i know this is a bit of topic but does anyone know where there is a free searchable database to locate a veteran of the war of 1812, both american and canadian? thanks schani

This may be a bit off topic, but in researching possible Mayflower lines I have come across a descent from Peter West of Duxbury (b. 1648; d. 1720), son of Francis WEST and Margery REEVES. It is widely claimed in pedigrees on RootsWeb that Francis WEST was a son of Francis WEST, Colonial Governor of Virginia, and grandson of Thomas WEST, 3rd Lord Delaware. Has this relationship been proven, or is it wishful thinking on the part of many people? Thanks, Len

could anyone confirm that the info below is accurate considering the source: Re JOB WINSLOW: in the book "The Great Migration Begins" by Charles Robert Andersen, Job Winslow is listed as the son of Kenelm Sr. and Eleanor (sometimes spelled differently) Adams. Born circa 1641. Job has a brother, Kenelm Jr. who married Mercy Worden. I am new to this "Mayflower" research but the book is well documaented and has been quoted to me as being a very reliable source also some help in regards to the info presented below Re : JOHN HOWARD WINSLOW: book i have and other research material "indicate" that John (Hayward) Winslow (John Winslow was the great grandson of Kenelm Jr. & Mercy Worden) left New England in May 1760 on board the "Charming Molly" to settle in Annapolis, Nova Scotia. does anyone have access to New England Source material that would confirm and support this information. It appears that he was born in Freetown, Mass on 22 march 1738. He came with his wife Abigail (nee Fenno). This is the 1st time i have seen this name "Fenno".!? The move to Nova Scotia is an important event for me as John Winslow's daughter eventually marries into my Winchester family any help would be appreciated schani Biermann, researching Winchester and Morgan in New England States, Nova Scotia and New brunswick

***-----Original Message----- ***From: James W. Crippen [mailto:crippen3@alaska.com] ***Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2002 2:51 AM ***To: MAYFLOWER-L@rootsweb.com ***Subject: Re: [MFLR] Freeman list *** *** ***S Biermann: ***If you successfully capture this list, I too am interested. I have a ***nebulous pair who arrived from England after 1650 who appear in a 1665 ***court case. Thomas Crippen must have become a freeman during the ***1665-90 period, judging by the estate. Question is when? ***Good luck on your quest. ***JC3 James, it isn't clear to me whether you know that Thomas Crippen was in fact a freeman. I looked through the index of each volume of PCR which has court orders and did not find Thomas Crippen being granted freemanship [Shurtleff, Nathaniel B._Records of the Colony of New Plymouth in New England_(Boston, the Press of William White, 1855, reprinted New York, AMS Press, 1968)]. In fact the only mention of Thomas Crippen is 6 Mar. 1665/6, General Court: "Wheras Thomas Crippen hath bine convicted before the Court of lacivious speeches tending to the upholding of and being as a pandor of his wife in lightness and laciviousnes, the Court saw reason to require bonds of him for his good behavior; and wheras the said Crippen could not procure surties, hee hath and doth by these presents bind over unto the Court...the value of forty pounds, out of his estate..." (PCR 4:116) My own personal and quite likely incorrect reading of that ("could not procure surties") suggests to me that Thomas may not have been well-connected at that time. I know nothing about him, but he seems to have been in a Quaker area before he moved to CT--would that have any bearing on things? [Incidentally, PCR Vol. 8 has the 1643 list of freemen]

***-----Original Message----- ***From: Joan C. Miller [mailto:jrm107@juno.com] ***Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2002 9:14 PM ***To: MAYFLOWER-L@rootsweb.com ***Subject: [MFLR] Re: MAYFLOWER-D Digest V02 #115 *** *** ***I'm reading and learning what you're saying re "Freeman". Are there ***other definitions of this word? *** I have a copy of Lucius R. Paiges publication, "List of Freemen of ***Massachusetts, 1630-1691". *** It states, "Before a member of society could exercise the right of ***suffrage, or hold any public office, he must be made a "freeman" by the ***general or quarterly court." *** "The "Freeman's Oath" was the first paper printed in New England. It was ***printed at Cambridge, by Stephen Daye, in 1639, upon a single sheet, in ***the manner of a handbill, and without date." *** Of course, it goes on to define the "Oath" and gives a list of these ***freemen. Joan, I believe that Paige's book lists freemen of the Massachusetts Bay Colony, which was a separate governmental entity from Plymouth Colony. Each colony had its own laws and practices, rather as if they were separate states today. In 1691 Plymouth Colony lost its independence and merged with Mass. Bay. So for the period covered by Paige's book there would be small differences in what exactly being a freeman entailed, but I think what you quote--that a man (not "member of society," if you will pardon a little indignation on behalf of the others) had to be officially approved by the central government before he could vote or hold office--is the important core. We're talking about a long period of time and completely different colonies made up of people of somewhat different backgrounds. Over this period of time the make up of the population and the challenges the colonies faced internally and in their relationship with England changed enormously, and one would expect that voting rights would change too, just as they have in the twentieth century. So it seems that the only "static" definition one would find would have to be a very general or basic one.

S Biermann: If you successfully capture this list, I too am interested. I have a nebulous pair who arrived from England after 1650 who appear in a 1665 court case. Thomas Crippen must have become a freeman during the 1665-90 period, judging by the estate. Question is when? Good luck on your quest. JC3 Schani Biermann wrote: > > could someone possibly explain to me -or indicate to me a good website, > about this "Freeman List" that so many books/articles refer to. i have many > ancestors who came over to America from England and then made their way into > NB & NS. there is always a notaion that they became a "Freeman"?? > > schani Biermann, researching Winchester, Morgan and Winslow in New England > States , New Brunswick & Nova Scotia > > ==== MAYFLOWER Mailing List ==== > Check out the web page of the General Society of Mayflower Descendants at http://www.mayflower.org/

I'm reading and learning what you're saying re "Freeman". Are there other definitions of this word? I have a copy of Lucius R. Paiges publication, "List of Freemen of Massachusetts, 1630-1691". It states, "Before a member of society could exercise the right of suffrage, or hold any public office, he must be made a "freeman" by the general or quarterly court." "The "Freeman's Oath" was the first paper printed in New England. It was printed at Cambridge, by Stephen Daye, in 1639, upon a single sheet, in the manner of a handbill, and without date." Of course, it goes on to define the "Oath" and gives a list of these freemen.

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FO.2ADI/157.1.1 Message Board Post: You wrote: "Hi, I am also descended from Kenelm Winslow but i have never seen anything saying that Kenelm and Edward had a sister...... Megs" See NEHGS Register 121:26-7

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Winslow Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FO.2ADI/157.1 Message Board Post: Hi, I am also descended from Kenelm Winslow but i have never seen anything saying that Kenelm and Edward had a sister...... Megs

Thanks very much for looking at the reference for me ... guess we'll need another route. If I can get away at lunch tomorrow, I'll visit the library ... I'll let you know what I find. A question(s): I thought (evidently mistakenly) that the reference to The Mayflower Descendant (below) was an article in a journal of some sort? Is The Mayflower Descendant a journal or a "multi-vilumed book"? Is it "infallible"? Have omissions been discovered previously? How many (roughly)? Are they recorded somewhere? I recently discovered a connection (for which I had been searching) in an edition of a Samuel Orcutt book which included "additions and corrections." It was very helpful. I'm curious if a similar body of additions and corrections exists? Thanks again for all of your marvelous work! ----- Original Message ----- From: Stacy Wood To: stephen ferriss ; MAYFLOWER-L Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 5:27 PM Subject: Re: [MFLR] Sturtevant to Bradford ... Come in Please In the index of names for the Mayflower Descendant Volumes I through XXXIV there are only two entries for Abiah/Abia Sturtevant: the Vol. III, No. 3, p. 164 item that I passed earlier and a Vol. XI, No. 3 (July 1909) p. 163 item that follows: "STURTEVANT Abiah, daughter of Noah and Susanna, died 1 May 1756, aged 8 years, 7 months, 18 days." There are references to Fear Sturtevant as follow: Vol. V p. 180; Vol. X p. 10; Vol. XIV p. 34; Vol. XVII p. 130; and Vol. XXVII p. 120. Because Abiah/Abia does not appear further in the Index, I have not checked all of these. I should point out that Charles Northmore Sturtevant, M.D., was one of the four people serving on the Committee on Consolidated Index for the first 34 Mayflower Descendant volumes. I doubt that he would have let another Abiah/Abia reference slip by. Vol. V p. 180 lists the children of Fear, daughter of Rev. Isaac Cushman, and William Sturtevant. There are 5: Isaac (8/10/1708), Hannah (8/20/1711), Rebeckah (July "ye deceast" 1715) and twin daughters Fear and Elisabeth born 7 Apr. 1719 and the entry adds that Fear married Capt. John Waterman of Halifax. Vol. XIV p. 34 states that "William Stirtevant & Feare Cushman was married ffebruary 12th 1707." Vol. X p. 10 states "Fear, wife of William, died 13 July, 1746, in her 58th year." I can find no marriage of aother Fear Cushman to another Nehemiah Sturtevant. ----- Original Message ----- From: stephen ferriss Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 5:55 PM To: Stacy Wood; MAYFLOWER-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [MFLR] Sturtevant to Bradford ... Come in Please I apologize. I should have vaccinated against the "Multiple Abiah's Syndrome" (MAS). Yes ma'am there are several Abiah Strutevants. 1) The one you mention below, born to Nehemiah and Ruth in 1720. 2) Another Abiah born to Noah Sturtevant (son of Nehemiah and Ruth) and Susanna Harlow in 1747. This Abiah died at 8 years of age... 3) And the Abiah I'm seeking who was born to Nehemiah and Fear (Cushman) Sturtevant in 1748. This Abiah would be the granddaughter of the Nehemiah and Ruth you mention below. Sorry for the confusion. I'm hoping the article in The Mayflower Descendant, Volume III, 1899 (see below) will help. Thank you for the information on my Abiah Sturtevant's (b.1748) Aunt Abiah (b. 1720). ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Stacy Wood To: stephen ferriss ; MAYFLOWER-L Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [MFLR] Sturtevant to Bradford ... Come in Please Early Records of Plympton, MASS. on page 164 of the July, 1901 issue of "The Mayflower Descendant" appearing in Vol. III, No. 3 states: "The Children of Nehemiah Sturtevant by Ruth his wife Cornelias ... Marcy ... Paull ... Nehemiah ... Noah ... Ruth ... Noah ... Abia Sturtevant was born July the 30th 1720 Georg ... Lusanah ..." The birth of "Curnelios" is also to be found on page 123 of the April, 1901 (Vol. III, No. 2). No other children are listed but Nehemiah's wife is identified with a note stating "in a modern hand" as Ruth Sampson." See GSMD "The Henry Samson Family MFFG Vol. XX, Part I page 65 which confirms Nehemiah's wife was Ruth Samson. ----- Original Message ----- From: stephen ferriss Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 4:52 PM To: MAYFLOWER-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [MFLR] Sturtevant to Bradford ... Come in Please Still hunting Abiah Sturtevant b. Nov. 27, 1748 and d. Oct. 30, 1841. Married: 1) Moses Cass, Jr Feb. 3, 1767 2) Joseph Judd abt. 1791 Abiah is reportedly the daughter of Nehemiah and Fear (Cushman) Sturtevant. Does anyone have the following cite? George Ernest Bowman, "Early Records of Plympton, Mass," The Mayflower Descendant, Volume III, 1899. If so, would you please peek to see if this relationship is confirmed in that article? Thank you for any assistance. Steve Ferriss ==== MAYFLOWER Mailing List ==== Check out the web page of the General Society of Mayflower Descendants at http://www.mayflower.org/

I apologize. I should have vaccinated against the "Multiple Abiah's Syndrome" (MAS). Yes ma'am there are several Abiah Strutevants. 1) The one you mention below, born to Nehemiah and Ruth in 1720. 2) Another Abiah born to Noah Sturtevant (son of Nehemiah and Ruth) and Susanna Harlow in 1747. This Abiah died at 8 years of age... 3) And the Abiah I'm seeking who was born to Nehemiah and Fear (Cushman) Sturtevant in 1748. This Abiah would be the granddaughter of the Nehemiah and Ruth you mention below. Sorry for the confusion. I'm hoping the article in The Mayflower Descendant, Volume III, 1899 (see below) will help. Thank you for the information on my Abiah Sturtevant's (b.1748) Aunt Abiah (b. 1720). -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Stacy Wood To: stephen ferriss ; MAYFLOWER-L Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 2:27 PM Subject: Re: [MFLR] Sturtevant to Bradford ... Come in Please Early Records of Plympton, MASS. on page 164 of the July, 1901 issue of "The Mayflower Descendant" appearing in Vol. III, No. 3 states: "The Children of Nehemiah Sturtevant by Ruth his wife Cornelias ... Marcy ... Paull ... Nehemiah ... Noah ... Ruth ... Noah ... Abia Sturtevant was born July the 30th 1720 Georg ... Lusanah ..." The birth of "Curnelios" is also to be found on page 123 of the April, 1901 (Vol. III, No. 2). No other children are listed but Nehemiah's wife is identified with a note stating "in a modern hand" as Ruth Sampson." See GSMD "The Henry Samson Family MFFG Vol. XX, Part I page 65 which confirms Nehemiah's wife was Ruth Samson. ----- Original Message ----- From: stephen ferriss Sent: Monday, May 27, 2002 4:52 PM To: MAYFLOWER-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [MFLR] Sturtevant to Bradford ... Come in Please Still hunting Abiah Sturtevant b. Nov. 27, 1748 and d. Oct. 30, 1841. Married: 1) Moses Cass, Jr Feb. 3, 1767 2) Joseph Judd abt. 1791 Abiah is reportedly the daughter of Nehemiah and Fear (Cushman) Sturtevant. Does anyone have the following cite? George Ernest Bowman, "Early Records of Plympton, Mass," The Mayflower Descendant, Volume III, 1899. If so, would you please peek to see if this relationship is confirmed in that article? Thank you for any assistance. Steve Ferriss ==== MAYFLOWER Mailing List ==== Check out the web page of the General Society of Mayflower Descendants at http://www.mayflower.org/

In a message dated 5/27/02 11:03:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time, taire@webtv.net writes: > HI - > I would also be interested in the answers to Elizabeth's question > concerning Warren and Church burial and/or homesites, as well as > Schani's question regarding "freeman". According to Richard Warren's "Silver Book", he died in Plymouth, and is probably buried in an unmarked grave. His daughter Elizabeth died in Hingham MA, and her husband, Richard Church, died Dedham MA and was buried in Hingham. Regards, Rick Turner (a descendant of Richard and Elizabeth Church, through their daughter, Abigail (Church) Thaxter "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."---The Declaration of Independence "I love the word 'friends'. It means so much, for we are, and should be, friends for the glory of God and the salvation of the world."---Alice C. Winslow (1856-1927), 1913

Still hunting Abiah Sturtevant b. Nov. 27, 1748 and d. Oct. 30, 1841. Married: 1) Moses Cass, Jr Feb. 3, 1767 2) Joseph Judd abt. 1791 Abiah is reportedly the daughter of Nehemiah and Fear (Cushman) Sturtevant. Does anyone have the following cite? George Ernest Bowman, "Early Records of Plympton, Mass," The Mayflower Descendant, Volume III, 1899. If so, would you please peek to see if this relationship is confirmed in that article? Thank you for any assistance. Steve Ferriss

The explanation Dianne quotes below of freemanship is a good, basic definition. I am sure she is aware that it is of necessity somewhat limited, and because there were others interested I would like to add a bit which is more specific to Plymouth Colony. The qualifications for freemanship varied from place to place and over time, and as with all human affairs, what was officially recorded may not always have been how things were actually done. A book which I like very much by George D. Langdon, Jr., _Pilgrim Colony: A History of New Plymouth 1620-1691_(New Haven, Yale University Press,1966), p. 81 has this comment: "Like Massachusetts [the Bay Colony, as opposed to Plymouth Colony], Plymouth began to use the word freeman to designate citizenship, including the right to vote for the governor and assistants and to hold colony office. But unlike the Bay Colony, Plymouth did not at first attempt to spell out statuatory requirements for freemanship. Before 1656 no legislative statement of qualifications existed; and even thereafter candidates were required only to secure approval of the freemen in their towns before presenting their names to the General Court [which then acted upon them]." Langdon argues for a relatively broad franchise in an article in _William and Mary Quarterly_20:513-26, "The Franchise and Political Democracy in Plymouth Colony." H. Roger King, in _Cape Cod and Plymouth Colony in the Seventeenth Century_(Lanham, MD, University Press of America, 1994) pp 148-52 argues that being granted freemanship was not simply a matter of meeting official qualifications. He concludes that "While not in a position to pass restrictive town ordinances, as the General Court could do for the colony, the towns nonetheless exercised strong influence over freemanship. They did so primariliy by limiting the honor to those who were of known quality or the descendants of early founders and settlers." p. 151 The definition quoted below does not allow for the fact that the practices in the colonies were fluid, evolving, and subject to changing circumstances. No mention is made, for instance, of church membership. While in the Bay Colony church membership was an early requirement, it was not until Plymouth was confronted with what they considered the menace of the extreme Quakers that a religious requirement was formalized. But again, all this was fluid and flexible and there were surely "unwritten" practices. I'm no expert on this, I just wanted to add that freemanship was not quite as simple a matter as the definition quoted suggests, and that on the whole it appears that in Plymouth Colony, while the Good Old Boy network seems to have been working, freemanship seems to have been more open than in Mass. Bay. One would have to be careful in making assumptions about a particular ancestor based on his being or not being a freeman. ***Freeman: In Colonial days this term referred to any male over twenty-one ***years old who owned personal property or real estate valued at a ***prescribed ***amount. He also was obliged to be a peaceful man, endorsed by a ***majority of ***the town's Freemen. Only after this vote at a semi-annual ***meeting of the ***selectmen, could the man take the Freeman's Oath. His duties ***were to elect ***deputies to the General Assembly of the colony and to elect new ***Freemen. He ***was a member of a local church and had the right to vote and pay taxes. *** ***Source: "A to Zax, a comprehensive dictionary for genealogists and ***historians" by Barbara Jean Evans, © 1995 *** ***Hope this helps, *** ***Dianne *** *** ***==== MAYFLOWER Mailing List ==== ***Check out the web page of the General Society of Mayflower ***Descendants at http://www.mayflower.org/ *** ***

In a message dated 5/26/02 10:47:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ussenterprise@sasktel.net writes: << could someone possibly explain to me -or indicate to me a good website, about this "Freeman List" that so many books/articles refer to. i have many ancestors who came over to America from England and then made their way into NB & NS. there is always a notaion that they became a "Freeman"?? >> Freeman: In Colonial days this term referred to any male over twenty-one years old who owned personal property or real estate valued at a prescribed amount. He also was obliged to be a peaceful man, endorsed by a majority of the town's Freemen. Only after this vote at a semi-annual meeting of the selectmen, could the man take the Freeman's Oath. His duties were to elect deputies to the General Assembly of the colony and to elect new Freemen. He was a member of a local church and had the right to vote and pay taxes. Source: "A to Zax, a comprehensive dictionary for genealogists and historians" by Barbara Jean Evans, © 1995 Hope this helps, Dianne

HI - I would also be interested in the answers to Elizabeth's question concerning Warren and Church burial and/or homesites, as well as Schani's question regarding "freeman". Thank you, Terri

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/rw/FO.2ADI/157 Message Board Post: i am descended from Kenelm Winslow but would like more information on his sister, Magdalene. i thought she stayed in england and did not come over to america.Some say she DID arrive in america and 2nd married a Worden. interested primarily on the WAKE connection (her first husband) I am connected to the Winslow line through marriage of My Winchester family of Nova Scotia, canada.

On Sun, 26 May 2002 19:32:57 -0700 stephen ferriss <circle@ntplx.net> writes: > In an earlier query, I asked about Abiah Sturtevant (b. Nov. 27, 1748). > The Abiah Sturtevant I am interested in is the daughter of Nehemiah > Sturtevant (b. Nov. 18, 1710) and Fear Cushman (b. Jul. 10, 1718. Steve - Your earlier message seemed to indicate that Abiah was the daughter of Peleg Sturtevant, but he was born 25-Jan-1735/6 Plympton (son of Nehemiah Sturtevant and Fear Cushing) and so not likely to have a daughter born in 1748. The Bowman Files show only four children for Nehemiah and Fear - Peleg, Perez, Phear and Ruth. What is your source for Abiah's birth and parentage? Dale H. Cook, Chief Engineer, WWWR Roanoke VA, WCQV Moneta VA, WKBA WZZI Vinton VA, WKPA WLNI WLVA WZZU Lynchburg VA

could someone possibly explain to me -or indicate to me a good website, about this "Freeman List" that so many books/articles refer to. i have many ancestors who came over to America from England and then made their way into NB & NS. there is always a notaion that they became a "Freeman"?? schani Biermann, researching Winchester, Morgan and Winslow in New England States , New Brunswick & Nova Scotia

Can anyone recommend a good movie that somewhat faithfully captures the time and mood of the early settlers? Thanks. Steve Ferriss