In a message dated 5/10/2002 6:32:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time, mazie@adelphia.net writes: << - Richard Warren (d. 1728) m. Elizabeth - Mary Warren (b. 1610) m. Robert Bartlett (b. 27 May 1603) - Mercy Bartlett (b. 10 Mar 1650) m. John Joy (b. 10 Aug 1644) - Joseph John Jay (b. 30 Sep 1672) m. Mary Ann Orchard - John Jay (b. 1715) m. ? - David Jay m. - Thomas Jay (b. 28 Jan 1779) m. Abishiba Morse (b. 15 May 1773) - Elizabeth Jay (b. 5 Oct 1807) m. James Pennell (b. 1 Jul 1802) - Nancy Pennell (b. 8 Nov 1831) m. William Wigfield (b. 1814) Has anyone on the list used this or part of this lineage to become a member of the Society? The John Joy that married Mercy Bartlett, I have seen listed as John Ivey, Jay amd Joy. Has this been determined to be "fact"? Thanks in advance for any assistance. Sincerely, Tim Cooper >> Tim: According to The Joy Genealogy by Helen Bourne Joy Lee it states the following for the John who married Mercy Bartlett: John b. Boston Mass 10 Aug 1641, pb Oct 1641 First Ch Boston, prob killed in King Philip's War. Named in grfather John Gallop's will 1649, not in father's will 1677. A John Joy m. Mercy, had son John b Boston 30 Sept 1672. A John Jay of Mass served with Mass in King Philip's War 1675-76 (His of King Philip's War, George M. Bodge; estate of John Joy of Marblehead Essex Co Prob Recs 1729-30.) Now in the Richard Warren silver book it states thusly: Mercy Bartlett b. Plymouth 10 Mar 1650/1. She m. Plymouth 25 Dec 1668 John Joy of Boston; perhaps the one b. Boston 10 8th mo 1641; son of Thomas and Joan (Gallop) Joy. If so, he must have died before Thomas Joy wrote his will on 8 July 1677 as he is not named in that will. No Suffolk or Plymouth Co. PR or LR for John Joy. Child: (JOY) b. Boston: John b. 30 Sept 1672; n.f.r. References: Plymouth Colony Recs 8:32(m). Boston VR 9:11(b. John), 123 (b. son John). Hingham Hist 2:396. Note Plymouth Colony Recs 8:32 and MD 3:111, 117; 18:57 all say she m. John Ivey. A recent reading of the original records by Barbara Merrick reveals that Mercy married John Joy. Having said that, I don't see how you have arrived at a surname of JAY for the son of John Joy in your lineage and then to proceed to bring the line down continuing with the spelling as JAY. What are your sources to provide a wife for John (b. 1672)? I'm curious since Thomas Joy/Joan Gallop and Richard Warren are my direct ancestors. I'm sure that other Joy researchers would be curious as well. Please provide to this list what your source is for bring your line down from this John. To that point from Richard Warren it was okay. I am questioning the Jay spelling and the information you used to arrive at providing a wife for this individual when the Mayflower Society couldn't when it published its Richard Warren 5 generations in 1999! Christie Trapp