Dear Peter, Thank you for that - the library say their volunteer(s) can help search the newspapers for the article.  Kind regards, Susan ________________________________ From: Peter Klein <[email protected]> To: Susan C <[email protected]>; [email protected] Sent: Thursday, August 15, 2013 9:45 AM Subject: Re: [MAR] Accidental drowning in Shields, Tyne and Wear Hello Susan, Have you tried the Newcastle Local Studies Library archive?  In the period 1750-1800 they have several newspaper titles, any one of which might well have reported William Ainslie's drowning at Shields.  The Archive holds the Newcastle Advertiser, the Newcastle Courant, and the Newcastle Weekly Chronicle, and they would appear to have all those titles for the period throughout the 1790s, both on microfilm and in bound volumes.  These are very likely to have circulated at South Shields.  See:  http://www.newcastle.gov.uk/wwwfileroot/legacy/libraries/NewspaperfactsheetMarch2011.pdf.  If the accident was reported, the name of his ship will almost certainly appear there, although it may well be a long search. Regards, Peter Klein ________________________________ From: Susan C <[email protected]> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, 15 August 2013, 16:03 Subject: [MAR] Accidental drowning in Shields, Tyne and Wear Hello listers, I may be on the wrong list, but I welcome suggestions to look for possible records of an ancestor who drowned in the river between 1790 - 1798.  He was William Ainsley, b. 1776 in Wooler, Northumberland.  He fell off a plank when he was boarding a ship, in Shields.  There were small boats on the river, possibly fishermen, who tried to reach him but the current was too fast.  Perhaps an article in a local newspaper would be a place to search, but are there other sources of a record for his death?  I don't know where to search for newspapers that existed then - or which library holds newspapers of those years.  Perhaps a Mariner record of accidental drownings?  I am not sure if he was a seaman or traveling at the time, if he was traveling then I would need the ship name to obtain a manifest list. And that is another issue, I do not have details regarding the ship he was boarding.   Are there records of ships anchored in Shields in 1790 - 1798? Thanks to anyone who can point me in the right direction in this incredibly difficult puzzle. Regards, Susan ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi CV, In 1828/29 in Lloyd's Register there were 15 brigs and 4 schooners, and in 1829/30 14 brigs and 9 schooners, all called "Thomas".  Can you give us some idea of which port she came from, or an approximate date, or the name of her master?  It might help narrow the search. Regards, PK ________________________________ From: C. V. <[email protected]> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, 16 August 2013, 17:09 Subject: [MAR] Find a lost english brig/schooner named Thomas (1829) Hi everybody, I need your help to find some information about an english brig (or schooner) named "Thomas", lost in 1829, near South Africa. I would like to know if there are some death certificate for men lost at sea? Thank you in advance if you can help me. CV                         ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Regret death certificates were not introduced on British vessels until July 1837, and even then, from observations made on the Mariners List, they were very patchy, but see the leaflets produced by the National Maritime Museum : <http://www.rmg.co.uk/researchers/library/research-guides/general-introduction/research-guide-a3-tracing-family-history-from-maritime-records> or the National Archives : <http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/looking-for-person/bmdatseaorabroad.htm> Paul On Fri, 16 Aug 2013 18:09:14 +0200, "C. V." <[email protected]> wrote: >Hi everybody, > >I need your help to find some information about an english brig (or schooner) named "Thomas", lost in 1829, near South Africa. > >I would like to know if there are some death certificate for men lost at sea? > >Thank you in advance if you can help me. >CV > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message 50° 33' N, 2° 26' W http://www.pbenyon.plus.com/Naval.html

Hi everybody, I need your help to find some information about an english brig (or schooner) named "Thomas", lost in 1829, near South Africa. I would like to know if there are some death certificate for men lost at sea? Thank you in advance if you can help me. CV

Is anyone else having problems accessing the “CLYDESITE” database. I have been trying for a couple of days now to no avail. Any suggestions ?? Joe McMillan, South Australia.

I understood that the tonnage cited as the "weight" of a vessel is the cubic capacity of profit making space - i.e. the capacity of cargo it can carry in terms of goods and passengers. Is this correct? Ruth > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Rosemary > & Stan Rodliffe > Sent: 16 August 2013 13:01 > To: [email protected] > Subject: [MAR] Tonnage v Registered Tonnage > > I have discovered that when Queen of the Bay was being > advertised for passengers heading for the goldfields in South > Africa that it was described as 800 tons whereas its > registered tonnage is 391. I have read a little about the > derivation of registered tonnage but can't understand where > the 800 tons comes from. > > Grateful for guidance. > > Best wishes > > Rosemary Rodliffe > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I have discovered that when Queen of the Bay was being advertised for passengers heading for the goldfields in South Africa that it was described as 800 tons whereas its registered tonnage is 391. I have read a little about the derivation of registered tonnage but can't understand where the 800 tons comes from. Grateful for guidance. Best wishes Rosemary Rodliffe

For any in the UK who may be interested I have been informed: This afternoon at 1600hrs the BBC Radio 4 obituary programme, Last Word" is including him. I also have some personal recollections of the FLYING ENTERPRISE events as relayed to me by Ken Dancy. I have been trying to post these to Mariners', but for some reason they have not appeared! (Will try to reformat in order to preserve the information for posterity!) Ron ***** On 11/08/2013 20:06, Paul Benyon wrote: > Hi all, > > An interesting obit in the Daily Telegraph for those of us who were > glued to our radios at the end of 1951 and early days of 1952 : > > <http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/military-obituaries/naval-obituaries/10236118/Kenneth-Dancy.html> > > following the death of Kenneth Dancy, mate of the tug Turmoil, which > went out to attempt to tow the Flying Enterprise back to Falmouth. > > Paul > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

My apologies to all. So many messages in my Inbox that I didn't notice that Piers had already given Judy her information.   Regards, Adi

Hello Judy, >  >It sounds as if you have only one page i.e. image #123 of 1,332. His record on Ancestry is actually 5 pages - images 120 - 124 inclusive. You reach these by using the scroll arrows forward and back from the page that Ancestry's search engine delivers you to. That will give you his Seaman's Register Ticket # 345,455 if you didn't already have that, his previous seagoing experience and his certificate number - 3119. His address in 1851 was 3 Morden Place, Lewisham Road, Greenwich. >  >Have you checked the Merchant Seamen records on FindMyPast? There is at least one hit for him there. >  >  >Regards, >Adi >  >  >  >  >  > > > >>________________________________ >>From: LORNE ANDERSON <[email protected]> >>To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >>Sent: Friday, August 16, 2013 3:25:35 AM >>Subject: Re: [MAR] MARINERS Digest, Vol 8, Issue 285 >> >> >>Frederick George Halden WEST . >> >> >>  I have a copy of Certificate of Competency as a Second Mate for Frederick George Halden WEST dated December 11, 1851 in the Merchant Service.  Does anyonehave any other information on this gentleman. >> >>  He is part of my husband’s WEST family.  His father was Matthew Thomas WEST and his mother was Eliza HALDEN.  Up until I found this document on Ancestry.com, I had thought that he had died in 1844 ( no documentation at all for this date, though).  So, hoping that I may be able to follow his travels or path in later years. >> >>Thank You, >> >>Judy Anderson >>

Sean I have searched the index to Births Deaths and Marriages for the state of Victoria 1836 - 1888. There is only the following MALLIN references, as you will see there is no death for a John Mallin in that era. Also I searched the 1889 - 1901 era, again, no death for a John Mallin. Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Mary Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: John Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Bridget RYAN Age: Sex: F Birth Place: MELBOURNE Death Place: Year: 1842 Reg Number: 445 Denomination: Roman Catholic Parish: St Francis, Melbourne Fiche: 1091 Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Joseph Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Mary DARLING Age: Sex: M Birth Place: MELBOURNE Death Place: Year: 1842 Reg Number: 452 Denomination: Roman Catholic Parish: St Francis, Melbourne Fiche: 1091 Surname: MALLIN Given Names: James Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Agnes Elliott HENDERSON Age: Sex: Birth Place: SEBASTOPOL Death Place: Year: 1867 Reg Number: 24593 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Agnes Elliott Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Agnes ELLIOTT Age: Sex: Birth Place: SEBASTOPOL Death Place: Year: 1869 Reg Number: 5086 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: William Andrew Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Agnes Elliott HENDERSON Age: Sex: Birth Place: SEBA Death Place: Year: 1875 Reg Number: 5500 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Francis Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 6 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8173 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Elizabeth Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 8 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8174 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Mary Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 1 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8175 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Margaret Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 3 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8176 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: George Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Margaret MALLIN Age: 6M Sex: Birth Place: MELB Death Place: Year: 1874 Reg Number: 8876 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: James Event: M Spouse Surname/Father: MAGOVERN Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Elizabeth Age: Sex: M Birth Place: Death Place: Year: 1853 Reg Number: 1617 Denomination: Roman Catholic Parish: St Francis, Melbourne Fiche: 736 Surname: MALLIN Given Names: John Event: M Spouse Surname/Father: CLINE Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Catherine Age: Sex: M Birth Place: Death Place: Year: 1855 Reg Number: 1523 Denomination: Parish: Fiche:

Hi Judy His certificate is on page 123, but have you also looked at pages 120, 121, 122 and 124? The first three pages document his earlier career (he went to sea at about 13 ie 1845 ish), the last is the other side of his certificate. Can't help with his later career but the lack of any further certificates suggest that he did not progress further (? lost at sea), or if he did, that he took his later examinations in one of the colonies and the paperwork stayed there. Cheers Piers

re: Irish oak - ship building see: http://www.irishoakforests.com/uses.htm other information about what led to the devastation of irish forests can be found by googling: Irish oak ship building Paddy On 16/08/2013, at 8:17 AM, Piers Smith-Cresswell <[email protected]> wrote: > I'm not 100% confident now about my identification of her official > number following my digging around in the newspapers, I'll have to think > about it as there are some discrepancies, over tonnage etc. However, an > interesting story emerges about whatever ship named INDUSTRY made it to > Melbourne in 1858. > > I suggest you have a look through the Australian Newspapers on the Trove > site, bearing in mind that there was more than one vessel of that name, and > that reporting isn't 100% accurate. If you search "barque industry" in > trove and then "hulk industry" in the NZ "Papers Past" site, and > Google, you will find the following tale:- > > You will recall that Industry arrived at Melbourne in May 1858. She was put > up for sale in August 1858 but it appears she didn't sell. The suggestion > that she was built of Irish oak, imported to Canada, sounds quite > preposterous *http://tinyurl.com/l3f8hrd . * In September 1858 she was > still in port and a French ship discharged ballast and equipment into her. > She was sold in January 1859 for £800, and was stated as being "about 23 > years old" (ie built c.1835) see *http://tinyurl.com/nurf4cp .* . The > Argus reported on the 8th January that she had been sold to New Zealand > owners and had been refitted to carry 2000 head of sheep to New Zealand, > where she was intended to be turned into a coal hulk. * > http://tinyurl.com/qdg6wud . *A New Zealand newspaper reported her as > being 700 tons, and referred to her being intended to be hulked at Port > Chalmers (ie Dunedin). Her new owner appears to have been a John Jones. * > http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* <http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b> > > She cleared from Hobsons Bay on 19th January; her master being reported > as "W.R. Stephenson" *http://tinyurl.com/nf2dqm3 * > > Then "The barque *Industry*, bound for Otago, commenced taking in sheep on > Thursday morning (Feb. 3.) alongside the Williamstown Railway Pier, and > completed her loading of 1700 ewes, with which she hauled off before dark". > -*Argus*. *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* > > She sailed on February 6th 1859 for New Zealand. * > http://tinyurl.com/nl87cej* <http://tinyurl.com/nl87cej>* *but ran into > trouble: > > "On sighting Tewaewae's Point, a vessel was observed to be on shore there, > and the steamer [GEELONG] bore down to her assistance. She proved to be > the barque * "Industry,"* from Melbourne to Otago, with sheep, which had > drifted on the rocks in a most dangerous position. With considerable > difficulty the crew were induced to assist in the endeavour to get her off, > which was at length successful, and the * "Industry"* proceeded on her > voyage, not having apparently received any serious damage. But for the > opportune arrival of the steamer, the barque would in all probability have > become a total wreck, as both the captain and crew appeared to be utterly > indifferent as to the result." *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* > > Her consort NORTH STAR, sold at the same time and also intended as a > hulk, ran aground at the New River and sustained considerable damage. * > http://tinyurl.com/**qck2v2b* <http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b>. Which must > raise some question as to whether her owners were actually bothered at all > about whether INDUSTRY arrived or not. > > She arrived at Dunedin on 26th February. "Same day, *Industry*, 487 tons, > Stephen, from Melbourne, via the Bluff, with 1700 sheep, 100 boxes candles, > 766 deals, 700 tons coal, l package harness, and 1 dog cart. Arrived at > 9.20 a.m." *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* > ** > May 7th: "The barque* "Industry"* was run aground at the Bluff. Owner > Jones. Seaman - Barnes" > *http://tinyurl.com/**qck2v2b*<http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b> .She > was turned into a hulk, ie a floating warehouse. > ** > That would normally be about the last one would expect to hear of her. But > no! Twenty years later (1878) the much decayed vessel pops into the > newspapers again. In 1878 Dunedin City Council wanted to turn her into a > floating swimming pool! http://tinyurl.com/pebgma6. This report sums up > her career since 1858, discusses her current condition and the plans for > her, and adds the fact that Industry had been condemned at Melbourne [her > crew having presumably being paid off]. > > However people smelt something fishy going on, not just the reek from the > bilges of the decayed vessel ...was the council paying too much and being > scammed? http://tinyurl.com/qe5kuva. It became a local issue * > http://tinyurl.com/otfjjhd* <http://tinyurl.com/otfjjhd>* *and* > http://tinyurl.com/mz9rgqz*. Suspicions were summed up by the Grey River > Argus report on 27th December "The City Council of Dunedin bought an old > worm eaten hulk called the Industry to turn her into public baths. They > paid £600 for her and she was valued at £500. The report of Captain > Russell, Lloyd's agent, on the hulk is short and sweet; it is as follows: > That the Industry has been a ship of 500 tons burthen, American built; he > believes her to be about 50 years of age; he has examined her timber and > found it rotten from top to bottom, and he can put no intrinsic value on > her". http://tinyurl.com/q8o4pc5 > > Despite the Chairman of the Baths committee pressing for an enquiry to > exonerate him, it wasn't voted for http://tinyurl.com/pt7pqbd . It all > sounds very political. A Cllr Fish seems to have been deeply involved but > voted against the inquiry. Or it was. Later in 1879 there does seem to > have been an inquiry after all but it exonerated everyone. * > http://tinyurl.com/mr39hqx . *Some more subtle searching might tease out > more of the tale. > > It is not clear whether Industry was ever converted into public baths, or > whether the Council got their money back. > > Presumably, as the* Otago Daily Times *so graphically put* *it, after that > Industry simply "melted away in her unsavoury bed". > > An interesting tale..... > > Cheers > Piers > > > > > > Piers would you know who bought the INDUSTRY and what became of her? Also > what was the role of the agent T.H. Martin, Forrest and Co were they the > ship owners? Thank you for the reference number to the crew list, the > next time I’m in London, I’ll look it up at the National Archives. > > > > Again, much obliged for all your help. > > > > Best wishes , > > > > Seán Tapley > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Sean, do you know roughly what year John Mallin would have been born ? cheers Jenny -----Original Message----- From: Sean_tee Sent: Friday, August 16, 2013 2:29 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [MAR] Mallin - Ship's Carpenter Dear Jenny & Piers, Many thanks for your time and all your research on my behalf. Jenny to answer your question; John Mallin, ships carpenter, was the son of Michael Mallin. I don’t know his mother’s name, I’d be guessing. John was married to Mary Mangan in Dublin in 1848 and they had two sons Michael (1852) and John (1854). Therefore given the birthdates of his children I would think John was on the 1858 voyage. John’s wife died before he went to Australia and his children were reared by their grandparents. John died in Australia, don’t know when or where. I think he has an accident and it may have been something to do with his gold mining activities in the Bendigo area. That’s all I know. Piers would you know who bought the INDUSTRY and what became of her? Also what was the role of the agent T.H. Martin, Forrest and Co were they the ship owners? Thank you for the reference number to the crew list, the next time I’m in London, I’ll look it up at the National Archives. Again, much obliged for all your help. Best wishes , Seán Tapley ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

on 16 Aug 2013 Joe McMillan wrote Is anyone else having problems accessing the ?CLYDESITE? database. I have been trying for a couple of days now to no avail. Any suggestions ?? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The whole site has been down since 13/8 and there has been no word from the owner since then in the usual places. This has happened before for a while, and there is also the possibility that it he has closed it down. In the meantime you could post your query here. DAvid

Frederick George Halden WEST . I have a copy of Certificate of Competency as a Second Mate for Frederick George Halden WEST dated December 11, 1851 in the Merchant Service. Does anyonehave any other information on this gentleman. He is part of my husband’s WEST family. His father was Matthew Thomas WEST and his mother was Eliza HALDEN. Up until I found this document on Ancestry.com, I had thought that he had died in 1844 ( no documentation at all for this date, though). So, hoping that I may be able to follow his travels or path in later years. Thank You, Judy Anderson [email protected] Sent from Windows Mail From: [email protected] Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎August‎ ‎16‎, ‎2013 ‎12‎:‎11‎ ‎AM To: [email protected] Today's Topics: 1. Re: Mallin - Ship's Carpenter (J. Fawcett) 2. Re: Mallin - Ship's Carpenter (Patricia Byers) 3. Re: Mallin - Ship's Carpenter (J. Fawcett) 4. Clydesite (Joe McMillan) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 10:15:30 +1000 From: "J. Fawcett" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [MAR] Mallin - Ship's Carpenter To: <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original Sean, do you know roughly what year John Mallin would have been born ? cheers Jenny -----Original Message----- From: Sean_tee Sent: Friday, August 16, 2013 2:29 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [MAR] Mallin - Ship's Carpenter Dear Jenny & Piers, Many thanks for your time and all your research on my behalf. Jenny to answer your question; John Mallin, ships carpenter, was the son of Michael Mallin. I don?t know his mother?s name, I?d be guessing. John was married to Mary Mangan in Dublin in 1848 and they had two sons Michael (1852) and John (1854). Therefore given the birthdates of his children I would think John was on the 1858 voyage. John?s wife died before he went to Australia and his children were reared by their grandparents. John died in Australia, don?t know when or where. I think he has an accident and it may have been something to do with his gold mining activities in the Bendigo area. That?s all I know. Piers would you know who bought the INDUSTRY and what became of her? Also what was the role of the agent T.H. Martin, Forrest and Co were they the ship owners? Thank you for the reference number to the crew list, the next time I?m in London, I?ll look it up at the National Archives. Again, much obliged for all your help. Best wishes , Se?n Tapley ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 10:20:37 +1000 From: Patricia Byers <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [MAR] Mallin - Ship's Carpenter To: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 re: Irish oak - ship building see: http://www.irishoakforests.com/uses.htm other information about what led to the devastation of irish forests can be found by googling: Irish oak ship building Paddy On 16/08/2013, at 8:17 AM, Piers Smith-Cresswell <[email protected]> wrote: > I'm not 100% confident now about my identification of her official > number following my digging around in the newspapers, I'll have to think > about it as there are some discrepancies, over tonnage etc. However, an > interesting story emerges about whatever ship named INDUSTRY made it to > Melbourne in 1858. > > I suggest you have a look through the Australian Newspapers on the Trove > site, bearing in mind that there was more than one vessel of that name, and > that reporting isn't 100% accurate. If you search "barque industry" in > trove and then "hulk industry" in the NZ "Papers Past" site, and > Google, you will find the following tale:- > > You will recall that Industry arrived at Melbourne in May 1858. She was put > up for sale in August 1858 but it appears she didn't sell. The suggestion > that she was built of Irish oak, imported to Canada, sounds quite > preposterous *http://tinyurl.com/l3f8hrd . * In September 1858 she was > still in port and a French ship discharged ballast and equipment into her. > She was sold in January 1859 for ?800, and was stated as being "about 23 > years old" (ie built c.1835) see *http://tinyurl.com/nurf4cp .* . The > Argus reported on the 8th January that she had been sold to New Zealand > owners and had been refitted to carry 2000 head of sheep to New Zealand, > where she was intended to be turned into a coal hulk. * > http://tinyurl.com/qdg6wud . *A New Zealand newspaper reported her as > being 700 tons, and referred to her being intended to be hulked at Port > Chalmers (ie Dunedin). Her new owner appears to have been a John Jones. * > http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* <http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b> > > She cleared from Hobsons Bay on 19th January; her master being reported > as "W.R. Stephenson" *http://tinyurl.com/nf2dqm3 * > > Then "The barque *Industry*, bound for Otago, commenced taking in sheep on > Thursday morning (Feb. 3.) alongside the Williamstown Railway Pier, and > completed her loading of 1700 ewes, with which she hauled off before dark". > -*Argus*. *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* > > She sailed on February 6th 1859 for New Zealand. * > http://tinyurl.com/nl87cej* <http://tinyurl.com/nl87cej>* *but ran into > trouble: > > "On sighting Tewaewae's Point, a vessel was observed to be on shore there, > and the steamer [GEELONG] bore down to her assistance. She proved to be > the barque * "Industry,"* from Melbourne to Otago, with sheep, which had > drifted on the rocks in a most dangerous position. With considerable > difficulty the crew were induced to assist in the endeavour to get her off, > which was at length successful, and the * "Industry"* proceeded on her > voyage, not having apparently received any serious damage. But for the > opportune arrival of the steamer, the barque would in all probability have > become a total wreck, as both the captain and crew appeared to be utterly > indifferent as to the result." *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* > > Her consort NORTH STAR, sold at the same time and also intended as a > hulk, ran aground at the New River and sustained considerable damage. * > http://tinyurl.com/**qck2v2b* <http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b>. Which must > raise some question as to whether her owners were actually bothered at all > about whether INDUSTRY arrived or not. > > She arrived at Dunedin on 26th February. "Same day, *Industry*, 487 tons, > Stephen, from Melbourne, via the Bluff, with 1700 sheep, 100 boxes candles, > 766 deals, 700 tons coal, l package harness, and 1 dog cart. Arrived at > 9.20 a.m." *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* > ** > May 7th: "The barque* "Industry"* was run aground at the Bluff. Owner > Jones. Seaman - Barnes" > *http://tinyurl.com/**qck2v2b*<http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b> .She > was turned into a hulk, ie a floating warehouse. > ** > That would normally be about the last one would expect to hear of her. But > no! Twenty years later (1878) the much decayed vessel pops into the > newspapers again. In 1878 Dunedin City Council wanted to turn her into a > floating swimming pool! http://tinyurl.com/pebgma6. This report sums up > her career since 1858, discusses her current condition and the plans for > her, and adds the fact that Industry had been condemned at Melbourne [her > crew having presumably being paid off]. > > However people smelt something fishy going on, not just the reek from the > bilges of the decayed vessel ...was the council paying too much and being > scammed? http://tinyurl.com/qe5kuva. It became a local issue * > http://tinyurl.com/otfjjhd* <http://tinyurl.com/otfjjhd>* *and* > http://tinyurl.com/mz9rgqz*. Suspicions were summed up by the Grey River > Argus report on 27th December "The City Council of Dunedin bought an old > worm eaten hulk called the Industry to turn her into public baths. They > paid ?600 for her and she was valued at ?500. The report of Captain > Russell, Lloyd's agent, on the hulk is short and sweet; it is as follows: > That the Industry has been a ship of 500 tons burthen, American built; he > believes her to be about 50 years of age; he has examined her timber and > found it rotten from top to bottom, and he can put no intrinsic value on > her". http://tinyurl.com/q8o4pc5 > > Despite the Chairman of the Baths committee pressing for an enquiry to > exonerate him, it wasn't voted for http://tinyurl.com/pt7pqbd . It all > sounds very political. A Cllr Fish seems to have been deeply involved but > voted against the inquiry. Or it was. Later in 1879 there does seem to > have been an inquiry after all but it exonerated everyone. * > http://tinyurl.com/mr39hqx . *Some more subtle searching might tease out > more of the tale. > > It is not clear whether Industry was ever converted into public baths, or > whether the Council got their money back. > > Presumably, as the* Otago Daily Times *so graphically put* *it, after that > Industry simply "melted away in her unsavoury bed". > > An interesting tale..... > > Cheers > Piers > > > > > > Piers would you know who bought the INDUSTRY and what became of her? Also > what was the role of the agent T.H. Martin, Forrest and Co were they the > ship owners? Thank you for the reference number to the crew list, the > next time I?m in London, I?ll look it up at the National Archives. > > > > Again, much obliged for all your help. > > > > Best wishes , > > > > Se?n Tapley > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 10:21:05 +1000 From: "J. Fawcett" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [MAR] Mallin - Ship's Carpenter To: <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Sean I have searched the index to Births Deaths and Marriages for the state of Victoria 1836 - 1888. There is only the following MALLIN references, as you will see there is no death for a John Mallin in that era. Also I searched the 1889 - 1901 era, again, no death for a John Mallin. Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Mary Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: John Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Bridget RYAN Age: Sex: F Birth Place: MELBOURNE Death Place: Year: 1842 Reg Number: 445 Denomination: Roman Catholic Parish: St Francis, Melbourne Fiche: 1091 Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Joseph Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Mary DARLING Age: Sex: M Birth Place: MELBOURNE Death Place: Year: 1842 Reg Number: 452 Denomination: Roman Catholic Parish: St Francis, Melbourne Fiche: 1091 Surname: MALLIN Given Names: James Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Agnes Elliott HENDERSON Age: Sex: Birth Place: SEBASTOPOL Death Place: Year: 1867 Reg Number: 24593 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Agnes Elliott Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Agnes ELLIOTT Age: Sex: Birth Place: SEBASTOPOL Death Place: Year: 1869 Reg Number: 5086 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: William Andrew Event: B Spouse Surname/Father: William Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Agnes Elliott HENDERSON Age: Sex: Birth Place: SEBA Death Place: Year: 1875 Reg Number: 5500 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Francis Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 6 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8173 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Elizabeth Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 8 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8174 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Mary Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 1 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8175 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: Margaret Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Arthur Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Eliza Jane MCCUSKEY Age: 3 Sex: Birth Place: BULL Death Place: Year: 1868 Reg Number: 8176 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: George Event: D Spouse Surname/Father: Unknown Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Margaret MALLIN Age: 6M Sex: Birth Place: MELB Death Place: Year: 1874 Reg Number: 8876 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: Surname: MALLIN Given Names: James Event: M Spouse Surname/Father: MAGOVERN Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Elizabeth Age: Sex: M Birth Place: Death Place: Year: 1853 Reg Number: 1617 Denomination: Roman Catholic Parish: St Francis, Melbourne Fiche: 736 Surname: MALLIN Given Names: John Event: M Spouse Surname/Father: CLINE Spouse Gvn Names/Mother: Catherine Age: Sex: M Birth Place: Death Place: Year: 1855 Reg Number: 1523 Denomination: Parish: Fiche: ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 2013 15:24:55 +0930 From: "Joe McMillan" <[email protected]> Subject: [MAR] Clydesite To: <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Is anyone else having problems accessing the ?CLYDESITE? database. I have been trying for a couple of days now to no avail. Any suggestions ?? Joe McMillan, South Australia. ------------------------------ To contact the MARINERS list administrator, send an email to [email protected] To post a message to the MARINERS mailing list, send an email to [email protected] __________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body of the email with no additional text. End of MARINERS Digest, Vol 8, Issue 285 ****************************************

I'm not 100% confident now about my identification of her official number following my digging around in the newspapers, I'll have to think about it as there are some discrepancies, over tonnage etc. However, an interesting story emerges about whatever ship named INDUSTRY made it to Melbourne in 1858. I suggest you have a look through the Australian Newspapers on the Trove site, bearing in mind that there was more than one vessel of that name, and that reporting isn't 100% accurate. If you search "barque industry" in trove and then "hulk industry" in the NZ "Papers Past" site, and Google, you will find the following tale:- You will recall that Industry arrived at Melbourne in May 1858. She was put up for sale in August 1858 but it appears she didn't sell. The suggestion that she was built of Irish oak, imported to Canada, sounds quite preposterous *http://tinyurl.com/l3f8hrd . * In September 1858 she was still in port and a French ship discharged ballast and equipment into her. She was sold in January 1859 for £800, and was stated as being "about 23 years old" (ie built c.1835) see *http://tinyurl.com/nurf4cp .* . The Argus reported on the 8th January that she had been sold to New Zealand owners and had been refitted to carry 2000 head of sheep to New Zealand, where she was intended to be turned into a coal hulk. * http://tinyurl.com/qdg6wud . *A New Zealand newspaper reported her as being 700 tons, and referred to her being intended to be hulked at Port Chalmers (ie Dunedin). Her new owner appears to have been a John Jones. * http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* <http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b> She cleared from Hobsons Bay on 19th January; her master being reported as "W.R. Stephenson" *http://tinyurl.com/nf2dqm3 * Then "The barque *Industry*, bound for Otago, commenced taking in sheep on Thursday morning (Feb. 3.) alongside the Williamstown Railway Pier, and completed her loading of 1700 ewes, with which she hauled off before dark". -*Argus*. *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* She sailed on February 6th 1859 for New Zealand. * http://tinyurl.com/nl87cej* <http://tinyurl.com/nl87cej>* *but ran into trouble: "On sighting Tewaewae's Point, a vessel was observed to be on shore there, and the steamer [GEELONG] bore down to her assistance. She proved to be the barque * "Industry,"* from Melbourne to Otago, with sheep, which had drifted on the rocks in a most dangerous position. With considerable difficulty the crew were induced to assist in the endeavour to get her off, which was at length successful, and the * "Industry"* proceeded on her voyage, not having apparently received any serious damage. But for the opportune arrival of the steamer, the barque would in all probability have become a total wreck, as both the captain and crew appeared to be utterly indifferent as to the result." *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* Her consort NORTH STAR, sold at the same time and also intended as a hulk, ran aground at the New River and sustained considerable damage. * http://tinyurl.com/**qck2v2b* <http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b>. Which must raise some question as to whether her owners were actually bothered at all about whether INDUSTRY arrived or not. She arrived at Dunedin on 26th February. "Same day, *Industry*, 487 tons, Stephen, from Melbourne, via the Bluff, with 1700 sheep, 100 boxes candles, 766 deals, 700 tons coal, l package harness, and 1 dog cart. Arrived at 9.20 a.m." *http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b* ** May 7th: "The barque* "Industry"* was run aground at the Bluff. Owner Jones. Seaman - Barnes" *http://tinyurl.com/**qck2v2b*<http://tinyurl.com/qck2v2b> .She was turned into a hulk, ie a floating warehouse. ** That would normally be about the last one would expect to hear of her. But no! Twenty years later (1878) the much decayed vessel pops into the newspapers again. In 1878 Dunedin City Council wanted to turn her into a floating swimming pool! http://tinyurl.com/pebgma6. This report sums up her career since 1858, discusses her current condition and the plans for her, and adds the fact that Industry had been condemned at Melbourne [her crew having presumably being paid off]. However people smelt something fishy going on, not just the reek from the bilges of the decayed vessel ...was the council paying too much and being scammed? http://tinyurl.com/qe5kuva. It became a local issue * http://tinyurl.com/otfjjhd* <http://tinyurl.com/otfjjhd>* *and* http://tinyurl.com/mz9rgqz*. Suspicions were summed up by the Grey River Argus report on 27th December "The City Council of Dunedin bought an old worm eaten hulk called the Industry to turn her into public baths. They paid £600 for her and she was valued at £500. The report of Captain Russell, Lloyd's agent, on the hulk is short and sweet; it is as follows: That the Industry has been a ship of 500 tons burthen, American built; he believes her to be about 50 years of age; he has examined her timber and found it rotten from top to bottom, and he can put no intrinsic value on her". http://tinyurl.com/q8o4pc5 Despite the Chairman of the Baths committee pressing for an enquiry to exonerate him, it wasn't voted for http://tinyurl.com/pt7pqbd . It all sounds very political. A Cllr Fish seems to have been deeply involved but voted against the inquiry. Or it was. Later in 1879 there does seem to have been an inquiry after all but it exonerated everyone. * http://tinyurl.com/mr39hqx . *Some more subtle searching might tease out more of the tale. It is not clear whether Industry was ever converted into public baths, or whether the Council got their money back. Presumably, as the* Otago Daily Times *so graphically put* *it, after that Industry simply "melted away in her unsavoury bed". An interesting tale..... Cheers Piers Piers would you know who bought the INDUSTRY and what became of her? Also what was the role of the agent T.H. Martin, Forrest and Co were they the ship owners? Thank you for the reference number to the crew list, the next time I’m in London, I’ll look it up at the National Archives. Again, much obliged for all your help. Best wishes , Seán Tapley ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The final instalment of crew details from the Agreement & Account of Crew for Queen of the Bay for her fourth voyage, from London to Table Bay and return. Scans of the documents are available via links at: <http://www.thornburypump.co.uk/Ancestry/QotB.php> http://www.thornburypump.co.uk/Ancestry/QotB.php Name (Age) / Birthplace / Name of last ship / Capacity Frederick C Wale / (37) / Plymouth / Queen of the Bay, Sunderland / Master Henry Coleman / (57) / Kent / Queen of the Bay, Sunderland / Mate William Blakey / (23) / Hull / ????? / 2nd Mate John Thorne / (23) / Dartmouth / First ship / Carpenter Henry George / (23) / London / Caroline Elizabeth, London / Steward James Shirtland / (27) / London / Wellington, London / Cook Thomas Wright / (27) / B'water / Lightning, Liverpool / AB William McCullough / (33) / Liverpool / Queensland, London / AB Charles Parker / (29) / Portland / Nina, London / AB Thomas Baldissen / (25) / Hull / Marchment, Glasgow / AB George Baker / (20) / Bristol / Jade, London / AB Robert Evans / (21) / B'water / Baroness, London / AB Joseph Wale / (15) / Cornwall / Queen of the Bay, Sunderland / Boy Thomas W Blomfield / (18) / Queen of the Bay, Sunderland / Apprentice The documents include dates of joining and discharge, wages, etc. We will be grateful for any corrections to our transcripts and pleased to hear from anyone with links. Best wishes Rosemary Rodliffe Our resources available on-line: <http://www.thornburypump.co.uk/Ancestry/resources.php> http://www.thornburypump.co.uk/Ancestry/resources.php Kelly's Directories of Norfolk and Cambridgeshire 1900 Return of Owners of Land in Norfolk 1873 Newnes Round the Coast 1895 Black's Guides to Cornwall 1879, Gloucestershire 1875 and South Wales 1883 Norfolk photographers details free at <http://www.earlyphotographers.org.uk/> http://www.earlyphotographers.org.uk/

Dear Jenny & Piers, Many thanks for your time and all your research on my behalf. Jenny to answer your question; John Mallin, ships carpenter, was the son of Michael Mallin. I don’t know his mother’s name, I’d be guessing. John was married to Mary Mangan in Dublin in 1848 and they had two sons Michael (1852) and John (1854). Therefore given the birthdates of his children I would think John was on the 1858 voyage. John’s wife died before he went to Australia and his children were reared by their grandparents. John died in Australia, don’t know when or where. I think he has an accident and it may have been something to do with his gold mining activities in the Bendigo area. That’s all I know. Piers would you know who bought the INDUSTRY and what became of her? Also what was the role of the agent T.H. Martin, Forrest and Co were they the ship owners? Thank you for the reference number to the crew list, the next time I’m in London, I’ll look it up at the National Archives. Again, much obliged for all your help. Best wishes , Seán Tapley

Hello Susan, Have you tried the Newcastle Local Studies Library archive?  In the period 1750-1800 they have several newspaper titles, any one of which might well have reported William Ainslie's drowning at Shields.  The Archive holds the Newcastle Advertiser, the Newcastle Courant, and the Newcastle Weekly Chronicle, and they would appear to have all those titles for the period throughout the 1790s, both on microfilm and in bound volumes.  These are very likely to have circulated at South Shields.  See:  http://www.newcastle.gov.uk/wwwfileroot/legacy/libraries/NewspaperfactsheetMarch2011.pdf.  If the accident was reported, the name of his ship will almost certainly appear there, although it may well be a long search. Regards, Peter Klein ________________________________ From: Susan C <[email protected]> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, 15 August 2013, 16:03 Subject: [MAR] Accidental drowning in Shields, Tyne and Wear Hello listers, I may be on the wrong list, but I welcome suggestions to look for possible records of an ancestor who drowned in the river between 1790 - 1798.  He was William Ainsley, b. 1776 in Wooler, Northumberland.  He fell off a plank when he was boarding a ship, in Shields.  There were small boats on the river, possibly fishermen, who tried to reach him but the current was too fast.  Perhaps an article in a local newspaper would be a place to search, but are there other sources of a record for his death?  I don't know where to search for newspapers that existed then - or which library holds newspapers of those years.  Perhaps a Mariner record of accidental drownings?  I am not sure if he was a seaman or traveling at the time, if he was traveling then I would need the ship name to obtain a manifest list. And that is another issue, I do not have details regarding the ship he was boarding.   Are there records of ships anchored in Shields in 1790 - 1798? Thanks to anyone who can point me in the right direction in this incredibly difficult puzzle. Regards, Susan ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message