Lists: I have a subscriber whom I shall call, "old professor", he keeps me on my toes and gives postive critcism . Here is the information you need to know...keep copy of this for your records as I will not be repeating this information every time I post. ----------------------- SOURCE: NEW ENGLAND HISTORICAL AND GENEALOGICAL REGISTER III Janauary, April, July, October, 1849 as "List of Freemen"; Lucius Paige, Boston,Mass. ------------------------- =============================================================================== FYI: "Colonial Records"...all the Freemen oaths were filed at the General Court in Boston which probably are at the Massachusetts State Archives. http://www.ancestorspy.com/ma/state.htm#Colonial -------------------------- FYI: Early Maine records.. ....all deeds prior to 1737 are published as YORK DEEDS 1642-1737 and General Court Committee sale of Eastern Lands,can be found at: Maine Historical Society, Portland,Maine [has url] Massachusetts State Archives [has url] Maine State Archives, Augusta,Maine "land Office records in Maine State Arc." ---------------------------- FYI: Court records: Province and Court Records of Maine,1639-1727 [6 volumes], published by the Maine Historical Society,1928 and are on microfilm at the FHL.[family history libraries..] All the original court records for York County are at the Maine State Archives. Before statehood[1820] Maine's Court of Appeals was the Massachusetts Superior Court of Judicature [1692-1780]....these are called "Suffolk Files" and located at the Massachusetts State Archives. The "Circuit court records" are also held at the Mass.State Archives. --------------------------------------------------------------- Maine State Archives State House station 4 Augusta,Me 04333 (good source] --- Maine State Library [has good collections of early Maine] State House station 64 Augusta,me 04333 has vital records,census records,adjutant general records,Maine Land office records,county marriage returns,etc. of early Maine.] ---- Maine HIstorical Society Library 485 Congress St. Portland,Me 04101 (collections printed works) ------------------------------ Maine Genealogical Society P.O. Box Farmington,Maine 04938 ---------------------- University of Maine @ Orono Raymond Folger Library Special Collections Dept Orono,Me 04469 (good collection of state,county,and town histories) ----------------------------------------------------- The sources information is published in: Ancestry's Red Book, American State, County,& Towns Sources; Alice Eichholz,Ph.D.,C.G.,Salt Lake City,Uh,1989. -- Now,professor,where is my "A".....<G> Cynthia Administrator for Ma-Bay-Colony-L@rootsweb.com Bunnydust@attbi.com MBC archiver (postings) http://archiver.rootsweb.com and put Ma-Bay-Colony in the box

Joan: You may be right but I am following the spellings of towns and names as shown in the book....no changes made . Cynthia -- Administrator for Ma-Bay-Colony- L@rootsweb.com Bunnydust@attbi.com MBC archiver (postings) http://archiver.rootsweb.com and put Ma-Bay-Colony in the box > Bunny, I think that the old name for York was Agomenticus. > joan from Old Orchard Beach, Maine > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <bunnydust@attbi.com> > To: <MA-BAY-COLONY-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 8:21 PM > Subject: [Ma-Bay-Colony] Freemen of Mass,1630-1691.............1652 at > Accomenticus or Gorgeana > > > > List of Freemen of Massachusetts 1630-1691,Lucius R.Paige, New England > > Historical Genealogical Register,Boston,1849 > > -------- > > FYI: Accomenticus or Gorgeana:(old names for what is now YORK,MAINE) > > > > Godfrey,Edward Crocket,Thomas Alcocke,Jn > > Dixon,William Codogan, Richard Parker,George > > Evered,Andrew Knight,Robert Rogers,William > > Alcocke,Samuel Alcocke, Joseph Wjer[Wier],Peter > > Addams,Phillip Raines,ffrauncis Ed____,Robert > > Hatch,Philip Davis,Jn Bond,Niccolas > > Johnson,Edward Gajle[Gale/Gail],Hugh Garnesey,Wm > > Banckes,Richard Wentom,Edward Brancen,George > > Topp,Mary Hilton,William Moore,William > > Donell, Henry Stirt,Edward Young,Rowland > > Parker,Jn Bragdon,Arthur Ellingham,William > > Tuisdale,Jn,jr Courteous,Thom. Stover,Silvester > > Dennell,Thomas Rushworth,Edward Harker,jn > > Davis,Niccolas Angier, Sampson Norton,Henry > > Hetherse,Robert ffreathy, William Davis,Jn > > Tuisdall,Jn [sr] Preble, Abraham Couch,Jn > > Whelewright[WHEELWRIGHT],Thomas--------------------------- > > ------ > > transcribed by: > > Cynthia > > Administrator for Ma-Bay-Colony-L@rootsweb.com > > Bunnydust@attbi.com > > MBC archiver (postings) > > http://archiver.rootsweb.com and > > put Ma-Bay-Colony in the box > > >

List of Freemen of Massachusetts 1630-1691,Lucius R.Paige, New England Historical Genealogical Register,Boston,1849 -------- FYI: Accomenticus or Gorgeana:(old names for what is now YORK,MAINE) Godfrey,Edward Crocket,Thomas Alcocke,Jn Dixon,William Codogan, Richard Parker,George Evered,Andrew Knight,Robert Rogers,William Alcocke,Samuel Alcocke, Joseph Wjer[Wier],Peter Addams,Phillip Raines,ffrauncis Ed____,Robert Hatch,Philip Davis,Jn Bond,Niccolas Johnson,Edward Gajle[Gale/Gail],Hugh Garnesey,Wm Banckes,Richard Wentom,Edward Brancen,George Topp,Mary Hilton,William Moore,William Donell, Henry Stirt,Edward Young,Rowland Parker,Jn Bragdon,Arthur Ellingham,William Tuisdale,Jn,jr Courteous,Thom. Stover,Silvester Dennell,Thomas Rushworth,Edward Harker,jn Davis,Niccolas Angier, Sampson Norton,Henry Hetherse,Robert ffreathy, William Davis,Jn Tuisdall,Jn [sr] Preble, Abraham Couch,Jn Whelewright[WHEELWRIGHT],Thomas--------------------------- ------ transcribed by: Cynthia Administrator for Ma-Bay-Colony-L@rootsweb.com Bunnydust@attbi.com MBC archiver (postings) http://archiver.rootsweb.com and put Ma-Bay-Colony in the box

I found sons-in-laws names by putting in my GGGmother's name. The one that I'm thinking of specifically was living with her grand-daughter, and I knew her first name - fairly uncommon - so there was the grand-daughter's husband and all of the kids (which I didn't know before). In another family, I found a son living with the brother of his dead wife (they were only in their early 20's when she died). It definitely pays to put EVERYONE'S name in for a particular family. I've discovered a lot of things that I didn't know before the 1880 census came on line! Would also like to add my voice to that big "thank you" to those volunteers who accomplished that huge task! Leslie in NC -where it is snowy, windy and VERY cold tonight! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Toby & Jim Hurley" <tjhurley1@earthlink.net> To: <MEYORK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 8:16 PM Subject: Re: [MEYORK] 1905 1880 US Census | > Since the LDS index is an every-name index, you might try searching for | > another member of the household (unexpected spelling of first name) or | > searching on first name (unexpected spelling of last name). The 1880 | > index is a transcription of the film - with errors, I am sure. No index | > is perfect. | | This is a perfect answer. It was exciting news to finally have the 1880 census fully | indexed since that is the one--for those of you who are unaware--is soundexed for | households w/ children under the age of 10 ONLY. So, if you were looking for an adult | w/o children or those w/ children grown and gone, you were SOL unless you knew exactly | where to look and did a house-by-house search there. | | I live in the Salt Lake area and have friends who do genealogy consulting. I've been | told by them that it took the volunteers 12 years to complete this massive project, so | we owe a lot to some dedicated people that they took on something of this magnatude. | 12 YEARS! Can you imagine? I get seasick from looking at film after too long. | | Yes, there are problems, many problems. There are some people who are listed as | ????????? In addition, as stated by Diana, there are transcription errors: my | husband's Swensides are indexed as Eads. That doesn't even come close to the various | ways one can spell Swenside. | | And, I've had to do as she suggested: look for someone else known to be in the | household for that census. Sometimes I find and sometimes I don't. | | But, keep working with it, try anything and everything you can think of, and hopefully | you'll be successful in finding the person(s) you seek. Use all of your genealogy | training and skills, be a Sherlock Holmes, to search that database. | | Happy hunting! | | Toby Hurley | Sandy, UT | | | | ============================== | To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: | http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 | |

> Since the LDS index is an every-name index, you might try searching for > another member of the household (unexpected spelling of first name) or > searching on first name (unexpected spelling of last name). The 1880 > index is a transcription of the film - with errors, I am sure. No index > is perfect. This is a perfect answer. It was exciting news to finally have the 1880 census fully indexed since that is the one--for those of you who are unaware--is soundexed for households w/ children under the age of 10 ONLY. So, if you were looking for an adult w/o children or those w/ children grown and gone, you were SOL unless you knew exactly where to look and did a house-by-house search there. I live in the Salt Lake area and have friends who do genealogy consulting. I've been told by them that it took the volunteers 12 years to complete this massive project, so we owe a lot to some dedicated people that they took on something of this magnatude. 12 YEARS! Can you imagine? I get seasick from looking at film after too long. Yes, there are problems, many problems. There are some people who are listed as ????????? In addition, as stated by Diana, there are transcription errors: my husband's Swensides are indexed as Eads. That doesn't even come close to the various ways one can spell Swenside. And, I've had to do as she suggested: look for someone else known to be in the household for that census. Sometimes I find and sometimes I don't. But, keep working with it, try anything and everything you can think of, and hopefully you'll be successful in finding the person(s) you seek. Use all of your genealogy training and skills, be a Sherlock Holmes, to search that database. Happy hunting! Toby Hurley Sandy, UT

I don't dispute that you have found persons in the film census that you did not find online. What you _may_ be experiencing is faulty indexing. Since the LDS index is an every-name index, you might try searching for another member of the household (unexpected spelling of first name) or searching on first name (unexpected spelling of last name). The 1880 index is a transcription of the film - with errors, I am sure. No index is perfect. Diana MEDOMAK@aol.com wrote: > The 1880 census on the LDS site is also incomplete. I have found Head of > Households in the 1880 census who are not on the LDS site.My experience has > been that the LDS site can give you some hints where to look but it is loaded > with errors. The information put in by individual - not the info from town > records- is often just plain wrong. Do not rely on it as a source - get solid > facts. > > Phil > > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 > > >

List of Freemen of Massachusetts, 1630-1691 by Lucius R.Paige,1849 ------------ From this point on,the freemen list will state the towns where the men were from !! Remember, what consisted of Mass Bay Colony then was what is now Maine, NH.,and Mass. ------------- 16 Nov.1652: appeared before the Commissioners at KITTERY [now Maine],and submitted to the Government of Massachusetts; the record of their oath does not appear. [Colonial Records , Vol.VI,page 116] Withers,Tho. Wincoll, Jn. Chadborn,Wm Gunison, Hugh Spencer,Thom. Durston,Tho. Mendam,Rob't Rise,Thomas Emery,James Remeth,Christian ffrost,Niccolas Weimouth,Rob't Chadorne,Humphrey Cunley,Abraham Nason,Richard Bayley,Mary Paule, Daniel Diamont, Jno Leader,George Symons, Jn Greene,Jn. Mattoone,Hugbert Wilson,Gowen Palmer,Wm Shrires,Jerre Hoord,JN Spinney,Tho. Lord,Nath. Mile, Joseph Mavericke,Antipas Shapleigh,Niccolas Emery,Antho. Jenkins,Regnald[sic] White,Jn Jones, Tho. Douning,Dennis Andrewes,Jn. Davies,Daniell Babb, Phillip Everett,Wm. ------------- -------------- ---------------- transcribed by: Cynthia Administrator for Ma-Bay-Colony-L@rootsweb.com Bunnydust@attbi.com MBC archiver (postings) http://archiver.rootsweb.com and put Ma-Bay-Colony in the box

Hello again! Just for the record, I found one other reference to the (de) Lumleys in the Faris book, on p. 171. Bertram HARBOTTLE [7th in descent from Edward I]... "He was married in 1439 to JOAN LUMLEY, daughter of Thomas Lumley, 2nd Lord Lumley (of Magna Carta Surely descent and descendant of Charlemagne), by Margaret daughter of James Haringon, Knt., of Wolfage... They had one son and five daughters. He entered on the estates on the death in 1450 of Elizabeth, Lady Hilton, widow of Bertram Monboucher..." Not being familiar with the previous de Lumley citations, I'm not sure that this is the same Lumley family, but in any case, Faris offers no royal connection for the Hiltons. Kendall Mellem ----- Original Message ----- From: Karen Sullivan <ksullivan@hvc.rr.com> To: <MEYORK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 3:45 PM Subject: RE: [MEYORK] Re: Hiltons and Royalty? > The book mentioned by Kendall Mellem, *Plantagenet Ancestry of > Seventeenth-Century Colonists* (2nd ed.), by the late David Faris, is > published by the New England Historic Genealogical Society and is considered > to be one of the most scholarly works available on royal connections to the > Plantagenet kings of England. The index does not mention any de Lumleys and > the only Hilton mentioned is p. 267, Godfrey Hilton, who m. Eleanor de > Welles. > > Karen Sullivan >

The 1880 census on the LDS site is also incomplete. I have found Head of Households in the 1880 census who are not on the LDS site.My experience has been that the LDS site can give you some hints where to look but it is loaded with errors. The information put in by individual - not the info from town records- is often just plain wrong. Do not rely on it as a source - get solid facts. Phil

In a message dated 1/23/03 2:48:39 PM !!!First Boot!!!, h.d.morine@ns.sympatico.ca writes: > HELP! Did someone pose a link to the 1880 US Census for Wells Maine or > just Maine in the past week? > The link to the 1905 Wells census was posted recently; <A HREF="http://www.knights.hls-inc.net/1905_census_wells.htm">http://www.knights.hls-inc.net/1905_census_wells.htm</A> Eliz

Hi Deb The Mormon site has the 1880 census index. It is very helpful and gives quite a bit of info. However, it does not give everything. If you want the entire info let me know as I have access to the 1880 film itself. Sandy

HELP! Did someone pose a link to the 1880 US Census for Wells Maine or just Maine in the past week? I thought I had book marked the site and had written info down and can't remember where it was from. Diana

The Mormon site has the 1880 census online for US, Canada and England. (free site) www.familysearch.org. Debbie S

I was very remiss in not thanking Lee Simonds for being so kind as to copy all these pages and send them to me so that I could put them on my web site. I do appreciate it and from the number of hits this morning, I assume it is being very useful to others. Thanks Lee!! Other Maine towns on my site now are: Dayton Alfred Hollis Waterboro Lyman Coming soon: Kennebunk Kennebunkport South Berwick Also Salmon Falls, New Hampshire. If anyone has access to any other 1905 Town Registers for Maine towns and would like to photocopy and send them to me I will be happy to add them to the site. They are very rare so I'm having trouble finding them. This site will always be free!!!!!! Happy Hunting Darlene

source: List of Freemen of Massachusetts 1630-1691 by Lucius R.Paige,1849 ----------------- 3 May 1649....John WARD....C.R.,Vol.II page 228 ----------------- 22 May 1650.....C.R..Vol IV...page 1 Shepheard,John Prentice,Henry Busby,Abraham Greene,Jacob Stower,Richard Welch,Thom. Paine, Wm. Mattocke,David Saunders,John Parmiter,Rob't Addams, Peeter Jones, John Edmonds,Joshua Underwood, Wm. Bale, Nathaniel Mirriam, Joseph Addington, Isaack Glover, Habbacuck [sic] foster,Samuell Weld, John Harris, Rob't Brand,George Williams, Samuell Hanford,Thomas Parker, John Knoules, John Ball, John Pearse, Rob't Mason, Henry Ireland, Wm. Browne,Edmond ------------- ------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 7 May 1651 ....C.R...Vol.IV...page 33 Haugh,Sam. Whitney,Richard Ouldam,Richard Hamlett,Wm Taylor,John Butler,Henry ffry,George Pratt,Wm. Blake,Wm Way, Aaron Convers, Josias Brookes, John Mousell,John thomas,Hugh Grise,Charles Saunders, Martin Kingsly,Samuel Owen,Wm Walsby,David Rise, Edward Johnson, Solomon Dell, George ------------------ ------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------- transcribed by Cynthia Administrator for Ma-Bay-Colony-L@rootsweb.com Bunnydust@attbi.com MBC archiver (postings) http://archiver.rootsweb.com and put Ma-Bay-Colony in the box

http://www.knights.hls-inc.net/1905_census_wells.htm HOME PAGE: http://www.knights.hls-inc.net/ Hello everyone, I have just completed the 1905 Census for Wells, York Cty. Maine. (Ogunquit was part of Wells at this time so it is included. If you have not checked out the previous towns, this was a private census for the town directory. The following is an excerpt: "Pope, Chas O prop Fairview Hotel Nancy W (Locke) housework *Mary (married Place) Dover, N H" Family groups are listed by last name, then first. Following this is the person's occupation and other members of the family with their occupation. Wives are listed with their maiden names in parenthesis. Daughter who have married are listed followed by their married names in parentheses with the word "married" in front. If the child no longer lives in the town, the current residence is given following the name. This is a great way to find some of those women who have disappeared. One can even get an idea of where in the town the individual lived by the post office which is given after the first name. For example, if it says Wells Depot, the mail went to the Wells Depot post office as opposed to the main post office or maybe RFD #1. Anyway, check it out and I hope you find it helpful. Darlene

Twelve-Generation Ahnentafel of SUSAN THORNE, wife of Capt. ROGER DUDLEY (father of Gov. THOMAS DUDLEY). (This mail was limited due to file size constraints imposed by Rootsweb. For a full 31-generation output, contact the sender off-line. WARNING: THE LATTER OUTPUT NUMBERS OVER 1000 PAGES!) Note: this output relies upon the information in Royalty.ged created by Carol Rein Shwayder. It has been modified in several ways from the original, including place nomenclature, the spelling of names, especially in connection with double vowels so as to more-nearly match local written language, and also by my supplying a modicum of individuals to hook Susan Thorne to Carol Rein Shwayder's data. Many of the individuals are mentioned in Frederick Lewis Weis' "Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists...", but the information contained therein has not yet been fully added in the interest of getting this info out in context with issuing the notice concerning Royalty.ged and the notice of publication of the book on Dudley's royal ancestry. 'Gene Hubbard FIRST GENERATION 1. SUSANNA THORNE: (1558 - ) married Capt. ROGER DUDLEY SECOND GENERATION 2. THOMAS THORNE: married 3. MARY PUREFOY THIRD GENERATION 6. EDWARD PUREFOY: married 7. ANNE FETTIPLACE FOURTH GENERATION 14. RICHARD FETTIPLACE: married 15. ELIZABETH BESSILES FIFTH GENERATION 30. WILLIAM BESSILES: born in Bessiles-Leigh (now Besselsleigh), Berkshire, ENG; married; died in 1515 31. ALICE HARCOURT: born in Wytham, Berkshire, ENG; died before 1526 SIXTH GENERATION 62. Sir RICHARD HARCOURT Knight: married before 16 Dec 1445; died on 1 Oct 1486 in Wytham, Berkshire, ENG 63. EDITH ST. CLAIRE: born in 1425 in Wethersfield, co. Suffolk, ENG; died before 11 Aug 1472 SEVENTH GENERATION 124. Sir THOMAS DE HARCOURT Knight: born in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG; married; died in 1420 in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG; 125. JANE FRANCEYS: born in Formark, co. Derby, ENG; 126. THOMAS ST. CLAIRE: born about 1400 in Wethersfield, co. Suffolk, ENG; died in 1434 in Chalgrove, Oxon (and Sussex EIGHTH GENERATION 248. Sir THOMAS DE HARCOURT Knight: married about 1374 in England (cousins); died on 4 Dec 1417 in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG 249. MAUD DE GREY: born about 1350 in Rotherfield - dau. of Sir John Grey II; died after 1367 in England - wife of John Botetourt 250. Sir ROBERT FRANCEYS 252. Sir PHILIP SEYNTCLERE/ ST. CLAIRE : married before 1398; died in 1408 253. MARGARET DE LOVAINE: born in 1372; died in 1408 NINTH GENERATION 496. Sir WILLIAM DE HARCOURT Knight: born about 1300 in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG; married by 1344; died on 6 Jun 1349 in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG 497. Lady JANE DE GREY: born about 1300 in Codnor [Park], Derbyshire, ENG 498. Sir JOHN II, Lord DE GREY K.G.Baron de Rotherfield: born before 1300 in Rotherfield Greys, Oxfordshire, ENG; married; died on 1 Sep 1359 in Rotherfield Greys, Oxfordshire, ENG 499. AVICE MARMION Lady Grey: born about 1320 in England - dau. of John Lord Marmion; died after 1350 in England - wife of Sir John II Lord Grey 506. Sir NICHOLAS LOUVAIN : born in 1325; married after 1369; died in 1376 507. MARGARET DE VERE: born about 1342 in Hertfordshire, ENG; died on 15 Jun 1398 in ENGLAND TENTH GENERATION 992. Sir JOHN DE HARCOURT: born about 1275 in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG; married by 1286; died in 1330 in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG 993. ELEANOR or ELLEN LA ZOUCHE: born about 1275 994. Sir RICHARD DE GREY: born in 1281; married; died on 10 Mar 1334/35 in Codnor [Park], Derbyshire, ENG 995. JOAN FITZ PAYN 996. Sir JOHN DE GREY: born about 1275 in Rotherfield, ENG; married; died on 17 Oct 1311 in ENGLAND 997. MARGARET D'ODINGSELLS: born about 1280 in Maxstoke, ?England - dau. of William Odingsells; died after 1300 in Rotherfield, ENG - wife of Sir John de Grey 998. JOHN, Lord MARMION: born about 1292 in ENGLAND; married; died in 1335 999. MAUD DE FURNIVAL: born about 1295 in England - dau. of Thomas Lord Furnival 1014. JOHN DE VERE [7th] Earl of Oxford: born about 1300; married 1015. MARGARET MAUDE DE BADLESMERE: born in 1310; died in 1366 ELEVENTH GENERATION 1984. RICHARD DE HARCOURT: born in Stanton Harcourt, Oxfordshire, ENG; died in 1293; married 1985. MARGARET BEKE: born in Eresby, Lincolnshire, ENG 1986. EUDO (EUDES) LA ZOUCHE: born about 1212 in Devonshire - son of Roger; married before 13 Dec 1270 in ?Wiltshire; died in 1279 in Haryngworth (Harringworth), Northamptonshire, ENG 1987. MILICENT DE CANTELOU: born about 1250 in Calne, Wiltshire, ENG; died about 1299 in England (Cauntelo) 1988. Sir HENRY DE GREY: born in ( of Essex, Aylesford and Ho, Kent); married; died in Sep 1308 in Aylesford, co. Kent, ENG 1989. ELEANOR DE COURTENAY Lady Grey 1990. Sir ROBERT, Lord FITZ PAYN: married 1991. ISABELLA DE CLIFFORD 1992. ROBERT DE GREY: born about 1250 in England - reign of Henry III; married 1993. JOAN DE VALOINES: born about 1255 in ENGLAND 1994. WILLIAM II D'ODINGSELLS: born about 1250 in ?Maxstoke, Oxfordshire, ENG; married in ENGLAND; died in 1295 in Warwickshire, ENG 1995. ELA FITZ WALTER: born about 1252 in Essex 1996. Sir JOHN, Baron MARMION: married; died before 1322 1997. Lady ISABEL (???) MARMION: born in England (unk maiden name) 1998. THOMAS, Lord FURNIVAL : born about 1255; married before 1272 1999. JOAN DE SPENSER: born about 1255 in Ryhall 2028. ALFONSO DE VERE: born about 1262 in Great Hormean, Hertfordshire; married; died in 1329 2029. JOAN FOLIOT : born about 1275 2030. BARTHOLOMEW DE BADLESMERE Lord Badlesmere: born about 1275 in Ireland (aka Bart); married before 1306 in Her 2nd husband; died in 1332 in ?England (hanged) 2031. MARGARET DE CLARE: born in ?Ireland - dau. of Thomas de Clare; died in 1365 in Wigmore - wife of Edmund Mortimer TWELFTH GENERATION 3968. WILLIAM DE HARCOURT: married 3969. HILLARIA DE HASTINGS 3970. Lord JOHN OF BEKE: born in Eresby, Lincolnshire, ENG 3972. ROGER LA ZOUCHE [younger son]: born about 1186 in Devonshire - younger son of Alan; married about 1209 in ?Devonshire; died shortly bef 14 May 1238 in Devonshire 3973. Lady MARGARET (???): born about 1190 in ENGLAND; died ? aft 1232 in Devonshire 3974. WILLIAM DE CANTELOU Baron Abergavenny: born about 1225 in Calne, Wiltshire, ENG; married about 1247; died in 1254 3975. EVE DE BRAOSE/ BRAIOSE: born about 1227 in Abergavanny; died in 1255 3976. a SON GREY: married 3977. LUCY DE MOHUN 3978. Sir HUGH DE COURTENAY Baron of Oakhampton: born about 1250 in ?Okehampton; married; died on 20 Feb 1291/92 in Oakhampton (Sherwood?) 3979. AILENOR (ELEANOR) DE SPENSER: born about 1288; died on 1 Oct 1328 3982. Sir JOHN DE CLIFFORD 3986. THOMAS DE VALOINES 3988. WILLIAM ODINGSELLS: born about 1220 in ?ENGLAND; married; died in 1268 in Warwickshire, ENG 3989. JOAN (???): born about 1225 in ?England (Unk maiden name); died in Warwick, ?England wife of William Odingsells 3990. Sir WALTER FITZ ROBERT: born about 1216 in ?Dunow, co. Essex, ENG; married in ENGLAND; died on 10 Apr 1258 3991. IDA LONGESPEE: born about 1222 in Salisbury; died in Essex - wife of Walter Fitz Robert 3992. Sir WILLIAM DE MARMION: born in England - son of Robert de Marmion; married in 1248; died before 1276 in Northampton? 3993. LORETTE DE DOVER: born about 1230 in England - dau. of Richard Fitz Roy; died in England - wife of Sir William de Marmion 3998. Sir HUGH I DE SPENSER : born about 1230 in Ryhall; married about 1249; died in 1265 in battle at Evesham 3999. ALINE BASSET: born about 1232 4056. ROBERT DE VERE Earl of Oxford: born in 1240; married before 1252; died in 1296 in (Earl of Oxford 4057. ALICE DE SANFORD : born about 1240; died in 1285 4062. THOMAS DE CLARE Lord of Thomand: born in Ireland - Lord of Thomond; married; died in 1287 in Ireland 4063. JULIANA FITZ MAURICE: born about 1267 in Ireland - dau. of Maurice - Lord Offaly; died in Ireland - wife of Thomas de Clare

The book mentioned by Kendall Mellem, *Plantagenet Ancestry of Seventeenth-Century Colonists* (2nd ed.), by the late David Faris, is published by the New England Historic Genealogical Society and is considered to be one of the most scholarly works available on royal connections to the Plantagenet kings of England. The index does not mention any de Lumleys and the only Hilton mentioned is p. 267, Godfrey Hilton, who m. Eleanor de Welles. Karen Sullivan Visit Alden Kindred of America at http://www.alden.org/ --------------------------------- Once, on this earth, once, on this familiar spot of ground, walked other men and women, as actual as we are today, thinking their own thoughts, swayed by their own passions, but now all gone, one generation vanishing after another, gone as utterly as we ourselves shall shortly be gone like ghosts at cockcrow.-- G.M.Trevelyan -----Original Message----- From: Eugene Hubbard [mailto:hubfam@earthlink.net] Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 8:20 PM To: MEYORK-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [MEYORK] Re: Hiltons and Royalty? keks wrote: > I have Hiltons in York Co.--was unaware of any Hilton connection to > royalty. > Who was the immigrant ancestor with the royal connection? I don't see > one > listed in David Faris' _Plantagenet Ancestry of Seventeenth-Century > Colonists_, 2nd edition. Is this a new discovery? > > Kendall Mellem > Thomas de Lumley married Elizabeth Plantagenet. If that isn't in the book, I'd hazzard a guess the book isn't worth the salt you paid for it. Their daughter Sybil married William Hilton, who was the father of Mark Roger Hilton, who was the father of the Hiltons of New Hampshire. Henry II of England + Alys of Porhoet were Hilton ancestors. That should nail down the Royalty issue. There are literally hundreds of "Royalty" ancestors of the Hiltons in the Royalty.GED I mentioned and sent out. In fact, in that ged, I discovered a common ancestor of 1) the Dudleys, 2) the Hiltons, 3) the Hubbards of Maine, 4) the Hutchinsons, 5) the Wheelwrights of Mass and Maine, 6) Pres. Abe Lincoln's line, and 7) Pres. Geo. Washington's line. I also know the ancestors of Presidents Bush and Franklin Roosevelt are in there. 'Gene Hubbard ============================== To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

Hi Gene or any of the lucky listers who will be receiving a copy--- Being a Hilton descendant, I also would like a copy of the Royal GED eventually. My line goes from Peavey, Ladd, Dearborn, Garland, Sears, Hilton, Lumley, Plantagenet, King Edwared IV. Gene, does this coincide with your listing?

Dear Hall, and List: I have no proof concerning Edward Hilton. If one were to say absolutely that Edward was not connected to William Hilton (or for that matter to Mark Roger), then I would say one should not believe in a proven close royalty connection either. On that basis, I would have to retract my earlier statement concerning Edward. If he is connected to either of the William Hiltons, my statement concerning royalty stands. In any event, it would be safe to say no low-born individual would have been put in charge of a business operation in the New World, nor would they have had either the education or the ability to read and write. I'm unaware of any document saying he was educated, but I bet he was.... 'Gene Hubbard Hal Bradley wrote: >I believe your link to Mark Roger Hilton is outdated. Edward Hilton and his >brother William Hilton were the sons of William Hilton of Northwich, >Cheshire, England (cf. Anderson's "The Great Migration Begins...", sub. >Hilton; NEHGR 95:181). > >Edward was a fishmonger by trade, hardly the occupation of the son of >nobility. > >That Sybil de Lumley married William, Baron Hilton is proven. That Edward >and William Hilton of New Hampshire were descended from this couple is not. > >If you have proof of this link, would you please share it with the list? > >Thank you. > >Hal Bradley >