I'm sharing this with the whole list to help everyone understand the value of land records to trace your ancestors, especially in the pre-1850 time period when the census records do not give family members' names and there are not many other records. Before people recorded births, marriages, and deaths, they accurately recorded land ownership. In a message dated 10/14/2006 12:21:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time, gregdawn@pathwaynet.com writes: > Q: are they related/descendents of THE Benjamin Payne that married > Charlotte Norris?? > Looking through the land records and the census, I now have 3 Benjamin Paynes in the early 19th century in or near Harford Co, MD. The first (whom I presume is the one you meant married Charlotte Norris) died in 1821 according to a deed in 1842 when Benjamin N Payne and his wife Mary sold land to Amanda Zana Payne. It says that Benjamin's estate had been divided into 6 lots on petition of his heirs. After 1821, there are two Benjamins in various land records and census in Harford County. Benjamin Payne, born about 1795 in PA (he married Eleanor and moved to KY about 1847). A 1822 deed indicates that this Benjamin, along with Edward, Lydia, Mary, and John were the heirs of John Payne late of Fawn Township, York Co, PA. Another deed in 1847 indicates that Alice was the widow of the elder John and still living. Benjamin N Payne, born about 1806 (He married Mary Cathcart in 1829) A deed in 1829 from Charlotte Payne Jr to Benjamin N Payne and witnessed by Vincent Norris strongly suggests that this Benjamin N is the son of Benjamin Payne and Charlotte Norris and that the elder Charlotte was still living. (I'll bet the middle initial "N" is "Norris".) He was in Baltimore County in the 1840 census and appears to have purchased his first property there in Feb 1845. Until Dec 14, 1869 he is a party to about a hundred deeds and leases in Baltimore County with his wife. There is then one lease on Jan 11, 1871. After that they both disappear. Since Mary is listed without him in the 1870 census, it appears that he must have died after Dec 14, 1869 and before the census in 1870. Mike Pierce