I have been researching my Dill ancestors, the first being John Dill who came to America in 1659, and was in Talbot Co., MD and their son John Dill who married Sarah and owned a plantation in Murderkill Hundred, DE near Whiteleysburg, MD beginning in 1702. I agree with Stuart that during the 17th and early 18th centuries, the primary mode of transportation in the western part of lower DelMarVA (that nearest to the Chesapeake Bay) was via boats on the rivers. For example, John Dill who came to America in 1659 lived in the area between of what is now Oxford and Easton MD. His son John Dill later bough his own property near the fork of the Choptank and Tuckahoe rivers circa 1700 and later in 1702 to own property in Murderkill Hundred (now Kent Co., DE) which is just a few miles east of the present DE/MD border near Whiteleysburg, MD. If one checks, you will find that the Choptank River is tidal (hence navigable by small ships and boats) up to Greensboro, MD. So too the Nanticoke River is tidal and navigable up to Blades, DE and the Marshyhope Creek tidal and navigable up to Federalsburg, MD. These rivers and creeks were the easiest and fastest way to get the plantation owner's goods to a seaport, do their annual trading and take their new supplies back to their plantations. If one took advantage of the tidal currents he/she could travel between their home and the nearest seaport with considerable goods, minimum labor and in good time. This discussion has been one of the best on this web site over many years. With love in Christ, George D. Dill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stuart Bechman" <sbechman@sbcglobal.net> To: <lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 6:38 PM Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 + general migrations - Broad Creek) Not sure if this might be the explanation you are seeking, but I just recently found a 1998 PhD dissertation paper on-line about the lower Delmarva peninsula, especially Sussex County, Delaware being a hotbed of Loyalist "Tory" support for the British as the Revolutionary War broke out: http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/obj/s4/f2/dsk1/tape11/PQDD_0003/NQ41532.pdf It could be that when war broke out, those who favored staying with Britain joined their compatriots in lower DelMarVa (or perhaps the revolutionaries invaded to secure the land for the US?) This is also the source where I learned that transportation in the lower Delmarva was by boats, not by road. -Stuart Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2013 16:06:06 -0500 (EST) From: ARHGenealogy@aol.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 + general migrations - Broad Creek) Slightly off track (but not too far, I hope): In History of Delaware, Scharf says about Broad Creek Hundred: "The Penns never exercised their authority in this hundred prior to the settlement of the division line, and there does not appear of record any mention of any land granted by them prior to 1776. There were very few settlements made in the hundred prior to 1730, and those mainly on the streams in the southwestern section. Large portions of the land remained vacant for years, and it was not until the year 1838 that the last piece of vacant land in the hundred was granted. The early settlers came from Maryland and Virginia, and in the year 1776 large numbers emigrated from the upper part of the State and from Pennsylvania." I haven't found any other source that talks of a migration "from the upper part of the State and from Pennsylvania" to Broad Creek in 1776. Does anyone have any info on that? What would be the reason--escaping the revolution, cheap land, religion, or something else? Andrew H. *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Sent from my Verizon Wireless Phone Jane McDonnell <jdmcdonnell@comcast.net> wrote: >Joe, > > > >This comment from the Familysearch.org page on emmigration to DELAWARE made me think that Baltimore was more of a final destination. > >> http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/m/c/i/Donald-L-McIlvain/GENE1-0003.html > >> The Delaware River brought the original European settlers to Delaware. For more than three centuries it served as a waterway connecting many Delaware towns to each other and to Philadelphia. >> >> A frequently used land migration route was from Philadelphia to Wilmington and then on to Baltimore. >> > >But I know from my own families of Delaware that there was no land migration over time, but there was movement up and down the coast. In my case original settlers from DelMarVa moved to Philadelphia and Chester County PA. Since Lewes and Philly were the main ports for quite some time, there may have been some adventurers flowing southerly also from Philly to Lewes. > >This might be a place for you to look for your coastal Hopkins family near Lewes. > >Jane >*************************************** >QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Joe, This comment from the Familysearch.org page on emmigration to DELAWARE made me think that Baltimore was more of a final destination. > http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/m/c/i/Donald-L-McIlvain/GENE1-0003.html > The Delaware River brought the original European settlers to Delaware. For more than three centuries it served as a waterway connecting many Delaware towns to each other and to Philadelphia. > > A frequently used land migration route was from Philadelphia to Wilmington and then on to Baltimore. > But I know from my own families of Delaware that there was no land migration over time, but there was movement up and down the coast. In my case original settlers from DelMarVa moved to Philadelphia and Chester County PA. Since Lewes and Philly were the main ports for quite some time, there may have been some adventurers flowing southerly also from Philly to Lewes. This might be a place for you to look for your coastal Hopkins family near Lewes. Jane

Not sure if this might be the explanation you are seeking, but I just recently found a 1998 PhD dissertation paper on-line about the lower Delmarva peninsula, especially Sussex County, Delaware being a hotbed of Loyalist "Tory" support for the British as the Revolutionary War broke out: http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/obj/s4/f2/dsk1/tape11/PQDD_0003/NQ41532.pdf It could be that when war broke out, those who favored staying with Britain joined their compatriots in lower DelMarVa (or perhaps the revolutionaries invaded to secure the land for the US?) This is also the source where I learned that transportation in the lower Delmarva was by boats, not by road. -Stuart Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2013 16:06:06 -0500 (EST) From: ARHGenealogy@aol.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 + general migrations - Broad     Creek) Slightly off track (but not too far, I hope): In History of  Delaware, Scharf says about Broad Creek Hundred: "The Penns never exercised their  authority in this hundred prior to the settlement of the division line, and  there does not appear of record any mention of any land granted by them prior to  1776. There were very few settlements made in the hundred prior to 1730, and  those mainly on the streams in the southwestern section. Large portions of the  land remained vacant for years, and it was not until the year 1838 that the last  piece of vacant land in the hundred was granted. The early settlers came from  Maryland and Virginia, and in the year 1776 large numbers emigrated  from the upper part of the State and from Pennsylvania."  I haven't found any other source that talks of a  migration "from the upper part of the State and from Pennsylvania" to  Broad Creek in 1776. Does anyone have any info on that? What would be the  reason--escaping the revolution, cheap land, religion, or something  else? Andrew H.

I was able to find a drawn layout of the family's Franklin County property online. There seems to be quite a bit available online now, but whether any of the Delaware records have been digitized, I can't say. Cindy -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Barb Holmes Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 5:38 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Well Jim, in my case I'm talking about a visit made in 1991 :-( We found the actual drawn layout of the original lot. As I remember, I had written to the Archives and someone there actually found the deed and drawn layout, copied it and sent it to me for a charge. When I was able to go to see what else they might have, no one on the staff at the time was able to point me to anything specific, other than I think an Index on microfilm and the suggestion I read Munger's 240 page book, which "would answer all the questions I might have." I found nothing of help on that visit. >From Munger's Acknowledgments of her book, she states: "...the Green >Books and many boxes of historically valuable land records retrieved from storage in the attic of the capitol building. The two and one-half years [1986-1989] that I have spent as final chief of the Division of Land Records have afforded me the opportunity to study the documentation in depth.... The archival background of the GUIDE is the body of land records in the Pennsylvania State Archives ...from before Pennsylvania became a colony to the present. In the late 1950s the Bureau of Land Records undertook an overall records management program, which included a complete inventory, lamination, and microfilming. For some reason, the projected publication of a catalog or guide to the records failed to happen. Twenty years later, [1978] when attempting to use the documents for historical research, I more than once noticed the absence of any type of finding aid available for public use. ...It is intended that this GUIDE will benefit the public as much as the staff and will form the bibliographic base for my projected study of land policy and politics in Pennsylvania." -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim Moore Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 1:57 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Thank you, Cindy. My wife's family is from Franklin Co. I married her anyway. :-). Sent from iPhone > On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, "Cindy and David Steinhoff" <cdsteinhoff@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that > discusses land records housed in the PA State Archives: > http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed > and does refer readers often to Munger's book. > > Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of > land records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one > folder for Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative > portion of this page to understand how records are stored and organized. > > I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in > Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From > about > 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were > in Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A > few family members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the > 1850s and 1860s. > Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family > was there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it > took some time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries > to filter down to the residents who were affected. The original land > grant to the family occurred through William Penn's organization in > the early 1770s, and I was able to trace much of this through the land > records at the Pennsylvania State Archives. I found quite a bit > online, though would like to visit the > archives in person one day, in case there is more there. > > Cindy in Maryland > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim > Moore > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. > > Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take > the time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know > you told us about the book that explains the history of the records. > I'm asking about the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and > exactly what one asks to see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can get! > > Thank you, kindly. > > Jim Moore > > >> On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> wrote: >> >> When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original >> Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had >> just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide >> for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and >> help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land >> record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. >> Also this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to >> re-register the deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father >> Robert Holmes died. >> Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. >> The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. >> How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time >> to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of >> Joseph Lake >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM >> To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your >> material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same >> specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; >> Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. >> >> I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great >> interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald >> Hopkins >> (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New >> Castle Co, >> DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle >> and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show >> that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. >> >> With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails >> one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) >> to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these >> facts, how would you use them to proceed? >> >> Joe Lake >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jane McDonnell >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jim, >> >> Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, >> Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in >> question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, >> part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see >> my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern >> counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working >> extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too >> would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex >> (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest >> county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, >> MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon >> line was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by >> Maryland throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have >> had a fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town >> straddling the county line (Milford north and south). I have family >> (Hazzard) in the Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in >> Broadkill/ln Hundred who didn't know the county or the state they >> lived in during their lives. >> Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and >> one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have >> history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the >> last 58 years of his life. >> >> As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the >> lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or >> province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer >> than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I >> imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the >> Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which >> I have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until >> statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after that? >> >> I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political >> history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history >> document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, >> I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing >> as a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity >> that DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much >> misinterpretation!). >> >> I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my >> "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have >> collected this information to add to my notes from the easily >> attainable "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") >> >> That portion of my notes follows: >> >> BROADCREEK HUNDRED >> Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest >> colonial group from: >> 1) Accomac Shire (1634) >> became Northampton (1642) >> Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the >> south >> (1663) >> Accomac became Accomack in (1940) >> 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. >> >> First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke >> Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now stands. >> The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, >> Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were >> Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns >> associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. >> >> LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED >> Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD >> with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border >> dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good >> chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will >> list > MD. >> >> Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and >> Sussex Co. >> For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but >> records for Kent should be double checked >> >> beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became >> known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in >> folder from church records as "evidence" >> >> See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. >> >> The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe >> most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called >> "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with >> different boundaries, from at least 1721. >> >> Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so >> virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac >> County > VA. >> Original >> settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish >> Prespyterians >> >> Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA >> or MD. >> It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. >> >> see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of >> William Penn's land grant. >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg >> And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to >> as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD >> or VA. >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Sorry, didn't mean for this to go to the list. -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Cindy and David Steinhoff Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 5:30 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 It was Cindy who asked where you were from <grin!> The members of my family who were from Franklin County lived in the northern part of the county, way north of Waynesboro. They were in the Amberson Valley and my 6x-great-grandfather was the minister at Upper Path Valley Presbyterian Church from the early 1770s through 1790 when he died. The family moved west from Franklin County a generation later and settled in Westmoreland County, Pennsylvania, which is where I am from. I now live near Annapolis in Maryland, and know Salisbury fairly well. Cindy -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of lenorah123@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 4:27 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 HEY JIM, WE NIVED FROM SALISBURY, MD TO WAYNESBORO, PA 3 YEARS AGO. WHENEVER I TELL STRANGERS WE MOVED FROM SALISBURY THEY WANT TO KNOW WHY WE LEFT THERE FOR HERE. BUT WE LOVE IT UP HERE. NORAH HASTINGS COLLINS HASTINGS, RUARKS, CALLAWAYS, TAYLORS ETC. AND THE YORK CO., PA COOPERS -----Original Message----- From: Jim Moore Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 2:57 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Thank you, Cindy. My wife's family is from Franklin Co. I married her anyway. :-). Sent from iPhone > On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, "Cindy and David Steinhoff" > <cdsteinhoff@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that > discusses land records housed in the PA State Archives: > http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed > and does refer readers often to Munger's book. > > Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of > land records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one > folder for Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative > portion of this page to understand how records are stored and > organized. > > I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in > Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From > about > 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were > in Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A > few family members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the > 1850s and 1860s. > Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family > was there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it > took some time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries > to filter down to the residents who were affected. The original land > grant to the family occurred through William Penn's organization in > the early 1770s, and I was able to trace much of this through the land > records at the Pennsylvania State Archives. I found quite a bit > online, though would like to visit the archives in person one day, in > case there is more there. > > Cindy in Maryland > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim > Moore > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. > > Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take > the time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know > you told us about the book that explains the history of the records. > I'm asking about the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and > exactly what one asks to see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can > get! > > Thank you, kindly. > > Jim Moore > > >> On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> >> wrote: >> >> When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original >> Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had >> just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide >> for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and >> help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land >> record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. >> Also this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to >> re-register the deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father >> Robert Holmes died. >> Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. >> The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. >> How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time >> to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of >> Joseph Lake >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM >> To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your >> material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same >> specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; >> Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. >> >> I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great >> interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald >> Hopkins >> (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New >> Castle Co, >> DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle >> and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show >> that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. >> >> With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails >> one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) >> to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these >> facts, how would you use them to proceed? >> >> Joe Lake >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jane McDonnell >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jim, >> >> Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, >> Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in >> question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, >> part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see >> my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern >> counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working >> extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too >> would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex >> (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest >> county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, >> MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon >> line was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by >> Maryland throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have >> had a fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town >> straddling the county line (Milford north and south). I have family >> (Hazzard) in the Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in >> Broadkill/ln Hundred who didn't know the county or the state they >> lived in during their lives. >> Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and >> one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have >> history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the >> last 58 years of his life. >> >> As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the >> lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or >> province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer >> than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I >> imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the >> Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which >> I have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until >> statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after >> that? >> >> I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political >> history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history >> document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, >> I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing >> as a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity >> that DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much >> misinterpretation!). >> >> I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my >> "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have >> collected this information to add to my notes from the easily >> attainable "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") >> >> That portion of my notes follows: >> >> BROADCREEK HUNDRED >> Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest >> colonial group from: >> 1) Accomac Shire (1634) >> became Northampton (1642) >> Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the >> south >> (1663) >> Accomac became Accomack in (1940) >> 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. >> >> First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke >> Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now >> stands. >> The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, >> Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were >> Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns >> associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. >> >> LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED >> Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD >> with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border >> dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good >> chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will >> list > MD. >> >> Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and >> Sussex Co. >> For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but >> records for Kent should be double checked >> >> beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became >> known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in >> folder from church records as "evidence" >> >> See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. >> >> The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe >> most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called >> "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with >> different boundaries, from at least 1721. >> >> Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so >> virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac >> County > VA. >> Original >> settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish >> Prespyterians >> >> Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA >> or MD. >> It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. >> >> see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of >> William Penn's land grant. >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg >> And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to >> as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD >> or VA. >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

It was Cindy who asked where you were from <grin!> The members of my family who were from Franklin County lived in the northern part of the county, way north of Waynesboro. They were in the Amberson Valley and my 6x-great-grandfather was the minister at Upper Path Valley Presbyterian Church from the early 1770s through 1790 when he died. The family moved west from Franklin County a generation later and settled in Westmoreland County, Pennsylvania, which is where I am from. I now live near Annapolis in Maryland, and know Salisbury fairly well. Cindy -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of lenorah123@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 4:27 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 HEY JIM, WE NIVED FROM SALISBURY, MD TO WAYNESBORO, PA 3 YEARS AGO. WHENEVER I TELL STRANGERS WE MOVED FROM SALISBURY THEY WANT TO KNOW WHY WE LEFT THERE FOR HERE. BUT WE LOVE IT UP HERE. NORAH HASTINGS COLLINS HASTINGS, RUARKS, CALLAWAYS, TAYLORS ETC. AND THE YORK CO., PA COOPERS -----Original Message----- From: Jim Moore Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 2:57 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Thank you, Cindy. My wife's family is from Franklin Co. I married her anyway. :-). Sent from iPhone > On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, "Cindy and David Steinhoff" > <cdsteinhoff@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that > discusses land records housed in the PA State Archives: > http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed > and does refer readers often to Munger's book. > > Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of > land records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one > folder for Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative > portion of this page to understand how records are stored and > organized. > > I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in > Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From > about > 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were > in Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A > few family members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the > 1850s and 1860s. > Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family > was there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it > took some time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries > to filter down to the residents who were affected. The original land > grant to the family occurred through William Penn's organization in > the early 1770s, and I was able to trace much of this through the land > records at the Pennsylvania State Archives. I found quite a bit > online, though would like to visit the archives in person one day, in > case there is more there. > > Cindy in Maryland > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim > Moore > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. > > Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take > the time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know > you told us about the book that explains the history of the records. > I'm asking about the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and > exactly what one asks to see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can > get! > > Thank you, kindly. > > Jim Moore > > >> On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> >> wrote: >> >> When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original >> Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had >> just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide >> for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and >> help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land >> record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. >> Also this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to >> re-register the deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. >> Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. >> The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. >> How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time >> to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of >> Joseph Lake >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM >> To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your >> material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same >> specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; >> Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. >> >> I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great >> interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald >> Hopkins >> (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New >> Castle Co, >> DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle >> and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show >> that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. >> >> With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails >> one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) >> to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these >> facts, how would you use them to proceed? >> >> Joe Lake >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jane McDonnell >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jim, >> >> Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, >> Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in >> question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, >> part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see >> my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern >> counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working >> extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too >> would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex >> (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest >> county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, >> MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon >> line was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by >> Maryland throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have >> had a fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town >> straddling the county line (Milford north and south). I have family >> (Hazzard) in the Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in >> Broadkill/ln Hundred who didn't know the county or the state they lived in during their lives. >> Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and >> one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have >> history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the >> last 58 years of his life. >> >> As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the >> lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or >> province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer >> than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I >> imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the >> Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which >> I have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until >> statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after >> that? >> >> I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political >> history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history >> document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, >> I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing >> as a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity >> that DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much >> misinterpretation!). >> >> I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my >> "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have >> collected this information to add to my notes from the easily >> attainable "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") >> >> That portion of my notes follows: >> >> BROADCREEK HUNDRED >> Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest >> colonial group from: >> 1) Accomac Shire (1634) >> became Northampton (1642) >> Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the >> south >> (1663) >> Accomac became Accomack in (1940) >> 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. >> >> First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke >> Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now >> stands. >> The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, >> Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were >> Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns >> associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. >> >> LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED >> Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD >> with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border >> dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good >> chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will >> list > MD. >> >> Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and >> Sussex Co. >> For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but >> records for Kent should be double checked >> >> beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became >> known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in >> folder from church records as "evidence" >> >> See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. >> >> The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe >> most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called >> "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with >> different boundaries, from at least 1721. >> >> Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so >> virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac >> County > VA. >> Original >> settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish >> Prespyterians >> >> Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA >> or MD. >> It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. >> >> see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of >> William Penn's land grant. >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg >> And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to >> as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD >> or VA. >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Well Jim, in my case I'm talking about a visit made in 1991 :-( We found the actual drawn layout of the original lot. As I remember, I had written to the Archives and someone there actually found the deed and drawn layout, copied it and sent it to me for a charge. When I was able to go to see what else they might have, no one on the staff at the time was able to point me to anything specific, other than I think an Index on microfilm and the suggestion I read Munger's 240 page book, which "would answer all the questions I might have." I found nothing of help on that visit. >From Munger's Acknowledgments of her book, she states: "...the Green Books and many boxes of historically valuable land records retrieved from storage in the attic of the capitol building. The two and one-half years [1986-1989] that I have spent as final chief of the Division of Land Records have afforded me the opportunity to study the documentation in depth.... The archival background of the GUIDE is the body of land records in the Pennsylvania State Archives ...from before Pennsylvania became a colony to the present. In the late 1950s the Bureau of Land Records undertook an overall records management program, which included a complete inventory, lamination, and microfilming. For some reason, the projected publication of a catalog or guide to the records failed to happen. Twenty years later, [1978] when attempting to use the documents for historical research, I more than once noticed the absence of any type of finding aid available for public use. ...It is intended that this GUIDE will benefit the public as much as the staff and will form the bibliographic base for my projected study of land policy and politics in Pennsylvania." -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim Moore Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 1:57 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Thank you, Cindy. My wife's family is from Franklin Co. I married her anyway. :-). Sent from iPhone > On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, "Cindy and David Steinhoff" <cdsteinhoff@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that > discusses land records housed in the PA State Archives: > http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed > and does refer readers often to Munger's book. > > Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of > land records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one > folder for Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative > portion of this page to understand how records are stored and organized. > > I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in > Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From > about > 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were > in Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A > few family members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the 1850s and 1860s. > Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family > was there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it > took some time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries > to filter down to the residents who were affected. The original land > grant to the family occurred through William Penn's organization in > the early 1770s, and I was able to trace much of this through the land > records at the Pennsylvania State Archives. I found quite a bit online, though would like to visit the > archives in person one day, in case there is more there. > > Cindy in Maryland > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim > Moore > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. > > Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take > the time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know > you told us about the book that explains the history of the records. > I'm asking about the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and > exactly what one asks to see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can get! > > Thank you, kindly. > > Jim Moore > > >> On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> wrote: >> >> When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original >> Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had >> just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide >> for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and >> help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land >> record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. >> Also this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to >> re-register the deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. >> Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. >> The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. >> How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time >> to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of >> Joseph Lake >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM >> To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your >> material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same >> specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; >> Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. >> >> I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great >> interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald >> Hopkins >> (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New >> Castle Co, >> DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle >> and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show >> that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. >> >> With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails >> one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) >> to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these >> facts, how would you use them to proceed? >> >> Joe Lake >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jane McDonnell >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jim, >> >> Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, >> Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in >> question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, >> part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see >> my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern >> counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working >> extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too >> would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex >> (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest >> county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, >> MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon >> line was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by >> Maryland throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have >> had a fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town >> straddling the county line (Milford north and south). I have family >> (Hazzard) in the Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in >> Broadkill/ln Hundred who didn't know the county or the state they lived in during their lives. >> Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and >> one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have >> history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the >> last 58 years of his life. >> >> As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the >> lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or >> province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer >> than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I >> imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the >> Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which >> I have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until >> statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after that? >> >> I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political >> history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history >> document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, >> I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing >> as a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity >> that DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much >> misinterpretation!). >> >> I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my >> "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have >> collected this information to add to my notes from the easily >> attainable "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") >> >> That portion of my notes follows: >> >> BROADCREEK HUNDRED >> Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest >> colonial group from: >> 1) Accomac Shire (1634) >> became Northampton (1642) >> Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the >> south >> (1663) >> Accomac became Accomack in (1940) >> 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. >> >> First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke >> Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now stands. >> The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, >> Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were >> Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns >> associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. >> >> LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED >> Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD >> with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border >> dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good >> chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will >> list > MD. >> >> Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and Sussex Co. >> For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but >> records for Kent should be double checked >> >> beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became >> known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in >> folder from church records as "evidence" >> >> See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. >> >> The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe >> most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called >> "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with >> different boundaries, from at least 1721. >> >> Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so >> virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac >> County > VA. >> Original >> settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish >> Prespyterians >> >> Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA or MD. >> It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. >> >> see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of >> William Penn's land grant. >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg >> And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to >> as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD >> or VA. >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

HEY JIM, WE NIVED FROM SALISBURY, MD TO WAYNESBORO, PA 3 YEARS AGO. WHENEVER I TELL STRANGERS WE MOVED FROM SALISBURY THEY WANT TO KNOW WHY WE LEFT THERE FOR HERE. BUT WE LOVE IT UP HERE. NORAH HASTINGS COLLINS HASTINGS, RUARKS, CALLAWAYS, TAYLORS ETC. AND THE YORK CO., PA COOPERS -----Original Message----- From: Jim Moore Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 2:57 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Thank you, Cindy. My wife's family is from Franklin Co. I married her anyway. :-). Sent from iPhone > On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, "Cindy and David Steinhoff" > <cdsteinhoff@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that > discusses > land records housed in the PA State Archives: > http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed and > does refer readers often to Munger's book. > > Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of > land > records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one folder for > Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative portion of this > page to understand how records are stored and organized. > > I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in > Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From about > 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were in > Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A few > family > members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the 1850s and 1860s. > Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family was > there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it took some > time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries to filter down > to the residents who were affected. The original land grant to the family > occurred through William Penn's organization in the early 1770s, and I was > able to trace much of this through the land records at the Pennsylvania > State Archives. I found quite a bit online, though would like to visit > the > archives in person one day, in case there is more there. > > Cindy in Maryland > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim Moore > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. > > Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take the > time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know you told > us > about the book that explains the history of the records. I'm asking about > the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and exactly what one asks to > see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can get! > > Thank you, kindly. > > Jim Moore > > >> On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> >> wrote: >> >> When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original >> Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had >> just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide >> for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and >> help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land >> record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. Also >> this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to re-register the >> deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. >> Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. >> The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. >> How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time >> to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joseph >> Lake >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM >> To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your >> material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same >> specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; >> Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. >> >> I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great >> interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald >> Hopkins >> (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New >> Castle Co, >> DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle >> and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show >> that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. >> >> With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails >> one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) >> to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these >> facts, how would you use them to proceed? >> >> Joe Lake >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jane McDonnell >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jim, >> >> Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, >> Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in >> question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, >> part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see >> my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern >> counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working >> extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too >> would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex >> (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest >> county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, >> MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon line >> was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by Maryland >> throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have had a >> fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town straddling the >> county line (Milford north and south). I have family (Hazzard) in the >> Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in Broadkill/ln Hundred who >> didn't know the county or the state they lived in during their lives. >> Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and >> one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have >> history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the >> last 58 years of his life. >> >> As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the >> lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or >> province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer >> than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I >> imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the >> Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which I >> have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until >> statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after >> that? >> >> I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political >> history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history >> document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, >> I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing as >> a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity that >> DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much >> misinterpretation!). >> >> I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my >> "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have collected >> this information to add to my notes from the easily attainable >> "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") >> >> That portion of my notes follows: >> >> BROADCREEK HUNDRED >> Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest >> colonial group from: >> 1) Accomac Shire (1634) >> became Northampton (1642) >> Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the >> south >> (1663) >> Accomac became Accomack in (1940) >> 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. >> >> First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke >> Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now >> stands. >> The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, >> Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were >> Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns >> associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. >> >> LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED >> Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD >> with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border >> dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good >> chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will list > MD. >> >> Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and Sussex >> Co. >> For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but >> records for Kent should be double checked >> >> beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became >> known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in >> folder from church records as "evidence" >> >> See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. >> >> The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe >> most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called >> "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with >> different boundaries, from at least 1721. >> >> Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so >> virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac County > VA. >> Original >> settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish Prespyterians >> >> Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA or >> MD. >> It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. >> >> see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of >> William Penn's land grant. >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg >> And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to >> as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD >> or VA. >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Slightly off track (but not too far, I hope): In History of Delaware, Scharf says about Broad Creek Hundred: "The Penns never exercised their authority in this hundred prior to the settlement of the division line, and there does not appear of record any mention of any land granted by them prior to 1776. There were very few settlements made in the hundred prior to 1730, and those mainly on the streams in the southwestern section. Large portions of the land remained vacant for years, and it was not until the year 1838 that the last piece of vacant land in the hundred was granted. The early settlers came from Maryland and Virginia, and in the year 1776 large numbers emigrated from the upper part of the State and from Pennsylvania." I haven't found any other source that talks of a migration "from the upper part of the State and from Pennsylvania" to Broad Creek in 1776. Does anyone have any info on that? What would be the reason--escaping the revolution, cheap land, religion, or something else? Andrew H. In a message dated 11/24/2013 3:08:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jdmcdonnell@comcast.net writes: Joe, Stuart's thoughts made me do some googling to see if I could find other "ways in" to Broadkiln Hundred than just Accomac, Somerset and Philadelphia. One place I never spent anytime looking at was Baltimore. I want to keep looking at this way of using what we know of the land and migration patterns to see what happens. I did this in Western NY and had the time of my life researching! One thing I came across was the following website for a Hopkins family including an Archibald and John Hopkins in slightly different generations than yours, but perhaps they were related your family. This Hopkins family migrated from Albany to Baltimore. Then sons moved on to Virginia and Ohio. They were Scots-Irish, on a quick read probably Presbyterian. So they fit the "type" for settlers who arrived in Broadkiln Hundred. http://veaches.net/abbott/hopkins_story.html Jane *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Joe You may already have this, I found it while searching for my Hazzard family in this line at Broadkiln, and I thought I'd search for you too. It doesn't help your quest to go further back in history, but I wanted to post it before I forgot about it. from this website: http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/m/c/i/Donald-L-McIlvain/GENE1-0003.html > Deed Book M, No. 12, p. 458, Sussex Co., DE. > 5 Aug 1782. Deed. Between Archibald Hopkins of Sussex Co. and wife Prudence and William Peery, Sussex Co. Tract in Broadkiln Hundred, 200 acres, being part of a larger tract granted by patent dated 2nd of 2nd month 1686 to William Clark for 800 acres called Mill Plantation which 200 acres aforesaid the said William Clark by deed of sale conveyed to Mathew Ozburn who conveyed it to Thomas Bedwell and Honer Bedwell his wife which they by deed of sale conveyed to William Clark son of William Clark who conveyed same to John Fisher and he by deed of sale conveyed to Enoch Commings and Enoch Commings and Hannah his wife conveyed the same to Robert Smith who dying indebted to sundry persons the 200 acres was sold for payment of debt and conveyed by Ryves Holt and John Neill, exrs. of Robert Smith to James McIlvain who devised the same to his son David McIlvain who died intestate and the above Archibald Hopkins who married his eldest daughter the above named Prudence preferred a petition to the Orphans Court to make partition of the said 200 acres among the several heirs but the five freeholders appointed to divide the land reported that the land would not admit of being divided and a valuation was made. Beginning at a corner oak in Coolspring Branch; County Road leading to the town of Lewes; Scudder's line. 2 parcels of 213 and 18 acres, for 500 pounds. Wit: James Vent, Samuel Hudson. Ackn. 7 Aug 1782.

Joe, Stuart's thoughts made me do some googling to see if I could find other "ways in" to Broadkiln Hundred than just Accomac, Somerset and Philadelphia. One place I never spent anytime looking at was Baltimore. I want to keep looking at this way of using what we know of the land and migration patterns to see what happens. I did this in Western NY and had the time of my life researching! One thing I came across was the following website for a Hopkins family including an Archibald and John Hopkins in slightly different generations than yours, but perhaps they were related your family. This Hopkins family migrated from Albany to Baltimore. Then sons moved on to Virginia and Ohio. They were Scots-Irish, on a quick read probably Presbyterian. So they fit the "type" for settlers who arrived in Broadkiln Hundred. http://veaches.net/abbott/hopkins_story.html Jane

Thank you, Cindy. My wife's family is from Franklin Co. I married her anyway. :-). Sent from iPhone > On Nov 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, "Cindy and David Steinhoff" <cdsteinhoff@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that discusses > land records housed in the PA State Archives: > http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed and > does refer readers often to Munger's book. > > Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of land > records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one folder for > Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative portion of this > page to understand how records are stored and organized. > > I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in > Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From about > 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were in > Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A few family > members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the 1850s and 1860s. > Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family was > there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it took some > time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries to filter down > to the residents who were affected. The original land grant to the family > occurred through William Penn's organization in the early 1770s, and I was > able to trace much of this through the land records at the Pennsylvania > State Archives. I found quite a bit online, though would like to visit the > archives in person one day, in case there is more there. > > Cindy in Maryland > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim Moore > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. > > Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take the > time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know you told us > about the book that explains the history of the records. I'm asking about > the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and exactly what one asks to > see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can get! > > Thank you, kindly. > > Jim Moore > > >> On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> wrote: >> >> When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original >> Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had >> just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide >> for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and >> help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land >> record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. Also >> this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to re-register the >> deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. >> Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. >> The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. >> How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time >> to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joseph >> Lake >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM >> To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your >> material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same >> specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; >> Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. >> >> I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great >> interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald >> Hopkins >> (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New >> Castle Co, >> DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle >> and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show >> that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. >> >> With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails >> one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) >> to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these >> facts, how would you use them to proceed? >> >> Joe Lake >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jane McDonnell >> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 >> >> Jim, >> >> Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, >> Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in >> question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, >> part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see >> my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern >> counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working >> extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too >> would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex >> (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest >> county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, >> MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon line >> was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by Maryland >> throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have had a >> fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town straddling the >> county line (Milford north and south). I have family (Hazzard) in the >> Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in Broadkill/ln Hundred who >> didn't know the county or the state they lived in during their lives. >> Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and >> one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have >> history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the >> last 58 years of his life. >> >> As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the >> lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or >> province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer >> than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I >> imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the >> Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which I >> have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until >> statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after that? >> >> I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political >> history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history >> document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, >> I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing as >> a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity that >> DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much >> misinterpretation!). >> >> I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my >> "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have collected >> this information to add to my notes from the easily attainable >> "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") >> >> That portion of my notes follows: >> >> BROADCREEK HUNDRED >> Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest >> colonial group from: >> 1) Accomac Shire (1634) >> became Northampton (1642) >> Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the >> south >> (1663) >> Accomac became Accomack in (1940) >> 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. >> >> First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke >> Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now stands. >> The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, >> Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were >> Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns >> associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. >> >> LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED >> Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD >> with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border >> dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good >> chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will list > MD. >> >> Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and Sussex Co. >> For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but >> records for Kent should be double checked >> >> beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became >> known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in >> folder from church records as "evidence" >> >> See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. >> >> The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe >> most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called >> "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with >> different boundaries, from at least 1721. >> >> Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so >> virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac County > VA. >> Original >> settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish Prespyterians >> >> Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA or MD. >> It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. >> >> see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of >> William Penn's land grant. >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg >> And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset >> http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to >> as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD >> or VA. >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> *************************************** >> QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? >> Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: >> http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I'm not Barbara <grin>, but I can refer you to this web page that discusses land records housed in the PA State Archives: http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/rg/rg17.htm . It's quite detailed and does refer readers often to Munger's book. Once you move past the narrative, you'll see a listing of the types of land records housed at the archives, and it includes at least one folder for Delaware counties. It's important to read the narrative portion of this page to understand how records are stored and organized. I am originally from Western Pennsylvania and know exactly where in Westmoreland County my family lived from about 1830 or so on. From about 1770 until then, when the first family members moved west, they were in Franklin County, Pennsylvania, north of Hagerstown, Maryland. A few family members remained in Franklin until their deaths in the 1850s and 1860s. Franklin was part of 2 other counties over the years that my family was there, making it a challenge to find records. It seems like it took some time for the knowledge of a change in the county boundaries to filter down to the residents who were affected. The original land grant to the family occurred through William Penn's organization in the early 1770s, and I was able to trace much of this through the land records at the Pennsylvania State Archives. I found quite a bit online, though would like to visit the archives in person one day, in case there is more there. Cindy in Maryland -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jim Moore Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2013 12:23 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take the time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know you told us about the book that explains the history of the records. I'm asking about the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and exactly what one asks to see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can get! Thank you, kindly. Jim Moore On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> wrote: > When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original > Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had > just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide > for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and > help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land > record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. Also > this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to re-register the > deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. > Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. > The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. > How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time > to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joseph > Lake > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your > material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same > specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; > Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. > > I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great > interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald > Hopkins > (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New > Castle Co, > DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle > and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show > that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. > > With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails > one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) > to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these > facts, how would you use them to proceed? > > Joe Lake > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jane McDonnell > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Jim, > > Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, > Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in > question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, > part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see > my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern > counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working > extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too > would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex > (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest > county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, > MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon line > was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by Maryland > throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have had a > fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town straddling the > county line (Milford north and south). I have family (Hazzard) in the > Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in Broadkill/ln Hundred who > didn't know the county or the state they lived in during their lives. > Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and > one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have > history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the > last 58 years of his life. > > As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the > lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or > province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer > than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I > imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the > Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which I > have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until > statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after that? > > I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political > history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history > document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, > I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing as > a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity that > DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much > misinterpretation!). > > I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my > "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have collected > this information to add to my notes from the easily attainable > "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") > > That portion of my notes follows: > > BROADCREEK HUNDRED > Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest > colonial group from: > 1) Accomac Shire (1634) > became Northampton (1642) > Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the > south > (1663) > Accomac became Accomack in (1940) > 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. > > First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke > Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now stands. > The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, > Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were > Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns > associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. > > LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED > Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD > with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border > dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good > chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will list MD. > > Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and Sussex Co. > For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but > records for Kent should be double checked > > beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became > known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in > folder from church records as "evidence" > > See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. > > The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe > most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called > "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with > different boundaries, from at least 1721. > > Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so > virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac County VA. > Original > settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish Prespyterians > > Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA or MD. > It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. > > see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of > William Penn's land grant. > http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg > http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg > And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset > http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to > as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD > or VA. > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Jane: You're on target with the details below. I don't know in what form you found them, but they stem from the book "A Chapter of Hopkins Genealogy" published in 1905 by Ella Warren Harrison. Archibald & John are, as you said, one generation later than the generation where I have my "Brick Wall". They ultimately settled in Rockingham Co, VA and from there to the Middle West in later generations. It is a related line & I have DNA tested a living descendant. I could never find them in the Baltimore area and if you have info showing they actually did "stop" there I would appreciate getting the sources, records where you found them. In any event, thanks for your response and comments. Joe Lake Jane McDonnell wrote: Joe, Stuart's thoughts made me do some googling to see if I could find other "ways in" to Broadkiln Hundred than just Accomac, Somerset and Philadelphia. One place I never spent anytime looking at was Baltimore. I want to keep looking at this way of using what we know of the land and migration patterns to see what happens. I did this in Western NY and had the time of my life researching! One thing I came across was the following website for a Hopkins family including an Archibald and John Hopkins in slightly different generations than yours, but perhaps they were related your family. This Hopkins family migrated from Albany to Baltimore. Then sons moved on to Virginia and Ohio. They were Scots-Irish, on a quick read probably Presbyterian. So they fit the "type" for settlers who arrived in Broadkiln Hundred. http://veaches.net/abbott/hopkins_story.html Jane *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you to all who have responded to my note about early Sussex records. Barb Holmes: It might be helpful to numerous Listers if you would take the time to tell us about the records you saw in Harrisburg. I know you told us about the book that explains the history of the records. I'm asking about the specifics of where one goes in Harrisburg and exactly what one asks to see. Hey, I'm old and need all the help I can get! Thank you, kindly. Jim Moore On Sun, Nov 24, 2013 at 12:10 PM, Barb Holmes <bholmes@austin.rr.com> wrote: > When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original > Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had just > written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide for, > published in1991, which they said this book would explain and help in > understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land record along > Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. Also this book would > explain why his son John Holmes had to re-register the deed in 1754 in > Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. Donna Munger was > chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. The book does a good job > of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. How confusing for the people > who lived in the area when it came time to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples > found out the hard way. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joseph > Lake > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM > To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your material, > I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same specifications: 1723 > Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); > Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. > > I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great > interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald Hopkins > (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New Castle > Co, > DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle and NO > earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show that > Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. > > With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails one > aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) to try and > find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these facts, how would > you use them to proceed? > > Joe Lake > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jane McDonnell > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM > Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 > > Jim, > > Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, Delaware > was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in question, > records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, part of the East > Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see my note at the end) or > in Pennsylvania archives (the southern counties, Sussex on the Delaware, > New > Castle). I've been working extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these > references. So, I too would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although > called > Sussex (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest > county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, MD > even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon line was > drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by Maryland throughout > the > decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have had a fluid border with Kent > Co. especially with a major town straddling the county line (Milford north > and south). I have family (Hazzard) in the Bridgeville and Seaford area, > and > Burtons in Broadkill/ln Hundred who didn't know the county or the state > they > lived in during their lives. Their land patents in the NW Fork area were > granted by Maryland, and one ancestor thought he had lived his life in > Maryland only to have history posthumously correct him. He had been a > Delawarian for the last 58 years of his life. > > As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the lower > counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or province) of > Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer than it seems to > have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I imagine because of a > centralized government system that gave the Pennsylvania Assembly sway over > the area for a good long time (which I have no end date for). Was > Philadelphia the seat of power until statehood was granted to Delaware? Or > did things change before/after that? > > I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political > history > of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history document of > the > area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, I have to go back in > and make new notations. Now it is as confusing as a family tree with the > ancestral lines confused (another oddity that DelMarVa seems prone to - so > much documentation, so much misinterpretation!). > > I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my > "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have collected this > information to add to my notes from the easily attainable "History of the > Hundreds of Delaware") > > That portion of my notes follows: > > BROADCREEK HUNDRED > Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest > colonial group from: > 1) Accomac Shire (1634) > became Northampton (1642) > Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the south > (1663) > Accomac became Accomack in (1940) > 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. > > First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke > Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now stands. > The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, Collins, > Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were Seaford and > Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns associated with our > branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. > > LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED > Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD with > land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border dispute was > settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good chance their birth was > actually in Delaware, though the records will list MD. > > Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and Sussex Co. > For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but > records for Kent should be double checked > > beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became known > as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in folder from > church records as "evidence" > > See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. > > The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe most > of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called "Worcester > Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with different boundaries, > from at least 1721. > > Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so virtually > the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac County VA. > Original > settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish Prespyterians > > Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA or MD. > It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. > > see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of William > Penn's land grant. http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg > http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg > And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset > http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to as > the > "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD or VA. > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > *************************************** > QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? > Visit The Lower DelMarVa Roots Mailing List FAQ: > http://www.tyaskin.com/handley/ldrfaq.htm > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LOWER-DELMARVA-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

When I visited Harrisburg, PA to look at their holdings of original Pennsylvania/Delaware deeds, I was told that Donna Bingham Munger had just written a book, Pennsylvania Land Records, A History and Guide for, published in1991, which they said this book would explain and help in understanding why our ancestor Robert Holmes' Delaware land record along Mispillion Creek, was being held in Harrisburg, PA. Also this book would explain why his son John Holmes had to re-register the deed in 1754 in Harrisburg, PA, after his father Robert Holmes died. Donna Munger was chief of the Division of Land Records, 1986-1989. The book does a good job of explaining the deeds of this PA/DE area. How confusing for the people who lived in the area when it came time to pay their taxes, as Peter Waples found out the hard way. -----Original Message----- From: lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lower-delmarva-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Lake Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 3:58 PM To: lower-delmarva-roots@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald Hopkins (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New Castle Co, DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these facts, how would you use them to proceed? Joe Lake -----Original Message----- From: Jane McDonnell Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2013 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Jim, Since you asked about a specific date, I would say Sussex County, Delaware was not reliably used in records until 1775. For the area in question, records would "probably" be in Accomac or Northampton, VA, part of the East Shore Colonies (they also have fluid boundaries, see my note at the end) or in Pennsylvania archives (the southern counties, Sussex on the Delaware, New Castle). I've been working extraordinarily hard trying to sort out these references. So, I too would love anyone's dating/boundaries. Although called Sussex (territory of Pennsylvania) from an early date, most of the lowest county was "Somerset Co, MD" (part also was Dorchester and Worcester, MD even shown as New Castle on a 1668 map) before the Mason Dixon line was drawn. Land patents were continuing to be granted by Maryland throughout the decades of dispute. Sussex also seems to have had a fluid border with Kent Co. especially with a major town straddling the county line (Milford north and south). I have family (Hazzard) in the Bridgeville and Seaford area, and Burtons in Broadkill/ln Hundred who didn't know the county or the state they lived in during their lives. Their land patents in the NW Fork area were granted by Maryland, and one ancestor thought he had lived his life in Maryland only to have history posthumously correct him. He had been a Delawarian for the last 58 years of his life. As you point out, Delaware was referred to in many records as "the lower counties of Delaware, (or Sussex), in the territories (or province) of Pennsylvania" from it's earliest days until much longer than it seems to have been necessary - nearly the 19th century. I imagine because of a centralized government system that gave the Pennsylvania Assembly sway over the area for a good long time (which I have no end date for). Was Philadelphia the seat of power until statehood was granted to Delaware? Or did things change before/after that? I have started to write a narrative to try to sort out the political history of the Hundreds of Delaware. Every time I read a new history document of the area, or find judicial findings for a new generation, I have to go back in and make new notations. Now it is as confusing as a family tree with the ancestral lines confused (another oddity that DelMarVa seems prone to - so much documentation, so much misinterpretation!). I would love to hear input from anyone. If anyone wants to read my "confusing notes", I have added a few of them below. (I have collected this information to add to my notes from the easily attainable "History of the Hundreds of Delaware") That portion of my notes follows: BROADCREEK HUNDRED Early settlers came from Virginia and Maryland, the largest earliest colonial group from: 1) Accomac Shire (1634) became Northampton (1642) Split and became Accomac County to the north and Northampton in the south (1663) Accomac became Accomack in (1940) 2) And some settlers also from Pennsylvania. First land records date from 1680. Being heavily settled by Nanticoke Indians, a reservation was made of 500 acres were Laurel(town) now stands. The Indians were moved further west. Families of note include, Collins, Ellegood and Derrickson and later Marvil. Other towns were Seaford and Concord which was laid out in 1796. These are the towns associated with our branch of Hazzards. Lewisville became Bethel in1880. LITTLE CREEK HUNDRED Was settled with many official records assuming it was Somerset, MD with land patents recording the land was in MD, till the border dispute was settled.The generations born before 1775 have a good chance their birth was actually in Delaware, though the records will list MD. Other border anomalies: The town of Milford is in both Kent and Sussex Co. For purposes of our family tree we assume they were in Sussex Co. but records for Kent should be double checked beginning in 1682 this piece of Delaware was ceded to Penn and became known as Sussex County in the territories of Pennsylvania see docs in folder from church records as "evidence" See the history of Somerset County on wikipedia. The part of Somerset Co, MD that was to become Indian River and maybe most of Sussex, in the eastern Hundreds at least, was once called "Worcester Manor" and then Worcester County, MD. perhaps with different boundaries, from at least 1721. Somerset was early Sussex area as far as Rehoboth settlement, so virtually the same as Sussex and part of Kent. It bordered Accomac County VA. Original settlers were from Accomac VA and immigrating Scot-Irish Prespyterians Records from the 1600s thru most of the 1700s will be originally VA or MD. It won't be reliably Delaware until after 1775. see also Pennsylvania, as Delaware was originally a province of William Penn's land grant. http://www.mapsofpa.com/17thcentury/1688morden.jpg http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg And you can see it could be referred to as Newcastle, or Somerset http://www.mapsofpa.com/18thcentury/s627.jpg Occasionally referred to as the "southern counties" of PA or the "Eastern Shore Colony" of MD or VA. *************************************** QUESTIONS about POSTING GUIDELINES, SUBSCRIBING or UNSUBSCRIBING? 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Stuart: Thanks for the comments. I doubt that I did a thorough job, but I did go to the Counties on the east side & north end of the Chesapeake and found the Hopkins surname in several places but the details didn't seem to fit altho I may have missed a clue, which is a negative feeling. Joe Lake Stuart Bechman wrote: Joe, I have had a similar block for a Sylvester Deputy that seemed to suddenly appear in Cedar Creek Hundred, Sussex County in 1728. Thinking that he must have emigrated either from the north or the south, I scoured records from Philadelphia, Somerset County, MD, and Accomac and Northampton counties of Virginia for any prior documentation but came up empty. Then I read a document that pointed out that much of lower Delmarva was forest and swampland, and that roads were almost nonexistent. Instead, people moved primarily along the rivers and creeks. The Nanticoke River rose in Cedar Creek Hundred, and when I traced that back to the Chesapeake Bay, I found Deputies in Dorchester County and Carroll County with Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2013 13:58:01 -0800 From: "Joseph Lake" <joslake@sbcglobal.net> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald Hopkins (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New Castle Co, DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these facts, how would you use them to proceed? Joe Lake

Joe, I have had a similar block for a Sylvester Deputy that seemed to suddenly appear in Cedar Creek Hundred, Sussex County in 1728. Thinking that he must have emigrated either from the north or the south, I scoured records from Philadelphia, Somerset County, MD, and Accomac and Northampton counties of Virginia for any prior documentation but came up empty. Then I read a document that pointed out that much of lower Delmarva was forest and swampland, and that roads were almost nonexistent. Instead, people moved primarily along the rivers and creeks. The Nanticoke River rose in Cedar Creek Hundred, and when I traced that back to the Chesapeake Bay, I found Deputies in Dorchester County and Carroll County with Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2013 13:58:01 -0800 From: "Joseph Lake" <joslake@sbcglobal.net> Subject: Re: [LDR] Sussex Co in 1723 Jane Mc Donnell, Jim Moore & List......While I cannot add to your material, I have a genealogical brick wall with almost the same specifications: 1723 Sussex Co, DE; possibly Scots Irish; Presbyterians (Cool Spring Church); Broadkill 100 (around Milton); etc. I read both of your e-mails in this (so far) short string with great interest. I have found a Sussex 1723 land deed involving Archibald Hopkins (purchaser) of Sussex and a niece of Sheriff Cantwell (seller,New Castle Co, DE) for land in Sussex, recorded in Sussex. No record in New Castle and NO earlier documents in Sussex, so the current facts seem to show that Archibald Hopkins arrived in Sussex c1723. With the detail contained in Jim Moores' and Jane McDonnells' e=mails one aspect of the brick wall is deciding where (which county, state) to try and find Archibald Hopkins before c1723??? If you had these facts, how would you use them to proceed? Joe Lake

Hi Joe, At that date, you will likely find land records in Maryland (most likely Somerset Co.) There may be wills recorded in "Sussex, Delaware" even though it could likely be archived in Pennsylvania, as Penn claimed the county at that point. All the states involved have many of the same records because of this problem, but you will need to search with all the "names" of the place to find them all. Here is an example, in a single court report how one fixed place is seemingly a part of three states (and shows how the citizenry felt about having so many jurisdictions to answer to!): > 12/6/1694 Peter Waples and Charles Tindall, both of the south side of Indian River, appeared in open Court at Lewes, County of Sussex Delaware and made a complaint against the Sheriff of Summersett Co. Maryland in that some time in the beginning of Aug last past he, the said SubSheriff Martin Trentman came to the house of the said Waple.....and there arrested him, the said Waples, who thereupon told the SubSheriff that he would not obey any Maryland writ in that he was an inhabitant of this County under the government of Pennsylvania, whereupon the Sheriff went on his way without the said Waples......said subSheriff came up again with 5 men.....said Sub Sheriff inquired for the man of the house and Peter Waples answered, "here I am"...the Sheriff called for ropes to bind Waples and thew him upon the bed. The said Charles Tindall came into the house and told them that they should not bind him without he see a lawful power, and taking a gun down from a rack, saying he would clear the house of them. They went away again without Waples, but on 9/22/1694 the High Sheriff Ephraim Willson came with 20 men, armed with sword and pistols and seized Waples and Tindall and bound them with cords, putting a sword to the breast of the wife of Waples and threatening the children to knock them down if they stirred and carried Waples and Tindall away to the house of James Round. They kept them prisoners for 2 days, bound over to Court. They were held until the next January Court date. Waples was prosecuted in Maryland and his son William later said it cost his dad a great sum of money.