shelter them from the sun - no tanning then! - and > carried sunshades, so their skin stayed soft and young looking far longer > than our skin does today. > > When Karenhappuch Brown married William R. J. Chapman in 1887 in Norfolk, > both were listed on the certificate as "of full age." It would have been > a > brave minister who asked the couple's ages - the groom was 23, the bride > 37. > I wonder if William ever knew Cary's true age! > > Happy hunting, > > Sonia > > -----Original Message----- > From: Helen Ulmann [mailto:hulmann@tca-online.com.au] > Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 4:58 PM > To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [MLN] The Ages of Agnes Georgina PEDDIE-Wright-Swayne- CONNELL > > Somehow or other, last night, I Filed this opus to Sonia (of Clutching at > Straws) instead of Sending, and now, instead of continuing the clutching > at > straws thread, what the hell, I'll ask for help with my CONNELL mob, but > this is what I meant to send. > > Sonia - here's another one, and of Midlothian origins at that, where the > lady gets a younger man and with a vengeance. . In Melbourne in 1854, > Agnes > Georgina SWAYNE, a widow and a "Lady", married my widowed, 57 year old and > rather rich ggggrandfather James CONNELL (b. "Newton" near Edinburgh > abt.1796 according to Chelsea Pensioner papers but "Newtown" on second > marriage certificate) stating that she was 47. The wedding was witnessed > by > her (we think) niece, Jean HILL nee YOUNG. Five years later, having > inherited from James to the detriment of James' only child Mary Ann, Agnes > Georgina died and was stated to be 67, the informant just happening to be > niece's husband, who inherited all. A rapid ageing of 15 years in 5. > > The truly astounding thing to discover was that Agnes Georgina was in fact > 71 when she married James. She had been christened at St. Cuthberts, > Edinburgh, in 1783, daughter of James Lieutenant PEDDIE and Elizabeth > YOUNG, married John WRIGHT in 1810, John SWAYNE in 1825, and came out to > Australia (stated age 50 on the ship's list) with daughter Christiana in > 1853. I wondered if I had missed another Agnes Georgina Peddie but the > names > of parents, place of birth, and number of children as given on her > marriage > certificate all accord with the above. Only the DOB/age is 24 years out! > > My cousin, a barrister, always thought there was something fishy about > Agnes > and the inheritance, but he didn't know that the discrepancy in age was 24 > years not 15. How did she do it!!! What was going on? Did James Connell > know? > > If anyone on the list has connections to any of the above, I would love to > get in touch. > > To confuse things even further, there is the birth of a James Connell in > Jan.1827 at Neilston, Renfrew, son of James Connell and Mary Young. In > 1826, James may well have been in Scotland as he had contracted varicose > veins "on the long march in Ireland" with his regiment, the 42nd, and was > en > route with first wife Mary SHINE of Adare Co. Limerick and daughter Mary > Ann > to Gibraltar where the rest of his regiment had already arrived. This may, > of course, be sheer coincidence, but after unravelling the foregoing I > don't > know! > > Helen > Australia. > > > > >

Google says Karenhappuch is a biblical name--Job's third daughter. I have a Karen Happuch in my family tree as well. -- Alice In a message dated 3/25/2005 7:29:03 AM Eastern Standard Time, glcrooks@bcpl.net writes: I was sure that i had seen every strangulation of English and old given names until is saw:Karenhappuch. I have soime dillies in my lines but none beats this!! Gordon

Hi, I have hit a brick wall with James Lyle and Margaret Laing from Currie. They had a child Margaret on 24/12/1841 in Currie. By 1864 they were living in Glasgow and James Lyle was deceased. I can find no trace of death certificates for either James Lyle or Margaret Laing. Would sks tell me waht the graveyard would be for Currie in Midlothian. Many thanks, Tricia Stewart Glasgow

it does indeed - when we were up there a few weeks ago I noticed some streets had two names Liz >From: WSLIBB@aol.com >Reply-To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >To: MIDLOTHIAN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [MLN] The Close's of Edinburgh >Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 15:07:47 EST > >Some years ago I wrote a story for my family detailing the history of >Libberton's Wynd within the High Street of Edinburgh. > >Perhaps this extract will help to explain the meaning and the description >of >the term 'Close' > >"At this point I feel that I should clarify if that is necessary the >difference between a Wynd and the other Scottish housing term “The >Close”. The main >difference is that a Wynd led from one street to another and was open at >bot >h ends in this case from the High Street to the Cowgate the Cowgate being >a >very fashionable area of Edinburgh at this time. A Close the name coming >from >the ‘French’ “Clos” meaning a narrow enclosed space was usually a >private >entrance to houses only open at one end with a gate which could and >usually >was locked at night. > >In 1776 ‘E. Topham’, in his book “Letters from Edinburgh”, >observed that >along with other matters; > >“From the High Street you pass down by means of different alleyways, or >as >they call them here Wynds and Closes, to the different parts of the Old >Town. >There are many of them, and so very steep, that it requires great >attention >to the feet to prevent falling. But so well accustomed are the Scots to >that >position of the body required in descending these declevities that I have >seen >a Scots girl run down them with great swiftness in pattens.” > >In 1790, the Town Council of the day ordered all Wynds and Closes to be >properly named. By means of proper signs and directions, this made >Libberton’s >Wynd number 260 High Street, and number 74 Cowgate. In 1849 the >superintendent >of streets renewed all the nameplates on the Wynds and Closes in the High >Street and the Cowgate." > >Hope this Helps > >Bill Libberton > > >