Jennie, Your story is a good one but sadly doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. Firstly the term "British" means people from Scotland, England and Wales. There is no such thing as Britain or people called "the British" if you exclude the Scots. I appreciate that most English people don't realise there is a difference between being English and being British and the BBC certainly cannot comprehend the difference but in my experience Canadians always knew the difference. For much of the 18th century Scotland was referred to in English publications as "North Britain". The bedrock of British colonial life in American and Canada in the 18th and 19th centuries was the Scots. After the collapse of the Jacobite Risings in 1746, within 20 years the majority of British troops in the American colonies had large contingents of Scots among them and indeed many of the defeated Jacobite chiefs raised regiments to fight on behalf of King George in America and Canada. The chiefs used this as a means of regaining their titles, estates and positions. The London based government agreed to it as a means of getting lots of military aged men out of the Scottish Highlands and thereby reduce any chance of another Jacobite Rising. Following the fall of British Colonial rule of America at Yorktown in 1783, a great many of the colonists who retained loyalty to King George, of whom a great many were either Scots or the sons and grandsons of Scots migrated north to Nova Scotia and Canada or west and southwest towards Texas, California, Mexico and the Caribbean. If you study the muster roll of the men who fought at The Alamo, you will find a large number of Scots and Mexicans and actually there were very few Americans lined up against Santa Ana and his troops. Until 1775 America was used as a "dumping ground" by the English and Scottish courts for criminals. In over 20 years of research, I have found that the overwhelming majority of those families whose entire presence in North America was based on the idea that an ancestor had been transported as a "political prisoner" and Jacobite rebel who opposed British rule, actually are descended from people who were no more than common thieves. After all if you had been transported to America for stealing sugar or something which today we might consider trivial, and had then made a great success for yourself, often building up a successful business and entering into Colonial politics, what would you tell your children? I would claim I had been sent to America as a political prisoner or escaped there as a political refugee and adherent of the Italian born Jacobite Charles Edward Stewart rather than just admit I had stolen some food to feed my starving family. Looking specifically at the Mackintoshes (to use the correct spelling of the name), the Mackintosh of Mackintosh at the time of the 45 Rising was a serving officer in the British army and his loyalty was to King George. His wife known to history as "Colonel Anne" was the daughter and sister of a Jacobite supporter so she called out some of the Mackintoshes to support Charles Edward Stewart and even held her husband as a "prisoner" for some time. Accordingly more Mackintoshes ended up in America as serving soldiers in the British army rather than as rebels transported rather than facing execution. Remember Ireland was a full part of what was known as "Great Britain" and thereafter as the "United Kingdom" until the 20th century so it was very common in the 18th and 19th centuries for Scots soldiers to be garrisoned in Ireland and to marry into Irish families. Equally many Irish emigrated long before the Potato famines of the mid 19th century and a great many were simply economic migrants like the majority of Scots. To compare the attitude of Scots towards the English although you said British in the 18th or 19th century to that of the IRA in the 20th century is totally inaccurate. There was a resentment towards the London Government and the way the Scots were often treated like second class citizens but the people of Yorkshire, Lancashire, Wales and Devon and Cornwall would have felt equally aggrieved at that time. However it was the Scots who largely opened up both America and Canada and indeed several rivers and lakes like the Stewart River are named after members of my own extended Highland Scottish family. On the negative side it was Scots sea captains who got paid large amounts to transport often Scots prisoners to America and certainly it was usually Scots who were the Plantation owners or managers who forced prisoners from Britain to work like slaves on the cotton and sugar plantations. Most of the generals who waged war on one another in the 1860s in what became known as the American Civil War were themselves grandsons and great grandsons of the Scots officers who had faced one another across the moor at Culloden just outside Inverness on 16th April 1746, most of the Union Generals coming from Hanoverian supporting clans and the Confederate Generals coming from Jacobite supporting clans. What is not in any doubt is that many of the Scots who settled in the American colonies married into Irish families who likewise had settled in the American colonies but you should not confuse many of the Irish who settled pre 1776 with those who flooded to America post 1840. Many of the early Irish settlers were members of the ruling classes, either Roman Catholic or Protestant and their servants, retainers and most importantly for the development of America, the skilled craftsmen who supplied these elite families. The descendants of those settlers would certainly have looked down on most of the post-famine immigrants in exactly the same way as their ancestors would have looked down on them before 1776 back in Ireland. However what is not in doubt is that all these pioneer families were brave, fearless people who were much stronger than we are today and that in every family, the rogues are as interesting as the sober-living individuals. All the best Mark John M Sutherland-Fisher Managing Director, Czech Match Ltd North Cadboll House, North Cadboll, Fearn by Tain, Ross-shire, Scotland. IV20 1TN Tel and Fax: 0044 (0) 1862 871877 Mobile: 0044 (0) 7765 272815 Email: info@czechmatch.co.uk website: www.czechmatch.co.uk "Bringing Two Worlds Together" -----Original Message----- From: mcintosh-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:mcintosh-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jennifer Sent: 21 March 2008 10:53 To: mcintosh@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MCINTOSH] mcintosh families entries to canada and usa in 1600,1700, and 1800's Haha ! WONDERFUL ! When I read the story of Peter McIntosh, I said to myself...that sounds like something my Dad & Grandpa would have pulled. To put it in a nutshell, the research I've found shows this : During the revolutionary war, there was a chap who was VERY pro-brittish. A very hardcore Tory who got the idea that he could turn a nice profit by buying American goods and selling them in England. He had a bit of a problem, tho...nobody would talk to him. Sooo, he hired Peter McIntosh to make the arrangements for him. Peter McIntosh found a ship alright...one owned and crewed completely by folks from Scottland...and whose captain was Scottish as well. Now, in those days, Scottish folks had about as much high regard for the brittish as the IRA did in later years. This did not stop our genius from paying off Peter McIntosh, paying the Scottish captain and crew in advance and loading his goods onto the ship. As the old saying goes, a fool and his money are lucky to get together in the first place. What happened was completely predictable. The ship was "attacked" by unnamed "pirates" and all of the goods vanished....then, while still at sea, the ship was attacked a SECOND time..this time by "rebels" who decided to take the ship to Nova Scotia where the ship was "condemned". While I cannot prove it, I think it far more likely that IF *ANY* of this story was true, rebels would have simply renamed the ship and used it to fight the Brittish. What is far more likely is that the goods were simply sold and the captain and crew split the profits. A McIntosh family value which I would fully believe, given my knowledge of my own families ...uh...value's. It should be noted that...while Peter McIntosh was from Scotland, many of the women married by the McIntosh line from his son James were...from that day to this...Irish. Due to the vast discrimination suffered by the Irish, however, the McIntosh family line has a long history of having refered to itself as either "Scottish" ...or, at best..."Scotch Irish". The history of those who have done this is not one to be proud of, as those calling themselves "Scotch Irish" became some of the worst bigots to discriminate against the Irish that there ever were. But, I suppose every family has a few skeletons in their closet, eh ? If you can document your findings, then this would verify a huge history which has the potential to show the McIntosh family line as ...quite possibly...being incredibly important to the american revolution. I look forward to seeing any info you might have that can document this. Jennie -----Original Message----- From: mcintosh-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:mcintosh-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Carol Fox Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 3:19 PM To: mcintosh@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MCINTOSH] mcintosh families entries to canada and usa in 1600,1700, and 1800's HI, MY MCINTOSH FAMILIES CAME FROM RUSSELL CO., VIRGINIA ALSO. I WILL CHECK TO SEE WHAT I HAVE. KEEP IN TOUCH. CAROL > From: dmcintosh@new.rr.com> To: mcintosh@rootsweb.com> Date: Thu, 20 Mar 2008 16:25:55 -0500> Subject: Re: [MCINTOSH] mcintosh families entries to canada and usa in 1600, 1700, and 1800's> > I show a James McIntosh, b.1795 in Russell County, VA; d. Breathitt Co., KY > married (10 Sept.,1813 in Clay Co., KY) to Catherine Fugate, b.1795 in VA. > James was the son of Peter McIntosh and Margaret "Peggy" Turner.> Peter came from Scotland and settled in Russell Co., VA.> > James had a number of children but I don't have either an Absolum or Edward > listed.> > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jennifer" <jenever@comcast.net>> To: <gc-gateway@rootsweb.com>; <mcintosh@rootsweb.com>; > <McINTOSH-L@rootsweb.com>> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 3:58 PM> Subject: Re: [MCINTOSH] mcintosh families entries to canada and usa in > 1600,1700, and 1800's> > > > Hi...> >> > I am working on one section of the McIntosh family tree...but I'm stuck.> >> > I am looking for documentation (grave! site photo's, family bible info or> > whatever) which shows the parentage of :> >> > James McIntosh - Born around 1790 in or near Perry, Kentucky> > Spouse : Katherine Fugate> > Son : Absolum Edward McIntosh> >> > Any help that's available would be appreciated. Thank you.> >> > Jennifer> >> >> > -------------------------------> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > MCINTOSH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message> > > > > > -------------------------------> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MCINTOSH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MCINTOSH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to MCINTOSH-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. 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