> > > William's baptism is in the Ancestry LMA records: > > London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906 about William Stephen = > Baker > > Name: William Stephen Baker > Record Type: Baptism > Birth Date: 21 Jan 1839 1839 > Baptism Date: 26 May 1839 > Father's Name: William Baker > Mother's Name: Sally Baker > Parish or Poor Law Union: Whitechapel St Mary > Borough: Tower Hamlets > > They were living in Charlotte Street and William Senior is a carpenter.=20= > > > There is another baptism with a child of the same couple in 1843 > Name: Eleanor Prudence Baker=20 > Record Type: Baptism=20 > Birth Date: August 24 1840 > Baptism Date: 29 Mar 1843=20 > Father's Name: William Baker > Mother's Name: Sally Baker=20 > Parish or Poor Law Union: Christ Church, Watney Street Borough: Tower = > Hamlets > > They lived in Catherine Street and William senior was again a Carpenter. > > Name: William Baker=20 > Age: Full Age=20 > Spouse Name: Sally Hunniball=20 > Spouse Age: Full Age=20 > Record Type: Marriage=20 > Marriage Date: 22 Apr 1838=20 > Parish: St Paul,=20 > Shadwell County: Surrey=20 > Borough: Tower Hamlets=20 > Father Name: Isaac Baker Spouse=20 > Father Name: John Hunniball > > William is a bachelor and Sally is a spinster. William is a carpenter = > living in Marman Street. Sally lives at 18 Storey Street. Isaac Baker = > is a carpenter too, and Joseph Hunniball is a millwright. > William & Sally were both literate and signed their names. Witnesses = > were Robert Hopkins & Joseph Scholey > I haven't found them yet in 1841. Thought I had but wrong details. > > I'll look again > > Anne > On 3 Apr 2011, at 02:20, Maree Gordon wrote: > >> Hello from New Zealand >> =20 >> Can anyone help here please to determine the true identity of this =20 >> couple...?? >> =20 >> William BAKER m/d Sally HUNNIBALL - June 1838, Stepney >> =20 >> William Stephen BAKER Ch 26 May 1839 Stepney, St Mary Whitechapel >> s/o William Stephen BAKER =3D Sally Baker nee HUNNIBALL >> =20 >> Thank you for reading this..... >> =20 >> Kind regards from Maree S. Gordon, Matamata, New Zealand=20 >> =20

It looks as though Martha was still in Colchester, which is Essex, not Sussex. 1841 England Census about Martha Collier Name: Martha Collier Age: 11 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1830 Gender: Female Where born: Essex, England Civil parish: St Peter Hundred: Colchester Borough County/Island: Essex Country: England Street Address: Middleboro' Occupation: Mary is a shopkeeper Registration district: Colchester Sub-registration district: Second Ward Household Members: Mary Collier 40 abt 1801 Female born Essex England Thomas Collier 19 abt 1822 Male b. Essex England Hannah Collier 13 abt 1828 Female b. Essex England Martha Collier 11 abt 1830 Female b. Essex England Henry Collier 7 abt 1834 Male b. Essex England Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 344; Book: 15; Civil Parish: St Peter; County: Essex; Enumeration District: 3; Folio: 39; Page: 5; Line: 24; HTH Anne On 5 Apr 2011, at 08:42, Phyl Stewart wrote: > > Hello All > > Could sks please look at the 1841 census and find SAMUEL PEARSALL, born about 1828 in Westminster and/or MARTHA COLLIER, born about 1831 in Colchester, Sussex, but probably in London by 1841? We'd like to find them with their families. > > Thanks in advance > > Phyl in NZ

This looks the most likely for Samuel 1841 England Census about Saml Pearsall Name: Saml Pearsall Age: 13 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1828 Gender: Male Where born: Middlesex, England Civil parish: St John The Evangelist Hundred: Westminster County/Island: Middlesex Country: England Street Address: 12 Cary St St John the Evangelist Westminster. Occupation: Smith ( Samuel senior & Jash) Registration district: Westminster Sub-registration district: St John the Evangelist Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Sam Pearsall 57 abt 1784 Male Elizth Pearsall 54 abt 1787 Female Jash Pearsall 30 abt 1811 Male born Middlesex England Henry Pearsall 20 abt 1821 Male born Middlesex England Saml Pearsall 13 abt 1828 Male born Middlesex England Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 737; Book: 14; Civil Parish: St John The Evangelist; County: Middlesex; Enumeration District: 16; Folio: 29; Page: 4; Line: 8; GSU roll: 438838. 1841 had ages of adults rounded down to the nearest 5 years, and didn't give relationships or exact birthplaces - just Yes or No to born in county. So SAmuel senior & Elizabeth, who I presume are the parents of the boys were both born outside Middlesex. HTH Anne On 5 Apr 2011, at 08:42, Phyl Stewart wrote: > > Hello All > > Could sks please look at the 1841 census and find SAMUEL PEARSALL, born about 1828 in Westminster and/or MARTHA COLLIER, born about 1831 in Colchester, Sussex, but probably in London by 1841? We'd like to find them with their families. > > Thanks in advance > > Phyl in NZ > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > This mailing list works in parallel with the London surname interest list on the web at http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hughw/london.html . Check for matching interests and add your own ! > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: LONDON-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LONDON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

That looks brilliant - many thanks, Andy. Lottie ________________________________________ From: Andy Hedgcock [andy701@blueyonder.co.uk] Sent: 04 April 2011 16:47 To: Lottie Alexander (l.alexander); LONDON@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LON] Brixton This link may help - http://www.urban75.org/brixton/history/reference.html Cheers Andy Support Shelterbox for disasters - http://www.shelterbox.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lottie Alexander (l.alexander)" <l.alexander@yorksj.ac.uk> To: <LONDON@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 4:38 PM Subject: [LON] Brixton > Hello > I have been asked to help with finding resources as follows: > > I need to gather some statistics on unemployment, education and housing in > Brixton between 1958 and 1981 > > I know I can check out the Office for National Statistics website, but I > wonder whether anyone who has been researching Brixton can offer any > further suggestions? My normal London research is for family history > purposes and I've never needed to look at Brixton. A Vision of Britain in > Time & British History Online are 2 resources I may be able to use. > > Many thanks! > Lottie > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > This mailing list works in parallel with the London surname interest list > on the web at http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hughw/london.html . Check for > matching interests and add your own ! > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: LONDON-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LONDON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

This link may help - http://www.urban75.org/brixton/history/reference.html Cheers Andy Support Shelterbox for disasters - http://www.shelterbox.org/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lottie Alexander (l.alexander)" <l.alexander@yorksj.ac.uk> To: <LONDON@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 4:38 PM Subject: [LON] Brixton > Hello > I have been asked to help with finding resources as follows: > > I need to gather some statistics on unemployment, education and housing in > Brixton between 1958 and 1981 > > I know I can check out the Office for National Statistics website, but I > wonder whether anyone who has been researching Brixton can offer any > further suggestions? My normal London research is for family history > purposes and I've never needed to look at Brixton. A Vision of Britain in > Time & British History Online are 2 resources I may be able to use. > > Many thanks! > Lottie > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > This mailing list works in parallel with the London surname interest list > on the web at http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hughw/london.html . Check for > matching interests and add your own ! > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: LONDON-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LONDON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

Hello I have been asked to help with finding resources as follows: I need to gather some statistics on unemployment, education and housing in Brixton between 1958 and 1981 I know I can check out the Office for National Statistics website, but I wonder whether anyone who has been researching Brixton can offer any further suggestions? My normal London research is for family history purposes and I've never needed to look at Brixton. A Vision of Britain in Time & British History Online are 2 resources I may be able to use. Many thanks! Lottie

Many thanks for everyone's help - will have a think whether to actually visit - its time rather than cost as it cane be included on my London travel card. Robert -----Original Message----- From: J K gen Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 3:13 PM To: Robert Webb Cc: London list post Subject: Re: [LON] Grosvenor Park Road Try searching, using the full address, on Google Maps, then use the street view. Looks to me that the house is still standing, but has had most of the window ornamentations removed, and a stucco/pebble dash finish put onto the brickwork - perhaps to hide poor quality bricks. Looks rather ugly to be honest. JK On 4 April 2011 14:51, Robert Webb <robert@robw1.plus.com> wrote: > Hi > I would like to see 24 Grosvenor Park Road, Walthamstow which was where my > great grandparents and family lived in 1901. Can someone advise which end > of the road it is ie Hoe Street or Wingfield Street and if within > reasonable walking distance of Walthamstow Station. Would also appreciate > if anyone knows whether they think that the house is “original 1901”and > not a subsequent rebuild. > Robert in N Wales

Hi Robert If you go to google and select maps Then enter the address 24 Grosvenor Park Road, Walthamstow It should take you there , you will see a little yellow man on the zoom bar, drag him onto the map where the pointer is, this will take you to street view You can then do a virtual wander around the streets, number 24 looks very much as if its seen better days (much better days I would say) Its the second house in from the Pembroke Rd junction Its an awful lot cheaper than the train <vbg> Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Hi > I would like to see 24 Grosvenor Park Road, Walthamstow which was where my great grandparents and > family lived in 1901. Can someone advise which end of the road it is ie Hoe Street or Wingfield > Street and if within reasonable walking distance of Walthamstow Station. Would also appreciate if > anyone knows whether they think that the house is “original 1901”and not a subsequent rebuild. > Robert in N Wales

Robert, I've had a look on Google maps using the Street View facility and no 24 seems to be a white painted house just before the junction with Pembroke Road ( so the Wingfield Rd end) . On the Street View there is a man in a blue T shirt bent over outside it. It looks like an original Victorian double fronted house. It says it is about 10 minutes walk from Walthamstow Central Station. down Hoe Street. HTH Anne On 4 Apr 2011, at 14:51, Robert Webb wrote: > Hi > I would like to see 24 Grosvenor Park Road, Walthamstow which was where my great grandparents and family lived in 1901. Can someone advise which end of the road it is ie Hoe Street or Wingfield Street and if within reasonable walking distance of Walthamstow Station. Would also appreciate if anyone knows whether they think that the house is “original 1901”and not a subsequent rebuild. > Robert in N Wales

Hi I would like to see 24 Grosvenor Park Road, Walthamstow which was where my great grandparents and family lived in 1901. Can someone advise which end of the road it is ie Hoe Street or Wingfield Street and if within reasonable walking distance of Walthamstow Station. Would also appreciate if anyone knows whether they think that the house is “original 1901”and not a subsequent rebuild. Robert in N Wales

No need to shout Bruce we heard you <g> May I ask if you know that there are actually gravestones there? Cemeteries tend to be large and difficult places to find an individual grave in, have you researched the locations as yet? Without the specific locations whoever you get to do the job will find it a hard task and obviously the longer it takes the more expensive it would be I only wish I could help specifically with your request but its a bit of a bus ride from Cornwall :-( Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > HI > CAN ANYONE RECOMMEND A GENEALOGICALLY ORIENTED PHOTOGRAPHER THAT IS > CHEAP AND COULD TAKE SOME PHOTO'S FOR ME OF SOME HEADSTONES IN THE ST > PANCRAS AN ISLINGTON CEMETERIES IN LONDON? > > THANKS > > BRUCE@BRUCE-W-GRAHAM.COM

Hi Anne, Thank you very much for the list of Jewish cemeteries. As they were married in Hambro Synagogue I think they were probably Ashkenazi Orthodox. I was thinking too about how far they would be able to transport the body from the place they died. I have done so much searching I got to the point where I didn't know where to go next. After getting your list I started searching again and found Hackney Cemetery and Hoxton Cemetery, both Orthodox, were purchased by Hambro Synagogue. Not likely that I would find my family though as there are limited records. Thank you for sticking me with a pin and getting me on track again. Marg >From the Beautiful British Columbia Cariboo Region, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Anne Peat" <anne.peat@bigwindows.demon.co.uk> To: "Margaret Cambridge" <talktomarg@shaw.ca> Cc: <London-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 12:16 AM Subject: Re: [LON] Jewish Cemeteries Marg, There is a list of Jewish Cemeteries in 'Victorian London Cemeteries' by Gendocs http://homepage.ntlworld.com/hitch/gendocs/cem.html#jewish Wikipedia also has a list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Cemeteries_in_London It would help to know whether your ancestors were Orthodox or Liberal or Reform. HTH Anne On 3 Apr 2011, at 22:14, Margaret Cambridge wrote: > My gr gr grandfather, George Lawrence LEE, was living at 39 Devonshire St, > Holborn when he died at home in 1871. My gr gr grandmother, Julia LEE, > was living at 83 Lambs Conduit St., Holborn when she died 6 months later. > > George and Julia were Jewish and had married in Hambro Synagogue in 1827. > Their children seemed to stray away from the Jewish faith but I don't know > whether this was so with the gr gr grands. > > Does anyone know what Jewish cemeteries would be in that area? > > Thank you...... > > Marg >> From the Beautiful British Columbia Cariboo Region, Canada

With that sequence of events I think what we are talking about is a man taking time off to go to London to oprganise his marriage. Perhaps even they were not formally engaged. Maybe it included final courtship and seeking the father's permission. Plus he had to be around for the calling of Banns I assume he was a not a lowly employee back in Oldham Ron Lankshear -Sydney NSW (from London-Shepherds Bush/Chiswick) try my links http://freepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~lankshear/ On 2011-04-04 4:27 AM, Beth wrote: > The newspaper article appeared on the 9th November 1851 and related to an > annual dinner held in Oldham on 31st October 1851 in which Mr H's apologies > were given for his absence. The source of the date of marriage in St > Pancras on 4 March 1852 was from parish registers, not from any GRO index, > and again confirmed in the divorce proceedings I acquired from National > Archves. > > Mr H's job took him away from London, but it is 125 days between the two > days, and whilst transport was slower than modern times, seems to be an > exceedingly long time if travel was the issue. > > The puzzle remains!

Marg, There is a list of Jewish Cemeteries in 'Victorian London Cemeteries' by Gendocs http://homepage.ntlworld.com/hitch/gendocs/cem.html#jewish Wikipedia also has a list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Cemeteries_in_London My immediate thought was Willesden, but the Gendocs list tells me it wasn't opened then > Jewish Cemeteries in Victorian London ~ > > • Alderney Road Cemetery (Orthodox), Alderney Road, E. London (1697-1852) > • Balls Pond Cemetery (Reform Synagogues), Kingsbury Road (1844-1951) > • Brady Street Cemetery (Orthodox), Brady Street, E. London (1761-1858) > • Forest Gate, West Ham > • Hackney Cemetery (Orthodox), Lauriston Road (1788-1886) > • Hoop Lane Cemetery East (Spanish & Portuguese), Golders Green (1897) > • Hoop Lane Cemetery West (Reform Synagogues), Golders Green (1897) > • Hoxton Cemetery (Orthodox), Hoxton Street (1707-1878) > • Jeremy's Green Lane, Edmonton > • Jewish Cemetery (Federation of Synagogues), Montague Road, Lower Edmonton (1889) > • Plushet Cemetery (Ortodox), High Street North (1896) > • Sephardi Nuevo (New) Cemetery (Spanish & Portuguese), Mile End Road (1733) > • Sephardi Velho (Old) Cemetery (Spanish & Portuguese), Mile End Road (1657-1742) > • The Bancroft Road Cemetery, Mile End (c.1810-1920) > • West Ham Cemetery (Orthodox), Buckingham Road (1857) > • Western Cemetery, Queen's Elm Parade, Chelsea (1815-1884) > • Western Synagogue Cemetery, Montagu Road, Lower Edmonton (1884) > • Willesden Cemetery (Orthodox), Beaconsfield Road (1873) It would help to know whether your ancestors were Orthodox or Liberal or Reform. HTH Anne On 3 Apr 2011, at 22:14, Margaret Cambridge wrote: > My gr gr grandfather, George Lawrence LEE, was living at 39 Devonshire St, Holborn when he died at home in 1871. My gr gr grandmother, Julia LEE, was living at 83 Lambs Conduit St., Holborn when she died 6 months later. > > George and Julia were Jewish and had married in Hambro Synagogue in 1827. Their children seemed to stray away from the Jewish faith but I don't know whether this was so with the gr gr grands. > > Does anyone know what Jewish cemeteries would be in that area? > > Thank you...... > > Marg >> From the Beautiful British Columbia Cariboo Region, Canada > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > This mailing list works in parallel with the London surname interest list on the web at http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~hughw/london.html . Check for matching interests and add your own ! > > Any problems, please contact the List Admin: LONDON-admin@rootsweb.com > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LONDON-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks to Ron, John & Roger for their suggestions about the interpretation of "matrimonial tour". The newspaper article appeared on the 9th November 1851 and related to an annual dinner held in Oldham on 31st October 1851 in which Mr H's apologies were given for his absence. The source of the date of marriage in St Pancras on 4 March 1852 was from parish registers, not from any GRO index, and again confirmed in the divorce proceedings I acquired from National Archves. Mr H's job took him away from London, but it is 125 days between the two days, and whilst transport was slower than modern times, seems to be an exceedingly long time if travel was the issue. The puzzle remains! Beth

HI CAN ANYONE RECOMMEND A GENEALOGICALLY ORIENTED PHOTOGRAPHER THAT IS CHEAP AND COULD TAKE SOME PHOTO'S FOR ME OF SOME HEADSTONES IN THE ST PANCRAS AN ISLINGTON CEMETERIES IN LONDON? THANKS BRUCE@BRUCE-W-GRAHAM.COM

My gr gr grandfather, George Lawrence LEE, was living at 39 Devonshire St, Holborn when he died at home in 1871. My gr gr grandmother, Julia LEE, was living at 83 Lambs Conduit St., Holborn when she died 6 months later. George and Julia were Jewish and had married in Hambro Synagogue in 1827. Their children seemed to stray away from the Jewish faith but I don't know whether this was so with the gr gr grands. Does anyone know what Jewish cemeteries would be in that area? Thank you...... Marg >From the Beautiful British Columbia Cariboo Region, Canada

Hello from New Zealand Can anyone help here please to determine the true identity of this couple...?? William BAKER m/d Sally HUNNIBALL - June 1838, Stepney William Stephen BAKER Ch 26 May 1839 Stepney, St Mary Whitechapel s/o William Stephen BAKER = Sally Baker nee HUNNIBALL Thank you for reading this..... Kind regards from Maree S. Gordon, Matamata, New Zealand

I can only read it as the writer thought that Mr H had married and was off on a travelling honeymoon. If that was Nov 1851 and he married in Mar 1852 perhaps their planned marriage was delayed or the writer misunderstood the timing Ron Lankshear -Sydney NSW (from London-Shepherds Bush/Chiswick) try my links http://freepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~lankshear/ On 2011-04-03 5:12 AM, Beth wrote: > "An apology was made for the absence of Mr H ...on account of Mr H > having gone on a matrimonial tour, he having himself become united, as well > as the towns".

I am hoping some very knowledgeable person will be able to better interpret some information I have discovered in an online newspaper. It reads as follows: "An apology was made for the absence of Mr H ...on account of Mr H having gone on a matrimonial tour, he having himself become united, as well as the towns". (Mr H had been unable to make an annual dinner of an association that employed him which had joined with other similar associations in other towns - becoming "united" so to speak.) I immediately thought that Mr H had got married and gone on a honeymoon, but the problem is that this paragraph was in a newspaper of Nov 1851 and the first instancce that I know of with Mr H marrying is in March of 1852 in Marylebone. When I googled matrimonial tours modern day references seem to relate to organised tours where you travel to find a "mail-order" bride! Googling e-books brings up some references of matrimonial tours, including one where a man took his mother on a matrimonial tour. So I started to think that a matrimonial tour was travelling around to find a wife; however, this does not explain the rest of the sentence in which Mr H had become united. Was it typical that young men become engaged and then embarked on travel before actually marrying - a twist on the the modern day OE (overseas experience)? Some instances of matrimonial tours that I have come across do refer to couples, so I have thoroughly confused myself online ... I have also considered that Mr H was either not telling his employers the truth, or that there was another marriage before the one in March 1852. Mr H was well educated and had good job prospects in England. However, he was unhappily married and deserted his wife in 1857, and left English shores. His first wife eventually found him and divorced him - Mr H having already remarried! Mr H has described himself as a bachelor on all marriage certificates that I have found. Collective wisdom would be much appreciated!!! Beth