Per Ancestry: Haplogroup C (M130) (Oceania, North/Central/East Asia, North America and significant presence in India) Thanks cousin, still very confused... :) Cuz Jimmie -----Original Message----- From: lovelace-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lovelace-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Greg Lovelace Sent: Sunday, July 18, 2010 7:17 PM To: lovelace@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LL] Indian blood and DNA At 09:02 PM 7/18/2010, Jimmie wrote: >I guess my question was: > >Haplogroup Q3, Q or C3; as stated by Betsy, where would this be when >someone has a DNA test, would these value be listed with this "male to >male offspring" orientated test or would this Haplogroup be only in the >mtDNA testing procedure? Haplogroup Q3,Q, or C3 would be present in >both forms of testing or not, this confusion comes from seeing the >result of the marker test and not seeing this "Q" value where does the Q3 et al value come from? Hey, Jimmie... I'm sorry, cuz... I guess I'm just as confused as you are. The Haplogroup we belong to goes back much further than the tests we are looking at, or at least that is my understanding. I just checked the FTDNA pages, and the haplogroup *is* listed in the results, just not with the marker matches. Go to this page and read about haplogroups: http://www.familytreedna.com/snps-r-us.aspx The haplogroup is listed under the heading "Y-DNA results" on the test subjects FTDNA page, and can be found by clicking on the link that says "Haplotree". Mine states that I belong to haplogroup R1b1b2. What this actually means is mostly unclear to me, except that the group arose in Europe in prehistoric times. You were asking about DNA testing for native American tribes. I googled and found some interesting links. Try some of these and see if they might answer some of your questions: http://www.manataka.org/page267.html http://www.comanchelodge.com/cherokee-blood.html http://www.healthanddna.com/ancestry-dna-testing/native-american-dna.html http://genealogical-research-methods.suite101.com/article.cfm/dna_testing_fo r_native_american_ancestry These should get you started. Hope it helps. Peace, Part of the Tree, Greg ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOVELACE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Greg"ette"-- This much I can tell you abt. haplogroup R1b1b2-- R1b (the ancestral group) was an offshoot in prehistoric times from R1, from which R1a also descends. Some researchers are now claiming that R1a represents the so-called "satem" split of the Indo-European language/culture groups, whereas R1b represents the so-called "centum" split from the Indo-European parent tree. Both groups ended up invading pre-historic Europe, but at widely divergent times--the centum group (R1b) much, much earlier (ca. 8000 B.C.E.), and the satem group around the time of Christ. (My dates could be off a little, but are close enough for purposes of this discussion.) As we all know, R1b became the dominant haplogroup in Western Europe (the so-called "Atlantic Modal Haplogroup"), whereas R1a tends to predominate in Eastern Europe (but extends as far south as Iran, Afghanistan, and even into India). This (again) corresponds exactly to the known historical migration patterns of the two groups, "centum" and "satem". But here's the really interesting part: Scandinavia, the ancient homeland of the Germanic peoples (whence we derive our language, English), was a mixture of R1a ("satem"), R1b ("centum"), and the "I1" group (my own group, also known as the autochthonous or aboriginal group). This is confirmed by linguistic studies, which clearly show that the Germanic languages (including English) arose due to a mix of differing foreign language influxes into that area. The Germanic language group shares the majority of its lexicon (word stock) with the Balto-Slavic group ("satem" or R1a). An example is our word "swine," which in Russian is "svinia" [spelled with English letters]). But the Germanic groups also show clear borrowings and influence from the Celto-Italic languages ("centum" or R1b). An example there (out of many possible ones) would be the word "rich" (or the German word "Reich") both of which stem from a Germanic original *rikja-, which was borrowed from a proto-Celtic form *rig-yo. The reference of course was to the "realm of the king". (The proto-Celtic word for "king" was "rix"--almost identical to the Latin "rex".) Here is the Wikipedia page for the "centum/satem isogloss": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centum-Satem_isogloss Basically, this term comes from representative forms of the word for [one] "hundred" in each of those ancestral language families: "satem" from the ancient Avestan (related to modern Farsi, or Persian), and "centum," from Latin. The Indo-European dialects diverged many thousands of years ago, at first into two main groups--one group preserving the original hard /k/ sound of the initial consonant of that word (originally something like *kmtom), whereas the so-called "satem" group changed the hard initial /k/ into a soft /s/-like sound, rather like the way we pronounce it today in English (although we do so for different reasons). I find it fascinating how genetics and linguistic studies are beginning to converge, and point to the same conclusion about our ancestry and language! Hope this helps some. Terry --- On Mon, 7/19/10, Jimmie Ryan <jimmie.ryan@verizon.net> wrote: From: Jimmie Ryan <jimmie.ryan@verizon.net> Subject: Re: [LL] Indian blood and DNA To: lovelace@rootsweb.com Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 7:23 PM Per Ancestry: Haplogroup C (M130) (Oceania, North/Central/East Asia, North America and significant presence in India) Thanks cousin, still very confused... :) Cuz Jimmie -----Original Message----- From: lovelace-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lovelace-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Greg Lovelace Sent: Sunday, July 18, 2010 7:17 PM To: lovelace@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LL] Indian blood and DNA At 09:02 PM 7/18/2010, Jimmie wrote: >I guess my question was: > >Haplogroup Q3, Q or C3; as stated by Betsy, where would this be when >someone has a DNA test, would these value be listed with this "male to >male offspring" orientated test or would this Haplogroup be only in the >mtDNA testing procedure? Haplogroup Q3,Q, or C3 would be present in >both forms of testing or not, this confusion comes from seeing the >result of the marker test and not seeing this "Q" value where does the Q3 et al value come from? Hey, Jimmie... I'm sorry, cuz... I guess I'm just as confused as you are. The Haplogroup we belong to goes back much further than the tests we are looking at, or at least that is my understanding. I just checked the FTDNA pages, and the haplogroup *is* listed in the results, just not with the marker matches. Go to this page and read about haplogroups: http://www.familytreedna.com/snps-r-us.aspx The haplogroup is listed under the heading "Y-DNA results" on the test subjects FTDNA page, and can be found by clicking on the link that says "Haplotree". Mine states that I belong to haplogroup R1b1b2. What this actually means is mostly unclear to me, except that the group arose in Europe in prehistoric times. You were asking about DNA testing for native American tribes. I googled and found some interesting links. Try some of these and see if they might answer some of your questions: http://www.manataka.org/page267.html http://www.comanchelodge.com/cherokee-blood.html http://www.healthanddna.com/ancestry-dna-testing/native-american-dna.html http://genealogical-research-methods.suite101.com/article.cfm/dna_testing_fo r_native_american_ancestry These should get you started. Hope it helps. Peace, Part of the Tree, Greg ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOVELACE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LOVELACE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message