>From London Journal ( 1720 ) ( London, England ), Saturday, July 24. 1725; Issue CCCX111. Since our last Commission of Bankrupcy has been awarded against :- George SIBLEY , late of Bow in the County of Middlesex, Brewer.

Just a caution, Bob, it is being despatched on the 24th, ie posted in the UK, not delivered to you in Brisbane! At least that's what mine said, and to allow for delivery time. Jan South Australia -----Original Message----- From: middlesex_county_uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:middlesex_county_uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Robert Campbell Sent: Wednesday, 3 November 2010 10:00 AM To: middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MDX] reference checking for certificates ordered from theGROandWilliam F or P LEE from Islington. Hi Charani, well I have just ordered the first 9 quid + certificate without the GRO reference as Judy suggested. Delivery will be around the 24th (I hope) and when I receive this, or a refund earlier, I will let the list know the results. Thus everyone will know for sure the GRO's current proceedure where the correct certificate reference is not so cut and dried. If I get it wrong and they refund the full fee it will be 100% improvement on yesterdays Melbourne Cup. (my horse is still running!) A bit of a rose for Islington Council their family history library offers excellant service for those researchers from "out of town." cheers Bob in Sunny Brisbane

Hello all, I have a question I have been hesitant to ask but here goes... Are all the English census records from 1841 on from Middlesex and London online on Ancestry? If not, are they more complete anywhere else? Thanks, Bev W

Many thanks for all tyhe replies re. Cornwall Cottages. I've found the area on the map. Thanks Steve Mills

On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 5:30 AM, Jan <jangmc@bigpond.com> wrote: > Just a caution, Bob, it is being despatched on the 24th, ie posted in the > UK, not delivered to you in Brisbane! At least that's what mine said, and to > allow for delivery time. I ordered three certs that had a despatch date of 4 Nov. They arrived in this morning's post :)) I've found I usually get the certs on or before the despatch date. A date three weeks hence certainly suggests Bob could be right. Please don't send lots of proof one way or t'other. Our esteemed admin will probably do her nut and we'll all be on lock down! <G>

Dear Ann. Is there any way we can get a print out of the talk that is to be held on the 18th i have been looking for John Seabrook who was a perfumer and lucifer match maker of Worship Street and Chiswell Streets during this period. As i live in Australia i cannot attend. Bert in Oz ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ann Sargeant" <ann.sargeant@ntlworld.com> To: "Middlesex List" <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2010 7:32 PM Subject: [MDX] LMA Talks and Walk in November 18 November: **Lost in London? Solving your London Family History Problems ** Tracing your ancestors back to the period before civil registration and the Victorian census returns can present a genuine challenge to most family historians. But if your family came from Middlesex/London, the problems that you’re likely to face can be even harder to overcome. The population of London doubled between 1801 and 1841 making it the most populated city in world. The administration of the area was enormously complicated. The records of the various authorities responsible for running London are now spread around a number of different record offices.This talk will explain how to access and make the most of the capital’s diverse collection of records and will give some useful tips on tracking down those elusive Middlesex/London ancestors. This talk at London Metropolitan Archives on Thursday 18 November from 2 to 3 pm is FREE but you must book in advance on 020 7332 3851. 23 November: **London During World War I - Guided Walk** Hear about the fascination and terror of the Zeppelin and Gotha bombing campaigns. Discover more about the internment of the German community, Belgian refugees, rationing, the women’s war and how some wounded soldiers entertained themselves. Meet at Holborn. Walk ends at Embankment. This guided walk on Tuesday 23 November from 11 am to 1 pm is £5. You must book in advance on 020 7332 3851. (Please note: the walk originally advertised for Monday 22 November has now sold out.) 29 November: **To The Rescue - Discover the history of the Royal Humane Society, Lloyd’s Patriotic Fund, Lloyd’s Medals and the Society for the Protection of Life >From Fire.** For over two hundred years these organizations have bestowed bravery awards to men and women including a Tsar, Grace Darling and Bram Stoker. The records of these organizations held by LMA tell the stories of the bravery of ordinary people in times of war and peace. There will be the opportunity to view documents from the collections. This talk at London Metropolitan Archives on Monday 29 November from 2 to 3 pm is FREE but you must book in advance on 020 7332 3851 Ann Middx Admin ************************************** Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** superfluous old messages in replies. List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks everyone, especially Judy for her clear instructions. I have now ordered a certificate for an ancestor for whom in the index there were 2 clear possibilities a year apart. I will let you know early December how it worked! Jan South Australia

The National Archives will be holding its annual Catalogue Day event on Friday 19 November. This free event is very popular and will provide an update on a variety of current projects. Kew is just over the river, and the day may be of particular interest to Middlesex researchers who are within reach. (I think there is still free parking.) Details: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/events/catalogue-day-19-11-10.htm Ann Middx Admin

One needs to be certain. I'm not sure whether they will confirm - maybe someone else here has recent experience. However the main telephone number of LMA is 020 7332 3820 in case you want to double check. Ann From: "Bob MACQUEEN" <bobmacqueen@ntlworld.com> I am particularly interested in the talk on 18th November and rang only to get an answerphone asking me to leave a message. I left one with a contact number and saying I wanted to attend but so far no reply. Will they - or do I need to phone again and is there a time that is best? Regards Bob On 02/11/2010 08:32, "Ann Sargeant" <ann.sargeant@ntlworld.com> wrote: > 18 November: **Lost in London? Solving your London Family History Problems > **

How very interesting! Thanks, Caroline. I'll have a look. Jan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Caroline Bradford" <caroline.bradford@btinternet.com> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2010 9:13 AM Subject: Re: [MDX] New Jerusalemite Church, Friar St , Blackfriars > No, Jan. This was a church of the Swedenborgian sect - Google for more details. > > Best wishes > > Caroline > > Sent from my iPad > > On 2 Nov 2010, at 21:53, "Neil & Jan Hearn" <neil.hearn3@bigpond.com> wrote: > > An ancestor was baptised in the New Jerusalemite Church, Friar St, Blackfriars in 1811. Would this have been an Anglican Church ? The father was Mark McLacklin and the mother Pamela. > > Thanks, > Jan > ----- >> > > > > ************************************** > Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** superfluous old messages in replies. > > List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Charani, well I have just ordered the first 9 quid + certificate without the GRO reference as Judy suggested. Delivery will be around the 24th (I hope) and when I receive this, or a refund earlier, I will let the list know the results. Thus everyone will know for sure the GRO's current proceedure where the correct certificate reference is not so cut and dried. If I get it wrong and they refund the full fee it will be 100% improvement on yesterdays Melbourne Cup. (my horse is still running!) A bit of a rose for Islington Council their family history library offers excellant service for those researchers from "out of town." cheers Bob in Sunny Brisbane ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charani" <charani.b@gmail.com> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2010 8:30 AM Subject: Re: [MDX] reference checking for certificates ordered from the GROandWilliam F or P LEE from Islington. > Nivard Ovington wrote: >> Now I didn't say order the cert and hope for the best > > I didn't say you did :)) > >> They haven't withdrawn the reference check they have altered and improved >> it > > I understood they had. That was certainly what was being said at the time > and it's also what I was told by the GRO themselves not so long ago. > > Never mind, forget I said anything then. > > -- > Charani (UK) > OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM > Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM > http://wsom-opc.org.uk > http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/ > >

I am particularly interested in the talk on 18th November and rang only to get an answerphone asking me to leave a message. I left one with a contact number and saying I wanted to attend but so far no reply. Will they - or do I need to phone again and is there a time that is best? Regards Bob On 02/11/2010 08:32, "Ann Sargeant" <ann.sargeant@ntlworld.com> wrote: > > 18 November: **Lost in London? Solving your London Family History Problems > ** > Tracing your ancestors back to the period before > civil registration and the Victorian census returns can present a genuine > challenge to most family historians. But if your family came from > Middlesex/London, > the problems that you¹re likely to face can be even harder to overcome. The > population of London doubled between 1801 and 1841 making it the most > populated city in world. The administration of the area was enormously > complicated. The records of the various authorities responsible for running > London are now > spread around a number of different record offices.This talk will explain > how to access and make the most of the capital¹s diverse collection of > records and will give some useful tips on tracking down those elusive > Middlesex/London > ancestors. > This talk at London Metropolitan Archives on Thursday 18 November from 2 to > 3 pm is FREE but you must book in advance on 020 7332 3851. > > 23 November: **London During World War I - Guided Walk** > Hear about the fascination and terror of the Zeppelin and Gotha bombing > campaigns. > Discover more about the internment of the German community, Belgian > refugees, rationing, the women¹s war and how some wounded soldiers > entertained themselves. Meet at Holborn. Walk ends at Embankment. > This guided walk on Tuesday 23 November from 11 am to 1 pm is £5. You must > book in advance on 020 7332 3851. (Please note: the walk originally > advertised for Monday 22 November has now sold out.) > > 29 November: **To The Rescue - Discover the history of the Royal Humane > Society, Lloyd¹s > Patriotic Fund, Lloyd¹s Medals and the Society for the Protection of Life >> From Fire.** > For over two hundred years these organizations have bestowed bravery awards > to men and women including a Tsar, Grace Darling and Bram Stoker. The > records of these organizations held by LMA tell the stories of the bravery > of ordinary people in times of war and peace. There will be the opportunity > to view documents from the collections. > > This talk at London Metropolitan Archives on Monday 29 November from 2 to 3 > pm is FREE but you must book in advance on 020 7332 3851 > > > Ann > Middx Admin > > ************************************** > Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** > superfluous old messages in replies. > > List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

An ancestor was baptised in the New Jerusalemite Church, Friar St, Blackfriars in 1811. Would this have been an Anglican Church ? The father was Mark McLacklin and the mother Pamela. Thanks, Jan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Caroline Bradford" <caroline.bradford@btinternet.com> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2010 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [MDX] Parish Church in the parish of St George Hanover Square > Definitely not, Darryl. The Royal Bavarian Chapel (now known as Our Lady of > the Assumption and St Gregory) started life as the chapel of the Portugese > Embassy and was taken over by the Bavarian Embassy when the former moved out > of the building. It was a Roman Catholic Chapel. The Parish Church in the > parish of St George Hanover Square was, unsurprisingly, St George! > > Best wishes > > Caroline > >> >> In 1870 would theRoyal Bavarian Catholic Church be the same church as >> that on a marriage certificate, stateing that, the marriage solemnized >> at Parish Church in the parish of St George Hanover Square >> Darryl > > ************************************** > Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** superfluous old messages in replies. > > List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thanks, for the speedy reply, Charani and Nivard will give the GRO a go with The William Percy LEE birth certificate with reference father's name John LEE from Islington in 1885 and see what happens. If he subsequently died in England or Wales his exact date of birth may if on the index entry point to the correct person, cheers Bob in Brisbane ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nivard Ovington" <ovington1@sky.com> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2010 7:43 AM Subject: Re: [MDX] reference checking for certificates ordered from the GROandWilliam F or P LEE from Islington. > Now I didn't say order the cert and hope for the best > > They haven't withdrawn the reference check they have altered and improved > it > > As I understand the new system you can order *with* a reference (ie the > fathers name) and if found true they will supply the cert, if found false > they tell you but do not charge > > Thats not hope > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > > > >> >> There are three ways to find out other than ordering the cert and >> hoping for the best. >> >> One is to put in the father's name and hope for the best. >> >> Another is to mail the GRO (with GQ in the subject line) and ask their >> advice on the best way to order a cert with a specified father now >> they've withdrawn the reference checking facility. >> >> The alternative is to ask the register office. >> >> However, IIRC, Islington is one of the unco-operative register offices >> who'll tell you to go to the GRO. If they are still as awkward as >> they used to be, then it's a matter of contacting the GRO and asking >> them to ask the "relevant person" to contact the register office and >> tell them to co-operate! :)) >> >> -- >> Charani (UK) > > >

Hi Carol, Now some years ago I managed to have the reference locations of my ancestors located at Edmonton Cemetery and from memory it didn't cost anything as I was able to supply the exact date of deaths from the certificates, which should be your first step. Mind you they were buried in graves where there no markers nor inscriptions. As a reference I looked up the content of a couple email replies I received when at the time I was asking the same question as yours :- " Your search may have to go a little further than Edmonton for a burial or cremation. The following may by of assistance. Edmonton Cemetery, Church Street Edmonton N9 Middlesex Lavender Hill Cemetery, Cedar Road Enfield Enfield Middlesex Hertford Road Cemetery,Enfield Highway Enfield Middlesex Old Southgate Cemetery,Waterfall Road ,Southgate N14 Middlesex All these do cover the Edmonton area There is a lawn grave section at The Enfield Crematorium,known as the Enfield Lawn Cemetery,and it may be worth contacting them at Great Cambridge Road, Enfield EN1 4DS Middlesex to request a search of their records. I have been lucky in my search with them at NO cost .Address all correspondence to Cemetery Registrar" and this one :- "I also have ancestors buried in Edmonton Cemetery (which is just down the road from me). I obtained their death certificates and then telephoned the cemeteries department of Enfield Council whereby I gave them the date of death and they looked up the records. This did not cost anything (mind you it helps to have an unusual surname)" From BC it may be more convenient to send an e-mail direct to Enfield Council, I found the head of the local History Library there most knowledgable and helpful :- Here are the Contact details:- Graham Dalling Local History Officer London Borough of Enfield Local.History@enfield.gov.uk hope this helps cheers Bob in Sunny Brisbane ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol" <minisntrees@highspeedplus.com> To: <Middlesex_County_UK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2010 4:25 AM Subject: [MDX] MDX Cemeteries > Hi all, > Could someone tell me if the "Old Edmonton" cemetery still exists? > Our family bible has a special events page & in it is recorded that so & > so > are > Buried in a cemetery of the above name. I think there are 5 members > buried > There, but I'm not certain. > > Thanks, > Carol in B.C. > > >

Hi been some time since I last ordered a certificate from the GRO, do the they still have the facility for reference checking? In this case I want to check out the father's name for a William Frederick or possibly William Percy LEE born in Holborn in 1884 or in Islington in 1885 respectively. This LEE family in the the 1891, 1901 and 1911 census has been fairly consistant with William's age at census time being 6, 16, and 26 and his birthplace being Islington or just London. 1881 to 1901 census finds the LEE family located at Islington so they didn't move away from the registration district of Islington. William had a sister Minnie Florence who was born, baptised and registered in Islington in the April to June quarter of 1882. Her age is consistently shown as 9 in 1891 and 19 in 1901, birthplace Islington so the family were pretty accurate. In 1901 the census shows "F" for second forename initial for both Minnie and William. On the balance may be an error by the census enumerator in William's case, and perhaps the "F" should have been a "P"?. William was not it seems baptised at the same church his sister was. William LEE is one of my remaining brick walls for this particular family. With a second forename of Percy and an exact date of birth may be a step forward and a whole lot simpler towards working around this wall. Any advice welcome before I potentially blow another 9 quid would be welcome. Cheers Bob in Brisbane.

The final word. JK On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 10:48 PM, Charani <charani.b@gmail.com> wrote: > J K gen wrote: > > I would wish folks could stop knocking my local council. The services > > provided by them to the residents who pay taxes are much more valuable > than > > any historical BMD cross checking services required by anyone, even > > residents doing family history. > > Sorry you regard it as "knocking [your] local council" but it is a > fact that they don't provide the service they are supposed to by law. > > I'm saying nowt more on the subject. > >

J K gen wrote: > I would wish folks could stop knocking my local council. The services > provided by them to the residents who pay taxes are much more valuable than > any historical BMD cross checking services required by anyone, even > residents doing family history. Sorry you regard it as "knocking [your] local council" but it is a fact that they don't provide the service they are supposed to by law. I'm saying nowt more on the subject. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/

Hi Bob, My advice would be the same as Nivard's. But you will have to order *without* giving a GRO reference, because that is the only way you can access the option to specify the father's name on the order form. Order a certificate for William LEE in the normal way, but when asked if the GRO reference is known, be sure to select the option NO. You are then asked to enter the year of birth, and the place of birth, and you can specify the father's forename as John. The GRO will search for one year either side of the date you've given until they find a William LEE birth that matches your requirements. There is only one registered in Islington in this time period (William Percy LEE), so if his father isn't John they won't produce a certificate. If yours happens to have been registered not in Islington but just over the boundary in a neighbouring district, or William was perhaps his second name and not his first (etc. etc.). the GRO won't find a matching record, and you can try again. The worst that can happen is that they refund your money! HTH Judy London, UK -----Original Message----- From: middlesex_county_uk-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:middlesex_county_uk-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Robert Campbell Hi been some time since I last ordered a certificate from the GRO, do the they still have the facility for reference checking? In this case I want to check out the father's name for a William Frederick or possibly William Percy LEE born in Holborn in 1884 or in Islington in 1885 respectively. This LEE family in the the 1891, 1901 and 1911 census has been fairly consistant with William's age at census time being 6, 16, and 26 and his birthplace being Islington or just London. 1881 to 1901 census finds the LEE family located at Islington so they didn't move away from the registration district of Islington. William had a sister Minnie Florence who was born, baptised and registered in Islington in the April to June quarter of 1882. Her age is consistently shown as 9 in 1891 and 19 in 1901, birthplace Islington so the family were pretty accurate. In 1901 the census shows "F" for second forename initial for both Minnie and William. On the balance may be an error by the census enumerator in William's case, and perhaps the "F" should have been a "P"?. William was not it seems baptised at the same church his sister was. William LEE is one of my remaining brick walls for this particular family. With a second forename of Percy and an exact date of birth may be a step forward and a whole lot simpler towards working around this wall. Any advice welcome before I potentially blow another 9 quid would be welcome. Cheers Bob in Brisbane.

I would wish folks could stop knocking my local council. The services provided by them to the residents who pay taxes are much more valuable than any historical BMD cross checking services required by anyone, even residents doing family history. JK On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 9:38 PM, Charani <charani.b@gmail.com> wrote: > > .... Islington is one of the unco-operative register offices > who'll tell you to go to the GRO. If they are still as awkward as > they used to be ..... > >