>From World ( 1787 ) ( London, England ), Friday, August 14, 1789; Issue 815. MARRIED. Wednesday morning, at St. Mary's, Islington, Mr. CODDINGTON , of Stamford, in Lincolnshire, to Miss DARKE ,of Fenchurch-street.

>From St. James's Chronicle or the British Evening Post ( London, England ), July 7, 1764 - July 10, 1764; Issue 522. On Friday last, as Mr. GREEN, Master of one of the Isleworth Stages, was driving under the Gate-way of an Inn at that Place, not stooping in Time, he was so terribly crushed, that it is thought he cannot recover.

Good morning, My thanks to Ann for her help with finding a possible marriage date. I have a daughter of the couple and a probable DoB from Free BMD and I have sent for the certificate. Roy Davies

From: "Peter" <peterj.martin@lineone.net> > I am looking for the marriage of James Cartwright of Croyden > to Caroline ? of Twickenham about 1835. In the 1851 census James' age > is given as 40 >and Caroline's as 38,so born c1811 and 1813 respectively. > Birth and/or baptism dates >would help also. Are the parish Records for > those areas online or CD? I would >appreciate any help. Hello Peter The Surrey Marriage Index on CD includes a number of Middlesex marriages. It looks as if you might be in luck as there is an entry included for the marriage of a James Cartwright and a Caroline Rowles at Laleham, Middlesex in 1833 . This will obviously need more work to prove or disprove as being the right people - unless the name Rowles is already featured in the family. One way to try to prove it would be to obtain the birth certificate of a child of your couple whose birth was registered after July 1837 as the cert should give the mother's maiden name. Ann

Roy, What are given as the places of birth in the 1851 census? Peter Hello, I am looking for the marriage of James Cartwright of Croyden to Caroline ? of Twickenham about 1835. In the 1851 census James' age is given as 40 and Caroline's as 38,so born c1811 and 1813 respectively. Birth and/or baptism dates would help also. Are the parish Records for those areas online or CD? I would appreciate any help Thank you Roy Davies

Hello, I am looking for the marriage of James Cartwright of Croyden to Caroline ? of Twickenham about 1835. In the 1851 census James' age is given as 40 and Caroline's as 38,so born c1811 and 1813 respectively. Birth and/or baptism dates would help also. Are the parish Records for those areas online or CD? I would appreciate any help Thank you Roy Davies

Thank you Jan & Robyn. This maybe something we will never know. This query has brought in some very good points to follow up, thanks once again. Anne On 11/26/2010 9:58 AM, Neil & Jan Hearn wrote: > Perhaps he came to Australia on the way to other more foreign parts but decided to stay here. Who would blame him? > > Jan > in beautiful Queensland > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robyn Fulton"<jrfulton@bigpond.net.au> > To:<middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 9:53 AM > Subject: Re: [MDX] PASSPORT APPLICATIONS 1855 > > >> Anne, >> >> Could I suggest to you that maybe he was going to the US goldfields and >> either changed his mind or went there first. Perhaps check the shipping. >> Robyn >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Anne Chapman"<anne@chapman.id.au> >> To:<middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 7:51 AM >> Subject: Re: [MDX] PASSPORT APPLICATIONS 1855 >> >> >

Perhaps he came to Australia on the way to other more foreign parts but decided to stay here. Who would blame him? Jan in beautiful Queensland ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robyn Fulton" <jrfulton@bigpond.net.au> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [MDX] PASSPORT APPLICATIONS 1855 > Anne, > > Could I suggest to you that maybe he was going to the US goldfields and > either changed his mind or went there first. Perhaps check the shipping. > Robyn > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Anne Chapman" <anne@chapman.id.au> > To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 7:51 AM > Subject: Re: [MDX] PASSPORT APPLICATIONS 1855 > > >> Thank you Charani, >> We have found a reference to a William Horne being on the Goldfields in >> Victoria, after this passport was issued. One of the replies suggested >> he may have needed one if going to a dangerous place. I wonder did he >> fully intend to try his luck there, before leaving UK. His father, >> Swithin Horne was a very well to do Master Butcher who owned quite a few >> butcher shops in the Regent Park area. >> Thank you once again, one and all for your help in this matter. Anne >> >> >> On 11/25/2010 9:56 PM, Charani wrote: >>> Anne Chapman wrote: >>>> Thank you Caroline and Graham, that was very interesting to know that he >>>> may not have needed a passport. >>> Passports didn't become compulsory until 1917 (IIRC). >>> >>> Canada, Australia, New Zealand were regarded as being part of the UK >>> so no passport was necessary, just as one isn't needed to go to >>> Scotland, Wales or N Ireland (yet!). One isn't needed for the Crown >>> Protectorates of the Isle of Man or the Channel Islands either. I'm >>> not sure about Eire but I don't think one was/is needed there either. >>> >>> If your man was emigrating, then, as has been indicated, he wouldn't >>> have needed one. Even if he was a merchant, I can't see he would have >>> needed one. I don't think Australia was regarded as dangerous per se. >>> >> ************************************** >> Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** >> superfluous old messages in replies. >> >> List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > ************************************** > Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** superfluous old messages in replies. > > List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Anne, Could I suggest to you that maybe he was going to the US goldfields and either changed his mind or went there first. Perhaps check the shipping. Robyn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Anne Chapman" <anne@chapman.id.au> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 7:51 AM Subject: Re: [MDX] PASSPORT APPLICATIONS 1855 > Thank you Charani, > We have found a reference to a William Horne being on the Goldfields in > Victoria, after this passport was issued. One of the replies suggested > he may have needed one if going to a dangerous place. I wonder did he > fully intend to try his luck there, before leaving UK. His father, > Swithin Horne was a very well to do Master Butcher who owned quite a few > butcher shops in the Regent Park area. > Thank you once again, one and all for your help in this matter. Anne > > > On 11/25/2010 9:56 PM, Charani wrote: >> Anne Chapman wrote: >>> Thank you Caroline and Graham, that was very interesting to know that he >>> may not have needed a passport. >> Passports didn't become compulsory until 1917 (IIRC). >> >> Canada, Australia, New Zealand were regarded as being part of the UK >> so no passport was necessary, just as one isn't needed to go to >> Scotland, Wales or N Ireland (yet!). One isn't needed for the Crown >> Protectorates of the Isle of Man or the Channel Islands either. I'm >> not sure about Eire but I don't think one was/is needed there either. >> >> If your man was emigrating, then, as has been indicated, he wouldn't >> have needed one. Even if he was a merchant, I can't see he would have >> needed one. I don't think Australia was regarded as dangerous per se. >> > ************************************** > Send your List messages using **PLAIN TEXT** and always **TRIM AWAY** > superfluous old messages in replies. > > List Admin can be contacted at: Middlesex_County_UK-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > MIDDLESEX_COUNTY_UK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thank you Charani, We have found a reference to a William Horne being on the Goldfields in Victoria, after this passport was issued. One of the replies suggested he may have needed one if going to a dangerous place. I wonder did he fully intend to try his luck there, before leaving UK. His father, Swithin Horne was a very well to do Master Butcher who owned quite a few butcher shops in the Regent Park area. Thank you once again, one and all for your help in this matter. Anne On 11/25/2010 9:56 PM, Charani wrote: > Anne Chapman wrote: >> Thank you Caroline and Graham, that was very interesting to know that he >> may not have needed a passport. > Passports didn't become compulsory until 1917 (IIRC). > > Canada, Australia, New Zealand were regarded as being part of the UK > so no passport was necessary, just as one isn't needed to go to > Scotland, Wales or N Ireland (yet!). One isn't needed for the Crown > Protectorates of the Isle of Man or the Channel Islands either. I'm > not sure about Eire but I don't think one was/is needed there either. > > If your man was emigrating, then, as has been indicated, he wouldn't > have needed one. Even if he was a merchant, I can't see he would have > needed one. I don't think Australia was regarded as dangerous per se. >

Thank you Caroline and Graham, that was very interesting to know that he may not have needed a passport. Anne On 11/25/2010 5:53 PM, Caroline Bradford wrote: > Hi Anne > > It seems, from the National Archives information sheet on the subject > (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/passports.htm) > that the index is all there is. > > At that time, passports would only have been issued to individuals with a > particular need for documentary evidence of the protection of the Crown - > merchants travelling to strange and dangerous parts, for instance. An > emigrant to Australia would not have needed one. > > HTH > > Caroline >

Could be him I suppose, but if you were a British subject in those days you did not need a passport to come to either Australia or New Zealand. Not sure about Canada, would need one if you were going via the USA. Cheers Graham Melbourne Oz

Thank you Nivard, Hope you are able to discover one of yours soon. Anne On 11/25/2010 10:22 AM, Nivard Ovington wrote: > Hi Anne > > I have searched the passport application indexes several times but have yet > to find one that could be mine so have not taken it any further > > > From the National Archives more on passports > http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/passports.htm > > Neither it or the bumph on findmypast seem to give an indication where to > find more > > I hope there is someone else who knows more on the subject > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > >

Anne Chapman wrote: > Thank you Caroline and Graham, that was very interesting to know that he > may not have needed a passport. Passports didn't become compulsory until 1917 (IIRC). Canada, Australia, New Zealand were regarded as being part of the UK so no passport was necessary, just as one isn't needed to go to Scotland, Wales or N Ireland (yet!). One isn't needed for the Crown Protectorates of the Isle of Man or the Channel Islands either. I'm not sure about Eire but I don't think one was/is needed there either. If your man was emigrating, then, as has been indicated, he wouldn't have needed one. Even if he was a merchant, I can't see he would have needed one. I don't think Australia was regarded as dangerous per se. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton, Greinton and Clutton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk http://www.savethegurkhas.co.uk/

Nivard, Yes the certificate gave the home address it should have been + correct occupation for the father, so he's mine allright. I was thinking of applying gradually for the London/Midlesex marriages with a Thomas W LEE groom. There quite a few contenders but names of their children don't ring any bells regarding family forenames unfortunately. cheers Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nivard Ovington" <ovington1@sky.com> To: <middlesex_county_uk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2010 4:54 AM Subject: Re: [MDX] Thomas William LEE was William Percy LEE andreferencechecking at the GRO > Partial good news then Bob > > I take it there were other details on the birth cert which confirmed this > was indeed you man? > > Sadly there was no obligation to supply the names a person was registered > with, in fact neither was it an obligation to supply any of the registered > names, only the name by which they were known by although in most cases > they were one and the same > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > > >> Have done the usual the CWGC for WW1 casualties, WW1 records, and >> passenger lists on Findmypast and checked out that marriages for all >> Thomas William LEE's in Middlesex/London after 1911. Was there an >> obligation at the time of marriage to provide the full names you were >> registered with? >> So any ideas of where to go from here folks? >> >> cheers >> Bob in Brisbane > > >

Hi Listers Can any of you wonderful people, tell me if, or where, more information might be held, if in fact there is, for a Passport granted as follows? HORN William J, Passport No 31109 DATE OF PASSPORT 17 OCTOBER 1855. This is hopefully my Great Grandfather, William John Horn(e) who came to Australia, but without further solid evidence, it must remain suspect for the time being. My Horne family were using both spellings, or at least the Clerks writing the documents were at the time. Hoping someone is able to help in this search. Anne

Hi Anne It seems, from the National Archives information sheet on the subject (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/passports.htm) that the index is all there is. At that time, passports would only have been issued to individuals with a particular need for documentary evidence of the protection of the Crown - merchants travelling to strange and dangerous parts, for instance. An emigrant to Australia would not have needed one. HTH Caroline > > Hi Listers > Can any of you wonderful people, tell me if, or where, more > information might be held, if in fact there is, for a Passport granted > as follows? > > HORN William J, Passport No 31109 DATE OF PASSPORT 17 > OCTOBER 1855. > > This is hopefully my Great Grandfather, William John Horn(e) who > came to Australia, but without further solid evidence, it must remain > suspect for the time being. My Horne family were using both spellings, > or at least the Clerks writing the documents were at the time. > Hoping someone is able to help in this search. > Anne

Today arrived the certificate ordered from the GRO for my William LEE born Islington 1885. This was ordered using the facility where the order was "without " the index reference known button. The GRO was given the date, registration district, names of the parents and only known forename William. They check one year either side of the date nominated ie a 3 year span for the same fee for a normal ordered certificate. The order was placed on the 3rd November, dispatched on the 12th and arrived in Australia 24th so no long delay. The surprise for me was that instead of the expected William F or William P LEE his name turned out to be Thomas William LEE, a combination otherwise in a month of Sundays I would never had thought up and with the previous system would have cost quite a few "wrong" certificates and pounds to discover. Thomas William LEE ottherwise known as plain old William LEE born Islington on April 25th1885, still single and living with his aged parents in 1911 is now my brick wall for the coming year, and with that combination of very common names a fairly daunting problem. Have done the usual the CWGC for WW1 casualties, WW1 records, and passenger lists on Findmypast and checked out that marriages for all Thomas William LEE's in Middlesex/London after 1911. Was there an obligation at the time of marriage to provide the full names you were registered with? So any ideas of where to go from here folks? cheers Bob in Brisbane

Hi Anne I have searched the passport application indexes several times but have yet to find one that could be mine so have not taken it any further >From the National Archives more on passports http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/passports.htm Neither it or the bumph on findmypast seem to give an indication where to find more I hope there is someone else who knows more on the subject Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Hi Listers > Can any of you wonderful people, tell me if, or where, more > information might be held, if in fact there is, for a Passport granted > as follows? > > HORN William J, Passport No 31109 DATE OF PASSPORT 17 > OCTOBER 1855. > > This is hopefully my Great Grandfather, William John Horn(e) who > came to Australia, but without further solid evidence, it must remain > suspect for the time being. My Horne family were using both spellings, > or at least the Clerks writing the documents were at the time. > Hoping someone is able to help in this search. Anne

Partial good news then Bob I take it there were other details on the birth cert which confirmed this was indeed you man? Sadly there was no obligation to supply the names a person was registered with, in fact neither was it an obligation to supply any of the registered names, only the name by which they were known by although in most cases they were one and the same Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Have done the usual the CWGC for WW1 casualties, WW1 records, and > passenger lists on Findmypast and checked out that marriages for all > Thomas William LEE's in Middlesex/London after 1911. Was there an > obligation at the time of marriage to provide the full names you were > registered with? > So any ideas of where to go from here folks? > > cheers > Bob in Brisbane