Part 2 of my brick wall surname - STREET Thomas STREET was son of William STREET and Elizabeth (notknown), born c 1727 (where?). Tom died in 1796 and had property at Knightsbridge (inherited from his father) and at New Bond Street. He married Sarah (notknown), place and date of marriage not known. Information re date of birth/place of baptism (assuming they were baptised) not known, but likely to have been in the London/Middlesex/?Surrey area, as a notice in the Evening Post following his death said he was "upwards of 40 years confectioner to the King", and I have found mention of him in "Officers of the Royal Household" in 1756 Groom of the Confectionery, and 1762 1st Yeoman of the Confectionery (from British History Online www.british-history.ac.uk/ ). While he died at his house at Knightsbridge, his will gives his address as "of St James's Palace". Both Thomas and Sarah are buried at Chiswick. I do not know how many children they had, but only four are mentioned in Thomas and Sarah's respective wills: (1) Thomas George STREET (c 1763-1845) TGS ran a newspaper in the Strand. He married at least three times: (1) Mary FROST (nee ARCHER); (2) Jane Douglas GARDINER; (3) Jane Catherine FRANKLIN. There were children from all marriages. I have a copy of his will and details of all his marriages. He is buried at Tower Hamlets. (2) Ann STREET (c 1772-1839). Ann married Richard JELLICO in 1786 at St Andrew Holborn. Neither Ann nor Richard left a will and I have details of their eight children. Richard died at Westminster in 1807 and Ann died at Lambeth and is buried there. (3) George STREET (c 1775-1826) George apparently joined the military. He married Sophia Eliza MORTON in 1799 at St Mary, Lambeth, and there appear to have been no children. George died in 1826 at Chelsea and is buried at Chiswick. (4) Sarah Jane STREET (c 1782-1830). She married (1) William EVANS (d 1807) and (2) William SIMS (d September 1830). There were children from both marriages. Sarah Jane died in January 1830 at Camberwell and is buried at Chiswick. My questions: (1) would Thomas have been likely to have served an apprenticeship as a confectioner? I haven't located his name in the online indexes (2) would Royal Archives be likely to have any information about Thomas, especially any biographical information? (3) can anyone offer any suggestions as to how I can find details of Thomas's birth/marriage/baptisms of his children ? Alison :-) Sydney Australia -----------------------------

My brick wall surname is STREET. I would like to find details of marriages for William STREET and his son Thomas as well as birth dates and places of their respective children. William STREET (birth date/place not known) married Elizabeth (surname, marriage date/place not known). Known children: (1) Jane STREET (b c 1722 - where?; died 1802 Knightsbridge)(Jane married a surgeon, John SMITH, in 1751 at Lincoln's Inn Chapel - there were no children and John died 1757). She is buried at Chiswick (2) Thomas STREET (b c 1727 - where?; died 1796 London)(see separate note). Thomas is buried at Chiswick William died in January 1770 and his will states he is "of the parish of St George Hanover Square in the County of Middlesex, Keeper of His Majesty's Gate at Hyde Park Corner". He names his wife as executrix and names only two children (Jane and Thomas). He had property in Knightsbridge. The "London Evening Post" of 3 February 1770 mentions in passing "Mr DUGGAN of Chapel Street May Fair, to be keeper of Hyde Park Corner Lodge and Gate in the room of the late Mr STREET". I also found online a copy of "Officers of the Royal Household" which mentions "the keeper of the Hyde Park Gate was appointed by the Lord Steward and was established at £27 per annum. This fell to £21 by 1817. the office was eliminated in 1830". I have found a marriage for a William STREET, parish of Chiswick to Elizabeth KNIGHT of parish of Mortlack (sic), Surrey, at St Mary Ealing in 1719 by licence, but can't prove this is "my" William - however, there does seem to be some association with Chiswick as William's son, Thomas STREET, and some of his immediate family requested burial at Chiswick. Another possibility is William STREET who married Elizabeth MASON at Wonersh in 1726. There is another William STREET with wife Elizabeth who had several children baptised at St Nicholas, Chiswick, in the 1720-1730 period but from the will of this William (a butcher of Turnham Green) it appears this is a different family. My questions: (1) is the King's Gate at Hyde Park Corner the old Toll Gate or one of the gates leading into the park? (2) can anyone help with more information about the position of Keeper of the Gate? (3) would there be any information in Royal Archives (or equivalent) about the position of Keeper of the Gate, any biographical information about holders of this position? I couldn't find anything about Lord Steward's papers in TNA catalogue (would they be held at TNA?) Alison :-) Sydney Australia ==============================

Listers, This problem has been an inpenetrable brick wall for some years. I, and several other researches, would greatly value any assistance. My G-Grandfather, Thomas REDMAYNE was born around 1859. The earliest documenation we have for him is the 1881 census and his marriage certificate. The census says he was born in Camden though in 1881 he was living in Byker, Newcastle. His marriage certificate names his father only as "REDMAYNE" (no forename) and states his occupation as "Barrister". However, I've been unable to trace any evidence of a BArrister by that name in that period, and Camden records office (and other nearby locatons) have no birth certificate. Family tradition has it that he was alienated from his family and I suspect he may have been illigitimate. A story from another researcher is that he was in fact born in Ireland even though all census from 1881 name the Camden area as his place of birth. There are tantalising parallels between Thomas REDMAYNE and two other REDMAYNEs - Robert Robey and John Marriner. These two brothers (born around 1830) were sons of a wealthy SilkMerchant Giles REDMAYNE and they were born in London and later settled in the Newcastle area. As it happened, Robert Robey Redmayne had a son Thomas born close to my G-Grandfather but I know this is definitely not the man as he became a doctor - my G-Granfather was a corn and hay merchant. As a final twist, on Dec 11, 1867 The times published an account of a widow, Mrs Fletcher, who had been paid to take care of an illegitimate boy born in Camden a few years previously. She had applied to the Marlbourough Magistrate because the father, T.A Redpath had ceased to pay the promised maintenance. The mother of the child used the name REDMAYNE. I've been unable to locate any official records of the court appearance to confirm that the boy in question was my G-Grandfather. Naturally, we'd be very grateful if anyone can help us overcome this impasse. regards Norman Jessup Sydney

Hi Listers, My great-grandfather, Francis (Frank) DANIEL, has baffled my family for about 100 years. My grandmother tried and failed to find out about her father, my father tried and failed, so now the job has fallen to me, and I've been trying for about 15 years now. Frank DANIEL, hammerman, appears on the 1881 census as J. Daniel, living in Greenwich, and giving his birth place as Woolverhampton [sic]. Also there are my great-grandmother, Louisa nee MASTERS, my grandmother (also Louisa) and a sister no-one knew about, Susan. My grandmother's 1876 birth certificate does not give a father's name but Susan's names Francis as her father and implies he and my great-grandmother were married. No marriage has ever been found. To cut a long story short, Frank was supposed to have died accidentally when my grandmother was "about 2", ie before Susan was born in 1880. Frank does not appear in the death indexes for that period or at any other time, or the marriage indexes, nor are there any more records of Susan. She was of course his property being named as the father, whereas my grandmother did not being illegitimate. So far I have tracked Frank on the censuses 1841-1881 and it seems fairly certain he was the son of Joseph and Agnes DANIEL of Stone, Staffs, born 1836. I have also found his marriage to Susannah APPLEGARTH in 1863 in Southwark. I cannot find Susannah and her children after 1871. My logic tells me that putting Frank's "death" around 1878 and making no mention of Susan means that my great-grandmother never expected to hear from them again. She married James PRINGLE in 1884 calling herself a widow. Question: where did they go? I suspect they emigrated but the Empire was a huge place. They were not with Frank's brothers in 1891 or 1901. Any leads on Frank and/or Susan would have me leaping with joy. Well, you did ask, Lin! Lesley

Looking for family etc. of Percy Freeman born 1885 England. Father Charles Freeman tailor. Information From his marriage certificate St. James church Oct 1918. Percy Freeman Private 54th Southampton Depot & 50 Kettering St. Streatham (his wife Olive Carter's address)

Good morning all, I appreciate that WOOD is a fairly common name but I am stuck with a William WOOD who married Sarah Maria TURNER at St Leonard's Shoreditch in 1799. Fortunately all the following generations had at least one middle name and they reached quite high office in the London United District of the Ancient Order of Foresters. However, I have no idea where William came from and there is a forest of William WOOD names about ( Sarah's family possibly came from Dorset). Any ideas would be appreciated - I've checked the 1841 and 1851 census but can't identify one that I can be sure of. I must admit that it is some years since I looked at this but seeing Lin's Email prompted me to send this message. Best Wishes, Peter Wood Flitwick, Bedfordshire

My on going brick wall is WILLIAM ALDEN - where was he born and who are his parents I have the 1841 census showing WILLIAM ALDEN (transcribed as Aldin) aged 36 with Amelia Alden (also transcribed as Aldin) aged 26 There is a 'no' for county for William, and an each way bet for Amelia On 4th August 1850 William died aged 45 - address was 10 Ebury Square, St George Hanover Sq. 1851 census shows Amelia (widow) occupation Char woman with their 4 children, Charlotte Ann b 1841, William b 1845 (my gg grandfather), Hannah Elizabeth b 1847 and Samuel James b 1850 It is interesting that there is a voided page where Amelia is transcribed as Christia, then following a corrected page . She is still living at 10 Ebury Sq I have the birth certificates for most of their children, and Amelia's maiden name is SHEPHERD As the 1841 census shows William's age as 36 and his death certificate shows 45 I assume he was born 1805/6. I am unable to find a marriage for this couple, there do not appear to be any christening records for any of the children. Some time ago I asked a researcher to look into the problem for me, and on checking the St George Hanover Sq records could find no answer for me. Any suggestions would be very much appreciated. Jen (NSW) w

I can't find my grandmother, born Caroline Selina "Lena or Helena" Brown Suffling, or her mother in the 1891 census. Gran was born in May 1877 at Elmore St. Islington and was living with her parents at the same address in 1881. Her parents didn't marry. Her mother, Ann Suffling, born Hanworth Norfolk, was living with her father Thomas H. Brown or Suffling in 1881 - but I can't find him earlier or later in time, though from something Gran said her father was living when she was nine. The 1881 shows Thomas H. "Suffling" as a railway clerk born "Lewes Yorks" - no such place. George Brown, born Norfolk and also a railway clerk, was head of the household in 1881. I think Thomas H. may have been a much younger half brother of George but can't prove it. Ann Brown, widow, aunt of widow Emma Haynes living in another flat in the house on Elmore St, may have been married to a relative of George and Thomas H. Brown (or Suffling,) but I can't find out who her late husband was. Ann Suffling died at Albion Grove Islington in Feb 1899. Can anyone solve the mystery? Appreciate any ideas! Sonia in the U.S.

I am looking for the marriage of Henry HIGGINSON and Mary (?). The earliest information I have concerning the couple is the baptism of their daughter Mary who was baptised in St Botolph's parish church, Aldgate on 10 January 1770 although she was actually born on 17 February 1763 accorduing to the parish register. The family was living in Chequer Yard, High St, Aldgate at the time of the baptism. I would appreciate any help in learning the details of their marriage and those relating to the baptism of the father Henry. Adrian

I have a brick wall on a maiden name of a Mrs Ann FRADSTALL Ann married for a second time Thomas Curby[marriage under Kirby] a carpenter, on 20 Oct 1765 by licence in Edmonton Middlesex England. The witnesses were Thomas BARROWS and William STEGGLE. Thomas may have been attached to the church as he has witnesses two other marriages on the double page holding 8 marriages. The couple had seven children baptised between 13 July 1766 to 2 March 1777. 4 children died before their parents, three were less than 6 months and another 12. The husband died 1796 followed by another son age 38 in 1805. Ann a widow was buried 16 Jan 1814 at Enfield age 78 years making her born approximately 1736. Ann was well off and left a will with two properties mention a copyhold on 19 Ironmonger Lane Cheapside London with an apppurts in baker st Enfield and a freehold house in Chase side Enfield. Previously found was a baptism 21 March 1762 in London of Anne Fradsall daughter of Joseph and Ann FRADSALL. But I have not been able to locate a marriage find any further detail to see if this is the same Ann. Karen Australia

Just a little reminder, please post your Brickwalls to London List, and not to me at the Admin address, otherwise no-one will see them except me ;)) Lin List Admin London

Hello, My "brick wall" concerns my 3rd ggrandfather, Samuel Rawlins, who baptized his three children in 1845 at St. Barnabas Finsbury in ISlington. He is listed as a "watch finisher" . I am trying to find out if he has connections to either James Rawlins, a clockmaker with Citizens and Clockmakers, George Rawlins, watchmaker of Whitechappel, or Charles Rawlins-jeweler, all who operated in and around London at the end of the 18th century into the early 19th century. Thank you, Bev W

The 1841 census shows William and Sophia Torrington living in Golden Lane Cripplegate with their children including William aged 15 and Charles aged 7. Sophia was said to be a shopkeeper whilst her husband was a brazier or tin man. The ultimate aim is to find the origins of William senior (born about 1793). Devon wills have so far not proved any assistance. However, there is also a mystery about the whereabouts of William junior and his brother in 1851. By then both parents had died (1841 and 1848) and sister Sarah (then an unmarried mother to another William) was then the head of the household living at St. Luke Old Street Finsbury - a visitor to the house was Emma Madden who three years later married Charles Torrington. However, I have been unable to find Charles on the 1851 census or his older brother William, both of whom were said to have been born in London. The mother Sophia was originally from Manchester and I believe that not all of the 1851 census is available for Manchester. The common misspelling of the surname is a problem with variations of Thorrington, Terrington and the T sometimes miss-transcribed as an F. William junior was also a brazier or tin man and Charles was later an umbrella maker but in 1861 he was living with wife Emma (nee Madden) and their children in Cripplegate and Charles had no employment. If anyone can find these two brothers in 1851 or provide some ideas regarding their whereabouts it would be appreciated. Margaret O'Shea

> > Evening > > > > I am trying to find my FRESHWATER family who lived in East End London > > > > I have fouind the family on the 1851 Census living at 10 Bakers Alley, > > Parish St Mary Stratford, Bow > > Samuel Freshwater 41 and wife Esther age 37, she was born Corbet, with > > children Frederick age 14, Enoch aged 10, Charles aged 6, John aged 4 and > > Francis aged 1. I could not find them on the 1841 census, but seeing > Enoch > > was born in 1841 I ordered his birth certificate and it gives the address > > as Bakers Alley, Bow, so in Feb. 1841 they were there > > > > I would like to find out who were the parents of Samuel Freshwater and > > Esther Corbet, They were married before 1837 so am unable to obtain a > > marriage certificate for them. according to the 1851 census, gives his > > place of birth as Stratford > > > > Regards > > Margaret > > >

> Evening > > I am trying to find my FRESHWATER family who lived in East End London > > I have fouind the family on the 1851 Census living at 10 Bakers Alley, > Parish St Mary Stratford, Bow > Samuel Freshwater 41 and wife Esther age 37, she was born Corbet, with > children Frederick age 14, Enoch aged 10, Charles aged 6, John aged 4 and > Francis aged 1. I could not find them on the 1841 census, but seeing Enoch > was born in 1841 I ordered his birth certificate and it gives the address > as Bakers Alley, Bow, so in Feb. 1841 they were there > > I would like to find out who were the parents of Samuel Freshwater and > Esther Corbet, They were married before 1837 so am unable to obtain a > marriage certificate for them. according to the 1851 census, gives his > place of birth as Stratford > > Regards > Margaret >

Marilyn, I think both Retribution and Bellerophon were moored at Sheerness at this period, not at Woolwich. I doubt if the release of a prisoner from the hulks is likely to have made the newspapers, especially as he seems to have been released with about 15 others, according to the recommendation notice. http://tinyurl.com/5ru6d2s I can't find anything in the online newspapers, either in the Times Digital Archive or the British Library's 19th Century Newspapers database. I'm afraid the date is too early for a truly 'local' newspaper in that area. Presumably you've tried searching the English and Scottish censuses for him? Sorry this doesn't help. Judy London, UK -----Original Message----- From: london-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:london-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Marilyn L. Arnold What newspapers were in print for the city of London during the above time period? I'm looking specifically for an article/s regarding a William Innes, of West Port, Dundee, prisoner received from Edinburgh on March, 23, 1822 aboard the Bellephon; he was discharged to the Retribution on April 14, 1823, and pardoned November 4, 1825. These Bellephon and Retribution were two prison hulks, moored at Woolwich, which appears to be near London. (REF: U.K. Prison Hulk Registers and Letter Books.) This man was one of my ancestors and was tried in Perth in January 1822 for utterance, sentenced to 7 years transportation. I've ordered the court records from Edinburgh, but would like to see how I might find out what happened to him after his release. I doubt he would have had money, and may have had to work before going back to Dundee. (If, he in fact did go back to Dundee; that is not clear .... I don't really know what happened to him, so am looking for any clues. Thank you! Marilyn DC

Elizabeth Wood, widow of George John Wood who had died in 1895 age37, died herself just a few years later, leaving a young family without parents. I may have traced her death age 34 in St George in the East Infirmary in Oct/ Dec Qtr of 1897, but where might I find her burial? In the Register, the column 'Where Buried' the entry says " Private Bradford " , so I assume it was a private burial - it has been suggested that 'Bradford' refers to the name of an undertaker .... please may I have some advice......... thank you, April Wood Ashton

Hello all. Hope someone can help. I'm looking for the parentage of Frank Hubert Arrowsmith who was born in 1886 Lambeth London. He married in 1908 London Camberwell to Kate Isabel Gardner who was born in Brixton Lambeth - Would luv to know her parents too ? I know they had a son, Norman Hubert Arrowsmith who was born 8 April 1910 at Dulwich Camberwell London . Parish of Woodford. Many thanks Muriel

I have hit a dead end with the birth of my great great grandfather John Dalton. He died in 1831 in Croydon and his age was given as 57. That would have made his birth year about 1774. I have found his marriage to an Anne Brown at St. Bride Fleet Street by Banns. There is no useful information in the banns. According to a bit of family lore he "was of London". His will mentions no siblings. On the 1811 census for Croydon there is only one other Dalton listed and I have traced him both up and down and found that a living descendant of this second Dalton is not a genetic match for me, thus they were not related. There was a birth of a John Dalton at Kingston upon Thames in the correct time but he apparently dies within the year of his birth. Bill Dalton

George John Wood age 37 died from an accident on a wharf in the City of London - the coroners report in the newspapers tells us that he fell from a barge on Brewers Wharf - I have his death certificate but have been unable to trace his burial- in 1892 the family were living in Lansdowne Road Canning Town but no longer there in 1896. George John is NOT buried City of London Cemetery, Tower Hamlets, East London Cemetery, Plaistow. Where else should I be looking? Thank you, April Wood Ashton