Hi Elaine If you know the approximate death (sounds like you do) and believe he may have left a will, it would be worth the five pound charge to find out Five pounds will not get you very far on any train <g> You can't even park for that in many places theses days :-( Details here (and downloadable form) http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/infoabout/civil/probate/index.htm (the above covers all post 1858 wills) Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Jon > thanks for trying and it seems I have to go elsewhere to view the latter > Wills 1941- 1945 These are on microfilm held at our State Library, means a > train trip to CBD in Melbourne !! > Elaine

Sorry Elaine Wills and probate on Ancestry only go up to 1941. Jon

Elaine, There's a death index of a Percy C. Bird, aged 54 in 1944 at Southend-on-Sea, Essex, vol. 4a p. 753. No more details given, it's just an index. Jon

Jon Many thanks and if you could, please send scanned image of the bapts, as I don't have this section for Ancestry ,mainly just for the Aussie and Census stuff. So many Percy BIRD not funny and I think he died 1944 and again I don't have this Ancestry for the Wills/ Probate images. If you do, could you please help me again to see if he left a will.?? Thank you !!! Elaine in OZ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon's FH" <jons.fh@btinternet.com> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2010 11:12 PM Subject: Re: [MDX] Need help with BIRD family > Hi Elaine, > > Here's one piece of good news for you at least! > > Percy Clive BIRD > bapt 21 June 1894 at St Mary, Lewisham > Parents: John Thomas & Sarah Elizabeth > > Kindest regards, > > Jon > ************************************** > Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** > superfluous old messages in replies. > > List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Judy and Peter, Many thanks for your reply re Timothy Nattrass I hope it is him and why was he so far from home Will was read in August 1821 so hopefully the right person. Cheltenham was/is a spa town isn't it or is this the closest non conformast cemetery of that time I wonder I must also google that Cheers Olwyn

Hi to all from Australia, Iam in need of help regarding a family of BIRD that lived in and around EDMONTON I have Percy Bird aged 20 years in the 1911 Census living or visiting his auunt & uncle William & Ann Jones They were born Pill, Somerset, whilst Percy was born in the surroundings of Edmonton / Tottenham His parents John Thomas BIRD and Sarah Elizabeth nee Jones Cannot locate this John Thomas Bird in the 1911 he was born c.1853 Marylebone and from the 1901 he had fathered Gertrude Edith 1888 and this Percy My questions are, where the heck is John Thomas Bird and his spouse sarah Elizabeth (1860 Bristol) in the later census, and did Ancestry scan the baptism register for Tottenham & Edmonton, and if so, could some help me out by checking to see if this Percy was baptised to John Thomas Bird and Sarah Elizabeth???? about 1891 and its not the Percy Edward Bird Ithink it could be Percy Clive BIRD?? 1890 He has me going around in circles as I don't know anything on this part of the family, or rather any BIRD lines I am entirely confused by this family, and I have no one to ask for help as all are in England 90% dead and I am the only one left in OZ to do the hunting Hope some one can offer some help or look ups One more question and its to do with areas in London, My dad had one last cousin living BARNES London and she was Ivy Melita Jones one son that I know of David Neville Jones he was born 1920 and have no clues if he married, died or other. This little bit of info was gleaned from a will Ivy left and her death certificate 1974 BARNES One last question, Does any one hold Directories or even Electoral Rolls for this BARNES area. Ancestrt have the phone books on line have checked them a few times for Ivy Melita Jones and her son, to no avail i think I really need some help here Thanks for reading this message Elaine in melbourne OZ

I'm trying to track down my RIDING family (married into my MENEREAUs). Daisy Ellen RIDING married Cecil Douglas MENEREAU. Her parents were Charles Cornelius RIDING (b 1869 St Giles RD) and Jane GOYMOUR (m Q2 1889 Marylebone RD) Charles Cornelius's parents were Charles Cornelius RIDING and Sophia BIBB (m Q1 1865 St Martin RD) However, on the 1871 census (RG number: RG10 Piece: 352 Folio: 31 Page: 56) it gives Chas C, head, age 26; Sophia, wife, age 23; Mary A, dau, age 4 and Chas C, son, age 0. The image gives Chas C (jnr) as 7mths. FreeBMD has his registration as 1869 which agrees with later censuses. There is a registration though for a William Q4 1870. That would agree with the 7mth old RIDING son. The only death I've been able to find is that of a William in St Geo in the East in Q4 1870. Unfortunately, because these births are in Westminster, Ancestry can't help with the earlier one but does have the later ones, confirming my quantum leap about their entries in FreeBMD. So, is the Q4 1870 death that of the William b Q4 1870 or did the enumerator start putting Chas C's entry into his summary book, look back and finish by putting in William's information? Or is this family rolling around on their clouds laughing their heads off? It certainly looks as though it's about to rain (tears of laughter) here! Any assistance in trying to sort this out would be much appreciated, esp as I have one teenager reading jokes to me and the other wanting my attention in helping him make a hot chocolate, atm!! :/ -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/

Following Paula's Email, a possible death for Sarah Elizabeth: Death Jan-Mar 1893 Sarah Elizabeth BIRD, aged 32 West Ham, vol. 4a page 112. Kindest regards, Jon

Could be about to get even more confusing :) St Ann's Church, Tottenham Gertrude Edith BIRD born 9 Dec 1888 baptised on 14 Apr 1889, parents John Thomas & Sarah Elizabeth BIRD, 11 Clifton Terrace, St Ann's Road, Father's occupation Telegraphist St Mary's Church, Lewisham Percy Clive BIRD baptised on 21 June 1894 age 4 years, parents John Thomas & Sarah Elizabeth (Dec?)* BIRD, residence 6 Linden** Road, Brockley, Father's occupation Telegraph clerk immediately followed by Charles Sydney BIRD baptised on 21 June 1894, born May 16, parents John Thomas & Sarah Jane BIRD, residence 6 Linden** Road, Brockley, Father's occupation Telegraph clerk * this is exactly as it appears in the baptism entry **really hard to make out street name so don't take this as gospel! John Thomas BIRD appears to have married again and the likely bride is Sarah Jane REDSHAW whom he married in Boston Reg District in 1893 1901 census 41 Monivea Road, Beckenham, Kent RG13 Piece 687/folio 29/page 49 John Thos BIRD* Head Married, M,48, Telegraph Clerkb St Marylebone, London Sarah J BIRD Wife M F 43 b Frampton Lincolnshire Gertrude BIRD Daughter F 12 b Tottenham Middlesex Percy Clive BIRD Son M 10 b Tottenham, Middlesex Ida May BIRD Daughter F 8 b East Ham, Essex Lilian Phoebe BIRD Daughter 4 b Beckenham, Kent *Transcribed by Ancestry as BESEL 1911 census: Glinton, Peterborough, Northamptonshire RG14/8707/451 John Thomas BIRD Head Married M 58 Post Office Pensioner b St Marylebone Middx Sarah Jane BIRD Wife F 52 b Frampton, Lincs Lilian Phoebe BIRD Daughter F 14 School b Beckenham, Kent married 17 years - 2 children born alive 1 still living 1 dead Hope this helps :) Paula On 09/10/2010 12:18, Elaine Jefferson wrote: > Hi to all from Australia, Iam in need of help regarding a family of BIRD that lived in and around EDMONTON > I have Percy Bird aged 20 years in the 1911 Census living or visiting his auunt& uncle William& Ann Jones > They were born Pill, Somerset, whilst Percy was born in the surroundings of Edmonton / Tottenham > His parents John Thomas BIRD and Sarah Elizabeth nee Jones > Cannot locate this John Thomas Bird in the 1911 he was born c.1853 Marylebone and from the 1901 he had fathered Gertrude Edith 1888 and this Percy > My questions are, > where the heck is John Thomas Bird and his spouse sarah Elizabeth (1860 Bristol) in the later census, and did Ancestry scan the baptism register for Tottenham& Edmonton, and if so, could some help me out by checking to see if this Percy was baptised to John Thomas Bird and Sarah Elizabeth???? about 1891 and its not the Percy Edward Bird Ithink it could be Percy Clive BIRD?? 1890 > He has me going around in circles as I don't know anything on this part of the family, or rather any BIRD lines

Hi again Elaine, Also..... Gertrude Edith BIRD Bapt April 14,1889 at St Ann, Tottenham Parents: John thomas & Sarah Elizabeth Kindest regards, Jon

Hi Elaine, Here's one piece of good news for you at least! Percy Clive BIRD bapt 21 June 1894 at St Mary, Lewisham Parents: John Thomas & Sarah Elizabeth Kindest regards, Jon

Interesting! 1851 census of Canada East St Paul d'Abbotsford, Hyacinthe County, Canada East Jos DRAKE Farmer, born England, religion Episcopalian, age next birthday 51 Lydia DRAKE born England, religion Episcopalian, age next birthday 50 Maria DRAKE born England, religion Episcopalian, age next birthday 22 Walter DRAKE born England, religion Episcopalian, age next birthday 20 1861 census of Canada East: Montreal, Canada East Roll:C-1249, Image:15373 Joseph M DRAKE Profession, trade or calling - Apothecary, born England, religion EC, age next birthday 35, Sex Male, Married or single - S Montreal, Canada East Roll:C-1245, Image:11916 Joseph DRAKE Profession, trade or calling - Vestry clerk of Christchurch Cathedral, born England, religion C of E, age next birthday 61, Sex Male, Married or single - M Lydia DRAKE born England, religion C of E, age next birthday 6o, Sex Female, Married or single - M 1871 census of Canada St Antoine Ward, Montreal West, Quebec Roll:C-10047, Page 68 DRAKE Joseph M*, M, 43, Born England C of England, Origin English, Physician, M(arried) DRAKE Mary Ann, F, 44, Born England, C of England, Origin English, M(arried) DRAKE Mary, F, 20, Born Scotland, C of England, Origin English *Transcribed as Joseph U DRAKE Abbotsford, Rouville, Quebec Roll:C-10069, Page 16 DRAKE Joseph, M, 71, born Angleterre, religion Anglicaine, origin Anglaise, occupation Cultivateur, M(arried) DRAKE Lydia, F, 70, born Angleterre, religion Anglicaine, origin Anglaise, M(arried) DRAKE Marya, F, 41, born Angleterre, religion Anglicaine, origin Anglaise, occupation Cultivateur, M(arried) <snipped> > who was bron 1828 Paddingto and emigrated to Canada in 1845 and became an > eminent physiologist and in 1897 the "Joseph Morley Drake chair of physiology" > was created after his death in 1886 in Abbotsford, Ottawa. His father Joseph > died before 1841 and after 1841 I cannot trace his mother Lydia, sister Esther > Maria or Walter. I believe it possible they all moved to Canada. > > Problem is ancestry has very little details - no immigration records etc - and > I can't even find Joseph Morley on the censuses. > > Does anyone have any details or know where I can find details especially on > Joseph Morley. > > Thanks > > Paul

Listers: I am looking for any connections to a James BILSON, son of Judith BILSON. All I have found to date is a listing under Livery of London that might be a possible connection BILSON, James, Bishopsgate St. within, Farrier's, Wine-merchant and the date 1791. I have also seen a christening for a Judith BILSON but this information goes back to 1618 in Saint Dunstan, Stepney. Judith BILSON was married in Christchurch, Hampshire in 1804 and "of the same parish" is noted on the marriage licence, but there are no Bilson names on any Christchurch films that I have read and I believe Judith was probably from the London area. Are there any BILSON connections out there or perhaps someone could offer suggestions as to where else one might search. I have tried the LDS pilot project to no avail, as well as Ancestry. Any comments would be very much appreciated. Kind regards, Helen Ginn

Many listers have kindly furnished me with the details of Joseph Morley DRAKE who was bron 1828 Paddingto and emigrated to Canada in 1845 and became an eminent physiologist and in 1897 the "Joseph Morley Drake chair of physiology" was created after his death in 1886 in Abbotsford, Ottawa. His father Joseph died before 1841 and after 1841 I cannot trace his mother Lydia, sister Esther Maria or Walter. I believe it possible they all moved to Canada. Problem is ancestry has very little details - no immigration records etc -  and I can't even find Joseph Morley on the censuses. Does anyone have any details or know where I can find details especially on Joseph Morley. Thanks Paul

Hi Judy many thanks for your reply re Timothy Nattrass will follow that up tonight Cheers Olwyn

Hi Listers, I am wondering if anyone is close to the cemetery please and could check if Timothy NATTRASS who died in 1820 was buried there He resided at Nelson Tce, Stoke Newington , He requested in his will that a Chapel be built at Canewdon and that some one from the ministery from the Countess of Huntingdon,s connexion be a preacher in this building I have his will but don't know where he is buried and would very much like to know Thankyou Olwyn

Olwyn, The information on this burial available on the IGI is: Name: Timothy Nattrass Burial Date: 23 Jun 1821 Burial Place: Cheltenham, Gloucestershire Record Set: RG4_3180 Collection: England and Wales, Non-Conformist Record Indexes (RG4-8) Regards Peter Olwyn, Burials at Bunhill Fields for the relevant period are covered by the City of London burials index at Find My Past, and Timothy NATTRASS (and variants) is not coming up in their index search. For nonconformist burials www.BMDregisters.co.uk (a pay/subscription site) can be helpful. The free index shows an entry for a Timothy NATTRASS buried at Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, in 1821 (RG4/3180). How sure are you about your 1820 death date? I see that his will was proved in August 1821. If there is a chance the 1821 Cheltenham burial could be he, you would have to buy a few credits at BMDregisters to look at the record. HTH Judy London, UK I am wondering if anyone is close to the cemetery please and could check if Timothy NATTRASS who died in 1820 was buried there He resided at Nelson Tce, Stoke Newington , He requested in his will that a Chapel be built at Canewdon and that some one from the ministery from the Countess of Huntingdon,s connexion be a preacher in this building I have his will but don't know where he is buried and would very much like to know Thankyou Olwyn

Olwyn, Burials at Bunhill Fields for the relevant period are covered by the City of London burials index at Find My Past, and Timothy NATTRASS (and variants) is not coming up in their index search. For nonconformist burials www.BMDregisters.co.uk (a pay/subscription site) can be helpful. The free index shows an entry for a Timothy NATTRASS buried at Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, in 1821 (RG4/3180). How sure are you about your 1820 death date? I see that his will was proved in August 1821. If there is a chance the 1821 Cheltenham burial could be he, you would have to buy a few credits at BMDregisters to look at the record. HTH Judy London, UK -----Original Message----- From: middlesex_county_uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:middlesex_county_uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Olwyn Sherwin I am wondering if anyone is close to the cemetery please and could check if Timothy NATTRASS who died in 1820 was buried there He resided at Nelson Tce, Stoke Newington , He requested in his will that a Chapel be built at Canewdon and that some one from the ministery from the Countess of Huntingdon,s connexion be a preacher in this building I have his will but don't know where he is buried and would very much like to know Thankyou Olwyn

Anyone looking for Harry MILLETT aged 11, born in Hackney, on the 1911 census, will find him as an Adopted Son of Richard & Alice WOOLLARD & transcribed as :- Harry Millett known as Jack, WOOLLARD. EDMONTON, Middlesex Reference RG14PN7371 RG78PN357 RD132 SD5 ED21 SN87 NOT connected to our research.

I rec'd a message that a Trina/Tina was trying to send me message-however, nothing comes thru, I'm just guessing it is about patrick Carmody. Since I do not belong to genes site I am guessing why it won't come thru, so I will never know. Thanks anyway