well and good, and excellent in that you took the time to go and cite all the information for records that are still basically CLOSED.... well and good, except many people are not necessarily asking for birth records to FIND OUT THE NAME..... they might have a date or a first name but not last name... THEY WANT TO READ the books and look for their family name, that date that place having the barest of information regarding their family and for those people the books are closed... now you might say that the index can be used and i will tell you that i have in my many years of doing this had problems with just about every single state index i have used.... all the clerk needed was a slight interruption and the record would be made but the index skipped.... depending on an index unless the index has been certified as 100% is foolishness... regardless, seems you have been a lucky one... know names and dates and places.... and seems too that you ONLY do direct line research and do not do FAMILY research... so if you were to be looking for a grand uncle you would be in the pits.... and have no recourse.... not everyone does ONLY direct line..... so, for all practical purposes... michigans records are closed and that is exactly the way they want it.... further, when i want a record, I want ALL the infomation on the record, not a certified copy extracted by a clerk. I want to see the notes that were entered... and prefereably a copy of the line entry..... now you might say, there are no notes, and i will tell you that there often are notes in the olderst records for i have seen them and since the new forms do not allow for such, you, as the paying customer will not get them....nor will you know OF them.... such a shame... i will say, i was soooooo very glad to have had access and the ability to actually READ the BIRTH RECORD BOOKS, LINE BY LINE BY LINE before the michigan laws were changed and that i do have whatever tidbit that someone recorded so long ago.... now, i was told in very very CERTAIN TERMS, long ago by somone on this list that THIS LIST IS CALHOUN SPECIFIC and this entire commentary as well as the original post regading the POTENTIAL NEW LAW is far from CALHOUN SPECIFIC...... On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 00:44:38 -0500, Renee O. <[email protected]> wrote: > Nope, > > Here is the Michigan State Law right from the Michigan State website. > > Certified Copies > Anyone is eligible to receive a certified copy of a Michigan death, marriage or > divorce record if ...... (my ending here, we are not discussing death, marriage, > divorce.) > > Anyone is also eligible to receive a birth record if that birth occurred at > least 100 years ago (MCL 333.2882(1)(b)). A certified copy is printed on special > safety paper and contains a raised, embossed seal. > > According to MCL 333.2882(1)(a)), only the following parties are eligible for a > certified copy of a birth record that is not at least 100 years old: > > (I have added numbers here to clarify my point. The numbers are not part of the > Michigan State site.) > > Number 5 applies to those related to the individual, which covers those of us > trying to get a birth certificate for our ancestors. We would be considered > heirs. The way I got the birth certificate for my dead brother was to copy this > law directly from the Michigan State Website with a link and the clerk checked > with her supervisor, who called Lansing, who told them I was correct. > > 1. The person named on the record, > 2. A parent named on the record, > 3. A legal guardian of the person named on the record. With your application you > must include a copy of the court-appointed legal guardianship papers. A > custody paper is not acceptable unless it specifically names you as a custodial > parent. > 4. A legal representative of the person named on the record. You must include > with the application a letter having your official letterhead stating who you > represent. > 5. An heir if the person on the record is deceased. A copy of a birth record > can be released to an heir of a deceased person, but you must state your > relationship to the person, provide the decedent's married name at the time of > death, and date and place of death. > 6. A court of competent jurisdiction that supplies a court order (a Michigan > court, a federal court or another jurisdiction whose laws are not in conflict > with Michigan laws). > > Renee > > Order a birth, death, marriage, or divorce record: > - Online using a credit card > - By mail > > Certified Copies > Anyone is eligible to receive a certified copy of a Michigan death, marriage or > divorce record if he or she makes the request in writing and prepay the required > search fee (MCL 333.2882(1c)) and (MCL 333.2882(1d)). Anyone is also eligible > to receive a birth record if that birth occurred at least 100 years ago (MCL > 333.2882(1)(b)). A certified copy is printed on special safety paper and > contains a raised, embossed seal. > > According to MCL 333.2882(1)(a)), only the following parties are eligible for a > certified copy of a birth record that is not at least 100 years old: > > The person named on the record, > > A parent named on the record, > > A legal guardian of the person named on the record. With your application you > must include a copy of the court-appointed legal guardianship papers. A custody > paper is not acceptable unless it specifically names you as a custodial parent. > > A legal representative of the person named on the record. You must include with > the application a letter having your official letterhead stating who you > represent. > > An heir if the person on the record is deceased. A copy of a birth record can > be released to an heir of a deceased person, but you must state your > relationship to the person, provide the decedent's married name at the time of > death, and date and place of death. > > A court of competent jurisdiction that supplies a court order (a Michigan court, > a federal court or another jurisdiction whose laws are not in conflict with > Michigan laws). > > Order a birth, death, marriage, or divorce record: > - Online using a credit card > - By mail > > On 12/8/2004 3:23:57 PM, [email protected] wrote: > > you must have had a lucky day with the clerk........ > > and yes they are closed in many many michigan counties even if over 100 > > years > > > > the issue in michigan is mute... > > it already exists.... > > sad > > but true > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Renee O. > > To: [email protected] > > Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2004 2:15 PM > > Subject: Re: [micalhou] New Legislation to affect Genealogists..... > > > > > > Well, actually, they are not closed if they are over 100 (I believe that > > is the > > cutoff) years old. > > > > You can also get them if you can prove the person is deceased. I did that > > with > > my brother who only lived one day. > > > > Renee (Holmes) > > O'Neal > > > > --- ".... valentine" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > someone > > > seems to think that this is NEWS to MICHIGAN... > > > birth records in michigan have been closed to all except the person > > > and immediate descendents if PROVEN for years.... > > > and years.... > > > in michigan, this is nothing new.... > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 11:12:49 -0700, Marta Norton <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > >From another list I am on: > > > > > > ============================== > Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. > New content added every business day. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx > >

Ok, time to drop this subject. I did not submit that information to start an argument, only to let people know that they can get birth records and what they need to do it. No I do not do only direct line research and yes, I did go to the trouble of quoting the facts from the official page, because facts are useful, especially to dispel rumors. In the case of my brother, I went to put a headstone on his grave and his name is wrong so we need to get it changed. That is a story in itself and I won't go into that here. For many of us, knowing that we can get records from over 100 years ago is great news when someone on this list said you can't. I think it was you, but maybe not. Not seeing the notes may be a bummer, but not seeing the record at all would be worse. Anyhow, I was trying to give positive information, not turn this thread into something negative and argumentative. Many of us are happy just to be able to get the birth record at all. This new law threatens to stop that as well, which I think was the point of the original person's email. It would mean no birth records, period, not even over 100 years old. Please don't send any negative replies to this, to the list. Send them to me directly. No need to clutter up the list with negative arguments. Renee (Holmes) O'Neal