Hello All, I got an email today from a gentleman researching his family in South Carolina. To make a long story short, he doesn't thing that the widow of Peter Howard (1730-1783) was the same Maryville Griffin who went to South Carolina. It appears there were two Ignatius Griffins, unless I'm reading this wrong. I had this from Linda Reno from the archives. I have in my file that Eleanor (Bowles) Howard died prior to 1776 based on the baptism of 2 children born to Peter Howard and a second wife, Elizabeth. There was at least one more Peter Howard around at that time and perhaps I placed the 2 children with the wrong man. The other Peter Howard was the son of Thomas Howard and Anastasia. He was married to a woman named Maryville ____ by the time of his death in 1783. Maryville ____married second, Ignatius Griffin and they then moved to South Carolina where Ignatius Griffin died ca1810. 4/30/1785: Maryland State Papers, Series A, Box 52, folder 112/1 contains a paper for Peter Howard, signed by Mary Griffin and Ignatius Griffin. She pleas to settle and pay to Jeremiah Tarlton all the monthly pay and collection of land that's due to her for her husband Peter Howard's servitude in the Army and you will mark off your debt. Wit: Martin Henry. (Courtesy, David Darnall Griffin 1/1/2001). David Griffin, 1/2/2000 who states that Ignatius Griffin died prior to 3/10/1810 when Mayville Griffin was appointed as his administrator. In 1811, Maryville Griffin paid from the estate. Their children: Henry, b. 1781; Bowen, b. 1782; Mavel, b. 178?, and Jesse, b. 1788. Ignatius Griffin witnessed a deed in Spartansburg District, SC on 12/18/1789. There was also another Peter Howard who married Sarah, widow of Walter Davis, between 1756-1757 and I don't know what happened to him. Then I was directed to these posts on Rootsweb: Then I was directed to these posts on Rootsweb: From: "holt" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [SCSPARTA] Griffin/Sanders Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2006 14:05:46 -0500 References: <[email protected]> 　 Kathy, I have this in one of my files, they Sanders/Saunders family was very related to my Gibson & Allen Families in Spartanburg. John and some of the other Sanders shows up in several documents with them.See below for mention of Ignatius & Mavel Griffin and also note the George Gibson below is my ggggrandfather and his brother Henry Gibson was married to Nancy Allen, Young Allen below is from that family. Thanks Robin Holt pg. 8 Nov. 6, 1810 > Mavel Griffin gave bond with Young Allen security for her future > adm. in the estate of Ignatius Griffin decd, in place of George > Gibson From: "holt" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [SCSPARTA] More Ignatius Griffin Family Information Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2006 14:22:57 -0500 References: <[email protected]> Here is more of the Griffin family in Spartanburg. I notice a Mavel Hill is listed and Ignatius widow was named Mavel. With that unusual of a name this might perhaps be his remarried widow(or married daughter named after her mom) and son Ignatius named after him, good chance it is. Robin 　 Series Number: S108093 Reel: 0024 Frame: 00712 item: 00 Date: 1851/12/01 Description: GRIFFIN, JESSE, WILL TYPESCRIPT, SPARTANBURG COUNTY (2 FRAMES) (MSS WILL: BOOK D, PAGE 318). Names Indexed: GRIFFIN, JESSE// GRIFFIN, OBADIAH/GRIFFIN, ELIZABETH/HILL, MAVEL/LITTLEJOHN, JOHN/LITTLEJOHN, ROBERTSON///GRIFFIN, IGNATIOUS/GRIFFIN, HENRY/GRIFFIN, NOLIN/HILL, NIPPY/LITTLEJOHN, THOMAS H./LITTLJOHN, SALATHIAL/ Locations: SPARTANBURG COUNTY // Type: WILL (TYPESCRIPT)// 　 DOES THIS MEAN THAT HE WAS KILLED IN 1810? IF SO, IT IS NOT THE JOHN SANDERS THAT I HAVE FOR SON IN LAW OF IGNATIOUS GRIFFIN. HE HAD TWO SONS AFTER 1810 AND HE FOUGHT IN THE WAR OF 1812. From: "holt" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [SCSPARTA] Griffin/Sanders Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2006 14:16:31 -0500 References: <[email protected]> Kathy, Heres another mention below of Ignatius ... Thanks Robin SOUTH CAROLINA ARCHIVES Series Number: S108092 Reel: 0061 Frame: 00027 ignore: 00 Date: 1776 C. OR LATER Description: GRIFFIN, IGNATIUS, ACCOUNT AUDITED (FILE NO. 3111) OF CLAIMS GROWING OUT OF THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION. Names Indexed: GRIFFIN, IGNATIUS// From: "Lee and Billie Jones" <[email protected]> Subject: [SCEDGEFI] Document with Waites, Allen, Saunders, Griffin, Harrison,Lipscomb, Jones, etc Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2006 16:04:29 -0400 Billie Jones ------------------------------------------- THE SOUTH CAROLINA MAGAZINE OF ANCESTRAL RESEARCH Volume XXX Fall 2002 Number 4 The South Carolina Magazine of Ancestral Research (ISSN 0190-826X) Brent H. Holcomb, Editor and Publisher Laurence K. Wells, Founder and Contributing Editor Published quarterly at Columbia, South Carolina © 2002 by Brent II. Holcomb Copy located at Camden Archives ------------------------------------------------------- LEGAL BRIEFS OF JUDGE THOMAS WATIES 1793-1828 Item number 288. Spartanb. Apr. 1810. The State vs John Saunders. Murder of Ignatius Griffin. (pgs 206-208) Young Allen. At a muster ground the prisoner & the son of dec'd had a quarrel. The deceased got very angry, pushed upon prisoner, who seemed to wish not to have anything to do with him. As prisoner went off, deceased followed him. Heard soon after a voice like Saunders's say "don't come or do so again," and then heard a blow struck. It was late in the evening. Went to this place. Saw S. of G. striking him with a stick. It appeared to be half of a fence rail, as thick as his arm. Others came up. Took off Saunders. Then took up Griffin. He fetched only a few breaths & died. Did not speak. X'd. The deceased & prisoner went to the ground that day from his house & appeared friendly. G. run his hors upon S. several times. Told S. he c'd whip him. S. said he did not wish to fight him. G. a quarrelsome man. a strong man. Very able to whip Saunders. He wanted to fight several of his neighbours that day. Saunders's knew very much cute, almost to the bone. Thinks it was done with a stick. The prisoner is reckoned a peaceable man by the neighbours. The deceased had several wounds on his head. Both parties had been drinking that day. Witness is the uncle of S. and G. married his sister. S. is the son in law of G. married G's daughter. Willis Allen. G & S had had frequent quarrels before. Never heard S. threaten to do G. any mischief. There had been a fight that day between S. & young Griffin. The were parted. Old. G. got very angry came up & told S. he had better whip him. S. said "no, I have no harm against you." This repeated by both several times. S. then on his horse, about to start. Very abusive language. G. run up his horse against s. several times. S. endeavoured to get out of his way. X'd. The deceased & prisoner came briefly together that day. The last quarrel they had was twelve months before. G. was as much of a man as any other of his weight. This his general character. Very violent when his anger was raised. G. was able to whip S. at any time. The wound on S's knee a very bad one. Very deep & ugly. The prisoner is the half brother & G. was the uncle of witness. James Harrison. Went to the place upon hearing the blows. Assisted in taking up G. He died in a few minutes. G. was about 50 years old. Henry Griffin. Has heard prisoner once threaten to kill his father if he did so & so. This twelve months before. They were friendly after that. His father was 60 odd years old. X'd. Just before the affair the parties were more friendly than they had been. Tracey. Was at the muster ground that evening. Heard the blow struck. Did not hear any previous words. Before they started G. seemed to want very much to fight S. but S. very unwilling to do so. For prisoner. John Lipscomb. Has been acquainted with prisoner for a length of time. Believes him a peaceable man. Knew the deceased. Thinks he could have whipped Saunders. T. Lipscomb. Saw prisoner after the affair. His neck & one side app'd to have ben in the dirt. Saw his knew. Thinks the wound was caused by a fall. S. a peaceable man. J. Hunter Jones. A. a quiet peaceable man. The deceased a violent man when angry. Buttrum. Was at prisoner's house when G. attacked it. The door shut to keep him out. G. very insulting, run his fist in S's face, pushed his head against the wall. S. got out of his way. Very humble. Went out of his house. G. still pushing on him. At last S. called for an axe & swore if G. persisted, he w'd kill him. G. called for the axe too. At last S. come in, & the door was shut & keep out G. G. tried to burst it open. Got a pole &U tried to jab S. ("this the time referred to bey John G.). Patterson. Was at S's house at the time. His evidence to the same effect. Wilson. Saw S. after the scuffle with young G. Does not believe that he got his knew hurt then. No appearance of it. Duncan. his evid. to the same effect. Brooks. Evid. to the same effect. Guilty of manslaughter & recommended to a pardon. ------------------------------------------------- My comments on the info. above which was scanned from SCMAR. Vol XXX Fall 2002 #4 p. 206-208.doc Comments: the information was on bottom 1/3 of 206, all 207 and top 1/3 of 208. So I deleted the portions of other cases that were on the page and included only the Item #288 "The State vs. John Saunders. Murder of Ignatious Griffin" I read and checked the spelling of some very unusal wording, and this is just as it is in the book. You will see "cute" in the paper, and I think that is "cut"; "hors" and I think that is "horse" I recognize some of the names listed as witnesses and wonder if they are the same as the ones later in Edgefield Dist. I have 2 Young Allen, but very little about them. No Willis Allen 8 James Harrisons but only 2 will work based on date of the case. 2 Unknown Griffins, one md. to Milly Golding [Probate Record, Calhoun Journal- will of William Golding /r/9-23-1782 in the office of Ordinary for 96 District. No. 15.] 1 John Lipscomb b. ca 1790 md Sarah Grigsby Mays 3 Thomas Lipscombs Reply by Kathy Wilcox <[email protected]> wrote: I think this Ignatius Griffin is my ancestor--just don't know which son, Henry or Jesse? This proves that Young Allen's sister, was Ignatius' wife. ( name was Mavel or Maryville). This case also shows that Henry Griffin was Ignatius' son, too, just as I thought! Many researchers think Ignatius was from St. Mary's Co, MD because there was one Ignatius Griffin there that served in the Revolution (pay record in 1782) and he married Mary Howard, widow of a Peter Howard. I have never believed this to be true, but couldn't prove it. But just in the last month, I found "Nase" Griffin on Spartanburg 1790 census and found hiim listed in the SC Patriot book as having served in 1782 in SC. Plus, Ignatius's 3 sons list SC as place of birth--from 1778-1794. The other Ignatious Griffin appears on the 1790 MD census, so they are 2 different people--especially if the SC Griffin married Young Allen's sister! John Sanders/Saunders was reported to have married Ignatius Griffin's daughter, Nancy or Mavel, but no one could offer any proof. Guess I have it now. I found the reference to the article using P.E.R.S.I. (periodical index) on Heritage Quest online. We get free access from our public library that subscribes through the Texas State Library. I also recognized Young Allen's name in Edgefield, but I never researched it. I just knew he was close or witnessed deeds in Spartanburg with these Griffins. Present day Cherokee County (I think close to Gaffney) is where they lived on Goucher Creek. Mavel is in the Goucher Creek Baptist Church records. So it appears that the conclusion is that there were 2 Ignatius Griffins, and that Maryville Howard Griffin is not the same as the Mavel Griffin in South Carolina. Gayle Howard Londeree [email protected]